No kidding. I thought you were just ribbing me a little!
They might not work, but we can have them there quickly!
Hell, the hospital is only 10 minutes from here. I can have them a batch by tomorrow at noon.
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You could probably buy some vacuum cleaners and tell them they are ventilators.
I have a freakin Rigid shop vac that will ventilate the shit out of somebody.
You get the attachment that connects to the exhaust, tape it up a little so that it fits better (where doesnât matter) and you have 1 3/4 hp. of ventilate the bajeezus out of someone!
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However you want to phrase it, he isnât buying them when there is a shortage and a critical need
Looks like it took you a while to read it, didnât it?
It might not be the ideal equipment, but its better than nothing. Or we could just save money and let people die.
A need for a ventilator that isnât an actual ventilator?
No. I read it before we started conversing. Thatâs how I knew to go back and grab a couple of quotes to slap you around with.
Logic bro. Youâre doin it wrong.
Or, as per my position, you could spend it on faulty poorly designed equipment, and kill them.
Back to the ole âsometimes something isnât better than nothingâ.
Does it do the job or not? If so, then it is an acceptable substitute. If not, then why does Cuomo want federal funding for it?
I donât think the manufacturer says itâs an actual ventilator.
The Atlantic article was quite interesting but probably too long for a country where the president can only focus on bullet points.
The way to go from this seems to be mass production of medical supply and tests to be able to contain small outbreaks in the future. This procedure is also one that some experts seem to favour over here in Germany.
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So this thread gave me a few ideas, since weâve seen similar behaviors here, really proves people are people regardless of geography.
A couple points that might be useful:
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youâll probably want to keep working out and thatâs great, I think many here have some home equipment or managed to buy some for the occasion. As a generic rule, err on the side of caution. Hospitals are the last place you want to be right now, theyâve been proven to be a vehicle of infection, so you donât want to injure yourself right now. In general, you donât want to have an accident, break something, even ruin a tooth or something else. Healthcare workers are going to be focused on treating coronavirus, so their attention to other stuff is going to be reduced, care is going to be reduced, going to the hospital or the dentits or else is risky;
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old people and their habits. Weâve seen the same here, I guess old people are old people in the whole world. They have all their habits and rituals and donât want to give them up since in a normal situation, itâs harmless stuff. Waking up early, taking coffe always at the same bar and have a chat with other old fellas about the good olâ times, going to the grocery store just to pick up one or two things every day instead of doing shopping once a week and so forth. In this situation, these habits ARE NOT harmless, for many reasons. You have to pound this notion into their brains.
Older people are the most at risk for severe complications and deaths, if we take the whole human side out of the equation, this means that theyâre the most responsible for overloading hospitals and ICU units. Itâs brutal, but from a strictly practical standpoint, thatâs the first reason they canât reason like âIâm old, if I die, I dieâ.
Fuck nope, even in that scenario, before death comes a timeframe in which they take up hospital beds, occupy ICU units and machines and workforce from the hospital staff, reducing their effectiveness for everyone else.
This notion really needs to be hammered into everyoneâs head, really. Itâs not just âI live/I dieâ, itâs that you infect other people that might live or die, and indirectly become a burden as you contribute in exhausting medical resoruces, that right now are not a commodity at all; -
I read people are still going outside, doing bike rides, throwing parties at home. If people are still gathering, even in small numbers, youâre not distancing and youâre not isolating, basically you have yet to start the real quarantine. Canât figure out if people realized the rate of spread of this virus, being in contact with a couple people every day, and theyâre in contact with a couple other people every day, and so forth, is a damn fine strategy to make social distancing useless. Itâs enough to keep it spreading big time. You have to either make a serious kind of isolation, or avoid it at all. We know something about half measures here and theyâre damaging, no two ways around it;
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tied to the previous point, a point of worry. Social distancing and isolation become alienating, quickly. Talking about staying at home, going out once a week for essential goods shopping, in and out, no going around and chatting and strolling or else. No parties, no happy hours, no gathering of any kind, no going to the park and so forth. People might have to stay completely alone at home, or they might avoid killing each other with their spouses, or might need to stay in the same house with someone whoâs compromised and keep distance at home too. There are A LOT of possible scenario that might really build up pressure at home, while already feeling pressured by the reduction in personal freedom and sudden change of habits. People here are developing insomnia, depression, paranoia and mental health is taking a hit on some.
