That’s actually the most flagrant transformation of - something that was said into something that was not- that I have ever seen.
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How so? The first comment is basically saying as women achieve more there will be lower quality men.
Hm, ok? So is he/she (I’m not sure what prfury is) saying that we’re basing the value of men strictly based on their career achievements? It’s a fair question to ask because how else was this conclusion arrived at?
This shows the clear cultural bias I have been trying to point out now. This bias has been engrained into everyone, that men must be ‘earners’ for value and rightfully so because this is how it’s been for over a millennia but nothing has been updated for women, women get off scot-free and here lies the problem.
I’m not sure if he did that. I too was wondering what he is basing quality off of. I don’t say this with bad intent, and I very well might be wrong, but PF comes across as hung up on money. So with that line of thinking, high quality means relatively high earning. Perhaps it’s gone over my head but there doesn’t seem to be much emphasis on virtues and characteristics in the thread. There are plenty of decent, caring, responsible men out there who are great husbands and dads, but are not swimming in dough. But it was said that simply by women earning increasingly more, the amount of low quality men will increase. How so? And how is it good if the sexes are turned against one another?
There’s a certain social Darwinistic theme in the thread. It might work in the jungle but it doesn’t work in a civilization of human beings. There are places in the world that live by that theme and I’d bet most here don’t want to live in them.
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I’ll try to dig into it tomorrow a little. I think I get the gist of what he’s saying.
The short version would be with greater population, the number would rise proportionately, and under the pressure of competition more will be exposed.
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A man not capable of landing a woman without the society shifting change you want to see
It’s pretty subjective. Depends on a variety of factors ranging from religion to income to race to etc.
Nah. I got the superior gender luck
Because it wasn’t necessary for them to be anything other. Nor was it expected of them as they were thought of genuinely lesser.
Probably continue to support themselves in a way that gives them the ability to be free from the lesser men.
Half is a joke of a number. It’s far less than 10% of the male population.
Some dudes are into that. Not my particular cup of jazz, but to each his own
As women achieve more a male will have to achieve more to appear desirable to them. And achieve has evolved for the female gender to beyond ass shape and willingness to cook and clean.
Nah ofc it doesn’t. As with most other things in this thread you swingandamiss.
I fully expect my wife to pull her weight. We decided early on to achieve. We hold each other accountable to the betterment of each other. Pretty simple
Because for centuries women were financially locked into accepting sub standard mates for survival. Women earning more eliminates that worry (or lessens it). It seems super straightforward to me
Agreed. And the vast majority of them find companionship. But the shitheads of the world don’t get a pass because they can hold down a job anymore.
You still haven’t defined what a “lesser man” is though. You’re dancing around it. What is subjective when I’m asking YOU what a lesser man is to YOU?
To me it seems like you’re arguing all or nothing. " A complete shit head" but that’s not what I’m talking about, nor do I think that is what Brickhead is talking about either.
I know plenty of guys that went to college, or hold down a job, but still don’t make enough simply because there aren’t that many decently paying jobs out there. Is that man a lesser man to you?
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I agree. However I also think that it applies equally to men.
Because I can’t define it. It’s a subjective view based on the particular women/etc.
However, happy to share my thoughts. I would say a lesser man is one not capable of accomplishing his life goals. Whether that be marriage, professionally, spiritually, or otherwise.
There’s a supply and demand to life. It absolutely applies to relationships. The more you supply the more you can demand. There’s always going to be the bottom portion on both sides that appeal to very few. Little do each bottom portion know but they belong together.
Bricks actually said it many times. 5s should go for 5s. It’s just a joke that the number is based on looks anymore.
Brah. I work in the analytics dept for the world’s largest staffing company. Real skilled unemployment is under 1%. You’re talking out of your ass lol
If the guys you know don’t make enough, it’s because they chose a less than marketable skill. I absolutely support their right to do so, but hopefully they’re not blaming anyone but themselves.
Edit: and fwiw, I would ask these men what their life goals were. Was it to be independently wealthy and successful? If so, it sounds like they shit the bed with that. If not, and they’re happy with a normal life, then nothing’s stopping them from being content
You posted the doors? How could you? Not sure we can be friends anymore. Lol
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You work in analytics, polo has a degree in analytics, what are the odds huh or is this like saying “I’m an account representative” when you’re basically customer service lol.
And when did I say anything about being unemployed? Can you not fucking read? I said making ‘enough’ to fit your belief of a worthy male which at first I perceived it to mean someone making far above the average.
But it was worse then even I expected it to be because your idea of a ‘lesser man’ is someone not being able to accomplish all their life goals??? FUCK ME. Really? I don’t know many people in their 60s and 70s that can say that let a lone some 25 year old lol.
