Diet Doesn't Work. Tried it All. Help/Coach Needed

[quote]eraser51 wrote:
sorry to push this again

just read the nutrition article… is it useful for me to pre workout eat a shake or drink something??

also could someone please coach me (Bill? Chris?)? at least for 1 month or so?
will pay of course :slight_smile:
someone has time?
think this will give me more confidence and a person for questions :slight_smile:

I am totally confused… asked a personal trainer/nutritionist at my gym; and he lowered my kcal to 1700 (low carb) and 2000kcal (high carb) with HC: 200protein and 180carbs 50 fat // LC: 200 protein 50 carbs, 50 fat

this is really confusing :confused:
dont know why everybody suggest eat much less than before :/[/quote]

I’m not a nutrition expert and you seem to be looking mostly for nutrition advice. I’m a strength coach, my best work is true the “output” part of the equation, not the “input” (nutrition).

A coach who simply lowers your calories (to a level that is about what a medium size figure girl competitor eats) when your fat loss stalls doesn’t know anything about getting someone lean naturally.

:slight_smile:

truth spoken

but I have no clue who to ask… and yeah it is really difficult to find nutritionist experts… believe you me :slight_smile:

who might I ask?

sadly eat less exercise more seems to be the first advice given everywhere… followed by: are you tracking accurately?.. sight…

Ideally something would be written for you specifically, but here are some brief guidelines which work very well:

Don’t let your calories go excessively low. A good minimum is your in-shape bodyweight in pounds times 12. For example, if you’d be in lean condition at 200 lb, have at least 2400 calories per day on most days.

At least one day per week, allow maintenance calories or a little more and have ample carbs.

Strongly limit consumption of foods containing vegetable oil, soybean oil, safflower oil, sunflower oil, peanut oil, or canola oil. (High-oleic versions of these oils are fine.) Minimize intake of poultry and pork fat.

Macadamias, hazelnuts, cashews, pistachios, and almonds are healthful but their calories must be accounted for. For example, 12 ounces per week provides about 2000 calories. Minimize intake of other nuts.

If needing to lose fat, limit your carbohydrate consumption to about 100-200 grams per day on most days. If you are very active, you can try 300 grams. You don’t have to count grams but for example a medium potato or a cup of cooked rice has about 40 g carbs or less. Low-calorie vegetables may be eaten freely.

However, watch the carbs of wheat products. Bread, for example, has twice the carbs per ounce as potatoes or rice!

Consider replacing wheat-containing foods with better choices. These include slow-cooked oatmeal, buckwheat, sweet potatoes, parsnips, carrots, turnips, squash, plantains, various legumes, potatoes, rye berries, barley, and rice. For rice, parboiled (converted) rice is a better choice than white.

On most days limit carb intake from fruits, juices, and sugar-containing foods to no more than 50 grams per day. This amount is met with two apples, two bananas, or four oranges per day, or one cup of berries.

Restrict carbs from some meals and fat from others, while always including protein. When having carbs and fats in the same meal, take special care on total meal size.

When feeling the instinct to stop eating, stop eating. Don’t tell yourself “there’s not that much left,” or worry about what others may think.

Consider abolishing your trouble foods entirely, or limiting them to one day per week or per month.

End your eating no later than 12-14 hours after arising. For example, if arising at 7 AM, finish eating ideally by 7 PM, or 9 PM at the latest.


I would seriously try having the nutrition basically good and the calories as we’ve discussed and put the trust in training, rather than aim for nutritional exactitude or tricky techniques beyond the above.

It does sound like you probably have many of the above down already. For example you don’t sound like a cheat eater. But the above was written for people in general.

The reason, by the way, on the limitation on particular fats on nuts has to do with linoleic acid content. Unfortunately the modern diet has far more linoleic acid than man has historically ever been able to eat, with the result that body content of linoleic acid is now, typically, almost unbelievably high. The only way to correct this is to, for a long time, have a low linoleic acid diet.

That is not the key to fat loss, it’s simply a good thing, hence the recommendations to avoid high linoleic foods. An improvement, not a key.

Thanks!

