Dogs Hate Me...

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[quote]jak3_dude wrote:
was the owner nervous?

bad dogs are rare. retarded owners are a dime a dozen

and when you guys say bite, do you mean draw blood? my dogs “bite” me all the time when I play fight with them which is akin to a hard nibble

a lot of people mistake playfulness for aggressiveness as well. my uncle’s German shepherd always ran after me when I was younger because I would run away from her, she thought I was playing and would continue to chase me around the house. it’s a vicious cycle

dogs are very good at reading body language, but some actions are generalized and we use them in different circumstances, but the dog just sees the action for what IT has generalized the action to, not what you are using the action for. again with running, running for play chasing and running out of fear. A playful dog will see ALL running as play chasing. even dogs can make mistakes

big red flags are growling, “mean” barking (usually accompanied by growling) the scrunched nose, showing off teeth. I would personally not turn my back, walk backwards calmly and give the dog distance. maybe pick up a stick or big rock just in case

even then, some of those flags are present in play as well, my dog occasionally play growls and barks, but his tail is wagging the entire time, so you know he’s playing

if you’re nervous about approaching a dog make sure the owner has complete control of the dog (ie. using a leash) put out your hand first, let him sniff it, then pet the dog on the head gently

if the dog isn’t on a leash, do the same, but let the dog come to you, stand still, they should saunter up to you, sniff your hand or leg

if you do have to fight off a dog my guess would be keep them at a distance with a stick or your foot with kicks, close space on your terms, pin them by the neck, watch out for their claws they ARE sharp enough, stay behind them (full naked choke hold). dogs are good at squirming around (thanks to excess skin around neck) so don’t underestimate their ability to slip out turn around and bite you
even in fights, dogs fixate and chase body parts, you can use this to trick them into going one direction giving you access to their sides for a swift kick to the ribs (some breeds this won’t work with)[/quote]

hmm that’s good advice. Thanks!

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[quote]tmay11 wrote:
Dogs are imo just really good at reading body language. From my experience dogs that “like” being aggressive take advantage of people that are frighten of them - they can see it on you and therefore assume they can take you. The same principles that apply to a bear attack apply hear also. Remember that dogs are dumb as shit ( as compared to you and I ). I have been in many circumstances where dogs are acting aggressively and/or charging and will immediately stop/retreat as soon as you make a powerful movement in their direction. The thing is that for this to work you have to truly not be scared of the dog - you can’t really fake it. This even applies to guarddogs (minus the utmost fearless). Next time you see some big dog at a fence barking at you aggressively try running at it yelling madly - 95% will shut up and cower. Again though , for this to work you can’t be scared of the dog. You have to really believe that you could beat the shit out of the dog and convey that to its little pea brain. This is most successful when aggressive dogs ACTUALLY piss you off as they do I.

On a side - Do you guys really think that many dogs could really “beat you” in a fight? Obviously they have some physical advantages (teeth, speed etc) but I think those are more than outweighed by a mans physical size and intelligence. Unless the dogs gets your neck immediately I don’t see why you shouldn’t be able to swiftly put it down. The above only applies to men in above average shape, not women, children and the general populace. Lets say a rottie or a sheperd gets a hold of your leg or arm. All it really takes is one solid kick or punch to its ribs and there’s a very good chance that you have caused some serious damage ( broken bones ) . You can also try to choke the dog out if it goes for any of your limbs … thoughts ??

btw - I have owned many big dogs and been around many big dogs so I’m not speaking from inexperience. Right now I own a sheperd/rottie mix. [/quote]

Eh you aren’t being fair to the dog by calling it stupid. Big dogs are likely as smart as toddlers, pretty intelligent for an animal. They have also been bred for years to not have an aversion to humans like wild animals and can read human body language and facial expressions. While I certainly feel you could damage a dog the serious bites I have seen didn’t involve the posturing of barking they were swift and had some growling but little barking. I think you underestimate the speed and power in a huge breed that sits between 100 and 200 pounds with little fat.

Not a particularly large dog, but fairly well trained. If you were unarmed and it was chewing on your arm I think you could kick it off you but it would require some serious composure.

Bouvier des Flandres Altan, de aanval - YouTube!

These are obviously much more serious dogs but to show they aren’t stupid they can be trained to swap targets to weapon arms etc.

