Fighting Someone High on Meth

Off Topic
61

[quote]B rocK wrote:
Find out where your sibling gets his shit, call the cops when he’s there and pray he gets arrested. It’s something i’ve thought about doing several times for a family member in a similar situation. [/quote]

If you have any sort of concern for your brother whatsoever, then this is the worst fucking idea I have ever heard of in my life. Even if you and your brother weren’t close at all and hated each other’s guts, it’s the worst idea I’ve ever heard.

First off, any addict can get clean and sober. There are no “lost causes”. That person cannot clean unless they are WILLING to do everything it takes to get sober. There is a huge difference between this and WANTING to be sober. If someone is deep in the throes of addiction and are unwilling to seek help, fine. If they are a loved one and you have done everything you can to get them help and they still won’t get sober, then you simply tell them that they are going to die if they continue down the path they are on and that you cannot bear to watch this slow suicide unfold so you are leaving this person’s life.

If you call the police and get him arrested, in all likelihood this will only increase the chances that he continues to abuse drugs. Traumatic experiences in jail/prison can occur, many of which do absolutely nothing to better his chances of remaining sober when he gets out of prison. All narcing on your brother does is eliminate a problem of YOURS, not his. If you simply don’t care about him at all, fine. Leave. Don’t be a bitch and rat him out. As a blood relative, his substance abuse certainly is your business because it effects you as well. But the question of the legality of his drug abuse is not your business at all, so you should not involve the police in this case. What would you do if a brother or sister were a hardcore alcoholic? Would you set them up to get busted driving drunk? How would you get rid of that problem huh?

62

[quote]B rocK wrote:
Find out where your sibling gets his shit, call the cops when he’s there and pray he gets arrested. It’s something i’ve thought about doing several times for a family member in a similar situation. [/quote]

From my extensive research of the US penal system through watching the Discovery Channel, I’ve learned that prison is a bad place to go if you’re a junkie.

63

[quote]Steel Nation wrote:

[quote]B rocK wrote:
Find out where your sibling gets his shit, call the cops when he’s there and pray he gets arrested. It’s something i’ve thought about doing several times for a family member in a similar situation. [/quote]

From my extensive research of the US penal system through watching the Discovery Channel, I’ve learned that prison is a bad place to go if you’re a junkie.[/quote]

Exactly. I’m sorry (actually, I’m not) but if you are willing to narc out a family member and send them to prison/jail over their drug addiction, you’re a bitch. Plain and simple. All this does is ease your own mind and it does nothing to ease the problems of the real person in need: the addict.

And all I have to say about fighting meth freaks is this: it’s real fucking hard for them to have lowered inhibitions and a high pain threshold if you SLIT THEIR FUCKING THROATS!!!

64

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

if I were in a fight right now, regardless of who I am fighting, I would definitely use kicks to the groin, jabs to the throat and/or eyes, I would try to cave your knees in and I would use any and all weaponry available to me. You never know in a fight, so I employ the Bas Rutten technique: anything goes.

But that is w/o being under the influence of meth. So, really meth would just make me a worse fighter because although my general goal of maiming my opponent is still there, my coordination is lowered and although my pain threshold MAY be higher (I’ve never experienced anything firsthand to indicate that this a likelihood), I am not a better fighter.[/quote]

You really need to learn what the continuum of force is.

It is people like you who think they’re acting in self defense, but end up in jail for five years for aggravated assault, battery, and assault with a deadly weapon and can’t ever get a job again because they don’t understand the legal system.

That’s the difference between “self defense” and fighting.

I love Bas Rutten, but everything he shows in that video, and talks about, will get the normal person locked up for many years.

65

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

if I were in a fight right now, regardless of who I am fighting, I would definitely use kicks to the groin, jabs to the throat and/or eyes, I would try to cave your knees in and I would use any and all weaponry available to me. You never know in a fight, so I employ the Bas Rutten technique: anything goes.

