DC Training Thread (Part 2)

Training Bodybuilding
801

[quote]johnson575 wrote:
When doing pinwheels, is the point to reach across the chest to the opposite shoulder or to bring up the weight closer to same side shoulder. Sometimes i have a problem feeling the work done.[/quote]

Hmmm. My chest would get in the way if I tried to reach the opposite side shoulder, and my arms are somewhat short anyway.

I don’t think that detail matters all that much, but just try it out and see what feels better.

If you can’t feel the work being done, try not to start the reps by shrugging your shoulder and THEN curling…
Start (with a bit of a bend in your elbow!) a rep by exploding the weight up via your arm flexors, and then you can (if necessary) add a little bit of a shoulder shrug, esp. on the second half of the set.

That technique may not work so well with the 135’s, but it works with anything below the 115’s or so :wink:

802

[quote]kylec72 wrote:
Pinwheels - DC Training/Pinwheel Curls - YouTube [/quote]

Yeah, he’s touching the middle or slightly on the same side he’s curling from.

Also doesn’t go all the way up… I don’t do that either, anymore. Going too far up with curls seems to bother my elbow are a bit.

803

[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
Mateus wrote:
I am loving the reverse close grip press on the smith for triceps. Does it make a huge difference if you use a 7 degree smith machine -vs- a 0 degree or completely vertical one?

For the sake of your setup and continued health I seriously hope that you meant “Reverse Wide grip press” :wink:

If you have an angled smith, set up so that the bar actually travels towards your feet when you press up (and towards your feet… :wink:

[/quote]

I was wondering why my wrists hurt so bad! JK!! typo. I will turn the bench around and press the opposite way. Currently we have been pressing towards our head. Doing them today so we’ll see how it goes…TY

804

i think that sometimes there are exercises where you just don’t feel it as you are doing it. another example i can think of where this might happen would be with sumo leg presses where my hams aren’t dying during the exercise, but i definitely know that they were worked hard when i wake up the next morning. pinwheels are like this for me as well, i typically will feel it a little more in the bis than in the forearms.

805

[quote]Mateus wrote:
Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
Mateus wrote:
I am loving the reverse close grip press on the smith for triceps. Does it make a huge difference if you use a 7 degree smith machine -vs- a 0 degree or completely vertical one?

For the sake of your setup and continued health I seriously hope that you meant “Reverse Wide grip press” :wink:

If you have an angled smith, set up so that the bar actually travels towards your feet when you press up (and towards your feet… :wink:

I was wondering why my wrists hurt so bad! JK!! typo. I will turn the bench around and press the opposite way. Currently we have been pressing towards our head. Doing them today so we’ll see how it goes…TY[/quote]

Definitely a difference when pushing up and away for the SWRGP. Its interesting how the body works from one week to the next. 1A last time was virtually no changes in weight and rep range from the previous session. This week I went up 25-95 lbs depending on the exercise. Loving DC. Only downside is that with a partner the workouts are taking around 90 mins. Nice to have a spotter that knows exactly what to do and when to do it. Trade off…

806

bump.

807

bump

808

Well…its been about a year, but I’m back to DC! I’ll let you guys know how things go.

809

Here is my sample blast setup, please critique.

A1
DB Bench (15-25 RP)
Push Press (11-15 RP)
Weighted Dips (11-15 RP)
Lat. P. Down (11-15 RP)
Deadlifts (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS)

B1
Thick bar BB curls (11-15 RP)
Reverse Grip preacher curl (10-20 SS)
Leg Press Calf Raise (10-12)
GHR (11-15 RP)
Front Squat (1x4-6 SS/ WM)

A2
Thick Bar B. Press(11-15 RP)
Seated DB Press (20-30 RP)
Skull Crushers (15-25 RP)
Wide Grip Weighted P. Up’s (11-15 RP)
Bent Over Rows (1x4-6 SS// 1x10-12 SS)

B2

Incline DB Curls (15-15 R.P.)
Hammer Curl (10-20 SS)
Seated Calf Machine (10-12)
Leg Curls (11-15 R.P.)
Bulgarian split Squat! (1x4-6 SS, WM)

A3
Incline DB Press (15-25 RP)
Seated Smith Machine (11-15 RP)
Thick bar CGBP (11-15 RP)
Chin Up’s (11-15 RP)
1 Arm DB Rows (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12SS)

B3
Zottman Curls (20-30 R.P.)
Pin Wheel Curls (10-20SS)
Standing DB calf Raise (10-12)
SLDL (11-15 RP)
BB Squat (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS)

…Lol I know this ishh is going to kick my ass… I read on IM that the ham exercises are SS not RP but on WOjo’s DVD they were RP… And calf raises are one set now? I also thought on the DVD they RP’d them…?

