[quote]countingbeans wrote:
redgladiator wrote:
I’m vegan too. I only eat organic grass fed meat.
You’re not a vegan, you’re a dumbass…
Vegan’s don’t eat any meat.
http://www.vegan.org/about_veganism/index.html
I bet you have a leather wallet too.[/quote]
What I can’t even have a leather wallet?? And I have to give up ALL meat? Flameout is not meat though is it? Guess I’m going to quit being a vegan, too much hard work.
[quote]dudinator wrote:
How many eggs does a hen lay per year? What are maintenance costs to humanely raise a hen? I ask because steak can be obtained with minimal suffering however it usually costs a lot more. If everyone in the world went vegetarian I can guarantee that demand for eggs would skyrocket, as would mistreatment of chickens. I’m curious though about the raising a hen thing for eggs (or multiple hens for my diet). [/quote]
It depends on the hen, time of the year, what she eats, her age, etc… but on average I’d say 4 eggs a week. I’ve goggled it and found numbers of 80 to 320 eggs/year (same average of 200/year or 4/week). So a bodybuilder would definitely want to have half a dozen hens. But then again, if you have a backyard, you can have half a dozen hens without problems.
[quote]
The conservation of energy argument wasn’t directed at you but mainly at the people who think raising animals is somehow making energy and matter disappear. [/quote]
I know it doesn’t disappear, but it’s not an efficient expenditure. It takes up to 16 pounds of grain to produce just one pound of meat, and even fish on fish farms must be fed 5 pounds of wild-caught fish to produce one pound of farmed fish flesh. All animals require many times more calories, in the form of grain, soybeans, oats, and corn, than they can possibly return in the form of animal flesh for meat-eaters to consume.
[quote]
http://www.wordtravels.com/Travelguide/Countries/Portugal/Climate/ 50 degrees in the winter? Doesn’t sound like you’d need to conserve many cals there. Not to mention the fact that native (we’re talking millions of years) ancestry has very little to do with Portugal since the Moors invaded it and most Portuguese ancestry would be traced back to Northern Africa since Africa had such an influence on it. [/quote]
That is true, it’s also true that in Brasil 50F was about the coldest I’d ever seen. But then you’d be neglecting my hungarian half.
[quote]
I don’t understand, how are genetics “stretching it”? Could you explain this a little bit better? How can carbs not work for me, work for someone else, and genetics not be to blame for it? Or are you just one of those people who believes the pc notion that genes have very little to do with who we are? Nothing about my lifestyle (lifting, football, volleyball, soccer, very active) changed when I went low carb, yet I became much leaner, stronger, and felt better. How can you explain that? [/quote]
Like I said, I don’t think you can use ancestry (and the genetics attached to it) as an explanation for everything. If you take me for example, it’s impossible to really find out what my ancestry is. As you pointed out, the Portuguese were under dominion of the Moors for over 800 years. But the other half of my family is Hungarian, which is mostly composed of the nordic people, huns, and even the turkish who spent a couple hundred years around the area. So what am I? I tan easily like any Spaniard with Moor blood, I have freckles like a Nordic, white skin and brown hair like a Hun, and have lived all my life in the tropical climate of Brazil. See what I’m saying? If you could trace down my ancestry, it’d be such a big mix, that neither part can really be held accountable for everything I am right now, as an organism. Plus, it takes more than a couple thousand years for an enviroment adaptation to be passed on as strong genetic mark. I’ll try to explain: some civilizations had access to fresh fruit because of the climate, so they ate it, others lived in snow and had no fruit, so they didn’t eat it, but the fact that they didn’t have immediate access to fruit doesn’t necessarily mean they have genetically adapt for the lack of fruit.
Well first, what is usually refered to as low carbs includes more than trace amounts of carbs. I’d say something around 30 to 60g of carbs a day. It’s incredibly easy to do as a vegetarian, eating things like eggs, seitan, tofu (baked, soft, firm, etc), tempeh, etc.
If you’re talking about more of a no-carb approach, like Atkins or Anabolic Diet, then it gets a little bit trickier, but I can see how it’d also be a bit trickier for a meat eater. I’d say you’ll probably eat a ridiculous amount of eggs and seitan, maybe some tempeh or baked tofu here and there (depends of how you’re counting fibers, otherwise even tempeh might throw you off). Now I know you’ll think “pff, you have only seitan, and I have all these different meats I can eat”, well some types of vegetarian protein (seitan, TPV, etc) can be made in a huge variety of different textures and tastes, much like dead animals.
