What do you mean by lofty do you mean unattainable or just it’s going to take a lot of work with no slacking
Well after looking at people who are 511 and 250 with 10% body fat I see what you mean well I guess my goal is that but if I land anywhere near 200 lbs with 10% body fat I will be extremely happy
Start a training log. This thread has just turned into random thoughts.
Below is an example from my log for my contest prep. You’ll get a lot more guidance on training and eating than in the pharma section.
Consistency in the log will be motivational and lead to consistency in eating/training.
6/13/2023
Weight 208.2
Food-Cals2437/C295/F72/P170
Meal1 4 whole eggs/80g oats/1 apple
Meal2 6oz chicken thigh/150g rice/green beans
Meal3 3 bean and cheese tacos w/rice
Meal4 2 peanut butter and jelly sand pre WO
Meal5 6 french toast
Training
Reps 226/Poundage 1795
down 10 reps/up 910lbs from last legs1
Legs1
Arsenal squat 270x10/450x8/540x8x630/6
Arsenal leg press 450x10/630x10/720x6
Adductor/abductor 4x15ea
Standing calves 4x15 to 300lbs
Arsenal leg extension 70x15/80x13/90x10/100x6
Cardio
No cardio
This hurt today. Added a fair bit of weight to my total poundage!! I think the every other week heavy work is paying off.
I’ve been really trying to focus on time under tension and I feel like it’s making my muscles bigger and harder but not necessarily adding strength
I mean its certainly doable with the trifecta… proper training/nutrition, drugs, and genetics. You would have to be dialed in on all three. Even with that it would take a few years IMO.
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250 is achievable, 10% is achievable, both at the same time is tough even with gear. I don’t believe I could do it at 5’10" TBH. My genetics just aren’t there for that size.
At 5’11", 220 lbs and 10% will be quite impressive. Nearly everyone that knows about training will know you use gear if you achieve this. Most will think you are a ton of gear (because most people that get there, are on a ton of gear.
For reference, I have a buddy that is between 5’11" and 6’. He is lean (I’d say right around 10%) and about 225 lbs. He looks freaky. Not open BBer freaky, but really vascular and strong AF. He is squatting in the 600s, benching over 450, strict pressing ~330 and has done an 800 lb deadlift. He takes what consider to be a lot of gear. Mostly Test and Tren, but often is taking over 2 grams combined.
I think he could get to 250, but even with his good genetics, 10% might be pushing it.
Another example is Chris Bumstead. He is 6’1", and in the off season gets to 265 lbs. I think he is above 10% body fat though in the off season. Not by a whole lot, but I’d guess more 12-14%. IIRC, he competes at 230 lbs, and is 4-5% body fat. Keep in mind he is the classic physique champion.
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@blshaw I think I’m gonna go beyond lofty and say [just being honest] damn near difficult/impossible.
Yes, of course, physique wise-given the right combination of A LOT of drugs, getting Hany or Chad Nicholls to prepare your diet and you sticking to every single gram of eating those macros, meal after meal, day and week and month and year after year, AND also getting one of the aforementioned pro trainers to craft your workout program and, not to be repetitive but you sticking to every exercise for every workout…If you can pull all that off then yes, it’s attainable!
The reason I said the above is because that is probably the only way you might get close to 5’11 250 with 10%[or less]BF. Given your age, that will also be an obstacle as we don’t recover as well and assimilate new muscle as rapidly/easily -even with drugs.
Now what @mnben87 said (5’11 220 but in the low teens BF) would be A BIT easier, but still would require ultra strict drugs, training, and most importantly eating and thinking about it now, I’d say that’s even a big stretch.
I can’t recall what you said you weighed, I may be wrong but I thought you said around 230-240. If that’s the case, we’ll just say 240, then right now you are carrying approximately…get ready for this…72lbs of BF!! (at 30%…I’m guesstimating but in your pics, even the newer ones I’d put you at 25% minimum but probably closer to 30%). Sucks to read that poundage, huh? Now I’m NOT saying this to dog you or get you down, but to show just how much most of us underestimate our BF% and way overestimate how much true lean body mass/muscle, we really are carrying. So with the above 72lbs, the math is easy and you my dude are really approx. 168lbs of lean muscle/bones/organs/etc. Give or take.
With all that said, if you dieted down to 10% from your current state, you’d weigh approx. 192lbs…BUT at 5’11 and 192lbs @ 10% BF [and yes, you’d have visible abs…not bodybuilder onstage abs but very visible] you’d look 1000X better than 240lbs, or more if you “bulked” even more and got heavier. You really have to do it just once to really see for yourself what I’m talking about. Anyone reading this who has ever dieted down for a show and been VERY lean, as in single digit BF, knows what I mean. We as lifters always get SO concerned with how BIG we can get, how much we can weigh, that almost all recreational lifters never really get very low in BF because the ego hit we’d take watching that scale go down 15, 20, 30 lbs or more would mindfuck a lot of people. However, once you’ve ever done this and seen pictures of yourself, ESPECIALLY if you take before pictures in say your underwear from all angles and then after pictures - it WILL blow your mind (it is also helpful taking the pics in your drawers so you can really see where your particular body “likes” to deposit most of your bodyfat)! You very quickly forget about what number the scale says you now weigh and instead you [or at least this was my first thought when I saw myself dieted down for my first competition] will think “jesus christ, I was a fatty, bloated, blob with some muscle that thought he was “jacked” but I looked awful!” You’ll see how before you have virtually zero muscle definition, vascularity, striations, etc. You literally just were big and puffy and blocky but felt “big” because the scale told you so.