810

I RP some calf sets like standing calf raises, because I just cant stand with the weight on my back for 4 minutes straight without my back playing up. But they are supposed to be ~12 rep straight set with a 5s negative and 15s stretch at the bottom of every rep.

On B3, you should do SLDL last, and maybe not do Squats just before, switch it with something easier on the lower back

Theyre the easy things I let more epxerienced people pick it apart further :stuck_out_tongue:

811

[quote]LilDaDDyDreW wrote:
Here is my sample blast setup, please critique.

A1
DB Bench (15-25 RP) - 20-30RP
Push Press (11-15 RP) - MIGHT WANT TO GO A LITTLE HIGHER
Weighted Dips (11-15 RP) - 11-20 OR 15-20RP
Lat. P. Down (11-15 RP)
Deadlifts (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS)

B1
Thick bar BB curls (11-15 RP) - 11-20 OR 15-20RP
Reverse Grip preacher curl (10-20 SS)
Leg Press Calf Raise (10-12)
GHR (11-15 RP) - 11-20 OR 15-20RP
Front Squat (1x4-6 SS/ WM) - MIGHT WANT TO GO WITH A 4-8SS, GIVE YOURSELF MORE ROOM TO OPERATE IN THE REP RANGE

A2
Thick Bar B. Press(11-15 RP) - IF THIS IS A BENCH PRESS, THEN GO WITH 20-30RP FOR SAFETY
Seated DB Press (20-30 RP)
Skull Crushers (15-25 RP) - OR 20-30RP, WHATEVER KEEPS THE ELBOWS FEELING GOOD
Wide Grip Weighted P. Up’s (11-15 RP)
Bent Over Rows (1x4-6 SS// 1x10-12 SS) - MAYBE 4-8 AND 8-12SS

B2

Incline DB Curls (15-15 R.P.) - 20-30RP
Hammer Curl (10-20 SS)
Seated Calf Machine (10-12)
Leg Curls (11-15 R.P.) - 15-30RP
Bulgarian split Squat! (1x4-6 SS, WM) - DON’T KNOW HOW WELL THESE WILL WORK DUE TO THEM TAXING THE STABILIZERS AND BEING SOMEWHAT OF A BALANCING EXERCISE. THE WIDOW FOR IT MIGHT BE HARD

A3
Incline DB Press (15-25 RP) - 20-30RP
Seated Smith Machine (11-15 RP) - 11-20 OR 15-20RP
Thick bar CGBP (11-15 RP) - 11-20 OR 15-20RP
Chin Up’s (11-15 RP) - GO WITH A HIGHER REP RANGE, MAYBE ABOUT 20-30RP
1 Arm DB Rows (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12SS) - HIGHER REPS BECAUSE YOU’RE GOING WITH A DB. I PERSONALLY GO WITH A 7-9 AND 9-16SS

B3
Zottman Curls (20-30 R.P.)
Pin Wheel Curls (10-20SS)
Standing DB calf Raise (10-12)
SLDL (11-15 RP) - DO THEM SS, MAYBE 8-12 - put these after squats
BB Squat (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS) - SAME AS OTHER THINGS, GO WITH THE 4-8SS AND THEN WITH THE WIDOWMAKER

…Lol I know this ishh is going to kick my ass… I read on IM that the ham exercises are SS not RP but on WOjo’s DVD they were RP… And calf raises are one set now? I also thought on the DVD they RP’d them…?[/quote]

i’m in caps above. might want to change things up because you end your blast with sldl/squats and then as you wrap back around you are doing deads, might not make your lower back very happy. hope the comments help. ham exercises are done rp, but not with sldl because a rp set can cause form to break down. calf raises are one set, do the 5 second negative, 15 second hold at the bottom and you will see why you aren’t rest pausing them.

