College Learning?

Off Topic
101

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]graudani wrote:
I’m a 3rd year student studying economics and accounting.
My average day:

10 hours of sleep
12 hours relaxing
1 hour at the gym
1 hour of class

I’ll only go to 1 class a day, and I don’t crack open any books, ever. In fact I don’t even study for some of my finals, university is such a joke.

Ps. I go to a school with a well respected econ program.[/quote]

No offense, but those of you only going to one class a day…why post that here as if your schedule is an average day for a college student?

I took 19 hours one semester. Trust me, there was no “10 hour sleeping” going on or 12 hours of relaxing.

If you guys are bullshitting your way through college, OF COURSE you have tons of free time.[/quote]

Hard to believe students are having trouble graduating in 4 or even 5 years. Can you believe six year programs are becoming more normal - not including a masters? Many campuses do not have classes before 9:30 a.m. and none on Friday because they are unpopular with the students. The average course load I have heard from my students is 14 hours. Once I found out my college did not charge for extra hours over 18, I had 19 to 23 hour semesters because I wanted to take the extra classes for free so I could learn about topics outside my major. I found it easier to focus on learning when I was busy learning. Maybe there is a lesson there.

But then X, we are over 30 so they should not listen to us anyways.

I am glad there are more examples of those striving to make the most of the college educational experience on this board (so far) than not.[/quote]

What exactly is wrong with not liking early class? In the paper the other day, a couple of high schools in Toronto changed the start time to 10am and they’ve been seeing grades significantly improving ever since.

Hell I would say the same is true for me. I always did better on exams that happened around mid-day than at 8:30 in the morning. It’s just when I function optimally. Oh and I was also in a 5 year program (1 year internship).

For some reason some people above the age of 30 like to talk shit about a younger generation just for the sake of it.

102

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]graudani wrote:
I’m a 3rd year student studying economics and accounting.
My average day:

10 hours of sleep
12 hours relaxing
1 hour at the gym
1 hour of class

I’ll only go to 1 class a day, and I don’t crack open any books, ever. In fact I don’t even study for some of my finals, university is such a joke.

Ps. I go to a school with a well respected econ program.[/quote]

No offense, but those of you only going to one class a day…why post that here as if your schedule is an average day for a college student?

I took 19 hours one semester. Trust me, there was no “10 hour sleeping” going on or 12 hours of relaxing.

If you guys are bullshitting your way through college, OF COURSE you have tons of free time.[/quote]

Hard to believe students are having trouble graduating in 4 or even 5 years. Can you believe six year programs are becoming more normal - not including a masters? Many campuses do not have classes before 9:30 a.m. and none on Friday because they are unpopular with the students. The average course load I have heard from my students is 14 hours. Once I found out my college did not charge for extra hours over 18, I had 19 to 23 hour semesters because I wanted to take the extra classes for free so I could learn about topics outside my major. I found it easier to focus on learning when I was busy learning. Maybe there is a lesson there.

But then X, we are over 30 so they should not listen to us anyways.

I am glad there are more examples of those striving to make the most of the college educational experience on this board (so far) than not.[/quote]

What exactly is wrong with not liking early class? In the paper the other day, a couple of high schools in Toronto changed the start time to 10am and they’ve been seeing grades significantly improving ever since.

Hell I would say the same is true for me. I always did better on exams that happened around mid-day than at 8:30 in the morning. It’s just when I function optimally. Oh and I was also in a 5 year program (1 year internship).

For some reason some people above the age of 30 like to talk shit about a younger generation just for the sake of it. [/quote]

It becomes harder to offer a wide variety of course and class times when you limit when classes can be held, this is something students complain about - not being able to get into a course.

I have taken and taught 8 a.m. classes. Given many have to work at 8 a.m. I do not see it as an unreasonable time. In fact, I do best before 10 a.m… Same thing with not having classes on Friday. Most people work at least five days a week. Part of college is preparing students for the workforce. Please look at the studies in the first post and tell me if those habits are conducive for a 40+ hour work week?

I have also taught night courses for traditional and nontraditional students and understand how 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. course schedules do not always work well.

I am familiar with the change in start times for high school, teenagers tend to need to sleep later in the day.

The reference to 30 because of an old hippy saying - there is humor there. And I finished my post on a positive note about the young whipper snappers.

Did you take courses during the internship? I am curious how this worked.