[quote]legendaryblaze wrote:
Huh? I asked you why you don’t eat meat. You said it was because people are doing it wrong. So why not buy from the people who are doing it right? [/quote]
Again, please stop repeating what I said. In an ideal world people would buy good meat. In the real world they don’t.
[quote]
if YOU were the one hunting, you’d be doing it just for the food right? So there would be no problems if YOU did it because YOU would be doing it only for the meat. What do you say to that? [/quote]
I say survivability and indulgence are completely different things, on such opposite ends of the spectrum, it’s silly to even try to compare them. It’s like saying that killing someone that is threatening your life is the same as shooting a random person in the streets.
Being a vegetarian for moral reasons is not about being more perfect [sic] than the Dalai Lama, it’s about minimizing suffering and abuse when and where you can. I said I used to use public transportation, but that’s almost impossible in the midwest suburbs. I don’t think Ive ever seen a bus here and we don’t have a subway (which I find very sad). I do share a car with my husband now. Before you attack my principles, you might wanna know:
"Many leading environmental organizations, such as the National Audubon Society and the Sierra Club, are now establishing the link between eating meat and eco-disasters like climate change. According to Environmental Defense, if every American skipped one meal of chicken per week and substituted vegetarian foods instead, the carbon dioxide savings would be the same as taking more than a half-million cars off U.S. roads.
Eating 1 lb of meat emits the same amount of greenhouse gasses as driving an SUV 40 miles."
[quote]
Farmers will switch to crop instead of livestock? Either way, the big farms who mass produce crop while using pesticide and all that shit are no different than the livestock farms. [/quote]
I think it’s established that plants don’t feel pain or fear.
[quote]
You didn’t address the fact concerning the families that don’t have the type or the luxury to research, buy and prepare several types of grain. [/quote]
I never said several, I said two or three. The exact same way you consume more than one type of meat. It’s not a luxury. The only reason vegetarian protein is more expensive to the consumer is because demand is so low. Economy 101.
[quote]
You honestly believe everyone in the world should stop eating meat? Mass production of meat is a necessary evil because there are a massive amount of people in this world. [/quote]
First, I honestly believe that you either don’t read my posts, or you have short term memory loss. I said that what I believe (my personal opinion) is that people should drastically reduce meat consumption to once or twice a week.
The world’s cattle alone consume a quantity of food equal to the caloric needs of 8.7 billion peopleÃ???Ã??Ã?¢??more than the entire human population on Earth.19 About 20 percent of the world’s population, or 1.4 billion people, could be fed with the grain and soybeans fed to U.S. cattle alone.
[quote]
I’ll have 300 grams of meat and you can have 300 grams of tofu. I will have eaten more.[/quote]
You need to learn to phrase your arguments better if you don’t want me to make fun of you for how amazing it is that your 300 grams if more than my 300 grams. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you’re talking about nutritional value.
From nutritiondata.com:
100 grams of chicken breast, unprepared: 172kcal, 11g fat, 0g carbs, 21g protein.
100 tempeh unprepared: 193 kcals, 11g fat, 9g carbs, 19g protein.
Oh snaps. Apparently my 300 grams is bigger than yours. 
Really? Your meat has carbs? And no saturated fat? Whoa, what magical meat have you been eating?
[quote]
You argue well, your cow arguement was true but i find it very odd that someone would go so far for animals that are bred to be killed so they may be eaten. [/quote]
So for this one I’ll just copy and paste from a website I like very much.
The animals are raised to be eaten; so what is wrong with that?
This question has always seemed to me to be a fancy version of "But we want to do these things, so what is wrong with that?" The idea that an act, by virtue of an intention of ours, can be exonerated morally is totally illogical.
But worse than that, however, is the fact that such a belief is a dangerous position to take because it can enable one to justify some practices that are universally condemned. To see how this is so, consider the following restatement of the basis of the question: "Suffering can be excused so long as we breed them for the purpose." Now, cannot an analogous argument be used to defend a group of slave holders who breed and enslave humans and justify it by saying "but they're bred to be our workers"? Could not the Nazis defend their murder of the Jews by saying "but we rounded them up to be killed"?