EDIT: oh ok you edited, still doesn’t make any fucking sense at all as a barometer. you painted yourself into a corner and now are trying to get out of it. its ok.
if my life’s goal was to sit on the beach, surf, and smoke weed would I be an accomplished individual in your eyes therefore deserving of 9s? doesn’t hold any water, brah
@EmilyQ
In the ideal vision I have, such hard-driving women wouldn’t be chosen according to some type of quota. There simply would be a minority of them as a result of what I’d like to see implemented, which has been done in the past and is actually being done now outside of America: social engineering and conditioning, propaganda, changes in education, financial incentives for getting married and starting families early. That wouldn’t stop women from knocking the corporate doors down or fulfilling a lofty ambition. In a first world society there will be talented women who don’t want to get married, don’t want children, or are unfit for marriage, but can do great jobs wherever they go. I don’t discount the achievements of great women throughout history at all.
Alongside that, and as I said before, I’d also like to see criminalization of alien of affections and adultery.
And I say this by way of compliment: if I needed a therapist (thank god I haven’t needed to in a long time) and I lived near your office, I’d go to you.
@pfury @greenboy There are indeed lesser men out there, though I think what makes them, as PF said varies upon the consideration of the individual. When I think of a lesser man, the image that comes to mind are the sort of lazy fathers and husbands of the boomer generation that I was exposed to growing up in a community of garden apartments. As I said elsewhere, the Al Bundy character of Married with Children didn’t come from nowhere. Many of these men were shot by their mid-forties and I don’t recall any of them representing the sort of men I’d like to emulate. And I am not putting down their jobs or income considering they did hold down employment and lived in a nice area, despite the apartments being small enough to drive some families nuts. These apartments now run for 333,000 bucks or thereabout, small and ordinary as they are.
Oh my god. This thread is still chugging along.
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Yup, and greenboy is getting more and more shrill and histrionic in his arguments as he continues to beat his head against the wall. Meanwhile, brickhead is now proposing some weird gender-communism of ‘to each according to their needs, from each according to their abilities’ where except for the top-tier talents, the majority of women are most useful to society as wives and mothers, regardless of what they may want out of life. Then there’s the ‘criminalization of alien of affections (I’m guessing this autocompleted wrong) and adultery’, which I’m waiting to be expanded upon. I’ve stopped contributing much in here since most of what I say falls on deaf ears, but I’m still following with morbid curiosity.
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Thanks for the summary, pal.
It’s a great thread. I’m following with some morbid curiosity as well. @OTHSteve
I’ve read your posts in the thread.
@greenboy doesn’t strike me as histrionic. He has stated over and over that he’s doing alright but is simply stating what he has observed. If I recall correctly there has been unsolicited advice given to him when he clearly stated he’s OK and is discussing something generally. It appears he’s not fond of current trends, as are other people, considering there are entire books and podcasts and You Tube channels with discussion of such trends. I think it’s his approach which has turned off some here; he gives some digs here and there.
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How about this then?
Seems appropriate enough?
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Nah I mostly deal with database work and a BI tool. Polo is leagues beyond my excel/BI make it work features. I’m more of a wing it/figure it out kinda guy. Also working in analytics isn’t that uncommon these days. Are you currently working/have you worked recently? If you’re at a non small company you probably have analytics going on behind the scene, and probably even a few coworkers whose sole job is analytics and/or R&A.
Then they set themselves unrealistic goals. I measure someone based on their ability to accomplish what they set out to accomplish.
I have a grandpa back in WV. He lives with my grandma in a paid off 900 sqft house, they have a few acres of land, he drives his Harley when it’s nice out. He never wanted a Porsche. Or a 90 inch TV. But by absolute values his greatest achievement in life was being a manager at Long John Silvers (those fuckin hush puppies thoughhhhhh).
Whatever helps you get through the convo. I think my concept of a lesser man (one who fails himself) seems pretty sound. Feel free to let me know what yours is. I’d love to hear it. Genuinely.
You aren’t automatically able to land 9s just because you are self satisfied. You still have to fill the things your partner wants in a mate. It’s 2019.
Which is the whole thing we’re talking about. Women started to achieve and want more than a guy who works and probably doesn’t beat her. The standard jumped.
Edit: and FTR, I would absolutely call you accomplished. If you genuinely achieved your goals and are genuinely happy, what kinda fucktard asshole would I have to be to think you aren’t accomplished. What’s the whole point of all this?
And it’s beyond childish to even imagine you or anyone can truly define “lesser men” as it’s such a subjective opinion.
A man of faith will think an atheist is a lesser man.
An athlete will think an obese person is a lesser man.
An academic will think a dumbass is a lesser man.
Etc.
This is still truly terrifying.
Have you figured out how to fix the low quality men issue and/or the high cost of living issue that actually spawns women working?