But that is w/o being under the influence of meth. So, really meth would just make me a worse fighter because although my general goal of maiming my opponent is still there, my coordination is lowered and although my pain threshold MAY be higher (I’ve never experienced anything firsthand to indicate that this a likelihood), I am not a better fighter.[/quote]

You really need to learn what the continuum of force is.

It is people like you who think they’re acting in self defense, but end up in jail for five years for aggravated assault, battery, and assault with a deadly weapon and can’t ever get a job again because they don’t understand the legal system.

That’s the difference between “self defense” and fighting.

I love Bas Rutten, but everything he shows in that video, and talks about, will get the normal person locked up for many years.
[/quote]

That behavior would only get me locked up if it was determined to be an excessive response to the threat I faced. Naturally I wouldn’t just kick some guy in the groin unprovoked. But if I were attacked, I’m not fighting fair and I’m fighting as viciously as possible until the threat to my safety has been neutralized and does not represent one to me anymore.

If a guy punches me in the face and I shoot him in self-defense, that is excessive and I will go to prison for manslaughter or possibly 2nd degree murder. But this has nothing to do with the OP. He simply stated that he thought fighting a meth freak would be a bad idea because of lowered inhibitions and a high pain threshold.

What I am having trouble saying in a succinct manner is that: A) the high pain threshold is pure bullshit in regards to meth and B) that a meth freak with lowered inhibitions doesn’t present any larger threat than anyone else does because we can all have varying degrees of lowered inhibitions and his willingness to go too far is offset by his lack of coordination or strength. Especially when facing a sober person whose inhibitions are already low enough where a vicious punch to the floating rib followed by a jab in the trachea and perhaps some eye-gouging is not out of the question, IF THESE ACTIONS REPRESENT A NECESSARY RESPONSE TO THE THREAT I FACE

My uncle was in the Hell’s Angels and he was one vicious motherfucker when it came to fighting. HE is a threat much more so than the 130 lb meth-addled loser who is willing to stab me with any sharp object he can find.

66

I tried an angel dust laced blunt 14 years ago and never did a drug since. It was a fun AND horrifying experience. I really thought the trip wasn’t going to end. I was hanging out with some dudes in high school and I would smoke weed here and there, never in large amounts and never frequently. One night we were out and they offered me but DID tell me what it was laced with. I said “whatever”, not knowing just how powerful that stuff is.

Only smoked a few stogies to get me through a 5 week stint of the Rapid Fat Loss diet earlier this year-never put any crap in my body since then. :slight_smile:

67

[quote]on edge wrote:

[quote]Nards wrote:
I learned from some sort of instructional video back in the 80s that a guy on PCP could put his fist through a car windshield, break every bone in his hand and not feel it for hours.
I think it was hosted by Lance Henriksen.[/quote]

No that was Terminator[/quote]
.

68

[quote]Vegita wrote:
Maybe this has already been thought about, but I didn’t see it posted and thought, Well it’s probably a good idea to post this just in case you didn’t already think of it.

Stick it in his pooper?

V[/quote]

FUCKING LOL!

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792×600 161 KB

Come at me, bro!

70

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
PCP and Meth are NOT the same thing. Lots of guys around here have committed murders while high on PCP, usually smoking joints dipped in embalming fluid which usually does contain some PCP. You don’t hear the same from the meth guys. They just stay up for days getting high and are more likely to steal shit than to murder someone. And Nikki, crackheads don’t fight, they just walk around very fast, looking for their next hit or some shit to steal to sell to get their next hit :)[/quote]

One of the joys of living in oregon, is we plateaued our meth epidemic some time ago–namely, every child born since 1980 or so, has grown up seeing tweakers out in the streets. We here can’t help but notice, now it’s showing up on the east coast, there’s finally federal dollars being thrown at it. But yeah, it bloomed here. The irritating part is, this whole thing could’ve been nipped in the bud if some cold medication lobbyists hadn’t successfully blocked attempts to track ephedrine shipments for two decades.