[quote]
I think it’s nice (attractive maybe? wink wink) that you believe so strongly in your morals. Though i wonder if you realize how unrealistic your dreams are? We NEED meat to survive. We need to eat well. It is a convenience as well as a necessity. Meat offers that easily and cheaply. [/quote]
I think it’s nice too. That’s why I said that everytime someone tries to bash it, I feel entitled to this tiny little bit of arrogance. I don’t know what dreams you’re talking about. I dont eat meat = fact, not dream. Eating meat might be a convenience, but it is not a necessity. Read Collucci’s article if you need convincing. Or wait, last time I checked I was still fine and alive, so yea… don’t thinkg I need meat. Easily? Yea, if you can easily ignore suffering and abuse? Cheaper? If you can ignore all the facts I’ve tried to show you.
I still think the food energy pyramid argument is a poor one for vegetarians, and if this was in person I’d carry on with it, but I’m just to lazy to do it over the computer. I also am not a believer in global warming, but again, too lazy to go there.
As far as genetics. I guess I’ll go to the root of the problem since we seem to have a misunderstanding. What is the difference between you and me and the way we deal with carbs differently if it’s not genetics? I do poorly with them, you don’t (as far as I can tell).
Right now I’m pretty close to that vegetarian diet as I’m poor and all I consume for the most part is eggs, whey, olive oil, broccoli, and butter. The thing is I love those foods, and you happen to like a lot of the foods that vegetarians eat. It’s easy for people like us to get on our high horses and condemn people for eating meat, cuz it’s not hard for us to give it up. However, some people can barely choke down other foods besides meat, see how it’d be hard for them to want to go vegetarian?
If there’s one thing I’ve gotten out of this thread though is the hen idea. I definitely want to buy a dozen hens now. Guess I got some research to do.
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:
I say survivability and indulgence are completely different things, on such opposite ends of the spectrum, it’s silly to even try to compare them. It’s like saying that killing someone that is threatening your life is the same as shooting a random person in the streets.
[/quote]
You use petty straw man arguments here. When i say you i mean you as in “BetaBerry”, not you in the arbitry sense.
You seem to be pretty hard headed. You complain about meat being acquired in inhumane (humane applies to humans, not animals, first of all) ways and when i offer humane alternatives you use retarded hitler analogies. It doesn’t work that way.
[quote]BetaBerry wrote: Being a vegetarian for moral reasons is not about being more perfect [sic] than the Dalai Lama, it’s about minimizing suffering and abuse when and where you can. I said I used to use public transportation, but that’s almost impossible in the midwest suburbs. I don’t think Ive ever seen a bus here and we don’t have a subway (which I find very sad). I do share a car with my husband now. Before you attack my principles, you might wanna know:
"Many leading environmental organizations, such as the National Audubon Society and the Sierra Club, are now establishing the link between eating meat and eco-disasters like climate change. According to Environmental Defense, if every American skipped one meal of chicken per week and substituted vegetarian foods instead, the carbon dioxide savings would be the same as taking more than a half-million cars off U.S. roads.
Eating 1 lb of meat emits the same amount of greenhouse gasses as driving an SUV 40 miles."[/quote]
Water vapor is a green house gas. It has more affect on our planet than carbon dioxide. And just so you know, those plants you eat need carbon dioxide. Do you know what green houses are? The more carbon dioxide there is, the more the plants can take up and produce oxygen as well as food for us heterotrophs. If there is not enough Co2, then the plants reverse the cycle and start absorbing oxygen and make co2 as well as releasing water vapor. Meat eaters are helping out vegetarians.
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:Farmers will switch to crop instead of livestock? Either way, the big farms who mass produce crop while using pesticide and all that shit are no different than the livestock farms.
I think it’s established that plants don’t feel pain or fear.[/quote]
That’s for sure but animals that are bred for meat are better treated than animals that are bred for milk, fur or eggs.
And how do these animals show fear? They are dumb as rocks. They act on instinct, sure, but can you honestly say they have any idea what is going on?
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:
I never said several, I said two or three. The exact same way you consume more than one type of meat. It’s not a luxury. The only reason vegetarian protein is more expensive to the consumer is because demand is so low. Economy 101.