812

Dropshot already made most of the necessary adjustments, but I’ll add a few that I noticed.

[quote]LilDaDDyDreW wrote:
Here is my sample blast setup, please critique.

A1
DB Bench (15-25 RP)
Push Press (11-15 RP)
Weighted Dips (11-15 RP)
Lat. P. Down (11-15 RP)
Deadlifts (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS)
[/quote]

Might want to go with a higher RP range for lat pull-downs, as lower reps (like 6-8) often cause people to make the exercise into an arm flexor one instead of a lat exercise.

I’d also go 4-8, and maybe 10-15 with the DL’s. Like dropshot said with the front squats, you want a little more room to maneuver within your rep range. Otherwise you’ll lose exercises much more often.

Realize that you won’t be able to do a WM very well with a freestanding front squat. You’ll need to either do them in the Smith, or you can use a leg press/machine variation that you aren’t using already.

Go at least 15-30, if not 20-30 with the skull crushers.

Bump the rep range up with the pull-ups (if possible, if not try rack chins).

Either go with the rep ranges that dropshot suggested on the bent rows, or just do one straight set of 8-12.

Switch the BB back squats to this workout.

I’d suggest just one high rep set with the 1 arm rows, done “Kroc Row” style. You really don’t need to do two sets for most row exercises and this is one that just seems to work well with higher reps.

Honestly I’d ditch the Bulgarian split squats altogether and put something like a leg press or machine hack squat variation here. Make it your second to last exercise and SLDL’s your last exercise. You never, ever want to try to do SLDL’s in the same workout as BB back squats when doing DC. That would be just asking for a lower back injury.

[quote]
…Lol I know this ishh is going to kick my ass… I read on IM that the ham exercises are SS not RP but on WOjo’s DVD they were RP… And calf raises are one set now? I also thought on the DVD they RP’d them…?[/quote]

They’re a straight set. 1 second squeeze at full contraction, 5 second negative, 15 second hold at fully stretched position on every single rep. Believe us when we tell you that you won’t want to do any more after the 1 straight set. :wink:

813

[quote]Stronghold wrote:
Well…its been about a year, but I’m back to DC! I’ll let you guys know how things go.[/quote]

Welcome back :slight_smile:

…how come?

814

[quote]LilDaDDyDreW wrote:
Here is my sample blast setup, please critique.

A1
DB Bench (15-25 RP)
Push Press (11-15 RP)
Weighted Dips (11-15 RP)
Lat. P. Down (11-15 RP)
Deadlifts (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS)

B1
Thick bar BB curls (11-15 RP)
Reverse Grip preacher curl (10-20 SS)
Leg Press Calf Raise (10-12)
GHR (11-15 RP)
Front Squat (1x4-6 SS/ WM)

A2
Thick Bar B. Press(11-15 RP)
Seated DB Press (20-30 RP)
Skull Crushers (15-25 RP)
Wide Grip Weighted P. Up’s (11-15 RP)
Bent Over Rows (1x4-6 SS// 1x10-12 SS)

B2

Incline DB Curls (15-15 R.P.)
Hammer Curl (10-20 SS)
Seated Calf Machine (10-12)
Leg Curls (11-15 R.P.)
Bulgarian split Squat! (1x4-6 SS, WM)

A3
Incline DB Press (15-25 RP)
Seated Smith Machine (11-15 RP)
Thick bar CGBP (11-15 RP)
Chin Up’s (11-15 RP)
1 Arm DB Rows (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12SS)

B3
Zottman Curls (20-30 R.P.)
Pin Wheel Curls (10-20SS)
Standing DB calf Raise (10-12)
SLDL (11-15 RP)
BB Squat (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS)

…Lol I know this ishh is going to kick my ass… I read on IM that the ham exercises are SS not RP but on WOjo’s DVD they were RP… And calf raises are one set now? I also thought on the DVD they RP’d them…?[/quote]

Didn’t you make a thread about DC vs. BBB and everyone (including several of us) told you to do BBB?

