Giving Boxing a second Chance!

Bigger Stronger Leaner
1

So, as my fight get closer and i’ve been improving my striking i’m interested in watching boxing again. I haven’t paid attention to boxing since Tyson is gone or any Pacquiao fights.

Any Fights you recommend? Why? Anything Goes, technical fights, brawls, vicious knockouts, thrilling decisions.

I’m specially interested in Duran, Barrera and Ward and seeing their technical proficiency.

My attention span is horrible, so if it’s a dull decision it might drive off my interest, but if it’s non-stopping frenetic action, then i think i can sit for 30 minutes watching a fight.

Looking for input, specially, from FightingIrish and all you boxing savvys.

I really want to be able to see all that details that differentiates a phenomenal boxer from a middle of the pack one.

2

Look up a few of the super six fights that just happened. I really enjoyed that tournament myself. You got a really good mix of styles and match ups in that series.

Another guy I liked in his earlier fights was Gamboa. So fast its ridiculous. He started decision hunting last time I saw him but that was almost a year ago.

3

Like Abraham VS Ward?

4

Gamboa is my fave at the moment, u should have seen his last fight, knocked out the dude in like 4 rounds. he’s not a decision hunter he’s just trying to tighten up his defense. plus im sure the fight youre talking about was against salido, he isn’t exactly easy to knock out

5

Kaiser,

I am going to go against the grain and say that you should watch tape of fairly conventional fighters that made it with fundamentals, as opposed to phenoms who are one of a kind talents. Under no circumstances should you watch and try to imitate Ali, Mayweather Jr., Whitaker, Willy Pep, George Foreman (the young stage), Ken Norton, Roy Jones Jr., etc.

The slick amazing performances take a unique set of attributes and skill. The rules of boxing also play a large part in their success. I am a believer that the “text-book” was written for a reason and especially for the more wide open world of MMA.

I do not mean this as a shot, I just assume that people are the rule, not the exception until proven otherwise.

General advice is to learn to work your jab. It is an amazing punch. Learn to set things up with it.

I consider Joe Louis possibly the greatest heavyweight of all time, and a very useful model.

Joe Louis Tribute Part 1 - YouTube

In order to make better recommendations I have a couple questions.

1.) Are you usually taller or shorter than your opponents?
2.) Are you more of a power puncher, a speed puncher, both, neither?
3.) Do you fight right or left side forward? If you know the handedness of your opponent please say so.
4.) What is your best punch? Hardest punch? Punch you like throwing the most?
5.) What is your best combination?
6.) How do you hold your hands in a guard?

Regards,

Robert A

6

If you have no attention span look up Edwin Valero, Julian Jackson and Gerald McClellan. Proceed to bask in the comfort of instant knockouts.

Duran was one of the greatest of all time. Barrera isn’t that far down the list. Everybody likes Mickey Ward but he really doesn’t belong in the same sentence. Barrera - Hamed is entertaining if you don’t like Hamed (and you shouldn’t). Duran - Barkley is a real barnburner (though it is not nearly him at his peak).

7

These two are great. They break down the style and strengths of two all time greats. I’ve been in boxing much of my life, but I still learned a lot from these and have been able to incorporate some of them in my style.

8

[quote]kaisermetal wrote:
Like Abraham VS Ward?
[/quote]

The whole series I enjoyed. You had different styles coming together and it made for great fights. Cant really say there was one I saw that made me hate it or bored me and I am pretty picky when it comes to boxing.

The thing with Gamboa is I havnt seen him fight in almost a year. Before that one fight I thought he was absolutely amazing. The guy is so fast its crazy.

9

[quote]Robert A wrote:
Kaiser,

I am going to go against the grain and say that you should watch tape of fairly conventional fighters that made it with fundamentals, as opposed to phenoms who are one of a kind talents. Under no circumstances should you watch and try to imitate Ali, Mayweather Jr., Whitaker, Willy Pep, George Foreman (the young stage), Ken Norton, Roy Jones Jr., etc.

The slick amazing performances take a unique set of attributes and skill. The rules of boxing also play a large part in their success. I am a believer that the “text-book” was written for a reason and especially for the more wide open world of MMA.