[/quote]
Que? I don’t eat more than one type of meat per meal. I am talking about per meal. And deer meat is yummy, i can eat that for months at a time {and do}.
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:
First, I honestly believe that you either don’t read my posts, or you have short term memory loss. I said that what I believe (my personal opinion) is that people should drastically reduce meat consumption to once or twice a week.
[/quote] Where did you write that? Must have missed it. I eat meat 2-3 times a week. Unless you count fish. Then it’s like 3-5 times a week.
Cool but cattles aren’t only there for meat. They are there for milk as well. Cheese, milk, yoghurt, creams, etc generally come from cows.
Where you going to get all that milk if not from millions of cows?
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:
You need to learn to phrase your arguments better if you don’t want me to make fun of you for how amazing it is that your 300 grams if more than my 300 grams. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you’re talking about nutritional value.[/quote]
Haha, tht’s cute. I had mentioned before hand that it was in reference to nutritional value. Good try.
[quote]BetaBerry wrote: From nutritiondata.com:
100 grams of chicken breast, unprepared: 172kcal, 11g fat, 0g carbs, 21g protein.
100 tempeh unprepared: 193 kcals, 11g fat, 9g carbs, 19g protein.
Oh snaps. Apparently my 300 grams is bigger than yours. ;)[/quote]
Should be “are bigger” but i concede defeat in THIS case.
And i eat meat for the protein. I think that’s why people eat meat, because of how much protein it has. The chicken still has more protein. You know how before i was talking about amino acids and proteins…well…that.
For my carbs i eat pasta 
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:
Really? Your meat has carbs? And no saturated fat? Whoa, what magical meat have you been eating?
[/quote]
Oops 
It was a mistake!
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:
So for this one I’ll just copy and paste from a website I like very much.
The animals are raised to be eaten; so what is wrong with that?
This question has always seemed to me to be a fancy version of "But we want to do these things, so what is wrong with that?" The idea that an act, by virtue of an intention of ours, can be exonerated morally is totally illogical.
But worse than that, however, is the fact that such a belief is a dangerous position to take because it can enable one to justify some practices that are universally condemned. To see how this is so, consider the following restatement of the basis of the question: "Suffering can be excused so long as we breed them for the purpose." Now, cannot an analogous argument be used to defend a group of slave holders who breed and enslave humans and justify it by saying "but they're bred to be our workers"? Could not the Nazis defend their murder of the Jews by saying "but we rounded them up to be killed"?[/quote]
Universally condemned by who? By humans. In the animal world there are no morals. Morality is a human invention. So we can pretty much change morality depending on how we as society see fit. Pedophilia and homosexuality was ok. Then they both became wrong and now homosexuality is ok again. Women weren’t allowed to vote or speak in church before. Now they can. People had no problem eating meat because it was a rare commodity that brought lots of nutritional value. Up until then people lived and died in accordance to how their crops did. A cow meant you could have milk and in dire times (ie crops produced little to nothing) enough meat to last the winter. So please don’t use this morality talk because it’s obviously very subjective. And comparing meat as food to nazis? You can do better than that. It’s a weak argument at best.
And we don’t breed animals for them to suffer, we breed them because they provide enjoyement (dogs, cats, turtles, snakes, etc in zoos or are pets), medical advances (rats, mice, monkeys,snakes, insects, etc). clothing (sheep and etc) and food (cow, pigs,chickens, turkeys, snails, fish, etc). Your argument here is flawed because that is exactly what we do not breed them for.
And again, you are crossing borders here.
Slaves and jews were not considered human. Yet, they are human. We realized that (a bit late though) and rectified that mistake. Regardless, cows, chickens and other animals are not human. To say we cannot cultivate them for our own gains sounds like a very defeatist attitude and is wrong because it says you’d rather the human species suffer and not prosper for the sake of other animals.
Animals are nothing. They eat, sleep, shit, reproduce and die. We built the pyramids, the airplane, we’ve been to space, we can genetically engineer any living thing, we can send information from one end of the world to the other end in the blink of an eye. You and I are having a discussion because of what humanity has achieved. We ARE the superior species and it is our right to do whatever the fuck we want.
I bet you’d be fine with medical advancements grinding to a halt because you can’t bear to think of the poor animals who suffer those tests.
