i honestly believe that gear is the same as raw cuz when you compete in equipped powerlifting, your going against people that gasp are in gear too!!
anyways, who likes to wear that stuff
bench shirts-suck, gotta get the groove down
squat suits- suck, can hardly get them off
deadlift suits- suck, can hardly bend down
raw is just as good as equipped, you just dont get to waer fancy shit
…I love the smell of 3 month old unwashed Katana in the morning…smells like…a PR…
[quote]jonatan-shg wrote:
Ruggerlife wrote:
BlackLabel wrote:
Im gonna get alotta shit for this but…
What’s the point of using gear? Why not just lift Raw and get more satisfaction from doing it yourself instead of the shirt or suit giving you those extra lbs. Ive just never seen the point.
Why do golfer’s use Big Bertha?
Why do Tennis players use new lighter/better rackets?
Why do hockey players use graphite sticks?
Why do [insert sport here] use [insert new equipment]?
And the similarity is what?
To play tennis you NEED a racket, to squat you need yourself, a barbell and plates, you don’t need a suit.
So no, it’s not the same thing.
[/quote]
Why didn’t you comment on the “Big Bertha” or “graphite” sticks (I could have also used the newer designs in goalie equipment for hockey)? Out of the 3 specifics I posted you only commented on tennis rackets, however you conveniently missed the “lighter/better” descriptive component.
Unfortunately, I know fuck all about tennis so I can’t name a premium racket. What I do know however, is people that play tennis, pay a hell of a lot for a premium racket when much cheaper alternatives are available. So the point of NEEDing a racket is moot. The comparison is with all the extra R&D that goes into the equipment.
shaking my head@ everyone trying to compare EVERYTHING to lifting with gear
would you paint without a paintbrush?
would you brush your teeth with no toothpase?
would you type with no keyboard?
if youre going to use an example, make it somewhat relevant to the subject.
heres one for you.
lifting without gear is like playing basketball.
lifting with gear is like playing slamball.
[quote]buckeye girl wrote:
I actually have a video of my most recent squat in my thong/Pro brief/Viking suit combo. You can’t see the thong or the briefs but they’re there. I think that the thong actually put about 5 extra pounds on my squat.[/quote]
Hell, I may have to invest in one of them there thongs if I can get 5lbs out of it. Or would that be like crossing over to the equipped side? Better not chance it. I don’t want to use anything that would add to my raw total (except a belt of course…and my knee sleeves…and wrist wraps…well you know what I mean. As equipped as possible while still remaining raw).
When we’re talking about waffles vs pancakes, are we talking about whole wheat protein pancakes or good old fashioned blueberry pancakes stacked to the ceiling dripping with butter (yeah real butter) and maple syrup. That would my choice.
[quote]buckeye girl wrote:
Modi wrote:
buckeye girl wrote:
DoubleDuce wrote:
I love it when geared lifters get their panties in a wad. Takes like 45 minutes to re-adjust under the suit and it’s funny as hell to watch them squirm.
That’s why I wear thongs under my briefs. No bunching. Ever.
Video or it didn’t happen. Those are the rules.
I actually have a video of my most recent squat in my thong/Pro brief/Viking suit combo. You can’t see the thong or the briefs but they’re there. I think that the thong actually put about 5 extra pounds on my squat.[/quote]
Well I want to see the vid also. Dont need to see the thong, just need a description to team with the vid and then just imagine it.
-NOW BACK TO THE MATTER AT HAND:
-
EVERY SINGLE top lifting single-multiply lifter also has some retarded RAW lift. Take an 850 mult-ply sqautter. He gets shit on by people who dont know. Take the suit off him, he does 700 in wraps and belt. Now hes the FUCKING MAN.
-
As someone stated easrlier, when you wear gear your copmeting against others with gear! so whoop dee doo.
-
Ive been in single ply and you need to train for months in it to get any sort of carry over. Its all a science. Am i cheating in my bench cause i take yoga and have an arch like a contortionist? Mad gym warriors who shit on gear take a different kind of gear and deadlift in straps. now is all that cheating?? HMM…
I am a raw competitor btw
I don’t think you can compare supportive gear to tennis rackets (or high-tech swimsuits, top-line track shoes, etc). But I don’t think gear needs a justification. Gear is around. It’s fun to use- a little tricky- but worth the learning curve. What’s to justify?
