[quote]SilentQuest wrote:
Do you guys use mixed grip for dl? If yes, woudl you say that alternating every set can avoid possibility of developing imbalance?[/quote]
Yes, you should switch it up. You do run the risk of developing an imbalance in your legs/back etc long term if you always use a particular mixed grip. I’m fixing that myself now.
-Dan
[quote]hueyOT wrote:
agreed, but if you’ve got compression in particular vertebrae, certain back movements serve to further wear the cartilage down.
you need to remember to rehab APPROPRIATELY!
[/quote]
I completely agree. There are still certain moves that I just don’t do as the risk vs reward just isn’t there. There is a world of difference between strengthening your back with certain exercises (my way) than never exercise that area (my doctors recommendation).
[quote]Tim K wrote:
I don’t know… how many other lifts are there with the word ‘dead’ in them? Kind of creepy.[/quote]
It’s just a name, like shoes. We could have been called the shoes for all you know.
Awesome to hear another good deadlift testimony! I have had two surgeries on my back at the L4-L5 and L5-S1 levels from an auto accident and previous military (Army, not military press) injury and my best/quickest/strongest recovery through it came from deadlifts. I use a 2" and sometimes a 2.5" bar to limit the weight I do, but it has given me one heck of a grip. The last 5x5 program I did was with the 2.5" bar and I would finish the last set with 290lbs.-310lbs. Not monstrous, but still a good lift. I weigh (depending on the weeks choices of food) between 190lbs.-195lbs.
Interesting note - my back feels so much better with straight bar deads than it does with trap bar deads. Not sure why or the mechanics of it, but trap bar deads just tweak me the wrong way.
Anyway, man good stuff! Keep up the good work.
[quote]grey wrote:
I’ve read all kinds of garbage recently that deadlifts are “bad for your back”.
Well…let me tell you a little story.
Three months ago I had a doctor tell me that I had probably herniated a disk.
I had lower back pain from doing heavy standing military presses.
This doctor told me to stop lifting weights. What did i do? I began an intensive deadlift routine and whala! 3 months later the same doctor has given me an all clear signal.
What does this lead me to believe…
Conclusion…deadlifts are our best friend and doing them right gives total body strength.
Finally…I will never stop deadlifting.[/quote]
I agree man,
For the past 4 to 5 years i had been bothered with a lower back pain after playing basketball. Got checked by doctor and chiropractic and could not find out what was wrong with my lower back, they even suggested that I should stop playing ball unless I can live with the pain?
Fortunately, came across T-Nation and Mr. CW and was introduced to dead lifts?Began by developing my form (light weight), 6 months later I am DL 390 (1 rep max) and most importantly pain free after playing ball?..
Thanks DL?s
C-Matic
If the doctor said “go ahead and keep lifting weights”, and you lifted like an idiot with bad technique, and you injured yourself, then you could sue the doctor.
Don’t mistake lack of knowledge for unwillingness to take the risk when they cannot be responsible for what you do out there. They don’t know if you know what you are doing.
Having said that, most general practitioners are not trained in health / fitness and not up to speed. But that is not what they are there for. It is a shame. It would be good if all GPs recommended to patients to start a weight training regime and gave out great diet books. OR at least, didn’t contradict good advice in areas they have never studied.
Years back they got a strong deadlifter and did xrays in a vet hospital -the xray machine was for horses, big enough to get a snapshot of the guy whilst doing deadlifts. They wanted to see what happened to the discs under load. They found zero compression - they were surprised and happy to discover how strong the guys spine was even after decades of deadlifting.
Has anyone ever injured their back deadlifting? Was it down to bad technique?
[quote]grey wrote:
I’ve read all kinds of garbage recently that deadlifts are “bad for your back”.
Well…let me tell you a little story.
Three months ago I had a doctor tell me that I had probably herniated a disk.
I had lower back pain from doing heavy standing military presses.
This doctor told me to stop lifting weights. What did i do? I began an intensive deadlift routine and whala! 3 months later the same doctor has given me an all clear signal.
What does this lead me to believe…
Conclusion…deadlifts are our best friend and doing them right gives total body strength.