Training Personal Protection Dogs To Protect Themselves! (K9-1.com) - YouTube!

And of course the premier protection dog super rare in the US

Caucasian mountain dog - YouTube!

Not really germane to the thread I just think its a sweet dog.

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[quote]tmay11 wrote:
Dogs are imo just really good at reading body language. From my experience dogs that “like” being aggressive take advantage of people that are frighten of them - they can see it on you and therefore assume they can take you. The same principles that apply to a bear attack apply hear also. Remember that dogs are dumb as shit ( as compared to you and I ). I have been in many circumstances where dogs are acting aggressively and/or charging and will immediately stop/retreat as soon as you make a powerful movement in their direction. The thing is that for this to work you have to truly not be scared of the dog - you can’t really fake it. This even applies to guarddogs (minus the utmost fearless). Next time you see some big dog at a fence barking at you aggressively try running at it yelling madly - 95% will shut up and cower. Again though , for this to work you can’t be scared of the dog. You have to really believe that you could beat the shit out of the dog and convey that to its little pea brain. This is most successful when aggressive dogs ACTUALLY piss you off as they do I.

On a side - Do you guys really think that many dogs could really “beat you” in a fight? Obviously they have some physical advantages (teeth, speed etc) but I think those are more than outweighed by a mans physical size and intelligence. Unless the dogs gets your neck immediately I don’t see why you shouldn’t be able to swiftly put it down. The above only applies to men in above average shape, not women, children and the general populace. Lets say a rottie or a sheperd gets a hold of your leg or arm. All it really takes is one solid kick or punch to its ribs and there’s a very good chance that you have caused some serious damage ( broken bones ) . You can also try to choke the dog out if it goes for any of your limbs … thoughts ??

btw - I have owned many big dogs and been around many big dogs so I’m not speaking from inexperience. Right now I own a sheperd/rottie mix. [/quote]

If you’re not speaking from inexperience, maybe its otherwordly experience? A dog with a good mouth can put you in shock in short order. Bank on it. I suggest you go put on a full bite suit and try some of your tactics with trained dogs and dogs with hard mouths (you will feel a bite even thru the protection on hard mouthed dogs). Once you do this, get back to us about how you feel you can beat most dogs. Some of what you say has merit as it concerns the average house dog, but you can totally throw this “advice” out the window with some other dogs.

As for your having been around and owned “many big dogs” - have you ever been bitten by one?

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[quote]groo wrote:

[quote]tmay11 wrote:
Dogs are imo just really good at reading body language. From my experience dogs that “like” being aggressive take advantage of people that are frighten of them - they can see it on you and therefore assume they can take you. The same principles that apply to a bear attack apply hear also. Remember that dogs are dumb as shit ( as compared to you and I ). I have been in many circumstances where dogs are acting aggressively and/or charging and will immediately stop/retreat as soon as you make a powerful movement in their direction. The thing is that for this to work you have to truly not be scared of the dog - you can’t really fake it. This even applies to guarddogs (minus the utmost fearless). Next time you see some big dog at a fence barking at you aggressively try running at it yelling madly - 95% will shut up and cower. Again though , for this to work you can’t be scared of the dog. You have to really believe that you could beat the shit out of the dog and convey that to its little pea brain. This is most successful when aggressive dogs ACTUALLY piss you off as they do I.

On a side - Do you guys really think that many dogs could really “beat you” in a fight? Obviously they have some physical advantages (teeth, speed etc) but I think those are more than outweighed by a mans physical size and intelligence. Unless the dogs gets your neck immediately I don’t see why you shouldn’t be able to swiftly put it down. The above only applies to men in above average shape, not women, children and the general populace. Lets say a rottie or a sheperd gets a hold of your leg or arm. All it really takes is one solid kick or punch to its ribs and there’s a very good chance that you have caused some serious damage ( broken bones ) . You can also try to choke the dog out if it goes for any of your limbs … thoughts ??

btw - I have owned many big dogs and been around many big dogs so I’m not speaking from inexperience. Right now I own a sheperd/rottie mix. [/quote]

Eh you aren’t being fair to the dog by calling it stupid. Big dogs are likely as smart as toddlers, pretty intelligent for an animal. They have also been bred for years to not have an aversion to humans like wild animals and can read human body language and facial expressions. While I certainly feel you could damage a dog the serious bites I have seen didn’t involve the posturing of barking they were swift and had some growling but little barking. I think you underestimate the speed and power in a huge breed that sits between 100 and 200 pounds with little fat.