[quote]Modi wrote:
buckeye girl wrote:
I actually have a video of my most recent squat in my thong/Pro brief/Viking suit combo. You can’t see the thong or the briefs but they’re there. I think that the thong actually put about 5 extra pounds on my squat.
Hell, I may have to invest in one of them there thongs if I can get 5lbs out of it. Or would that be like crossing over to the equipped side? Better not chance it. I don’t want to use anything that would add to my raw total (except a belt of course…and my knee sleeves…and wrist wraps…well you know what I mean. As equipped as possible while still remaining raw).
When we’re talking about waffles vs pancakes, are we talking about whole wheat protein pancakes or good old fashioned blueberry pancakes stacked to the ceiling dripping with butter (yeah real butter) and maple syrup. That would my choice.
[/quote]
Blueberry pancakes (made with WW flour) stacked to the ceiling and smothered in butter (the real stuff is the only kind worth eating) and syrup.
The bodybuilders can keep their low fat whole grain wheat grass pancakes with fish oil syrup.
[quote]drdgmuro wrote:
…I love the smell of 3 month old unwashed Katana in the morning…smells like…a PR…[/quote]
Do people wash them? I recently had a (non-lifter) tell me my knee wraps were stinky. They smelled fine to me. Ass wipe. Who’s going to be smelling my knees.
[quote]ouroboro_s wrote:
drdgmuro wrote:
…I love the smell of 3 month old unwashed Katana in the morning…smells like…a PR…
Do people wash them? I recently had a (non-lifter) tell me my knee wraps were stinky. They smelled fine to me. Ass wipe. Who’s going to be smelling my knees.[/quote]
I wash stuff before a meet, never dry it. You have to get the chalk out so it looks clean enough the equipment check refs won’t balk.
Knee wraps aren’t even on long enough to pick up a funk. I also had a non-lifter (husband) tell me they stink. Puss.
[quote]pushmepullme wrote:
ouroboro_s wrote:
drdgmuro wrote:
…I love the smell of 3 month old unwashed Katana in the morning…smells like…a PR…
Do people wash them? I recently had a (non-lifter) tell me my knee wraps were stinky. They smelled fine to me. Ass wipe. Who’s going to be smelling my knees.
I wash stuff before a meet, never dry it. You have to get the chalk out so it looks clean enough the equipment check refs won’t balk.
Knee wraps aren’t even on long enough to pick up a funk. I also had a non-lifter (husband) tell me they stink. Puss.[/quote]
I wash my shirt and suit and hang them to dry pre-meet but my wraps get half their spring from the dry funk in them. Plus, I don’t chalk my knees but I do lightly spray a bit of scent behind them.
Wait, if I rely on funk assisted spring is that cheating?
[quote]pushmepullme wrote:
ouroboro_s wrote:
drdgmuro wrote:
…I love the smell of 3 month old unwashed Katana in the morning…smells like…a PR…
Do people wash them? I recently had a (non-lifter) tell me my knee wraps were stinky. They smelled fine to me. Ass wipe. Who’s going to be smelling my knees.
I wash stuff before a meet, never dry it. You have to get the chalk out so it looks clean enough the equipment check refs won’t balk.
Knee wraps aren’t even on long enough to pick up a funk. I also had a non-lifter (husband) tell me they stink. Puss.[/quote]
Wash? Fuck that. Febreeze FTW. Also, nice arch in your avatar!
[quote]HolyMacaroni wrote:
malonetd wrote:
Fine, what about sprinters and shoes? You don’t need shoes to sprint, yet there are special shoes just for sprinting.
Why use pads or helmets for football? They’re not necessary to play the game?
Why do baseball players wear gloves? You don’t need a glove to catch a ball. What’s the point?
Is it necessary for Olympic lifters to wear Olympic shoes? I don’t think so. I’ve weightlifted in my New Balance’s before.
I’ve armwrestled on my kitchen table for years; why do armwreslters need a special table?