This is something to consider seriously in the US, given the gun culture there. If a real lockdown is enforced, things might get ugly, quickly.
Talking about home arguments turning to homicide or homicide/suicide over futile reasons, people pulling the trigger too easily on others if they feel threatened (i.e. they start expecting food supplies are going to drop significantly, I can imagine the rumble at the stores), withchunts looking for the spreader.
Anectodal fact based on current real life: people here have been going out jogging until last week. On their own, on desert streets or isolated parts of their towns for most part. The numbers here werenât dropping, so the government took harsher measures and kept repeating to people to stay at home. Doesnât matter if they didnât stop production and people HAD to go to work, and they were the bulk of people still going out. People started looking for a scapegoat, and it was the runners. It has passed the notion here that runner = spreader and source of all evil. Thatâs where the masses are brought to by isolation and building paranoia, which is unavoidable in this situation.
I can tell that if people here had guns, they would have shot runners on sight, and they werenât even the source of the problem. Thereâs an imitation scheme into these things, people are locked at home, spend all their time on socials, fake news and rage flow like wine.
Iâd seriously seriously take all these factors into account there in the US, violence at home and in the streets has a much higher chance to concretize.
Oh, the irony.
Only the braintrust of the Senate and Congress could make a bill that, maybe, sends people 1200 USD cost 10000 USD per taxpayer.
The US legislature has apparently decided to prove to the American people how unflappable they are in face of a crisis by engaging in the same absurd pork barrel politics they do every day.
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I think you were the first one to ask so then I responded. To be logically inconsistent I would have to not criticize Trump for something I criticized Obama for. Thatâs how that works.
Iâve actually been isolated in my house for over a week so I havenât discussed whatâs been happening in any depth with anyone aside from here. My wife is in emergency services so sheâs home long enough to sleep. I generally go against the crowd and since most posters on here are Trump haters I like to take the contrary position. I find it interesting how most people take it personal when their views are challenged. Ad hominems start flying fast.
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Patting Trump on the back for spouting out of his ass about a treatment that had not yet been proven to be significant, DIRECTLY against the advice of the NAID director, is stupid, whether or not he happened to accidentally land on the truth. And what corner of the internet did you even find that article in? You must have searched really hard for it.
On the topic of ventilators with @chris_ottawa. I heard that doctors have found that one ventilator can be used on several patients. I heard they found a way to get 6 patients hooked up to a single ventilator. That helps a bunch.
I also think my estimates on ventilator production are reflecting of my experience in the med device industry. Lots of hoop jumping with the FDA. IMO, we actually could make additional ventilators in a short time frame. Where I worked we were set up to make about 10K pumps a year on one shift. We couldnât expand much by making new production lines, but we could expand by running around the clock with three shifts. That would help.
Another thing we should consider is for the companies that produce ventilators to order way more components than they can assemble, and have other manufacturing companies assemble them. I think if Ford designs, goes though verification, and sets up there own manufacturing, we will not have anything for a while. If they receive all the parts, and engineers from the med. device companies, they might be able to make a good quantity of ventilators in a 4-6 month time line.
I would also like to say that the first modern design ventilator (not the iron lung) was invented in 1955. I am sure the new ones have more bells and whistles on them, but we had effective ventilators in the 1950s. Manufacturing technology was primitive then by todayâs standards, everything was likely mechanical. We should be able to produce something like this quickly that is far more effective than no ventilator at all.
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Japan is now contemplating stricter measures. Hong Kong and Singapore are going back to lockdown. I believe Taiwan is as well. These are places that seemed to have had things under control.
The surge in cases in HK and Singapore is largely due to residents returning from abroad. Over 70 percent of the current wave of cases are imported.
I heard about this. A bunch of western expats back from their skiing in Austria and Italy that came back and proceeded to flout the restrictions.
Thatâs a stellar look.
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