Not a particularly large dog, but fairly well trained. If you were unarmed and it was chewing on your arm I think you could kick it off you but it would require some serious composure.

Bouvier des Flandres Altan, de aanval - YouTube!

These are obviously much more serious dogs but to show they aren’t stupid they can be trained to swap targets to weapon arms etc.

Training Personal Protection Dogs To Protect Themselves! (K9-1.com) - YouTube!

And of course the premier protection dog super rare in the US

Caucasian mountain dog - YouTube!

Not really germane to the thread I just think its a sweet dog.
[/quote]

2nd video the white dog is a dogo argentino named “toro” owned by maureen osborn of texas. the breed (i own two) is bred to hunt and fight large game (boar, mountain lion, puma). they were not bred to be protection dogs, but some people work them in that sport.

for the guy that thinks he can fight a dog, find one similar to toro and let me know how that works out for you :slight_smile: and while you’re at it, please don’t forget all those police dogs that got their ass kicked by the suspect. oh. they didn’t. usually the suspect was crying like a bitch begging the cop to take the dog off him.

here’s my dogo at 12 months. I would NOT want to be bit by this guy, and I’ve been around 1000’s of dogs, mostly american pitbull terriers.

I present to you “Picasso de la Cocha” (“Hugo”), 100lbs lean @ 12 months. Already tested on boar and a full grown puma.

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I really try to only own fairly non aggressive dogs anymore. I currently have whats likely an English Mastiff/Italian Mastiff cross that I helped to rescue from a breeder of ghetto Italian Mastiffs. Luckily he seems to have most of the characteristics of the English personality wise only picking up a bit of agility and speed and slightly trimmer look from the IM side.

I just read your post Rockula. I think its generally accepted dogs can be racist, though some of it is cues from the owner. The only dog I ever owned that clearly hated African Americans was a rescue racing greyhound. He started out hating all men, even me. Was hyperaggressive to all other dogs and would absolutely try to kill anything like a cat or rabbit or whatever. After years he would tolerate other men handling him, but would always try to bite any African American male that came in range. This was a dog that had been seriously abused though…cigarette burn scars, what looked like whip marks and knife cut scars etc. and our thoughts were that he remembered mishandling by his trainers in racing(who for the most part are African American), but it was behavior that the dog was never able to be fully trained out of. He lived to an old age of 14 years and had mellowed quite a bit by the end, I can see why people do recommend them for pets, but he was hands down the dumbest dog I have ever known.

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Dogs love me, and if I get cold and lonely enough I love them too.

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As others have said, dogs sense fear, your probably afraid of dogs subconsciously, who would blame you after so many threats from them. They can probably sense your fear and can probably see your body language get defensive when you get near them. Either that or you hate dogs and secretly want to hurt them, they sense that shit too. Best you avoid dogs or you’ll end up nutless LOL

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[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

for the guy that thinks he can fight a dog, find one similar to toro and let me know how that works out for you :slight_smile: and while you’re at it, please don’t forget all those police dogs that got their ass kicked by the suspect. oh. they didn’t. usually the suspect was crying like a bitch begging the cop to take the dog off him.

here’s my dogo at 12 months. I would NOT want to be bit by this guy, and I’ve been around 1000’s of dogs, mostly american pitbull terriers.

I present to you “Picasso de la Cocha” (“Hugo”), 100lbs lean @ 12 months. Already tested on boar and a full grown puma.

[/quote]

x2

People who think they can easily put down a dog like that are living in a fantasy land, and even if they did, you are going to need to go to the hospital.

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Caucasian mountain dogs are such tight dogs. BG, Hugo is a great looking dog, how much is he weighing now? My one experience with a Dogo is being drunk and randomly walking through someones yard who had one, who started my way, needless to say I was out of that yard in half a second.