You also did not read the stickies over at IM.

815

Some measurements so far:
Week 1: Weight=182.2, Right Bicep=15.25, Right Thigh=22.75 (I start DC here. I did a cut before and kept nutrition the same except for workout fuel before the workout)
Week 2: Weight=181.8, Right Bicep=15, Right Thigh=22.5
Week 3: Weight=176.7, Right Bicep=14.875, Right Thigh=22.125 (here I realize I can afford to add more calories and carbs without getting fat, so I introduce Thib’s pre-workout protocol, 2 servings on carb refeed day, and 1 serving the other two days)
Week 4: Weight=179.8, Right Bicep=15.125, Right Thigh=22.125
Week 5: Weight=178.9, Right Bicep=15, Right Thigh=22.625 (this was measured yesterday)

Is it too early to tell whether I should make any further adjustments?
I am progressing in weight, so maybe I’m getting some mass while also losing some fat here. My waist size measurement actually continued to drop (31.75 to 31.125 during this time).
DC is a pretty demanding routine, and I would expect to get a bigger rebound than this following the cut, so perhaps I should bump the pre-workout protocol to 2 servings every workout day.
My biceps did not grow during this time, though I guess it’s still too early to say anything

816

give it a little more time and see how it works. because of the lower volume and because this is not one of the “pump” type workouts, then the measurements might have gone down just because you had less inflammation.

817

[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
LilDaDDyDreW wrote:
Here is my sample blast setup, please critique.

A1
DB Bench (15-25 RP)
Push Press (11-15 RP)
Weighted Dips (11-15 RP)
Lat. P. Down (11-15 RP)
Deadlifts (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS)

B1
Thick bar BB curls (11-15 RP)
Reverse Grip preacher curl (10-20 SS)
Leg Press Calf Raise (10-12)
GHR (11-15 RP)
Front Squat (1x4-6 SS/ WM)

A2
Thick Bar B. Press(11-15 RP)
Seated DB Press (20-30 RP)
Skull Crushers (15-25 RP)
Wide Grip Weighted P. Up’s (11-15 RP)
Bent Over Rows (1x4-6 SS// 1x10-12 SS)

B2

Incline DB Curls (15-15 R.P.)
Hammer Curl (10-20 SS)
Seated Calf Machine (10-12)
Leg Curls (11-15 R.P.)
Bulgarian split Squat! (1x4-6 SS, WM)

A3
Incline DB Press (15-25 RP)
Seated Smith Machine (11-15 RP)
Thick bar CGBP (11-15 RP)
Chin Up’s (11-15 RP)
1 Arm DB Rows (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12SS)

B3
Zottman Curls (20-30 R.P.)
Pin Wheel Curls (10-20SS)
Standing DB calf Raise (10-12)
SLDL (11-15 RP)
BB Squat (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS)

…Lol I know this ishh is going to kick my ass… I read on IM that the ham exercises are SS not RP but on WOjo’s DVD they were RP… And calf raises are one set now? I also thought on the DVD they RP’d them…?

Didn’t you make a thread about DC vs. BBB and everyone (including several of us) told you to do BBB?

You also did not read the stickies over at IM.

[/quote]

Don’t tell me what I did or did not read… As far as picking BBB or D.C. training, I know my body/life/schedule very well BBB will not work well for me.

818

[quote]TheBlade wrote:
Some measurements so far:
Week 1: Weight=182.2, Right Bicep=15.25, Right Thigh=22.75 (I start DC here. I did a cut before and kept nutrition the same except for workout fuel before the workout)
Week 2: Weight=181.8, Right Bicep=15, Right Thigh=22.5
Week 3: Weight=176.7, Right Bicep=14.875, Right Thigh=22.125 (here I realize I can afford to add more calories and carbs without getting fat, so I introduce Thib’s pre-workout protocol, 2 servings on carb refeed day, and 1 serving the other two days)
Week 4: Weight=179.8, Right Bicep=15.125, Right Thigh=22.125
Week 5: Weight=178.9, Right Bicep=15, Right Thigh=22.625 (this was measured yesterday)