I do not mean this as a shot, I just assume that people are the rule, not the exception until proven otherwise.

General advice is to learn to work your jab. It is an amazing punch. Learn to set things up with it.

Robert A[/quote]

I can’t stress this enough. RJJ was awesome, but if you fight like him, you’ll get murdered. You ain’t as quick as Floyd, don’t hit as hard as Pac, and you don’t have the chin, handspeed, or ring smarts of the legend Ali - so don’t fight like them.

But…that being said, fight like the best conventional fighter you can find, and in my opinion, in this day and age, that’s Juan Manuel Marquez.

Watch this fight with Juan Diaz - this, to me, is Marquez at his absolute finest. His physical gifts have diminished a bit with age but he’s still so fucking smart that he deals with Diaz’s charge early on, and slowly, methodically breaks him down with the straight right hand the lead uppercut.

Also, watch his pivots- he truly has some of the nicest moves in the game; he gets in trouble, backs against the ropes, and bang, he’s out and he’s punching.

Another terrific fight is his fight against Katsidis, where he does much the same thing - take on the early charge and then methodically destroy a younger opponent.

10

Another great technical fighter to watch is Bernard Hopkins. He keeps his chin down, hands up, is dirty as fuck, doesn’t get hit a lot, and picks his shots to hurt you the most while offering the least of himself up.

Here’s the first part of his legendary fight with Trinidad.

11

As far as legendary, incredible fights, it’s hard to find one that surpasses this - two average fighters who dumped every ounce of their being into this war and neither would go out. Greatest fight I’ve ever seen.

12

This is the second greatest fight I’ve ever seen - Jose Luis Castillo vs. Diego Corrales. Nothing except Round 9 of the Ward-Gatti fight beats Round 10 of this fight.

13
14

[quote]Robert A wrote:
Kaiser,

I am going to go against the grain and say that you should watch tape of fairly conventional fighters that made it with fundamentals, as opposed to phenoms who are one of a kind talents. Under no circumstances should you watch and try to imitate Ali, Mayweather Jr., Whitaker, Willy Pep, George Foreman (the young stage), Ken Norton, Roy Jones Jr., etc.

The slick amazing performances take a unique set of attributes and skill. The rules of boxing also play a large part in their success. I am a believer that the “text-book” was written for a reason and especially for the more wide open world of MMA.

I do not mean this as a shot, I just assume that people are the rule, not the exception until proven otherwise.

General advice is to learn to work your jab. It is an amazing punch. Learn to set things up with it.

I consider Joe Louis possibly the greatest heavyweight of all time, and a very useful model.

Joe Louis Tribute Part 1 - YouTube

In order to make better recommendations I have a couple questions.

1.) Are you usually taller or shorter than your opponents?
2.) Are you more of a power puncher, a speed puncher, both, neither?
3.) Do you fight right or left side forward? If you know the handedness of your opponent please say so.
4.) What is your best punch? Hardest punch? Punch you like throwing the most?
5.) What is your best combination?
6.) How do you hold your hands in a guard?

Regards,

Robert A[/quote]

1.) At this weight classes in cutting down to, i will be average height, 5’10 will get me both tallers and shorters fighters.
2.) I would say more of a power puncher, i don’t have the speed i had as a 155lbs anymore, but for the level i fight in i have above average punching power.
3.)I am left handed and he is right handed.
4.)My best punch would be my left straight, years from karate made it very solid, but people always commented that my left upper is a good one, but i don’t feel confident with uppers unless on clinch.
5.)I guess it would be the basic. Jab, Straight followed by a low-kick.
6.) I am training with my guard uphigh, but on my last fight, from karate background, i do have a tendency to let the guard a little under the chin if i’m lacking gas, not high muay-thai like, but around my chin, is a good height for parry and go for the counter, at least for me.

I think the greatest advantage i have from karate background is the footwork, i’m used to moving around and getting in and out without exposing myself to open-up brawls like many muay thai fighters here at Brazil use to do.

see? most of muay thai fighters here just stand & bang, they just move forward and back aggressively and with a huge gas tank, like rock’em sock’em robots.