WE come first.
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:
I think it’s nice too. That’s why I said that everytime someone tries to bash it, I feel entitled to this tiny little bit of arrogance. I don’t know what dreams you’re talking about. I dont eat meat = fact, not dream. Eating meat might be a convenience, but it is not a necessity. Read Collucci’s article if you need convincing. Or wait, last time I checked I was still fine and alive, so yea… don’t thinkg I need meat. Easily? Yea, if you can easily ignore suffering and abuse? Cheaper? If you can ignore all the facts I’ve tried to show you.[/quote]
Vegetables and grains can still be more expensive than meat, especially depending on the weather and time of year. Some people cannot afford that. Hamburgers come plenty and cheap. You still have not addressed this.
And you’re married? In your picture you look 18. Godamn that is a young age to get married.
[quote]dudinator wrote:
I still think the food energy pyramid argument is a poor one for vegetarians, and if this was in person I’d carry on with it, but I’m just to lazy to do it over the computer. I also am not a believer in global warming, but again, too lazy to go there.
As far as genetics. I guess I’ll go to the root of the problem since we seem to have a misunderstanding. What is the difference between you and me and the way we deal with carbs differently if it’s not genetics? I do poorly with them, you don’t (as far as I can tell).
Right now I’m pretty close to that vegetarian diet as I’m poor and all I consume for the most part is eggs, whey, olive oil, broccoli, and butter. The thing is I love those foods, and you happen to like a lot of the foods that vegetarians eat. It’s easy for people like us to get on our high horses and condemn people for eating meat, cuz it’s not hard for us to give it up. However, some people can barely choke down other foods besides meat, see how it’d be hard for them to want to go vegetarian?
If there’s one thing I’ve gotten out of this thread though is the hen idea. I definitely want to buy a dozen hens now. Guess I got some research to do.[/quote]
My grandmother has a small garden. She grows peaches, strawberry, tomatoes, potatoes, salad, pears, basil and apples.
If you have a balcony you can plant some pots and grow some tomatoes or whatever you need. It’s fun too
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:
The only reason vegetarian protein is more expensive to the consumer is because demand is so low. Economy 101.
[/quote]
You may want re-take “economy 101”. You obviously failed.
You have it backwards. Demand would be low because price is high, not the other way around. No one with half a brain would raise their price because demand was low.
[quote]redgladiator wrote:
DeadRamones wrote:
Let your dad experiment. Even if he don’t last long on it maybe he’ll learn something from it, like the values of more vegetables. In no way am I a vegan or vegetarian. I don’t knock it unless one of them starts to preach it to me.
Maybe you should try it before you start knocking it
[/quote]
Lol, I used to hangout with this group of friends & 1 of them was a vegan. He constantly preached about how meat is toxic. He didn’t eat any fruits either because of the seeds. He used to say something along the line of " If you eat fruit, you are preventing another life from forming" He was so annoying. Non of us cared that he was vegan but we used to all get angry when he started correcting us.
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
BetaBerry wrote:
The only reason vegetarian protein is more expensive to the consumer is because demand is so low. Economy 101.
You may want re-take “economy 101”. You obviously failed.
You have it backwards. Demand would be low because price is high, not the other way around. No one with half a brain would raise their price because demand was low.[/quote]
Demand is low, therefore production is low, so the offer is small than demand in comparrison. If a lot of people want a product there’s pressure into making the product more available. If not, few producers are going to cater to a smaller market.
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:
countingbeans wrote:
BetaBerry wrote:
The only reason vegetarian protein is more expensive to the consumer is because demand is so low. Economy 101.
You may want re-take “economy 101”. You obviously failed.
You have it backwards. Demand would be low because price is high, not the other way around. No one with half a brain would raise their price because demand was low.
Demand is low, therefore production is low, so the offer is small than demand in comparrison. If a lot of people want a product there’s pressure into making the product more available. If not, few producers are going to cater to a smaller market.
[/quote]
Look, you took an economics class, great. But you didn’t grasp it as much as you think. I suggest you don’t use it in your argument.
I apologize for coming off like a dick in the previous two posts to this also
[quote]legendaryblaze wrote:
You use petty straw man arguments here. When i say you i mean you as in “BetaBerry”, not you in the arbitry sense.