Is it too early to tell whether I should make any further adjustments?
I am progressing in weight, so maybe I’m getting some mass while also losing some fat here. My waist size measurement actually continued to drop (31.75 to 31.125 during this time).
DC is a pretty demanding routine, and I would expect to get a bigger rebound than this following the cut, so perhaps I should bump the pre-workout protocol to 2 servings every workout day.
My biceps did not grow during this time, though I guess it’s still too early to say anything[/quote]

Are you trying to continue the cut? If not, you definitely need to increase the calories by A LOT. In a 5 week span I gained roughly 7 pounds AND from the feel of it I leaned out some in the process as well. My pants began to feel much loser around the waist, yet I gained about 1’’ on my quads. This isn’t about me, though, and I only wanted to show you an example. Keep at it and do not underestimate the amount of food you need in order to grow. As Dante and other DC vets say make your body into a human blast furnace eating machine.

819

[quote]LilDaDDyDreW wrote:
Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
LilDaDDyDreW wrote:
Here is my sample blast setup, please critique.

A1
DB Bench (15-25 RP)
Push Press (11-15 RP)
Weighted Dips (11-15 RP)
Lat. P. Down (11-15 RP)
Deadlifts (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS)

B1
Thick bar BB curls (11-15 RP)
Reverse Grip preacher curl (10-20 SS)
Leg Press Calf Raise (10-12)
GHR (11-15 RP)
Front Squat (1x4-6 SS/ WM)

A2
Thick Bar B. Press(11-15 RP)
Seated DB Press (20-30 RP)
Skull Crushers (15-25 RP)
Wide Grip Weighted P. Up’s (11-15 RP)
Bent Over Rows (1x4-6 SS// 1x10-12 SS)

B2

Incline DB Curls (15-15 R.P.)
Hammer Curl (10-20 SS)
Seated Calf Machine (10-12)
Leg Curls (11-15 R.P.)
Bulgarian split Squat! (1x4-6 SS, WM)

A3
Incline DB Press (15-25 RP)
Seated Smith Machine (11-15 RP)
Thick bar CGBP (11-15 RP)
Chin Up’s (11-15 RP)
1 Arm DB Rows (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12SS)

B3
Zottman Curls (20-30 R.P.)
Pin Wheel Curls (10-20SS)
Standing DB calf Raise (10-12)
SLDL (11-15 RP)
BB Squat (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS)

…Lol I know this ishh is going to kick my ass… I read on IM that the ham exercises are SS not RP but on WOjo’s DVD they were RP… And calf raises are one set now? I also thought on the DVD they RP’d them…?

Didn’t you make a thread about DC vs. BBB and everyone (including several of us) told you to do BBB?

You also did not read the stickies over at IM.

Don’t tell me what I did or did not read… As far as picking BBB or D.C. training, I know my body/life/schedule very well BBB will not work well for me.[/quote]

Does DC training appeal to you as a time saver due to the 3 day training week? I can tell you first-hand this is very misleading because of the demands DC places on your body. In the words of SentoGuy - “I feel like I got run over by a truck the next day in many cases.” For me, I’m certain the Grim Reaper takes control of my body immediately following a workout, because the best way I can describe it is I feel like death haha.

820

[quote]LilDaDDyDreW wrote:
Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
LilDaDDyDreW wrote:
Here is my sample blast setup, please critique.

A1
DB Bench (15-25 RP)
Push Press (11-15 RP)
Weighted Dips (11-15 RP)
Lat. P. Down (11-15 RP)
Deadlifts (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS)

B1
Thick bar BB curls (11-15 RP)
Reverse Grip preacher curl (10-20 SS)
Leg Press Calf Raise (10-12)
GHR (11-15 RP)
Front Squat (1x4-6 SS/ WM)

A2
Thick Bar B. Press(11-15 RP)
Seated DB Press (20-30 RP)
Skull Crushers (15-25 RP)
Wide Grip Weighted P. Up’s (11-15 RP)
Bent Over Rows (1x4-6 SS// 1x10-12 SS)

B2

Incline DB Curls (15-15 R.P.)
Hammer Curl (10-20 SS)
Seated Calf Machine (10-12)
Leg Curls (11-15 R.P.)
Bulgarian split Squat! (1x4-6 SS, WM)