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[quote]groo wrote:
I really try to only own fairly non aggressive dogs anymore. I currently have whats likely an English Mastiff/Italian Mastiff cross that I helped to rescue from a breeder of ghetto Italian Mastiffs. Luckily he seems to have most of the characteristics of the English personality wise only picking up a bit of agility and speed and slightly trimmer look from the IM side.

I just read your post Rockula. I think its generally accepted dogs can be racist, though some of it is cues from the owner. The only dog I ever owned that clearly hated African Americans was a rescue racing greyhound. He started out hating all men, even me. Was hyperaggressive to all other dogs and would absolutely try to kill anything like a cat or rabbit or whatever. After years he would tolerate other men handling him, but would always try to bite any African American male that came in range. This was a dog that had been seriously abused though…cigarette burn scars, what looked like whip marks and knife cut scars etc. and our thoughts were that he remembered mishandling by his trainers in racing(who for the most part are African American), but it was behavior that the dog was never able to be fully trained out of. He lived to an old age of 14 years and had mellowed quite a bit by the end, I can see why people do recommend them for pets, but he was hands down the dumbest dog I have ever known.

[/quote]

Dogs don’t understand race per se. They are not racist. Dogs are creatures of habit however and spend time getting familiar with their surroundings.

This is why a dog will be very curious about a garbage bag, for example, in a backyard where there isn’t normally a bag. Unless of course the bag becomes a pattern, as in the case of weekly yard work.

Dogs are very in tune with their people too. Facial expressions, body language, voice tone et cetera.

I don’t want this to come off racist myself but different races do have physical feautures that are common to each race, including facial structure.

If a dog is accustomed to a certain race and sees another, the subtle differences are enough to set them off. Dogs tend to “bark first, think later”.

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[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:
Caucasian mountain dogs are such tight dogs. BG, Hugo is a great looking dog, how much is he weighing now? My one experience with a Dogo is being drunk and randomly walking through someones yard who had one, who started my way, needless to say I was out of that yard in half a second.[/quote]

Caucasian dogs can be downright scary. I had a friend that raised them a short while (he was a pitbull breeder). He said a Caucasian is to man what a pitbull is to another dog. If you’re outside the immediate family they are pretty intolerable and absolutely dangerous. Very protective.

My guy is about 110 if I had to guess. He’s lean. His pictures do not come close to doing his physicality any justice. You just have to see him. This guy can jump out of a 8 foot pen. If he catches me off guard while I’m walking him, it takes me a good 10 feet to put the brakes on - he will embarrass you with his strength if he gets any momentum.

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[quote]bushidobadboy wrote:

That is one handsome canine, but your pink dress and wellies kind of detracts from the overall picture.

Seriously though, whilst I doubt I could find time in my life for a dog like that, I’m envious that you obviously can. ‘Tested on boar and puma’. Bad. Ass.

BBB[/quote]

You don’t like my fucking dress? That’s my favorite dress asshole!

“Hugo” was tested quite hard (as hard as you can test a dog of that age) before he shipped to me b/c he was a replacement for a bitch that didn’t quite work out so they wanted to get it right and this is why I didn’t take a puppy replacement. He was said to be the best of 6 or so litters, and 20-something dogs. Took over a year to replace him. We’ll see how bad he is when I have him hunted soon :slight_smile:

I love the breed (when they are good) but they will never replace my apbt’s.

:slight_smile:

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[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:

[quote]groo wrote:
I really try to only own fairly non aggressive dogs anymore. I currently have whats likely an English Mastiff/Italian Mastiff cross that I helped to rescue from a breeder of ghetto Italian Mastiffs. Luckily he seems to have most of the characteristics of the English personality wise only picking up a bit of agility and speed and slightly trimmer look from the IM side.

I just read your post Rockula. I think its generally accepted dogs can be racist, though some of it is cues from the owner. The only dog I ever owned that clearly hated African Americans was a rescue racing greyhound. He started out hating all men, even me. Was hyperaggressive to all other dogs and would absolutely try to kill anything like a cat or rabbit or whatever. After years he would tolerate other men handling him, but would always try to bite any African American male that came in range. This was a dog that had been seriously abused though…cigarette burn scars, what looked like whip marks and knife cut scars etc. and our thoughts were that he remembered mishandling by his trainers in racing(who for the most part are African American), but it was behavior that the dog was never able to be fully trained out of. He lived to an old age of 14 years and had mellowed quite a bit by the end, I can see why people do recommend them for pets, but he was hands down the dumbest dog I have ever known.