You seem to be pretty hard headed. You complain about meat being acquired in inhumane (humane applies to humans, not animals, first of all) ways and when i offer humane alternatives you use retarded hitler analogies. It doesn’t work that way. [/quote]
However you mean by “you”, it doesn;t change my point, survivability and indulgence are opposutes. If by humane alternative you mean hunting, then the Hitler analogy has nothing to do with it, and it’s quite obvious it refers to your argument that animals are meant to be killed.
All the big forests in the world were doing just fine before livestock population skyrocketted in the 20th century, so no, cows are not helping the Amazon survive, your argument there is empty.
[quote]
That’s for sure but animals that are bred for meat are better treated than animals that are bred for milk, fur or eggs.
And how do these animals show fear? They are dumb as rocks. They act on instinct, sure, but can you honestly say they have any idea what is going on? [/quote]
Animals CAN be bred for milk and eggs with minimal suffering. For all I care, the one here that is dumb as a rock is you. Animals show fear, compassion and pain and it doesn’t take a genious to observe it. Whether they act by instinct or not is irrelevant, the instinct to survive is common to all of us, one could argue how many things that we consider so superior about humans are merely instinct.
Oh, so you were indeed advocating the no-variety diet and that’s why you think that needing 2 or 3 different types of food is such a huge burden.
A cow produces milk for longer than it produces meat. Plus, my biggest issue is with the suffering, which could be eliminated.
[quote]
Oh snaps. Apparently my 300 grams is bigger than yours.
Should be “are bigger” but i concede defeat in THIS case. [/quote]
That was a figure of speech, a clear analogy with the stereotypical “my (vehicle, sound system, gun, penis) is bigger than yours”.
That was just one example to show how misinformed you are to think that one cannot find good nutrition in a vegetarian diet.
Yea, probably caused by your irrational worshipping of meat.
Wow dude, that’s where you lost what little of my respect you had.
It’s because it’s out morals that we must apply it. Otherwise you could say that those things (pedophilia, for example), are OK as long as the person believes to be doing right, as in, the act is not against their morals.
“People had no problem eating meat because it was a rare commodity that brought lots of nutritional value.” So at what point exactly do you figure it became a necessity like you’re been trying to prove?
I’m against breeding companion pets. I’m against locking them up in zoos and circus. I think medical research on animals should be kept to a minimal and under more strict regulation. I’ against fur, leather, feathers, and mass produced wool.
Slaves and jews were always considered humans smartass. But they were considered inferior. Here’s the key: inferior. They were never seen as a different species, but as an inferior race or culture. And it’s disgusting how human kind believes it has the right to inflict pain on that which is inferior.
Chaging to non-animal souces would not hinder human development or prosperity. That would be true a 100 years ago when people migth die from cold without fur coats, but now, when we have alternatives, that is empty.
We may have done all that. We’ve also comitted genocides, caused extinction, we rape, murder, steal, lie, and we litter our planet with our trash. Oh, and we have dumbasses like you walking around feeling superior.
[quote]
We ARE the superior species and it is our right to do whatever the fuck we want. [/quote]
And here’s you getting the corpse that was once my (tiny) respect for you and throwing it to the bottom of the ocean to make sure it can never be retrieved.
[quote]
Vegetables and grains can still be more expensive than meat, especially depending on the weather and time of year. Some people cannot afford that. Hamburgers come plenty and cheap. You still have not addressed this. [/quote]
I’ve said before that meat is only cheaper because it’s mass produced. If a whole lot of people started buying tofu it’d be cheaper.Geez you’re slow. I do like how you think that really poor people buy burgers, lol. Do you want me to tell you a little bit of what it is like to be poor in a 3rd world country? You’d be surprised. Bread is the staple when you don’t have money. Then things like rice and beans. In Brasil rice and beans in the most consumed food, and it’s THE food for those who are poor. Beef, it’s a treat, not a staple.
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:
Vegetables and grains can still be more expensive than meat, especially depending on the weather and time of year. Some people cannot afford that. Hamburgers come plenty and cheap. You still have not addressed this.
[/quote]
Where the hell do you live? I hope this is a sarcastic joke that flew over my head. Do you shop for your own food?
BetaBerry just for the record the older you get the less lactose tolerant you get unless of course you are taking lactase supplements which will only enhance your ability slightly to process it.
