whats wrong with linear periodization. apparently its outdated and we are all too advanced for it
[quote]batman122 wrote:
whats wrong with linear periodization. apparently its outdated and we are all too advanced for it
[/quote]
He’s just doing a different form of periodization and looks to be getting steadily stronger while doing it. Anything wrong with that? Personally after doing western periodization for a while, I found it monotonous and much prefer conjugate periodization myself. I make consistant gains and don’t have to worry about any miscalculations and not hitting reps that I should be.
[quote]batman122 wrote:
whats wrong with linear periodization. apparently its outdated and we are all too advanced for it
[/quote]
Personally, linear periodization leaves me burnt out physically and psychologically and I’m more likely to get hurt doing it so progress stalls a lot. I don’t have those problems following Westside principles.
lots of people claim they get burnt out, thats because most people program out cycles with their ego. conjugate is useless for raw
[quote]batman122 wrote:
lots of people claim they get burnt out, thats because most people program out cycles with their ego. conjugate is useless for raw[/quote]
Care to post vids of your latest meet or mock meet like Fletch did? Then post vids of you a couple years ago and show us all the progress you’ve made while shitting on Westside?
show me any half successful raw lifters that use westside. theres about 2. i just dont like the fact that the sports been polluted and misinformation is everywhere. read lift run bang and juggernaut enough and if youre half intelligent youll catch on
At first I wrote batman off as just a troll, but your posts are getting slightly more interesting, so I’ll bite.
I agree with you that I think there is a lot of misinformation out there, and that raw lifters get caught up in the louie simmons bandwagon and end up practicing a lot of principles that might be more for geared lifters. But in the end, hard work is hard work, smart programming is smart programming. If you are going into the gym and a) lifting heavy ass weights, and then b) lifting lighter weights for lots of reps, you are probably going to get stronger. There are a million ways to program this kind of thing. You can do it 5/3/1 style - go in, lift your 3 + reps, then do boring but big assistance - say 60% for 5 x 10. Or you can go in monday, work up to a heavy 3 for your max effort, then go back thursday and do 15 x 3 at 60% for speed work, or 5 x 10 for some rep-effort. Not really much difference.
Philosophically, I agree with you that one should stick more to main movements. I agree that there is a lot of information out there that is geared towards lifters in suits and shirts. But you can’t write off “west side” because it’s not really a thing haha. It’s a training methodology, an idea that people try and follow. But everyone who does “west side” and doesn’t actually train with louie is doing their own spin. For example, you don’t see fletch doing super wide stance squats. For all you know, his workouts or my workouts or anyone who uses “west side” methodologies could pretty much look exactly the same as your workouts.
Bottom line is, there’s no use hating so hard in this sport. What works for you today might not work next year, and what you hate today might be the magic program/exercise/mindset that moves you forward in the future. Everybody is different and people have gotten strong a thousand different ways, so it’s best to open your mind, absorb all the information you can, give everything a shot, and learn from those experiences.
[quote]N.K. wrote:
At first I wrote batman off as just a troll, but your posts are getting slightly more interesting, so I’ll bite.
I agree with you that I think there is a lot of misinformation out there, and that raw lifters get caught up in the louie simmons bandwagon and end up practicing a lot of principles that might be more for geared lifters. But in the end, hard work is hard work, smart programming is smart programming. If you are going into the gym and a) lifting heavy ass weights, and then b) lifting lighter weights for lots of reps, you are probably going to get stronger. There are a million ways to program this kind of thing. You can do it 5/3/1 style - go in, lift your 3 + reps, then do boring but big assistance - say 60% for 5 x 10. Or you can go in monday, work up to a heavy 3 for your max effort, then go back thursday and do 15 x 3 at 60% for speed work, or 5 x 10 for some rep-effort. Not really much difference.
Philosophically, I agree with you that one should stick more to main movements. I agree that there is a lot of information out there that is geared towards lifters in suits and shirts. But you can’t write off “west side” because it’s not really a thing haha. It’s a training methodology, an idea that people try and follow. But everyone who does “west side” and doesn’t actually train with louie is doing their own spin. For example, you don’t see fletch doing super wide stance squats. For all you know, his workouts or my workouts or anyone who uses “west side” methodologies could pretty much look exactly the same as your workouts.
Bottom line is, there’s no use hating so hard in this sport. What works for you today might not work next year, and what you hate today might be the magic program/exercise/mindset that moves you forward in the future. Everybody is different and people have gotten strong a thousand different ways, so it’s best to open your mind, absorb all the information you can, give everything a shot, and learn from those experiences. [/quote]
Being dogmatic about any training methodology is kind of silly; unless you’ve written a program and are making money from it, you’ve got no personal investment beyond what you do in the gym yourself.