Why use a chessboard for chess? Alexander Alekhine can play just fine without one.
Do skateboarders need pads and helmets? The kids down my block never use them?
I lifted weights for years before ever touching chalk. I guess that’s not necessary either.
If we looked hard enough, we could find several things not needed for any particular sport.
come on man. i honestly don’t care if people use gear or not. but some of those arguments are rediculous.
[/quote]
What’s ridiculous? I listed things people don’t need to play their chosen sport, yet these things are generally accepted.
The comparison to a sprinter’s shoes is probably the most appropriate, though, since the level of increased performance is comparable.
Truthfully, though, the thing that’s really ridiculous is that, for whatever reason, gear bothers the hell out of so many people. I don’t understand that and the best answers anyone ever gives is that it’s cheating or that it weakens the public perception of the sport. Well, it’s not cheating if it’s allowed and who cares about the public perception. The sport’s not going anywhere.
For the record, there have been some decent posts in this thread that was destined for fail anyway.
[quote]LiveFromThe781 wrote:
also, comparing playing chess on a chessboard to lifting weight with briefs or a shirt is retarded. the chessboard is a fundamental part of the game, a bench shirt isnt fundamental to bench pressing.[/quote]
If people can play chess without a board – and people do all the time – then it’s not really a fundamental part of the game anymore.
I have to defend chess. I know a lot of chess players that now wear gear. Their speed in hitting the clock is amazing. Plus they can en passant like no one’s business.
[quote]malonetd wrote:
I have to defend chess. I know a lot of chess players that now wear gear. Their speed in hitting the clock is amazing. Plus they can en passant like no one’s business.[/quote]
LOL!
Funny thing is that there actually is doping going on in chess.
And there was a recent controversy about whether a top grandmaster was getting computer assistance during a match against another top grandmaster.
[quote]buckeye girl wrote:
I’m sick of people shitting in other threads about how gear is either:
A) cheating
B) getting out of hand
C) ruining our sport and it’s chances of becoming part of the olympics
D) lifts the weight for you
[/quote]
A. It seems like the biggest problem with the gear vs. no gear debate is that we want to think of all powerlifting as one single, happy unified sport.
Geared powerlifting and raw powerlifting are two completely different things, the problem is that people who compete in each variation of the sport want to compare themselves against one another.
So raw lifters bitch about how the geared guys’ totals are twice as high and say that gear use is cheating. On the one hand this is true, it would be cheating to show up to a raw meet in a 3-ply squat suit, but that generally isn’t the case.
At the same time, geared lifters need to make a point of saying that whatever numbers they throw out as their PRs are geared. Why? Because geared lifting is about learning to effectively use a tool, in this case the suit or shirt, to achieve a certain goal, some ridiculous total. Raw lifting is just about lifting a weight, where the only tool at your disposal is your own body.
Is either variation better than the other? no.
Does excelling in one or the other have any more or less merit? no
There needs to be an end to the pissing matches between geared and non-geared lifters, and people need to accept that they are two different sports.
It would be like having a golfer and a tennis player compete against each other in their respective sports. Obviously each is going to be better at his respective sport because that is what he trains for. Just because geared lifting and non-geared lifting use similar tools to measure strength doesn’t mean they are the same.
I have to say that the general public will never understand the sport whether the gear is there or it is raw. I tell people I compete in powerlifting and they usually ask me what I clean, though no in those words more like a pantomime. The gear is a natural progression to sports everyone is going to look for a way to be the best and that is what the gear is. But in all honesty i know that the gear saves my joints, with possible exception of my knees, and I feel better lifting in the gear than out. But no lifter will ever be strong in the gear if they are not strong out of the gear.
While I may have an 800 lb IPA depth squat and only a 650 raw, belted wrapped, squat that is still a strong squat. And what is raw that to me has to be better defined. Raw to me is with out the suits and shirts but everything else. Where some its nothing not even a belt. But if you go pure I know I get the most weight out of chalk.
I think one of the more complaints I have heard is from the belly benching and the extreme arches in benches. The high squats and the unlocked deads. These are things that are wrong with the sport and more people would have less of a problem if the lifts were good lifts.
