Feedback From Meat

Training Over 35 Lifter
161

[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
ouroboro_s wrote:
Here’s another squat question for you related to sitting back. I’ve spent a lot of time recently looking at my squat videos. I tend to lean forward quite a bit regardless of the weight. This is my raw squat. I haven’t spent as much time recently looked at geared squats.

I’m pretty sure this was my tendency even before I got into gear. How do I change my squat so it is more straight up and down or should I given that I compete in gear. I’m thinking I should because the forward lean makes it harder to hit depth but I look like I’m folding like a house of cards.

I’ve moved the bar lower and pushed my elbows forward but I still lean forward. I watch other people squat and it’s like they go up and down like a piston. I can’t seem to replicate that.

it really comes down to how you are built. you have extremely long legs and long torso which makes squatting straight up and down nearly impossible for you. you are doing a great job of working with what God gave you. you will always have some forward lean to maintain balance. as long as you continue to get stronger and are doing all you can do to make your form as perfect as you can, then you are doing great. leaning forward isn’t a big deal as long as you are keeping the elbows down as well as keeping the chest high and the back arched. don’t stress over it.

besides, you have long legs and get stares from people wishing they were you. i have short stubby legs and can NEVER find pants that are big enough around and short enough. imagine going to your local clothing store and asking for 42 x 30 jeans… or XXXL shirts. I basically live in golf shirts because they don’t shrink and they have extra long short sleeves.

see…things can be worse:)

[/quote]

You just made me feel a ton better. This is the first time in my life I’m looking at women who are 5’2" and weigh 165 with short arms and legs thinking: “man you are soooo lucky” They make it look incredibly easy. I just posted a squat video in my log that is pretty sad. Mind you, I"m having issues with my lats on one side that I’m working out.

162

Meet if you were going to try and set a Rack Pull PR of 500lbs what ramp up would you use? I was thinking 135x8, 225x5, 315x5, 405x1, 455x1, 500x1.

163

[quote]JoeGood wrote:
Meet if you were going to try and set a Rack Pull PR of 500lbs what ramp up would you use? I was thinking 135x8, 225x5, 315x5, 405x1, 455x1, 500x1.[/quote]

that looks really good to me but also listen to your body. sometimes i feel good and can just move right up. if you are tight, maybe take two sets with the light weight. sometimes i’ll do up to three sets with 135 or 225 just to get warmed and loosened up. definitely don’t do that with the higher sets though. it’s better to get the warm up done with the really light weights and then do single or doubles with the heavier ramping sets to get the body ready for the increasing weight.

164

Senior Carne,

I don’t normally like to think about ratios when comparing one lift to a similar lift (like Incline BB v. BB Flat Bench), but I’m curious as to what a typical (good) BB Pin Press v. BB Bench v. BB Close Grip might look like. Just trying to gauge some of my relative weaknesses. I know I have to bring my triceps strength up.

Today I did some “Sort of Pin Presses” (ie. BB elevated on steps/risers) and got only what my normal bench reps are. That seems unbalanced as I’d think I should be able to get higher weight/reps with the pin presses. Of course, I need more work :wink:

As always-- MUCHAS GRACIAS!

165

Hi Meat,

I’d love to have some input on my deadlift form. I already know it needs work and I have an idea of some things, but rather than say what I think, I’d love to have your input.

Here’s my lift from today (~414kgs)

For comparison here are a couple from 2 weeks ago:

405lbs

415lbs (miss)

166

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
Senior Carne,

I don’t normally like to think about ratios when comparing one lift to a similar lift (like Incline BB v. BB Flat Bench), but I’m curious as to what a typical (good) BB Pin Press v. BB Bench v. BB Close Grip might look like. Just trying to gauge some of my relative weaknesses. I know I have to bring my triceps strength up.