Anyway, the long and short is, it’s worse than fucking crack cocaine. At least crackheads die, unlike tweakers, which just drain society for the rest of their miserable meth-mouthed lives, not to mention fucking up (and literally fucking, sex abuse is rife in the population) their families too. Cops love a pot bust, because they make money. Meth busts leave nothing but hell-holes that need to be hazmat cleaned. To quote The King of Methlahem, “Meth is a lifestyle drug.”

It seems most of the violence they commit is on each other. However, they’re like magpies. They’ll steal anything shiny. Seriously, they’ll break into your house, leave the stereo alone, but steal your favorite CD.

A tweaker deal is something else. A guy who hasn’t slept in a week, drives out to a trailer in the woods to meet another guy who hasn’t slept in a week. The first guy knows the second guy hasn’t slept in a week, so he brings a friend. The second guy knows the first guy knows he hasn’t slept in a week and is bringing a friend, so he has a friend too.

Now, the first guy knows the second guy knows he hasn’t slept in a week and is also bringing a friend, so he’s armed. And the second guy knows the first guy hasn’t slept in a week, knows he has a friend too, and is armed, so he’s armed too. And so on. So, you end up with a bunch of psychos in a trailer out in the woods full of toxic shit, armed like a mad max movie, who all haven’t slept in a week. (seriously, they use, or used to use, I guess, hydroiodic acid and phosphorus, not to mention a shitload of solvents)
I’m not surprised by the amount of trailers that show up in the news after they explode. I’m surprised there’s any tweakers left alive who haven’t been asploded.

Unfortunately, if a tweaker comes clean, his brain chemistry is never right again. It causes schizophrenia. (It’s strange to use that as a symptom rather than a diagnosis now. APA changed its definition a couple years ago.) Tweakers will always be tweakers.

71

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
PCP and Meth are NOT the same thing. Lots of guys around here have committed murders while high on PCP, usually smoking joints dipped in embalming fluid which usually does contain some PCP. You don’t hear the same from the meth guys. They just stay up for days getting high and are more likely to steal shit than to murder someone. And Nikki, crackheads don’t fight, they just walk around very fast, looking for their next hit or some shit to steal to sell to get their next hit :)[/quote]

Ever wanna cheap sparring partner, give a crackhead five bucks and tell him you’ll come back next tomorrow. You’ll never get your five bucks back, but you’ll have a sparring partner until the guy cleans himself up from getting his ass kicked twice a week.

72

[quote]Totenkopf wrote:

[quote]on edge wrote:

[quote]Nards wrote:
I learned from some sort of instructional video back in the 80s that a guy on PCP could put his fist through a car windshield, break every bone in his hand and not feel it for hours.
I think it was hosted by Lance Henriksen.[/quote]

No that was Terminator[/quote]
.[/quote]

Thanks Totenkopf!

73

Think what you want about my response. But some people need to learn a lesson the hard way. That’s my belief and no amount of internet chatter is going to make me recind what I think.

74

[quote]ether_bunny wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
PCP and Meth are NOT the same thing. Lots of guys around here have committed murders while high on PCP, usually smoking joints dipped in embalming fluid which usually does contain some PCP. You don’t hear the same from the meth guys. They just stay up for days getting high and are more likely to steal shit than to murder someone. And Nikki, crackheads don’t fight, they just walk around very fast, looking for their next hit or some shit to steal to sell to get their next hit :)[/quote]

One of the joys of living in oregon, is we plateaued our meth epidemic some time ago–namely, every child born since 1980 or so, has grown up seeing tweakers out in the streets. We here can’t help but notice, now it’s showing up on the east coast, there’s finally federal dollars being thrown at it. But yeah, it bloomed here. The irritating part is, this whole thing could’ve been nipped in the bud if some cold medication lobbyists hadn’t successfully blocked attempts to track ephedrine shipments for two decades.

Anyway, the long and short is, it’s worse than fucking crack cocaine. At least crackheads die, unlike tweakers, which just drain society for the rest of their miserable meth-mouthed lives, not to mention fucking up (and literally fucking, sex abuse is rife in the population) their families too. Cops love a pot bust, because they make money. Meth busts leave nothing but hell-holes that need to be hazmat cleaned. To quote The King of Methlahem, “Meth is a lifestyle drug.”

