Fiscal Cliff Deal Reached

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
341

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]phaethon wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
It is a punishment on wealth creation, in the same manner a speeding ticket is a punishment on driving too fast. There is NO logical difference between a fine and a tax. We call it a tax when applied to something positive, and a fine when applied to a negative. If a progressive income tax isn’t a punishment for getting rich, speeding tickets aren’t a punishment for speeding.[/quote]

There is a significant difference between the two. A fine is intended to discourage an activity. A tax can be intended to discourage an activity but often is not. Income tax is not a punishment. The government wants you to work to earn more money so that it can take a piece.
[/quote]

I was speaking of function, not intent. Intent makes no difference to the people paying. I could shoot you to free your spirit of your corrupted physical body, it’s still murder and you’re still dead.
[/quote]

And wrong again. Intent is incredibly important. To say intent makes no difference is inane.

342

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]smh23 wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:

The idea of people paying their fair share should be zoomed in, as in California the top 15% pay 80% of the taxes.
[/quote]

What percentage of the total wealth do the top 15 percent command?[/quote]

Who cares? How is that relevant to the standard of living of others?[/quote]

Very, because assuming that they get paid voluntarily they made their customers lives better by making that money.

343

[quote]MaximusB wrote:

[quote]smh23 wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

It is a punishment on wealth creation, in the same manner a speeding ticket is a punishment on driving too fast. There is NO logical difference between a fine and a tax. We call it a tax when applied to something positive, and a fine when applied to a negative. If a progressive income tax isn’t a punishment for getting rich, speeding tickets aren’t a punishment for speeding.[/quote]

Semantics. Call it a “punishment,” doesn’t bother me. Doesn’t do jack shit to alter my point–that raising taxes on people on the cusp of welfare eligibility is stupid.[/quote]

I want to share something with SMH…

Our governor sold Proposition 30 as a tax increase needed for schools, he talked about how the kids needed the money, and how could we deny “the children.”

This tax taxed the wealthy and raised sales tax by 1/4%, bringing in an estimated $6 Billion.

So what happened once it passed, the lame ass governor gave Union workers raises and plans to expand Medicaid.

Oh and his budget for next year spends $6 Billion more than last year, how convenient since Prop 30 brings in $6 Billion. The tax was passed to pay for the spending increase, we are now over $100 Billion per year in spending, of which $46 Billion goes to the schools.

Governor Brown lied, the money went to give raises to Union workers, it did nothing for “the children.” Now, if you want to suggest that paying teachers more money equates to better student performance, we (California) are ranked 36th in education while having the highest paid teachers in the nation. So 35 states are doing it better for cheaper.

I would almost argue that raising taxes on the wealthy (or on anyone) is less important than how the money is truly spent. [/quote]

I’m not sure what this has to do with anything I’ve said. I’m certainly not arguing in favor of wasteful spending. And I’m not arguing in favor of high taxes on the rich. So…

344

[quote]phaethon wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]phaethon wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
It is a punishment on wealth creation, in the same manner a speeding ticket is a punishment on driving too fast. There is NO logical difference between a fine and a tax. We call it a tax when applied to something positive, and a fine when applied to a negative. If a progressive income tax isn’t a punishment for getting rich, speeding tickets aren’t a punishment for speeding.[/quote]

There is a significant difference between the two. A fine is intended to discourage an activity. A tax can be intended to discourage an activity but often is not. Income tax is not a punishment. The government wants you to work to earn more money so that it can take a piece.
[/quote]

I was speaking of function, not intent. Intent makes no difference to the people paying. I could shoot you to free your spirit of your corrupted physical body, it’s still murder and you’re still dead.
[/quote]

And wrong again. Intent is incredibly important. To say intent makes no difference is inane.[/quote]

You didn’t read what I wrote. Intent does not affect the market. It does not change what it does to the people paying. Progressive income taxation functions the same way speeding tickets do. The fact that you are hiding behind intent to distinguish the 2 proves my point. Progressive taxation is a penalty for success.