Humans are an exception in the entire spectrum of mammals worldwide for consuming milk past infancy, the enzyme needed to digest lactose, lactase, reaches its highest levels in the small intestines after birth and then begins a slow decline as one ages.
So while milk is good for kids, i doubt you are getting much from it, yes it will put weight on people but not the kind you want.
Other than that have fun with a vegan diet, i know i could not hack it lol i like meat far to much !
[quote]SmallToBig wrote:
BetaBerry just for the record the older you get the less lactose tolerant you get unless of course you are taking lactase supplements which will only enhance your ability slightly to process it.
Humans are an exception in the entire spectrum of mammals worldwide for consuming milk past infancy, the enzyme needed to digest lactose, lactase, reaches its highest levels in the small intestines after birth and then begins a slow decline as one ages.
So while milk is good for kids, i doubt you are getting much from it, yes it will put weight on people but not the kind you want.
Other than that have fun with a vegan diet, i know i could not hack it lol i like meat far to much !
[/quote]
Eh, luckily I dont really have problems with milk. I usually drink about 2 glasses a day, sometimes more, never really had problems with it.
I do love the taste of soy milk, and I’m constantly thinking about switching over, mostly because I can’t be 100% sure of how my milk is made (unfortunately they don’t come with a “happy cow” certificate on the bottle. :P).
[quote]DeadRamones wrote:
BetaBerry wrote:
Vegetables and grains can still be more expensive than meat, especially depending on the weather and time of year. Some people cannot afford that. Hamburgers come plenty and cheap. You still have not addressed this.
Where the hell do you live? I hope this is a sarcastic joke that flew over my head. Do you shop for your own food?
[/quote]
Yeah no shit, I wince when I reach for meat cause of the price tag, but I happily drop sprouts/asparagus into my basket because they’re practically free
Betaberry no one gives a fuck about your moral preference of food
Laboratories all over the world have shown to me that farm animals are not self-aware
Thats all I care about, and I will continue to eat them
Get hold of raw milk, there is lactase in that to help you break it down along with lipase, the way mother nature intended us to drink it. Should solve your problems.
You need meat and dairy products for vitamin B12, vegans and vegetarians claim they can get this from soya, but your body cant assimilate it and soya actually increases your need for vitamin B12.
Lol?
I would like to see those studies you speak of.
[quote]BetaBerry wrote:
Eh, luckily I dont really have problems with milk. I usually drink about 2 glasses a day, sometimes more, never really had problems with it.
I do love the taste of soy milk, and I’m constantly thinking about switching over, mostly because I can’t be 100% sure of how my milk is made (unfortunately they don’t come with a “happy cow” certificate on the bottle. :P).
[/quote]
Really ? Well your the exception rather than the rule 
And “lol” about the happy cow aha, in Ireland i can get my milk from a farmer but that’s just for tea/coffee etc. etc. it’s far to creamy to drink alot of.
edit: Nice sayings in your profile the Cat and Human one is very true !
[quote]Sniggel wrote:
Laboratories all over the world have shown to me that farm animals are not self-aware
Lol?
I would like to see those studies you speak of.[/quote]
Lol x2.
[quote]SmallToBig wrote:
BetaBerry wrote:
Eh, luckily I dont really have problems with milk. I usually drink about 2 glasses a day, sometimes more, never really had problems with it.
I do love the taste of soy milk, and I’m constantly thinking about switching over, mostly because I can’t be 100% sure of how my milk is made (unfortunately they don’t come with a “happy cow” certificate on the bottle. :P).
Really ? Well your the exception rather than the rule
And “lol” about the happy cow aha, in Ireland i can get my milk from a farmer but that’s just for tea/coffee etc. etc. it’s far to creamy to drink alot of.
edit: Nice sayings in your profile the Cat and Human one is very true !
[/quote]
Haha I know, my mom has a close friend (who was like an aunt for me growing up) who has a milk farm. Straight-from-the-cow milk is nothing like store bought! I honestly like it better after it’s homogenized, etc. I remember she’d tell me to try it right when they’re milking the cows, because it’s still warm but I never tried it. The whole “still warm” thing is just too weird lol.
Edit: I notice the double meaning in what I said… and it was not intended.