103

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

12 hours recreating/socializing
6 hours sleeping
2.5 hours at work
2.5 hours at class
1 hour of studying

Exaggerated cliff notes:
According to reports, half of college students are lazy and their education sucks.
Why?[/quote]

I’d say that’s about right for the average non-science degree. I spend 40 hours a week at a college campus interacting with students, professors and staff. You would not believe the laziness and quality of work these kids put out there. Finding a student worker who’s willing to learn and is not lazy is such a challenge. I’ve been given the opportunity to teach an IT class. After seeing some of the work these kids submit, I’d never do it. It’s not worth the aggravation.

I blame the kids who don’t seem to give a shit and the parents who force their kids to come here. I really think the kids and this country would be better off if people would give careers in trades some thought. There is nothing wrong with becoming a plumber, HVAC tech, mechanic or electrician. I have friends in these fields and they’re making anywhere between $60,000 and $110,000 with OT.

104

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]graudani wrote:
I’m a 3rd year student studying economics and accounting.
My average day:

10 hours of sleep
12 hours relaxing
1 hour at the gym
1 hour of class

I’ll only go to 1 class a day, and I don’t crack open any books, ever. In fact I don’t even study for some of my finals, university is such a joke.

Ps. I go to a school with a well respected econ program.[/quote]

No offense, but those of you only going to one class a day…why post that here as if your schedule is an average day for a college student?

I took 19 hours one semester. Trust me, there was no “10 hour sleeping” going on or 12 hours of relaxing.

If you guys are bullshitting your way through college, OF COURSE you have tons of free time.[/quote]

Hard to believe students are having trouble graduating in 4 or even 5 years. Can you believe six year programs are becoming more normal - not including a masters? Many campuses do not have classes before 9:30 a.m. and none on Friday because they are unpopular with the students. The average course load I have heard from my students is 14 hours. Once I found out my college did not charge for extra hours over 18, I had 19 to 23 hour semesters because I wanted to take the extra classes for free so I could learn about topics outside my major. I found it easier to focus on learning when I was busy learning. Maybe there is a lesson there.

But then X, we are over 30 so they should not listen to us anyways.

I am glad there are more examples of those striving to make the most of the college educational experience on this board (so far) than not.[/quote]

What exactly is wrong with not liking early class? In the paper the other day, a couple of high schools in Toronto changed the start time to 10am and they’ve been seeing grades significantly improving ever since.

Hell I would say the same is true for me. I always did better on exams that happened around mid-day than at 8:30 in the morning. It’s just when I function optimally. Oh and I was also in a 5 year program (1 year internship).

For some reason some people above the age of 30 like to talk shit about a younger generation just for the sake of it. [/quote]

?

I know what a full course load in a serious major looks like. I also know if I waited till fucking 10am to have my first class, I would have to take less hours overall and take LATER classes which will cut into time for extra curriculars…you know, those things that make a resume stand out?

I had early classes because I had classes all day til after 3pm…and I tried my best to be done with all of that by 4…because I had other shit to do.

Some of these posts indicate that many here don’t even take a full class load which changes everything.

105

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]graudani wrote:
I’m a 3rd year student studying economics and accounting.
My average day:

10 hours of sleep
12 hours relaxing
1 hour at the gym
1 hour of class

I’ll only go to 1 class a day, and I don’t crack open any books, ever. In fact I don’t even study for some of my finals, university is such a joke.

Ps. I go to a school with a well respected econ program.[/quote]

No offense, but those of you only going to one class a day…why post that here as if your schedule is an average day for a college student?

I took 19 hours one semester. Trust me, there was no “10 hour sleeping” going on or 12 hours of relaxing.

If you guys are bullshitting your way through college, OF COURSE you have tons of free time.[/quote]

Hard to believe students are having trouble graduating in 4 or even 5 years. Can you believe six year programs are becoming more normal - not including a masters? Many campuses do not have classes before 9:30 a.m. and none on Friday because they are unpopular with the students. The average course load I have heard from my students is 14 hours. Once I found out my college did not charge for extra hours over 18, I had 19 to 23 hour semesters because I wanted to take the extra classes for free so I could learn about topics outside my major. I found it easier to focus on learning when I was busy learning. Maybe there is a lesson there.

But then X, we are over 30 so they should not listen to us anyways.

I am glad there are more examples of those striving to make the most of the college educational experience on this board (so far) than not.[/quote]

What exactly is wrong with not liking early class? In the paper the other day, a couple of high schools in Toronto changed the start time to 10am and they’ve been seeing grades significantly improving ever since.

Hell I would say the same is true for me. I always did better on exams that happened around mid-day than at 8:30 in the morning. It’s just when I function optimally. Oh and I was also in a 5 year program (1 year internship).