Today I did some “Sort of Pin Presses” (ie. BB elevated on steps/risers) and got only what my normal bench reps are. That seems unbalanced as I’d think I should be able to get higher weight/reps with the pin presses. Of course, I need more work :wink:

As always-- MUCHAS GRACIAS![/quote]

if you are doing the “sort of pin presses” with them starting at about mid stroke, i find that my normal full ROM bench and mid range press is about the same. i typically use my floor press 1 RM as an indicator of what my full ROM bench is.

same with pin presses from about midway. now, once you get to about 3/4’s of the stroke my poundages increase greatly. that midpoint is where the pec give way to the shoulders which give way to the triceps.

sounds like you are right were you are supposed to be.

167

[quote]Ruggerlife wrote:
Hi Meat,

I’d love to have some input on my deadlift form. I already know it needs work and I have an idea of some things, but rather than say what I think, I’d love to have your input.

Here’s my lift from today (~414kgs)

For comparison here are a couple from 2 weeks ago:

405lbs

415lbs (miss)

[/quote]

from watching the vids, your comp. dead was your best… which is definitely a good thing:)

having said that, your approach to the sumo looks more like a wide stance conventional dead to me. you have your toes pointed out some but your knees track forward as you initiat the lift. the main cue that i could give you to help this is as you intiat the pull, do so by pushing the knees out as hard as you can and open up the groin.

turn your feet out more and squat the weight up. right now you are using mostly the posterior chain to start your lift. now, there’s nothing wrong with that. a buddy of mine uses this weird ass close stance sumo looking hybrid conventional, but it works.

all i’m saying is that if you want to really use the quads, hips and adductors you need to get your knees out a lot more. you can actually see your knees roll in as you start your pull. you have to fight that urge, sit back and open the groin.

i’ve found that deficit pulls with about a 4 inch deficit have really taught me to open the groin up and force the knees out.

lastly, you need to get your hips through faster… but don’t we all.

168

[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
Ruggerlife wrote:
Hi Meat,

I’d love to have some input on my deadlift form. I already know it needs work and I have an idea of some things, but rather than say what I think, I’d love to have your input.

Here’s my lift from today (~414kgs)

For comparison here are a couple from 2 weeks ago:

405lbs

415lbs (miss)

from watching the vids, your comp. dead was your best… which is definitely a good thing:)

having said that, your approach to the sumo looks more like a wide stance conventional dead to me. you have your toes pointed out some but your knees track forward as you initiat the lift. the main cue that i could give you to help this is as you intiat the pull, do so by pushing the knees out as hard as you can and open up the groin.

turn your feet out more and squat the weight up. right now you are using mostly the posterior chain to start your lift. now, there’s nothing wrong with that. a buddy of mine uses this weird ass close stance sumo looking hybrid conventional, but it works.

all i’m saying is that if you want to really use the quads, hips and adductors you need to get your knees out a lot more. you can actually see your knees roll in as you start your pull. you have to fight that urge, sit back and open the groin.

i’ve found that deficit pulls with about a 4 inch deficit have really taught me to open the groin up and force the knees out.

lastly, you need to get your hips through faster… but don’t we all.

[/quote]

Thanks Meat. I hadn’t thought about turning my feet out more. I’ll try that.

I’m still fairly new to sumo (about 6 months) so this is really a work in progress… but I guess it always is.

169

[quote]Ruggerlife wrote:
maraudermeat wrote:
Ruggerlife wrote:
Hi Meat,

I’d love to have some input on my deadlift form. I already know it needs work and I have an idea of some things, but rather than say what I think, I’d love to have your input.