It seems most of the violence they commit is on each other. However, they’re like magpies. They’ll steal anything shiny. Seriously, they’ll break into your house, leave the stereo alone, but steal your favorite CD.

A tweaker deal is something else. A guy who hasn’t slept in a week, drives out to a trailer in the woods to meet another guy who hasn’t slept in a week. The first guy knows the second guy hasn’t slept in a week, so he brings a friend. The second guy knows the first guy knows he hasn’t slept in a week and is bringing a friend, so he has a friend too.

Now, the first guy knows the second guy knows he hasn’t slept in a week and is also bringing a friend, so he’s armed. And the second guy knows the first guy hasn’t slept in a week, knows he has a friend too, and is armed, so he’s armed too. And so on. So, you end up with a bunch of psychos in a trailer out in the woods full of toxic shit, armed like a mad max movie, who all haven’t slept in a week. (seriously, they use, or used to use, I guess, hydroiodic acid and phosphorus, not to mention a shitload of solvents)
I’m not surprised by the amount of trailers that show up in the news after they explode. I’m surprised there’s any tweakers left alive who haven’t been asploded.

Unfortunately, if a tweaker comes clean, his brain chemistry is never right again. It causes schizophrenia. (It’s strange to use that as a symptom rather than a diagnosis now. APA changed its definition a couple years ago.) Tweakers will always be tweakers.
[/quote]

have you ever read “Methland” by Nick Reding? if not, i highly suggest it…i think you’ll find it very interesting.

75

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

if I were in a fight right now, regardless of who I am fighting, I would definitely use kicks to the groin, jabs to the throat and/or eyes, I would try to cave your knees in and I would use any and all weaponry available to me. You never know in a fight, so I employ the Bas Rutten technique: anything goes.

But that is w/o being under the influence of meth. So, really meth would just make me a worse fighter because although my general goal of maiming my opponent is still there, my coordination is lowered and although my pain threshold MAY be higher (I’ve never experienced anything firsthand to indicate that this a likelihood), I am not a better fighter.[/quote]

You really need to learn what the continuum of force is.

It is people like you who think they’re acting in self defense, but end up in jail for five years for aggravated assault, battery, and assault with a deadly weapon and can’t ever get a job again because they don’t understand the legal system.

That’s the difference between “self defense” and fighting.

I love Bas Rutten, but everything he shows in that video, and talks about, will get the normal person locked up for many years.
[/quote]

That behavior would only get me locked up if it was determined to be an excessive response to the threat I faced. Naturally I wouldn’t just kick some guy in the groin unprovoked. But if I were attacked, I’m not fighting fair and I’m fighting as viciously as possible until the threat to my safety has been neutralized and does not represent one to me anymore.

If a guy punches me in the face and I shoot him in self-defense, that is excessive and I will go to prison for manslaughter or possibly 2nd degree murder. But this has nothing to do with the OP. He simply stated that he thought fighting a meth freak would be a bad idea because of lowered inhibitions and a high pain threshold.

What I am having trouble saying in a succinct manner is that: A) the high pain threshold is pure bullshit in regards to meth and B) that a meth freak with lowered inhibitions doesn’t present any larger threat than anyone else does because we can all have varying degrees of lowered inhibitions and his willingness to go too far is offset by his lack of coordination or strength. Especially when facing a sober person whose inhibitions are already low enough where a vicious punch to the floating rib followed by a jab in the trachea and perhaps some eye-gouging is not out of the question, IF THESE ACTIONS REPRESENT A NECESSARY RESPONSE TO THE THREAT I FACE

My uncle was in the Hell’s Angels and he was one vicious motherfucker when it came to fighting. HE is a threat much more so than the 130 lb meth-addled loser who is willing to stab me with any sharp object he can find.[/quote]

you really don’t know what you’re talking about…

firstly, shooting someone in the scenario you described in murder. manslaughter is usually reseerved for negligance, or a bad fight where weapons are not involved.