I wear gear and like it because I can lift more and because I know that I am safer in it then with out it. Also don’t listen to the multiply guys that claim 200-500 out of gear most of those people have no idea what their raw max is.
[quote]MaddyD wrote:
Invictica wrote:
better not Sprint with clits
wow thats new,I always sprint with clits
“cleats” my friend [/quote]
DAMMIT!
Oh well, what’s done is done. I’m not gonna edit it. Its funnier this way.
[quote]buckeye girl wrote:
jonatan-shg wrote:
tmcg86 wrote:
jonatan-shg wrote:
Ruggerlife wrote:
BlackLabel wrote:
Im gonna get alotta shit for this but…
What’s the point of using gear? Why not just lift Raw and get more satisfaction from doing it yourself instead of the shirt or suit giving you those extra lbs. Ive just never seen the point.
Why do golfer’s use Big Bertha?
Why do Tennis players use new lighter/better rackets?
Why do hockey players use graphite sticks?
Why do [insert sport here] use [insert new equipment]?
And the similarity is what?
To play tennis you NEED a racket, to squat you need yourself, a barbell and plates, you don’t need a suit.
So no, it’s not the same thing.
I still don’t think there’s a fed that allows you to squat naked. So yes, you need a suit 
How tight and strong it can be, depends on the rules of the fed.
Life would be simpler if there was no gear. Just show up and lift. I’ve worn gear because i wanted to be competitive against other people wearing gear. Nobody who wears gear is competing in raw feds, nobody is pretending that these are raw lifts. It makes sense to wear the same gear as everybody else.
Yes, but as you say, people wear gear because other people wear gear, not because they really want to wear gear.
If there was no gear, it would be alot simpler.
I’m not saying, there should be no gear, so don’t whine, all you gear users, I use gear myself, but I would prefer doing it raw.
I think the similarity is pretty obvious. Like it or not, equipped powerlifting is a sport, which is arguably a whole different ballgame from raw lifting. Asking why an equipped powerlifter would want better, tighter gear with new fabrics is like asking why other athletes use the best equipment the can get their hands on. The point is to be the best, most competitive athlete you can be as the rules allow.
Whether you like the gear or not, successful equipped lifters at least deserve some amount of respect. To be successful requires a great deal of skill and technique on top of massive amounts of strength.
One of the reason guys that are moving insane amounts of weight are able to do so is because they’ve mastered their gear. You can’t put a shitty lifter in a Leviathan or SDP shirt and expect him to put 300 pounds on his lift. Gear like that is only going to make your technical flaws and weaknesses more obvious.
You certainly don’t need a suit to squat, but that’s what makes geared powerlifting a SPORT called Equipped Powerlifting. You also don’t need a platform, or 3 judges, or federations, or records or meets to be able to squat, but that is all part of the sport.
jonatan-shg, If you don’t want to compete against geared athletes, you have two options: compete in the raw division, or go workout in a gym and wear whatever you want on squat day. No one is holding a gun to your head and forcing you into a squat suit and just about every fed has a raw division now.
And…B rock
My whole point when I posted this was to have a place to discuss/whine/bitch/question gear use, rather than cluttering up other legitimate threads that have been created to actually discuss powerlifting.
I’m a high-squatting multi-ply powerlifter and don’t give a flying fuck about which anonymous internet personas approve of what I wear when I lift. As long as my numbers are going up and my name is going in the record books, I’m happy. I’m just tired of people bringing up gear in an attempt to disparage the efforts of successful lifters and ruin other threads.[/quote]
No, I can’t just join a RAW fed. I live in Denmark, and we only have one fed, a geared one.
I don’t care, either, if people use gear, I do myself, I just think it would help the popularity of to sport to do it raw.
[quote]malonetd wrote:
What’s ridiculous? I listed things people don’t need to play their chosen sport, yet these things are generally accepted.
The comparison to a sprinter’s shoes is probably the most appropriate, though, since the level of increased performance is comparable.[/quote]
I think nearly every example you listed was a piece of equipment that is required by the official rules for organized competition of the sport or is needed for the direct safety of the athlete/participant.