Here’s my lift from today (~414kgs)

For comparison here are a couple from 2 weeks ago:

405lbs

415lbs (miss)

from watching the vids, your comp. dead was your best… which is definitely a good thing:)

having said that, your approach to the sumo looks more like a wide stance conventional dead to me. you have your toes pointed out some but your knees track forward as you initiat the lift. the main cue that i could give you to help this is as you intiat the pull, do so by pushing the knees out as hard as you can and open up the groin.

turn your feet out more and squat the weight up. right now you are using mostly the posterior chain to start your lift. now, there’s nothing wrong with that. a buddy of mine uses this weird ass close stance sumo looking hybrid conventional, but it works.

all i’m saying is that if you want to really use the quads, hips and adductors you need to get your knees out a lot more. you can actually see your knees roll in as you start your pull. you have to fight that urge, sit back and open the groin.

i’ve found that deficit pulls with about a 4 inch deficit have really taught me to open the groin up and force the knees out.

lastly, you need to get your hips through faster… but don’t we all.

Thanks Meat. I hadn’t thought about turning my feet out more. I’ll try that.

I’m still fairly new to sumo (about 6 months) so this is really a work in progress… but I guess it always is. [/quote]

no problem…

the more you can get your feet parallel to the bar, the more quads you can get into that inital squat off the floor.

170

Meat,

What is your opinion of zercher squats for improving the start of the deadlift? Right now I’m stuck deciding between concentric full squat style or concentric half squat style. I think the half squat style would have more carryover since it mimics the starting thigh angle of the deadlift, is this right?

One last thing,
How low should I go for goodmornings if my goal is to improve the beginning of my deadlift? To a 45 degree torso angle or all the way down till my torso is parallel? Also, are you suppose to lock out with your hips, or more of a back extension style?

Thank you!

171

[quote]Mondy wrote:
Meat,

What is your opinion of zercher squats for improving the start of the deadlift? Right now I’m stuck deciding between concentric full squat style or concentric half squat style. I think the half squat style would have more carryover since it mimics the starting thigh angle of the deadlift, is this right?

One last thing,
How low should I go for goodmornings if my goal is to improve the beginning of my deadlift? To a 45 degree torso angle or all the way down till my torso is parallel? Also, are you suppose to lock out with your hips, or more of a back extension style?

Thank you![/quote]

before i give you suggestions for supplemental movements, can you send me a vid of your form. it’s always better to start there. if you have a form issue, all the supplemental movements in the world aren’t going to help you.

but… to answer your question, zercher squats, in my opinion, arne’t the way to go for starting strength. i would go deficit pulls and speed pulls for that. zerchers are really good for lockout strength. also, i’ve never liked squats as a supplement to deads. the bar position is all wrong therefore, the stressors are different.

i’m not a big fan of goodmornings. if i do them they are definitely not done heavy. form wise i look forward, i stop my decent when i can’t see what’s in front of me anymore.

are you asking about deadlift lockout?

172

[quote]maraudermeat wrote:

before i give you suggestions for supplemental movements, can you send me a vid of your form. it’s always better to start there. if you have a form issue, all the supplemental movements in the world aren’t going to help you.

but… to answer your question, zercher squats, in my opinion, arne’t the way to go for starting strength. i would go deficit pulls and speed pulls for that. zerchers are really good for lockout strength. also, i’ve never liked squats as a supplement to deads. the bar position is all wrong therefore, the stressors are different.

i’m not a big fan of goodmornings. if i do them they are definitely not done heavy. form wise i look forward, i stop my decent when i can’t see what’s in front of me anymore.

are you asking about deadlift lockout?

[/quote]

I haven’t filmed my deadlift form in a while, but heres an old video:

I basically can lockout anything out once it gets past mid-shin level. My weakness is the starting portion, sometimes the bar gets up by an inch or two but then it simply stalls. I’ve tried doing more squats but that didn’t seem to help, lots of speed pulls with 40-50% didn’t do anything for it either.

Here’s a vid of my sticking point

Right now I have two lower body sessions a week

Day 1: Week 1/2/3/4
DL on 4 inch platform 4x4/4x3/4x4/2x2
Cable Goodmornings 3x5
Single leg squat 2x10
Ab roller 3x8/2x8/3x8/2x8

Day 5:
Zercher Squats 4x4/4x3/4x4/2x2
Cable Goodmornings 3x5
Reverse lunge 3x6
Reverse crunch 3x12

Would you recommend to make both sessions deadlifts on a deficit? In case you’re wondering, I got the decrease in total workload every other week idea from Cresseys Maximum Strength book.