BUT, dieting down and getting to that low of a BF% is HARD, no doubt about it, and most lifters simply cannot stick to the strict diet, cardio, training, and NO CHEATING/SKIPPING MEALS/ALTERING THE DIET so it just doesn’t happen. Because even those men’s physique looking guys, the ab model guys in men’s health or whatever magazine, they are all INSANELY STRICT with their diet and training because you simply have to be to see ALL of your six-pack abs and to see all that muscle detail. You can see it on them because they have very, very little bodyfat.
For you Frank, I’d say to start slow and aim to get down to maybe 18-20%BF (but you have to figure out a way to get it accurately measured, you just cannot guess as again, we always way underestimate our BF levels) and take some pics and see how you look and feel. If you are able to do that, then keep at it and keep aiming to get a bit lower and lower every couple of months. But MONTHS is the key term because it is going to take MANY MONTHS for you dude to get all that BF burned off of you, so treat it like a marathon and play the long game. It will NOT happen in 2-3 months, that’s next to impossible and you’d literally have to starve yourself and then you will also lose your muscle tissue in the process. Give it a shot.
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I wholeheartedly agree with your post.
That is generous too. Most cutting from 30% to 10% will lose some muscle. I know the “if you get adequate protein and train thing”, but the reality is that much weight loss usually does end up causing some lean tissue loss.
If one were to cut using a lot of gear, then sure. Or if one were to do some anabolics after the cut, they’d regain size quickly.
This was me when I was powerlifting. I was a gross looking 230 lbs at 5’10" (natty at the time). I thought I looked big and was only 10-15 lbs away from abs haha.
As you said, it can be a bit depressing hitting these lower numbers on the scale and still the abs aren’t that great. I am at 185 lbs, and I have a 6 pack, but it isn’t quite where I’d like it to be. I had ab outline at 205-210 and with good lighting it didn’t look too bad. I just would have thought that being down to 185, I’d be jacked as hell.
I use this example a lot, but Frank Zane. Was an inch shorter than I am, but competed at about 190. I was previously delusional to think I was just a bit above 20% at 230 lbs. That would put me as having more lean tissue naturally than a 3X Mr. O winner. Occam’s razor says I was living in a fantasy at the time haha.
In another thread today, a guy has a goal of reaching 205 lbs at 10% BF at 5’10" with his first cycle. Starting at 180 lbs, but who knows what the BF % is. I brought up Zane, because the goal on the first cycle is basically matching Zane’s lean tissue with only 5% more body fat. The numbers he mentioned don’t sound as ridiculous as saying I want to match Zane’s muscle mass but be 5% more BF with my first cycle.
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I agree 100% but also not trying to crush anyone’s dreams. I’ve also seen some damn near miracle transformations but they are certainly rare.
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I’ve been going from 210 to 220 back and forth right now I’m at 214 yes I wholeheartedly agree that my diet needs consistency I’ve been trying a few different workout methods I’m not willing to give up until I reach my goals I’m getting more disciplined with my diet my tracker really helped me see how off my macros were
Well I just found a way to get my protein easily I just blended a lb of chicken breast in water and drank it its super easy I could easily eat 3lbs of chicken a day
That’s one way to do it if you’re lacking protein. If you’re cutting it would be much more satiating to prepare the chicken and make a proper meal. Chicken blended in water doesn’t sound very appetizing.
Congratulations. Consistency is key.
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It doesn’t taste bad I bet adding an avocado and some raw honey would probably make it taste good
I threw up in my mouth a little bit.
Fully agree. I like to find hacks to make dieting easier. Finding things I like that are filling and not much calories helps a lot. The only calories I drink are protein shakes, and a few light beers or seltzers on Friday and Saturday. Nothing excessive on the ethanol, I try to just have social drinks these days. Cutting the booze way down has helped quite a bit physique wise IMO.
Yeah I don’t drink alcohol or smoke/ vape cigarettes/nicotine
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Or…you could roast, saute or grill the chicken, with a honey glaze and with an avocado salad on the side. Just an idea.
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Or just have a protein shake in a normal flavor like chocolate or vanilla if you must drink your protein source.
Cooking is ideal, but a regular protein shake I see as a great tool for lifters. I can’t imagine it’s much more expensive than blending chicken.
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Well a lb of chicken breast has 139 grams of protein I would have to drink 6 protein shakes to get that much protein