Will try to use that… I understand pork but whats with chicken (poultry)?

do you guys know, if it is true that carbs are not necessary (even bad) after training?
read something (think mario dipasquale) and he said because the insulin sensitivity is raised it would be better to use protein only.

and does fat burn in the flame of carbs?
I mean the end product is ATP but do I need Oxalacetat/pyrovat for the carb cycle when without carbs?
and do I have to do cardio then (after or before) lunch with carbs?

would a refeed 2 per week be better than a mixed diet with daily carbs?

It may be different in Germany, I should have thought have that. But in the United States, poultry is fed largely with soy, resulting in poultry fat being very high in linoleic acid. That’s a fatty acid which is fine when it’s in moderate concentration in the human body, but with the relatively modern introduction of soy to animal feed, and relatively modern use of various high-linoleic vegetable oils for human use, concentration of this fatty acid in the body has skyrocketed.

Chicken breasts are fine as there is not much fat.

It could be that in Germany soy is not used. If so then there’s no issue.

The whole “fat burns in the flame of carbs” is a saying best forgotten, unless in a physiology class where the professor likes to be quoted verbatim on exams. It has little practical use. People burn fat just fine on low carb diets.

You will have oxaloacetate when on a low carb diet.

First the TCA (or Krebs, or citric acid) cycle is a cycle. It’s not that an oxaloacetate, or a pyruvate, or anything derived from a carbohydrate is used up for each fat molecule burned. It might have been originally obtained from a glucose, but ongoing replenishment is not needed, except to account for whatever is drawn off.

As for where replenishment is needed for that reason, first glucose does not have to come from dietary glucose. Many amino acids can be converted to glucose. Also, aspartic acid (an amino acid) can yield oxaloacetate.

The above carb amounts are usually fine, and if not ideal for a given person, it’s not for the sake of fats burning in their flame.

Carbs can be fine after training. It’s worked well for a lot of people, though when losing fat I’d rather see the carbs taken before training.

Dr DiPasquale is a solid source of advice. His ways are not the only ways, by no means is it necessary to do as he says, but his ways work well.

On the refeed versus mixed, both can work well… I’d suggest trying each and seeing which you prefer. You won’t be wasting your time on either approach. It may be that one will suit you better.

well thank you SO MUCH for all!
Just need to try then now :slight_smile:

Maybe I got something to ask another time if thats ok :wink:

Absolutely! Looking forward to hearing your good results.

HI!

back again… did make a PMSF (only protein 1000kcal) for further fat loss…
Sadly only lost 3-4kg… at least it did go down… but was quite hard to keep the kcal amount :confused:

also guess my T3 really did go down a lot now…

What / How can I start for MAX muscle gain and MAX fat loss?
Should I cycle carbs after training?

or keep the keto with a refeed once per week?

sorry If I ask again something similiar but I am clueless why it is still THAT hard to change my body composition despite trying so much :confused:

[quote]eraser51 wrote:
HI!

back again… did make a PMSF (only protein 1000kcal) for further fat loss…
Sadly only lost 3-4kg… at least it did go down… but was quite hard to keep the kcal amount :confused:

also guess my T3 really did go down a lot now…

What / How can I start for MAX muscle gain and MAX fat loss?
Should I cycle carbs after training?

or keep the keto with a refeed once per week?

sorry If I ask again something similiar but I am clueless why it is still THAT hard to change my body composition despite trying so much :/[/quote]

I find it absolutely infuriating that you continue to ask for advice despite outright ignoring the great advice you’ve received by some of the most knowledgable contributors to this forum.

“I did the exact opposite of what you told me to do and continued to starve myself to an even further degree than I was before. It didn’t work, so now what should I do???”

Unbelievable.

I am saying this to be helpful, with no intent to offer any insult or appear to do so. That’s not it all, by no means.

It seems the most likely explanation here is that dieting and planning for dieting has become something of a fixation and not actually rational. I wouldn’t say in the formal medical sense that there’s a disorder, but informally speaking it’s looking like diet planning has become, in effect, a disorder. It certainly has led you to a bad result which isn’t what you were wanting. You also wound up doing very differently than anyone advised, though it seemed the advice made sense to you at the time.

My suggestion is to back away, for the moment, from the smaller problem of “what specific diet changes to make” and instead turn to the larger problem of worrying too much, planning too much, overthinking too much on the diet and making things even worse.

Set a simpler goal of eating for a week just reasonably and naturally, paying attention to your instinctive feelings on food, not fearing carbs. Note your weight at the end of the week.