Also, what would you recommend for a sticking point on the bench press about 3 inches off the chest?

Here’s a bench video

I still need to work on my arch and utilizing leg drive. As you can see from the vid, once the bar gets past half way I can blast it to lockout with no problem.

I’m adding some paused high incline shoulder presses and upper back work.

My current bench and pullup routine is inspired by poliquin pullup system

“Another system I use is I do 10 sets of the exercise. If you can do 6 pull-ups by yourself, divide that by two, so that’s 3 pull-ups. Do 10 sets of 3. In the next workout you try to increase the total number of reps until you can do 10 sets of 6 (60). The day you can do 10 sets of 6 then you’ll be able to do 12 by yourself.”

I started off doing 10x3 with my 5rm weight, aiming to get 10x6 with that weight within the next month.

Day 3:
BP 10x3/8x3
Hammer Chin 10x3/8x3
Incline DB Press 3x8/2x8
Machine Cable Row 3x8/2x8

Day 6:
BP 8x3/10x3
Hammer Chin 8x3/10x3
Low Incline DB Press 3x8/2x8
Head supported rows 3x8/2x8

Sorry if my workout is a mess, I tried to make my own routine by tailoring it to myself based on the prilepins table, poliquins pullup system, and cresseys varied workload system.

173

heres that AMEN you were looking for !

174

and an update for ya…

few weeks back you advised me on which lifts to use in rotation after a missed bench 10" high. you advised floor presses , high-pin press , 4 brd , etc . after first time doing floor presses , I was astounded at how sore my core/abs felt , and you explained the whats and whys…made sense .

I did them again this past monday (3RM/2RM PR’s) ; funny thing is this time I absolutely toasted my upper back ! I even had to push my ME deadlift day (rack-pulls/3RM)from wednesday to thursday .sure , I did pull-ups as a lat accessory movement on monday , but I’ve done those before without anywhere near that amount of beating ; perhaps it was the combination of the two…who knows . I’ll probably take it pretty easy on the lat-work come DE bench day on saturday .

gotta tell ya , I wasnt diggin those floor presses at all the first time I did 'em ; just felt kinda lame . but I may have seen the light after the second go-'round . I should probably have done them 3 straight weeks (5RM/3RM/2RM).

after 4 weeks, and a deload(sick) ,of what you suggested in the 5RM range,I took a heavy single at 215 . got it up clean and even touch-and-go/no bounce . I’ll do another 2 to 4 weeks of triples using the same lifts , then hit that bitch again , but with a meet-legal pause .

175

and if you dont mind , one more thing .
what are your own personal thoughts on how often to switch ME lifts ?

I dont mean based on what WS authors recomend ; I mean based on your own experience/progress thru-out your career , with your lifts or with training partners , beginner vs. advanced , ect .

I realise this could be an enormous response , so if you dont have the time for it , thats cool

(I tried bringing this up on the Westside II thread , but nobody there wants to talk programming strategy ; they only want to post numbers )

176

[quote]marlboroman wrote:
and if you dont mind , one more thing .
what are your own personal thoughts on how often to switch ME lifts ?

I dont mean based on what WS authors recomend ; I mean based on your own experience/progress thru-out your career , with your lifts or with training partners , beginner vs. advanced , ect .