secondly, methamphetamine does increase pain threshold substantially. hell, the precursors like tyrosine and dl-phenylalanine are consistenly recommended to those with chronic pain. meth is obviously quite a bit stronger, and therefore has a much more noticeable effect on pain threshold.

thirdly, not everyone on meth is 130lbs. a lot of people might be skinny, but they’re still strong as fuck from working construction 15 hours a day.

i have seen tweakers walk down a street and punch out every window of every car they see. i’ve found them by following the blood trail.

i’ve fought with tweakers who have broken bones so badly that they’re limb is just hanging, and it still takes 4 cops to strap them down. in fact, i got called one time because some jackass was chucking cinder bloacks at cars that were driving by. when i got him to jail, he fought 7 of us, and when we got him in the cell, he proceded to punch the plexiglass window until he had an open fracture in his hand. then he wrote his name in his blood.

i’ve seen tweakers dumping a lab, and when the cops show up, they start chucking all the chemials at us so they can get away.

if you’re talking about defending yourself and escaping, then yes, it can be done. but i don’t suggest anyone knowignly fight someone on meth, especially without a substantial advantage.

76

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

And all I have to say about fighting meth freaks is this: it’s real fucking hard for them to have lowered inhibitions and a high pain threshold if you SLIT THEIR FUCKING THROATS!!![/quote]

LOL, I was waiting for this. You never disappoint DB.

77

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:

you really don’t know what you’re talking about…

firstly, shooting someone in the scenario you described in murder. manslaughter is usually reseerved for negligance, or a bad fight where weapons are not involved.

secondly, methamphetamine does increase pain threshold substantially. hell, the precursors like tyrosine and dl-phenylalanine are consistenly recommended to those with chronic pain. meth is obviously quite a bit stronger, and therefore has a much more noticeable effect on pain threshold.

thirdly, not everyone on meth is 130lbs. a lot of people might be skinny, but they’re still strong as fuck from working construction 15 hours a day.

i have seen tweakers walk down a street and punch out every window of every car they see. i’ve found them by following the blood trail.

i’ve fought with tweakers who have broken bones so badly that they’re limb is just hanging, and it still takes 4 cops to strap them down. in fact, i got called one time because some jackass was chucking cinder bloacks at cars that were driving by. when i got him to jail, he fought 7 of us, and when we got him in the cell, he proceded to punch the plexiglass window until he had an open fracture in his hand. then he wrote his name in his blood.

i’ve seen tweakers dumping a lab, and when the cops show up, they start chucking all the chemials at us so they can get away.

if you’re talking about defending yourself and escaping, then yes, it can be done. but i don’t suggest anyone knowignly fight someone on meth, especially without a substantial advantage.
[/quote]

I was hoping you’d comment here.

It’s always funny when the cops post and dispel whatever bullshit the general public has in their head about how easy it is to stop a committed attacker… especially when that attacker is feeling no fucking pain.

Once again, Rory Miller covers all of this in his book, and goes into detail especially in regards to dealing with drug addicts.

78

PM me I will give you some advice, I have to deal with people out of control tweaking on meth almost every night.

just last night for example:

cops brought in a dude caught leaving a home he has just robbed, he was tweaking bad, took 4 cops and two tazzers to bring him down, they brought him to the ed in shackles for “medical clearance” for jail, we had to have him unrestrained for the exam, and this little bastard was wild as hell and i pretty much had him is an arm triangle the entire time the other nurses and medics were getting vital signs and drawing blood, etc.

same night a few hours later, tweaker breaks into the WRONG house, owner blasts him in the leg with a shotgun at close range, out flight crew goes out to pick him up, he comes in agitated and combative, nearly pulls the scalp of one of the flight nurses(grabs a chunk of her hair), took 5 of us to hold him down until we could sedate him enough to fix his leg, which was pretty much hamburger…the trauma room and us looked like one of the worst scenes from a slasher horror move at the end of that one.

79

drugs sound so fun.

80

better than fighting mighty uncle Vinko