Then eat what you now think is your maintenance, you can go back to tracking your macros and so forth, but each week increase your calories by 100 calories per day. So next week you’re up 100 calories per day, the week after that another 100, etc.

Keep increasing until you have definitely seen your weight go up by a few pounds. Back off a touch, and try that for a while, this time following the advice given previously.

[quote]TrevorLPT wrote:

[quote]eraser51 wrote:
HI!

back again… did make a PMSF (only protein 1000kcal) for further fat loss…
Sadly only lost 3-4kg… at least it did go down… but was quite hard to keep the kcal amount :confused:

also guess my T3 really did go down a lot now…

What / How can I start for MAX muscle gain and MAX fat loss?
Should I cycle carbs after training?

or keep the keto with a refeed once per week?

sorry If I ask again something similiar but I am clueless why it is still THAT hard to change my body composition despite trying so much :/[/quote]

I find it absolutely infuriating that you continue to ask for advice despite outright ignoring the great advice you’ve received by some of the most knowledgable contributors to this forum.

“I did the exact opposite of what you told me to do and continued to starve myself to an even further degree than I was before. It didn’t work, so now what should I do???”

Unbelievable.[/quote]

hmmm… I am sorry … I didnt wanted to hurt anyones feelings…
I just want to soak up as much information as I can on health/fitness/nutrition topics

Sometimes its trial and error :slight_smile: sometimes its more error than success I guess?

To carify:
I asked an biochemist (guy) (which also has a HUGE blog in germany & is a trusted ressource ) for his “recipe” for fat loss and he strongly suggested to starve myself on pure protein for max fat loss till I reach my goal weight and THEN build muscle…

Dont know if this makes my stupid questions / interest any clearer… again sorry guys… didnt meant to hurt anyone…

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
I am saying this to be helpful, with no intent to offer any insult or appear to do so. That’s not it all, by no means.

It seems the most likely explanation here is that dieting and planning for dieting has become something of a fixation and not actually rational. I wouldn’t say in the formal medical sense that there’s a disorder, but informally speaking it’s looking like diet planning has become, in effect, a disorder. It certainly has led you to a bad result which isn’t what you were wanting. You also wound up doing very differently than anyone advised, though it seemed the advice made sense to you at the time.

My suggestion is to back away, for the moment, from the smaller problem of “what specific diet changes to make” and instead turn to the larger problem of worrying too much, planning too much, overthinking too much on the diet and making things even worse.

Set a simpler goal of eating for a week just reasonably and naturally, paying attention to your instinctive feelings on food, not fearing carbs. Note your weight at the end of the week.

Then eat what you now think is your maintenance, you can go back to tracking your macros and so forth, but each week increase your calories by 100 calories per day. So next week you’re up 100 calories per day, the week after that another 100, etc.

Keep increasing until you have definitely seen your weight go up by a few pounds. Back off a touch, and try that for a while, this time following the advice given previously.
[/quote]

thanks for your comprehension…

I will first stay on keto for a while though (tried a refeed yesterday and I still dont like and/or can metabolize carbs very well)
while raising fat to fill the gap on kcal slowly and try the (reverse diet) approach here… it has to work I guess :slight_smile:

Also need to raise training to a higher level…

Its just so much information out there with different aspects on every corner… hope you understand my confusion and helplessness…

There is an expression, “analysis paralysis.” It means being stopped by overthinking things.

I have the impression your difficulties are not caused by your failing to seek information, not putting time and care into your thinking, and not from failing to execute your plans. It seems like your effort is A+ on all these things.

Instead my impression is the difficulties are from over-analyzing. And at this point you’ve gotten where you need to restore yourself for a while, take a break from not only all this analysis but from stress of trying so hard to lose further fat while your metabolism isn’t aiding fat loss, and get a fresh start in a couple of months. Not going and regaining significant fat in the interim, a couple of pounds is okay. Get some added LBM while on gradually-increasing maintenance calories. Then make much better progress, on higher calories than where you have been stalled.

Therefore the above suggestion.

Why did you stay on the same calorie intake for two years? There are some pretty accurate calorie calculators out there that go by bodyfat percentage. Just follow a 25% defecit for a couple of months and you will lose weight. I am looking at doing a slower recomp with a 15% defecit and high protein intake.