[/quote]

Dogs don’t understand race per se. They are not racist. Dogs are creatures of habit however and spend time getting familiar with their surroundings.

This is why a dog will be very curious about a garbage bag, for example, in a backyard where there isn’t normally a bag. Unless of course the bag becomes a pattern, as in the case of weekly yard work.

Dogs are very in tune with their people too. Facial expressions, body language, voice tone et cetera.

I don’t want this to come off racist myself but different races do have physical feautures that are common to each race, including facial structure.

If a dog is accustomed to a certain race and sees another, the subtle differences are enough to set them off. Dogs tend to “bark first, think later”.

[/quote]

Of course they don’t have a thought process to being racist like a human would. But for all intents and purposes racist enough for what the count meant. Some dogs used to one race particularly a sight hound would definitely see a difference.

This is akin to not letting a dog unused to babies be around them until they become accustomed to babies. Babies smell look and sound different than older children and adult humans enough of a difference that some dogs don’t recognize them as humans without exposure.

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Just cover yourself in peanut butter before you approach dogs in the future. I guarantee they’ll love you.

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The last video pisses me off.

First, this breeder is appealing to the lowest common form of attraction that is a beacon for every asshole would-be dog owner in the world - unbridled aggression. Even going as far to liken the dog to a .45 caliber. She needs to be out of the breeding business. Period.

Next, her customer shown at the end does not appear to need a dog like that and he’s ill equippped to handle the dog. That dog is too much for that guy and he does not appear to have much, if any, control over the dog as evidenced by his speaking of various collars he’s tried. Collars don’t train dogs, people do. That one is a disaster waiting to happen and in my opinion, the breeder is complicit for selling the dog to him.

The last vid makes me sick and it’s one of the many reasons I’ve never had any interest in being a breeder.

Anyhoo…

Who’s up for the man v. Caucasian fight? Whoever is betting on the man, I’ll take your action. Don’t forget to kick him in the ribs or go for that rear naked choke. LOL

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not entirely related but funny as hell.

Good thread/discussion, I will chime in with my opinion:

as many others have mentioned dogs will be hostile to you depending on variety of factors.
I would say the biggest factors would be:

  1. Perceived threat level
  2. Perceived “strangeness” (dogs hate unfamiliar things)
  3. the dogs natural aggression level (or learned aggression level)
  4. your reaction to the dog.

The only factors you can really control are 4 and to a lesser extent 1.

For example if you extend your hand (open and upside down) towards an oncoming dog, they will usually take this as a friendly invitation to smell you (and will usually slow down and start wagging its tail) - not always of course.

Also if you smile at the owner of the dog, or say hello, the dog will usually take note and assume you are friendly, depending of course how the owner reacts.

There are many factors, but if you react friendly to the dog and the owner your usually golden… my opinion anyways.

I would think having just come from the gym your perceived threat level would be higher to the dog… simply because you probably smell very similar to someone who’s just been in a fight.

as a final note dogs on leashes are always more aggressive… but thats ok as long as the owner has control of the leash. i think there is something in dog mentality that tells it when its on a leash, its on gaurd duty… i could be out to lunch.

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[quote]WestCoast7 wrote:
Just cover yourself in peanut butter before you approach dogs in the future. I guarantee they’ll love you.[/quote]

lmao!

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Personal protection marketing for dogs is very weird. I enjoy the sport aspects like Schutzhund and Mondio Ring, but when they take it to personal protection they train it to a different level which is interesting, but I am not too fond of.

The third video was interesting to me for a couple reasons. It did show a bunch of beautiful dogs. It also showed how difficult they could be to control which is hard to find in many dog videos which certainly a lot of novice owners don’t take into consideration.

I also wondered what in the hell did that guy need or want a dog like that for? I would put him clearly in the realm of inexperienced owner.

I don’t think breeding dogs with demonstrated human aggression to high light these traits is particularly great either. I’ve seen this a lot more in Italian Mastiffs though people love their Canes no matter what.

Why stop with a dog when you could get this:

http://www.museomagazine.com/938543/THE-HYENA-AND-OTHER-MEN