I could see why you would need someone to provide you with a list for that. Some of us had actual role models. And a reading time of 65 minutes? Maybe you need to get a life.
That’s quite the summary. I really cannot add to it, it says it all.
The ol’ “Quit being a bunch of pussies.” trope. He gives zero fucks, except to make sure we know for sure, that he has his shit together and gives zero fucks. What’s amazing is the intensity of the pressure to recognize how little fucks he gives, that he needs to make sure we all know, that he’s not a pussy and gives zero fucks…
In the ‘Half of men wish they were dead’ thread we get this lovely piece of advice:
I think this illustrates the problem, perfectly…
Why do you need us to know how superior you are to this conversation? So much so, that you keep having it.
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Isn’t it? It’s pretty sick.
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It is tough for me to tell how difficult my education was compared to a student from 50 years ago.
I had a few older professors that seemed to have a goal of making the class just as hard as when they took it in the 1950s haha. We had one that was just kinda a dick in general. He thought it was more like the real world to be penalized for wrong answers. This made it possible to score less than 0 on an exam, and multiple classmates did exactly that. Pretty hard to come back from a -5 on a test haha.
I had a law professor that was like this. She was a royal cunt, lesbian, Harvard grad, etc. She was extremely intelligent and cussed like a sailor. I found her entertaining and quite funny to be honest.
Her exam was BRUTAL. I managed to pull out a decent grade on it, but she liked to let us know how far below her expectations we all were.
I gave it back to her in front of the entire class after she wanted to belittle us when I joked about what she made in a year (it is public knowledge as a state professor in TN) and that currently I was making that in a month so maybe she should stfu with the condescending shit as I could buy her.
She did not like it much, but there was also not much she could say back 
. And grading was “anonymous”.
I also referenced the student that had action taken against a former professor for stating her beliefs / speaking her mind and crushed on her grade just the year prior. It was a HUGE stink. The student sued, won, and that professor (that was tenured too) will never teach again anywhere.
Her only comment back was, “touché - moving on”. I respected her more after that and she quit the condescending shit.
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The overarching theme in the last 50 or so posts is that men are not being validated by society the same way we used to be, so in turn they become weak and suicidal.
If you need external validation to find value in yourself, achieve goals, plant roots et cetera…. you’re a weak man. And you would’ve been a weak man in 1950 too.
Be you, don’t worry about others. Believe it or not, men are capable of being highly successful in the business world today, and in entrepreneurship. We just have women in the competitive mix now. Are there occasionally diversity hires cancelling merit? Yes. Go kill yourself I guess. Or quit being a pussy and work to open another door. Like always. Which side of the coin are you?
And….if drinking a bud light makes you want to wear a dress and suck dicks that’s a you thing. Not Bud Light or Dylan Mulvaney. You can’t be “erased” if you don’t participate, so do you like sucking dicks or not? Nobody is raping you in to another way of thinking. Why are you nervous?
Society has not weakened men, it has just eliminated hiding spaces for weak men in many respects and you’re easy to spot now. All excuses and finger pointing.
Toughen up. You’ll be fine.
And Skyz, no. I’m not that guy.
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By any objective measure this is false. Physical health data alone prove this false, without even going into mental health and the actual actions of men as a group. Mass shootings, for instance, were virtually non-existent prior to 1964, despite the widespread availability of semi-automatic rifles, even by mail with no background checks.
Here’s my grandpa during WWII. That’s what a normal teenager who never lifted weights looked like in the 1940’s.
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No. It is more than occasional and has in fact become the norm.
Also, it has become a matter of policy in many public and private sectors. So be the strong man you claim to be but know you are also ignorant. You would think the recent AA decision would have enlightened you as to where we are as a society. By the way, AA benefits women, specifically white women, more than men.
You have an obsession with dick sucking. Maybe you should stop drinking bud lite.
As someone who worked with children in public education, I can say you are ignorant and out of touch. Public education, by current design, is actively weakening boys. It also weakens men in that you either stay, and behave accordingly, or quit. Women want to dictate how your sons are taught and raised. And they are winning.
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A couple questions from a lurker if I may:
What role and scope does a parent play in the upbringing of their kid and their dispositions and conclusions they draw as adults?
Put another way, If a boy is taught X and school, how much does a father/mother teaching/modeling their boy Y at home counteract it?