A3
Incline DB Press (15-25 RP)
Seated Smith Machine (11-15 RP)
Thick bar CGBP (11-15 RP)
Chin Up’s (11-15 RP)
1 Arm DB Rows (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12SS)

B3
Zottman Curls (20-30 R.P.)
Pin Wheel Curls (10-20SS)
Standing DB calf Raise (10-12)
SLDL (11-15 RP)
BB Squat (1x4-6 SS//1x10-12 SS) [/quote] Widowmaker. [quote]

…Lol I know this ishh is going to kick my ass… I read on IM that the ham exercises are SS not RP but on WOjo’s DVD they were RP… And calf raises are one set now? I also thought on the DVD they RP’d them…?

Didn’t you make a thread about DC vs. BBB and everyone (including several of us) told you to do BBB?

You also did not read the stickies over at IM.

Don’t tell me what I did or did not read[/quote] Maybe I should tell you to pay more attention while reading then? Both over at IM as well as in here we’ve discussed the following a few… Hundred times? :
-Vast majority of people do much better with higher RP reps on arm exercises, whether you think that you’re “fast twitch” or not. Also, safety issues.
-15-30RP on backwidth work, unless you’re gifted in that area and then go 12-20 or so… But not 11-15. I don’t know of a single person doing well in that area on 11-15…
-15-30RP on leg curls. Again, safety. And if you want to follow Charles Poliquin’s advice instead, then use one of his routines.
-4-6 reps on BO rows? Right. It’s supposed to train your backthickness, not your arm flexors and some lats.
Scapular retraction being pretty much half the row is important if you want to keep your shoulders healthy (otherwise you’re not doing shit to “balance out pressing with pulling”), especially if you don’t do any extra scap work.
BO rows are usually done for one set of 10-12. Alternatives would be 6-8+9-12 or (imo better) the other way around.
-Ham exercises involving the low-back /hip dominant ham work are not rest-paused. There is also a “special” protocol for SLDL’s.
-No back squats on the same day as SLDL’s (balance out low-back involvement)
-kroc row rep ranges etc. 4-6 reps on a one-armed DB row? …
-progression/shoulder fatigue problems when doing CGP after free-weight chest work. Alternatives:
In-Humans, SWRGB, CGP off the pins in a power rack, 2-board CGP…
-Exercise selection/Rep Ranges in general… 4-6 reps with Bulgarian Split Squats? And a split squat widow?
Exercises:

  1. Fast and safe progression
  2. Low injury potential
    -Elbow health (skullcrushers)
    -Try to avoid having Deads/Squats/SLDL’s/Bent-Rows etc (low-back stressing lifts) in adjacent sessions.
    -You need 5-6 good “big” exercises for every muscle-group in order to be able to do DC for a nice amount of time. 3 in your rotation and 2-3 alternatives in case you stall (more alternatives needed for biceps and other small muscle-groups compared to, say, quads) and so on.
    Make sure you have enough alternatives, otherwise you can just use something like 5/3/1 or whatever… Which imo would be the better option for you anyway (provided the assistance template is well-designed).

Seems like I have to mention the same stuff almost every single time someone posts a rotation here. In the end we get to hear “oh, I can’t feel my lats when doing DC… My arms didn’t grow… I got fat… I hurt my *insert joint-name/muscle here”… Not addressing this to you in particular, just wanted to get that off my chest for once.

Getting the vibe that almost no one actually does their homework here; they want to jump right into the action and expect others to take care of the details. And probably expect DC to turn them into a superheavy within 3 months…

It also seems like we get a lot of guys who are still rather weak and small, or afraid to eat or whatever.
(blasted article…) I’ll say it again: People who aren’t pushing and pulling major amounts of slag iron already are better off repeating the same exercise more often, improving their setup and technique and so on.

Even the 4-day version? What about 5/3/1? That’s done 3 days a week (more if you want) Not cool enough?
DC is very draining on the nervous(?) system. If you have a very hectic schedule, walking around like a zombie outside of the gym 6-8 weeks into a blast is not very helpful.

Don’t think I’m saying this to make fun of you or to patronize you…