Finally…I will never stop deadlifting.[/quote]
You are completely on the money. I suffered a very debilitating disc protrusion at the age of 14, and have had four recurrent episodes since then. The last 6 years I have been doing Romanians, Sumo and Regular D/L’s and the Chiropractor told me the reason I’ll never need surgery is because of my strength training. Oh yeah, my chiro is also a powerlifter and helped me walk when traditional doctors wanted to inject my spine with various anaesthetics so I could stand up and walk. Needless to say I refer everyone to my Chiro…he’s like the local Guru for everyone at the gym.
Strength training, incorporating deads, etc, is one of the best cures of back pain there is. End of story!
Great post, I will forward this to all the Doctors I know.
MTS
If only we could all have Franco Columbo as our chiropractor…
About six months ago I suffered a complete prolapse (nucleus squirted out) of the L4/L5 disc and I had to have surgery.
My surgeon used to play competitive rugby and his opinion was conventional deadlifs are great for most but if you have a very long torso + short legs (me!) it can cause a serious problem, but everyone can Sumo.
In fact he was very pro weightlifting except for heavy back squats.
When he was younger he was the sports surgeon for the Aus Rugby team and he felt that almost all of their lower back disc herniations and prolapses were caused by back squats but the movement was just too valuable to the players’ performance to leave out.
As for me I am back to my pre-surgegery weight (i regained 13kg in 4 months!!!). I have not started Sumos yet but i intend to.
[quote]gotaknife wrote:
About six months ago I suffered a complete prolapse (nucleus squirted out) of the L4/L5 disc and I had to have surgery.
My surgeon used to play competitive rugby and his opinion was conventional deadlifs are great for most but if you have a very long torso + short legs (me!) it can cause a serious problem, but everyone can Sumo.
In fact he was very pro weightlifting except for heavy back squats.
When he was younger he was the sports surgeon for the Aus Rugby team and he felt that almost all of their lower back disc herniations and prolapses were caused by back squats but the movement was just too valuable to the players’ performance to leave out.
As for me I am back to my pre-surgegery weight (i regained 13kg in 4 months!!!). I have not started Sumos yet but i intend to.[/quote]
Did he mention why he felt sumo style was better? I would guess its because it allows you to keep you back more upright than conventional but then what do I know!
Grats on getting back out there!
I think this is a pretty cool post. I started deadliftin (mostly stiff legged) a couple months ago, and the added back strength and endurance greatly improves my ability to enhance other lifts and everyday life. i read about form on here constantly and am very vigilant of my own form, and i’m almost scared to go too heavy because i don’t want to mess my back up. slow and steady i reckon. great post
I’ve had a herniated disc for about two years now. My back hasn’t felt better since I started pulling heavy. Coincidence? Doubt it.
Glad to hear all the good deadlifting stories. It just further confirms my opinion that they are required if you want to stay healthy.
I also agree that too much weight and bad form are dangerous. I guess you could compare it to driving a car. If you stay within the speed limit and stay between the white lines you should be ok. Go to fast and start fucking around on the road and you risk having an accident.
I like to mix up my weights. One pulling session will be 6 x 6 with a medium light weight with super form. I use around 275 for this day. I concentrate on keeping the bar close and think about my back and hip position during all phases of the lift. I also concentrate on keeping a tight center.
My heavy days consist of pyramiding low reps ending with a triple with 400 - 450 depending on how I feel. I know I can do more but I like to keep within the speedlimit. I am after all driving a body built in 1960 hahaha.
[quote]Magarhe wrote:
If the doctor said “go ahead and keep lifting weights”, and you lifted like an idiot with bad technique, and you injured yourself, then you could sue the doctor.
Don’t mistake lack of knowledge for unwillingness to take the risk when they cannot be responsible for what you do out there. They don’t know if you know what you are doing.
[/quote]
I have spoken with 6 different doctors about my spine and one of them, a whole one, mentioned anything about rehab, and this was only after I specifically asked him about it.
A doctor isn’t going to tell you to go back and deadlift because that isn’t his specialty. The problem is is that none of them admit that they know fuck all about weight training and then refer you to a specialist.
I’m about to get an attack of the fucking rage here. I did all the right things. I went to a doctor and asked for an MRI so I could then go to a rehab guru and get shit sorted out. Guess what? you can’t get an MRI without a specialist’s referral in Australia. And the only way to get a referral is to get an xray done. So even though I know an xray is fucking worthless, I have to fork out money for that.