Perhaps I am a bit glib, but I am not terribly concerned with what my children are exposed to information wise, because ultimately I will also expose them to values I deem worthy, and hopefully arm them with a “skeptics toolbox” so to speak of critical thinking skills. May the best ideas win. I am much more concerned with my kids thinking process than the conclusions being taught to them by others.
For example (and please lets not derail the conversation with this, I only use it to highlight a current political extreme), if schools are teaching a boy that transgenderism is positive, but the parent at home have the opposite view and teach the boy as such, who will ultimately “win” that battle? (again I dont need a specific answer about transgenderism, only using at as example of something being taught at school that contradicts the values at home).
The boy will either believe what the school tells him or learn to keep his mouth shut.
Not as much as you think.
Peer relationships play a bigger role in shaping a child’s social, emotional, cognitive, and behavioral development. Read Judith Harris.
Children spend a significant portion of their waking hours at school and with their peers. While parents play a crucial role in their children’s lives, they may not have the same amount of time or consistent influence as teachers and peers do. The cumulative effect of repeated exposure to certain ideas and beliefs at school can be powerful.
The curriculum is made with a purpose and goal in mind. Add to that media especially social media and it is an uphill battle.
As @zecarlo said they will accept it or keep quiet. Those that “fight back” are punished or put on drugs.
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By keep his mouth shut you mean that he will disagree with what the school teaches him?
Given all of that, should parents focus more on putting their kids in peer groups with shared value systems (in the community at large, not necessarily at school) if the goal is to raise them with the values they have as well?
Obviously this doesn’t avoid or negate the influence of what is happening at school.
The other larger question I suppose is that if your idea can’t win out against the other ideas your child is being exposed to, is it perhaps because it lacks merit? I have many different beliefs from my parents, and while some of them may be from peer groups many of them are simply an assessment of the facts and the conclusions I have reached on my own
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A kid can be correct and disagree with his school, but he’ll suffer the consequences of disagreeing with the system. Its similar to a modern workplace. You can disagree all you want and be totally correct doing so, but enjoy being unemployed.
We’re all free as long as it doesn’t challenge the system. Private or home school is ideal. For those where that’s not a viable option, you have to be involved collectively at the school level to maintain as much influence as possible over what your kid is being taught.
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I think for the purposes of my questions I’m only particularly interested in what the kid thinks at the end of the day (call it at age 18 or 25 or even 50 if we think these things are long reaching and societally shifting issues such as “weakening men”), not whether he actively gets involved in disagreements with the school to the point of discipline.
My question is more so a matter of the conclusion than the process. If a school teachers issue X to 100 kids, 50 of which come from a family that disagrees with it (call it position Not-X), assuming the 50 kids begin with Not-X, how many of those kids will be brought over to position X solely because of the school teaching it? How many would have arrived at that conclusion on their own?
The issue of what to do about it is separate.
Yes, being part of a peer group that shares similar values can provide reinforcement and support for the values taught at home. It can foster a sense of belonging and social cohesion within the group, providing a supportive environment for the child. Peer groups with shared values can also offer positive role models.
I do think that being exposed to perspectives you may not agree with is also beneficial as it can help with critical thinking, personal growth and tolerance.
Parents may not have a biggest influence but, they do have some. The biggest is going to be genetics and peers. Their intelligence/IQ, openness, neuroticism, etc. will play a major role in what they believe and may fall “victim” to.
The best thing for a child is for their parents to have chosen the right partner.
Sure, but they were still influenced by your environment and ultimately your genetics.
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Think about that for a moment. The kid is learning to fear the system.
I’m not saying they shouldn’t, that’s just not part of what I’m asking about (influence on his thoughts and conclusions about the issues)
I think maybe we are talking about different things here
My questions are trying to get to heart of how much influence society has on an individuals thoughts vs their family/community.
That seems to be the central thesis of this entire thread: “wokeness” or societal change is ruining what it means to be a male and driving more men to suicide or a life devoid of meaning and purpose as a man (summed up briefly and crudely)
Obviously if you are in disagreement with your workplace that clearly says to me you have not been influenced by them, and if you are willing to get fired over it you REALLY haven’t been influenced.
Although I’m not really sure what position my workplace could take on the types of issues being discussed here that I would feel the need to escalate my disagreement to the point of being fired, but I’m all ears and open to ideas.
Not buying Gillette razors seems like an easy one as a consumer, but as assembly line worker #64 at the plant what am I supposed to do in response to their ad from last year even if I vehemently disagree with it?