I realise this could be an enormous response , so if you dont have the time for it , thats cool

(I tried bringing this up on the Westside II thread , but nobody there wants to talk programming strategy ; they only want to post numbers )[/quote]

i’m glad my advice has benefited you some. sometimes you have to stick with it for awhile to develop the motor programs for that lift to get anything out of it. this leads me into your question about switching lifts. I used to switch every two weeks per Westside suggestions but i found that it took me two weeks to get familiar with some of the lifts again. i now do 4 week minicycles. I stick with the same first ME lift for four weeks before changing it up. I’ve tried longer than that but i find that i get stale after four weeks. four weeks is definitely my sweet spot. i often times switch up supplemental and accessory stuff weekly though.

my new thing is mixing in my variation of DE work as a second movement after ME stuff instead of doing my typical two ME movements. I’ve found that it’s easier to get faster to get through sticking point as apposed to getting stronger to get through those same sticking points:) when i say my variation, i mean that i do a slow eccentric and then explode on the concentric. i find that this protects my joints and allows me to do them on a weekly basis. i used to do them with a fast concentric/eccentric and it destroyed my shoulders and hips. plus there’s no way to keep my form tight doing them that way.

yeah… i remember the old westside thread. that was good times…

177

Hello Mr. Drummond

I have been following your training log and you have really inspired me. Your lifts are very impressive and motivate me to become the best I can possible be. I really appreciate the time you spend to help everyone as well.

I have a question regarding benching. There are two different benches in my gym. One has a very soft bench pad and the hooks are very small making it easier to slide the barbell out and keep the lats very tight. The other bench had a pad which is much harder but the hooks are more diagnol making it impossible to slide the barbell out. It is easier to lose tightness in the lats and keep the scapulae retracted. I read that having a soft bench pad will result in a loss of power and that in order to keep the lats tight, you have to slide the barbell out instead of pressing it out of the rack. I was just wondering bench would be better to use.

Thanks for your time.

178

[quote]yvanehtnioj wrote:
Hello Mr. Drummond

I have been following your training log and you have really inspired me. Your lifts are very impressive and motivate me to become the best I can possible be. I really appreciate the time you spend to help everyone as well.

I have a question regarding benching. There are two different benches in my gym. One has a very soft bench pad and the hooks are very small making it easier to slide the barbell out and keep the lats very tight. The other bench had a pad which is much harder but the hooks are more diagnol making it impossible to slide the barbell out. It is easier to lose tightness in the lats and keep the scapulae retracted. I read that having a soft bench pad will result in a loss of power and that in order to keep the lats tight, you have to slide the barbell out instead of pressing it out of the rack. I was just wondering bench would be better to use.

Thanks for your time. [/quote]

thanks for the kind words.

i would definitely go with the softer bench with the smaller hooks. all the benches at my gym suck. you work with what you have. at least you realize the difference. that’s a huge step in the right direction.

179

Thanks a lot. I really appreciate your help.

180

[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
marlboroman wrote:
and if you dont mind , one more thing .
what are your own personal thoughts on how often to switch ME lifts ?

I dont mean based on what WS authors recomend ; I mean based on your own experience/progress thru-out your career , with your lifts or with training partners , beginner vs. advanced , ect .

I realise this could be an enormous response , so if you dont have the time for it , thats cool

(I tried bringing this up on the Westside II thread , but nobody there wants to talk programming strategy ; they only want to post numbers )

i’m glad my advice has benefited you some. sometimes you have to stick with it for awhile to develop the motor programs for that lift to get anything out of it. this leads me into your question about switching lifts. I used to switch every two weeks per Westside suggestions but i found that it took me two weeks to get familiar with some of the lifts again. i now do 4 week minicycles. I stick with the same first ME lift for four weeks before changing it up. I’ve tried longer than that but i find that i get stale after four weeks. four weeks is definitely my sweet spot. i often times switch up supplemental and accessory stuff weekly though.

my new thing is mixing in my variation of DE work as a second movement after ME stuff instead of doing my typical two ME movements. I’ve found that it’s easier to get faster to get through sticking point as apposed to getting stronger to get through those same sticking points:) when i say my variation, i mean that i do a slow eccentric and then explode on the concentric. i find that this protects my joints and allows me to do them on a weekly basis. i used to do them with a fast concentric/eccentric and it destroyed my shoulders and hips. plus there’s no way to keep my form tight doing them that way.

yeah… i remember the old westside thread. that was good times…
[/quote]

thanks