I take the results back to my doctor and she looks at it and says “yep, you have back problems. You should go and see a specialist”. It takes me two months to get into the specialist’s office. When I get there, he says that the xray is worthless and that I should have got an MRI. So he sends me down to get an MRI and a nuclear scan done.
Another month goes by and I get the results and take them back to the specialist. He says “yep, you’ve ruptured a disc”. I say no shit, I told you that a month ago. He says that the best course of action is to do nothing for 3 months.
Three months go by and I see him for a follow up meeting. He asks me how I am going. I say “Shithouse. I have lost three inches off my legs, 10 kilos in bodyweight and I’ve put two inches on my waist from not being able to train”. He smiles and says “Well you would have got fat and weak as you got older anyway”.
The only reason that I got a referral to a rehab guy was that I threatened the specialist with defenestration if he didn’t. All up, this experience has cost me $2,500 and six months of my time for something that I asked for in the beginning.
Doctors can suck my dick.
I hurt my lower back about a month or two ago, and it still hurts when I sprint and my back feels particularly stiff in the mornings. I think I managed to hurt it during DLs actually, rounded my back a little too much on the way down.
Currently going through physiotherapy, and has been on-and-off with weightlifting (I felt that I re-injured it by weightlifting and playing rugby too soon, not giving the back ample time for recovery). After reading this thread, it’s really changed my mind, since I’ve actually gotten quite “scared” (for lack of a better word) about DLing and heavy squatting since the injury. After this thread, I think I’m going try some DLing again when I go to the gym.
fingers crossed
I was new and inexperienced.
I was impressionable at the time.
I would try just about anything once.
This is how my addiction started:
http://www.T-Nation.com/readTopic.do?id=341472
I went in for a torn pec and after this Dr. told me about that he also suggested I stop deadlifting cause I will probably end up hurting my back.
What a douche. I think I’ll stop going to work cause the bldg may fall down on my head too. Dumbass.
I despise Doctors.
[quote]Massif wrote:
Magarhe wrote:
If the doctor said “go ahead and keep lifting weights”, and you lifted like an idiot with bad technique, and you injured yourself, then you could sue the doctor.
Don’t mistake lack of knowledge for unwillingness to take the risk when they cannot be responsible for what you do out there. They don’t know if you know what you are doing.
I have spoken with 6 different doctors about my spine and one of them, a whole one, mentioned anything about rehab, and this was only after I specifically asked him about it.
A doctor isn’t going to tell you to go back and deadlift because that isn’t his specialty. The problem is is that none of them admit that they know fuck all about weight training and then refer you to a specialist.
I’m about to get an attack of the fucking rage here. I did all the right things. I went to a doctor and asked for an MRI so I could then go to a rehab guru and get shit sorted out. Guess what? you can’t get an MRI without a specialist’s referral in Australia. And the only way to get a referral is to get an xray done. So even though I know an xray is fucking worthless, I have to fork out money for that.
I take the results back to my doctor and she looks at it and says “yep, you have back problems. You should go and see a specialist”. It takes me two months to get into the specialist’s office. When I get there, he says that the xray is worthless and that I should have got an MRI. So he sends me down to get an MRI and a nuclear scan done.
Another month goes by and I get the results and take them back to the specialist. He says “yep, you’ve ruptured a disc”. I say no shit, I told you that a month ago. He says that the best course of action is to do nothing for 3 months.
Three months go by and I see him for a follow up meeting. He asks me how I am going. I say “Shithouse. I have lost three inches off my legs, 10 kilos in bodyweight and I’ve put two inches on my waist from not being able to train”. He smiles and says “Well you would have got fat and weak as you got older anyway”.
The only reason that I got a referral to a rehab guy was that I threatened the specialist with defenestration if he didn’t. All up, this experience has cost me $2,500 and six months of my time for something that I asked for in the beginning.
Doctors can suck my dick.[/quote]
Great Post. WORD!
[quote]SilentQuest wrote:
Do you guys use mixed grip for dl? If yes, woudl you say that alternating every set can avoid possibility of developing imbalance?[/quote]
Alternating grip was told to me this way by an “old” guy who I respect very much and is strong as hell. He said, that basically, and you are correct as well about imbalance, but it will save you much wear and tear on your biceps.