I’ll agree that I’m not a fan of conjugate periodization for raw lifters, and if pressed by someone looking for programming advice, I’d never steer anyone in that direction. But, ultimately, I don’t give a shit, and I’m sure the person in question doesn’t either. Do I think it looks silly when someone says they hit a 235lb PR on reverse band ultra-wide grip floor press? Sure, that’s entirely too many adjectives and not nearly enough weight. But that doesn’t make me give enough of a shit to tell them they’re doing it wrong, nor does it give me the right.
[quote]N.K. wrote:
At first I wrote batman off as just a troll, but your posts are getting slightly more interesting, so I’ll bite.
I agree with you that I think there is a lot of misinformation out there, and that raw lifters get caught up in the louie simmons bandwagon and end up practicing a lot of principles that might be more for geared lifters. But in the end, hard work is hard work, smart programming is smart programming. If you are going into the gym and a) lifting heavy ass weights, and then b) lifting lighter weights for lots of reps, you are probably going to get stronger. There are a million ways to program this kind of thing. You can do it 5/3/1 style - go in, lift your 3 + reps, then do boring but big assistance - say 60% for 5 x 10. Or you can go in monday, work up to a heavy 3 for your max effort, then go back thursday and do 15 x 3 at 60% for speed work, or 5 x 10 for some rep-effort. Not really much difference.
Philosophically, I agree with you that one should stick more to main movements. I agree that there is a lot of information out there that is geared towards lifters in suits and shirts. But you can’t write off “west side” because it’s not really a thing haha. It’s a training methodology, an idea that people try and follow. But everyone who does “west side” and doesn’t actually train with louie is doing their own spin. For example, you don’t see fletch doing super wide stance squats. For all you know, his workouts or my workouts or anyone who uses “west side” methodologies could pretty much look exactly the same as your workouts.
Bottom line is, there’s no use hating so hard in this sport. What works for you today might not work next year, and what you hate today might be the magic program/exercise/mindset that moves you forward in the future. Everybody is different and people have gotten strong a thousand different ways, so it’s best to open your mind, absorb all the information you can, give everything a shot, and learn from those experiences. [/quote]
oh im most certainly a troll! however i do try and absorb everything, i tried westside for a good year or two. completely wasted my time. a modified westside could work like the cube does, but thats pretty much half old school linear periodization as well if you check brandons logs. he doesnt fuck around with reverse safety squat bar band chain good morning squats. to be honest i started into this fucking thread drunk!ha. so probably came off badly.
at one stage i was a huge westside/louie simmons fanboy also to be brutally honest
[quote]batman122 wrote:
oh im most certainly a troll! however i do try and absorb everything, i tried westside for a good year or two. completely wasted my time. a modified westside could work like the cube does, but thats pretty much half old school linear periodization as well if you check brandons logs. he doesnt fuck around with reverse safety squat bar band chain good morning squats. to be honest i started into this fucking thread drunk!ha. so probably came off badly.
[/quote]
If you wasted your time you probably picked the wrong exercises to increase your main lifts. It is a template involving ME, DE, and RE, that’s all. The exercises you pick are ones that increase your main lifts. Bands, Chains, SS bar are just bells and whistles they are not the template. Most likely you did not identify what needed to be worked on and pick a lift that made it stronger. If you did not get stronger on the main lifts with your previous workouts, those exercises need to be dropped and different ones used.
Don’t have anything against other methods, many ways to skin a cat. Though if you weren’t getting stronger with a conjugate template, you most likely did it wrong by not properly evaluating your exercise selection.
I’m definitely not doing it totally by the book.
My ‘DE’ work is actually based off of Prilipen’s table with straight weight since the resistance curve is so different for raw lifters. Although, I’m experimenting with doing that and speed work with barbells the way it’s more normally thought of.
I also don’t do the DE work with box or a stance or style any different than the one I normally use.
[quote]Fletch1986 wrote:
I’m definitely not doing it totally by the book.
My ‘DE’ work is actually based off of Prilipen’s table with straight weight since the resistance curve is so different for raw lifters. Although, I’m experimenting with doing that and speed work with barbells the way it’s more normally thought of.
I also don’t do the DE work with box or a stance or style any different than the one I normally use.
[/quote]
No need to do it by the book, Westside doesn’t even do it by the book. It is ever evolving. If it makes you stronger, keep it in your rotation (or arsenal,) if it doesn’t, drop it or save it for a time where you think it may help. The only important thing is that your lifts go up in weight. If they are, keep at it.