15

…anything with Duran at 135 lbs.

either the 2nd or 3rd Esteban DeJesus fight. In the first fight, a non-title fight, DeJesus got Duran’s attention and payed for it badly in the 2nd and 3rd go, and DeJesus could go.

Its really sad that Duran is know for Leonard and Hagler and Barkley. And yes its unreal that he dropped Barkley, given that Barkley was a 200 lb man who dropped weight to make 160.

But Duran was pure hell at his natural weight of 135. He moved up cause he beat everybody and there was no money to make anymore.

He beat Leonard with 12 lbs of excess baggage.

People will say he had to move up cause he couldn’t make weight. But if Leonard was 130 lbs Duran would have gone down and made the weight no problem if the dollars were there. Go find video of Duran at 135.

The man was pure hell at 135.

LB

16

…anything with Duran at 135 lbs.

either the 2nd or 3rd Esteban DeJesus fight. In the first fight, a non-title fight, DeJesus got Duran’s attention and payed for it badly in the 2nd and 3rd go, and DeJesus could go.

Its really sad that Duran is know for Leonard and Hagler and Barkley. And yes its unreal that he dropped Barkley, given that Barkley was a 200 lb man who dropped weight to make 160.

But Duran was pure hell at his natural weight of 135. He moved up cause he beat everybody and there was no money to make anymore.

He beat Leonard with 12 lbs of excess baggage.

People will say he had to move up cause he couldn’t make weight. But if Leonard was 130 lbs Duran would have gone down and made the weight no problem if the dollars were there. Go find video of Duran at 135.

The man was pure hell at 135.

LB

17

Thanks Kaiser,

Ok, so you are a southpaw. Well since he has not been mentioned yet watching some film of Marvin Hagler may be in order. First thing to note is that he will switch from Southpaw to Orthodox and back. I think this may be of particular interest since switching stances happens, at least to me, fairly often breaking away from clinches/takedown attempts/defending takedowns and may help you set up low kicks as well. Be vary wary of what Irish and I stated about trying to imitate someone who’s nickname was “Marvelous”. Watch the angles and particularly the way he moves in and out while hitting.

HL

Haggler vs Hearns aka The War- FighinIrish posted Gotti vs Ward which is my favorite fight of all time. Really, my favorite series of fights. But the first round of Hagler vs Hearns is up there with anything else. It only goes three rounds.

Also as a bit of a case study, Michael Moorer (Not Michael Moore the director) Moorer was a southpaw and a student of the game, but not an all time great. Especially note what he does right and wrong against Holyfield (This is where FightinIrish yells dumping Atlas for Roach at his monitor), Foreman, and Tua.

HL

Regards,

Robert A

18

Holy cajoles! Hearns got some murder bombs there.

19

[quote]Robert A wrote:
Be vary wary of what Irish and I stated about trying to imitate someone who’s nickname was “Marvelous”.[/quote]

Nickname? :wink:
…Just being pedantic Robert.

I suppose it’s a pity that Duran is remembered for his remarkable run at lightweight. But beating Ray Leonard, going down to the wire against Hagler and defeating Iran Barkley (all above his best weight) are some of his finest acheivements.

20

[quote]duffyj2 wrote:

[quote]Robert A wrote:
Be vary wary of what Irish and I stated about trying to imitate someone who’s nickname was “Marvelous”.[/quote]

Nickname? :wink:
…Just being pedantic Robert.

I suppose it’s a pity that Duran is remembered for his remarkable run at lightweight. But beating Ray Leonard, going down to the wire against Hagler and defeating Iran Barkley (all above his best weight) are some of his finest acheivements.
[/quote]

You are technically correct, the BEST kind of correct.-Futurama

Duran was something very special. Hell, the whole Duran-Leonard-Hagler-Hearns interplay may be unique in boxing history. Four all time greats were basically beating each other for championships at the same time. The absolute four best were trying to fight, not duck each other. Duran even gave up a belt at one point to fight Hearns. We do not see that anymore. Instead we get Pac-man and Mayweather fighting stand ins for one another.

OK, which of the four was the “best” and why?

Regards,

Robert A