For some reason some people above the age of 30 like to talk shit about a younger generation just for the sake of it. [/quote]

It becomes harder to offer a wide variety of course and class times when you limit when classes can be held, this is something students complain about - not being able to get into a course.

I have taken and taught 8 a.m. classes. Given many have to work at 8 a.m. I do not see it as an unreasonable time. In fact, I do best before 10 a.m… Same thing with not having classes on Friday. Most people work at least five days a week. Part of college is preparing students for the workforce. Please look at the studies in the first post and tell me if those habits are conducive for a 40+ hour work week?

I have also taught night courses for traditional and nontraditional students and understand how 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. course schedules do not always work well.

I am familiar with the change in start times for high school, teenagers tend to need to sleep later in the day.

The reference to 30 because of an old hippy saying - there is humor there. And I finished my post on a positive note about the young whipper snappers.

Did you take courses during the internship? I am curious how this worked.
[/quote]

From my experience not getting into a class is mostly a product of poor planning by the students and has little do with a course not being offered enough.

Life in college is nothing like life in the workforce. They do not resemble each other. I don’t think simply forcing students to take early class will somehow prepare them any better for work life.

I am not against early classes, but I don’t think there’s anything wrong with people opting for the later options.

106

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

Did you take courses during the internship? I am curious how this worked.
[/quote]

After my 2 academic years I did a full time of working in a position related to my field of study. There were no courses but I had weekly assignments I had to submit to my internship counsellor about my position and there was also a large final assignment.

107

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]graudani wrote:
I’m a 3rd year student studying economics and accounting.
My average day:

10 hours of sleep
12 hours relaxing
1 hour at the gym
1 hour of class

I’ll only go to 1 class a day, and I don’t crack open any books, ever. In fact I don’t even study for some of my finals, university is such a joke.

Ps. I go to a school with a well respected econ program.[/quote]

No offense, but those of you only going to one class a day…why post that here as if your schedule is an average day for a college student?

I took 19 hours one semester. Trust me, there was no “10 hour sleeping” going on or 12 hours of relaxing.

If you guys are bullshitting your way through college, OF COURSE you have tons of free time.[/quote]

Hard to believe students are having trouble graduating in 4 or even 5 years. Can you believe six year programs are becoming more normal - not including a masters? Many campuses do not have classes before 9:30 a.m. and none on Friday because they are unpopular with the students. The average course load I have heard from my students is 14 hours. Once I found out my college did not charge for extra hours over 18, I had 19 to 23 hour semesters because I wanted to take the extra classes for free so I could learn about topics outside my major. I found it easier to focus on learning when I was busy learning. Maybe there is a lesson there.

But then X, we are over 30 so they should not listen to us anyways.

I am glad there are more examples of those striving to make the most of the college educational experience on this board (so far) than not.[/quote]

What exactly is wrong with not liking early class? In the paper the other day, a couple of high schools in Toronto changed the start time to 10am and they’ve been seeing grades significantly improving ever since.

Hell I would say the same is true for me. I always did better on exams that happened around mid-day than at 8:30 in the morning. It’s just when I function optimally. Oh and I was also in a 5 year program (1 year internship).

For some reason some people above the age of 30 like to talk shit about a younger generation just for the sake of it. [/quote]

?

I know what a full course load in a serious major looks like. I also know if I waited till fucking 10am to have my first class, I would have to take less hours overall and take LATER classes which will cut into time for extra curriculars…you know, those things that make a resume stand out?

I had early classes because I had classes all day til after 3pm…and I tried my best to be done with all of that by 4…because I had other shit to do.

Some of these posts indicate that many here don’t even take a full class load which changes everything. [/quote]

I don’t have a problem with people taking early class, I just don’t see anything wrong with avoiding them if you prefer a later option. A lot of the extra curricular stuff I was into took place on weekends.

108

What is the average age these guys are graduating if they take 6 fucking years to earn a 4 year degree because of all of this shit?

I was out of college by 21.

109

[quote]therajraj wrote:

From my experience not getting into a class is mostly a product of poor planning by the students and has little do with a course not being offered enough.

Life in college is nothing like life in the workforce. They do not resemble each other. I don’t think simply forcing students to take early class will somehow prepare them any better for work life.

I am not against early classes, but I don’t think there’s anything wrong with people opting for the later options.[/quote]

Did you go to a small or large university? The college I went to (Rutgers) had about 40,000 students and the scheduling was a logistical nightmare. Some buildings were over 5 miles apart with 20 minutes traffic between them during rush hour. I don’t know if it’s better now, but getting into the courses you wanted or needed wasn’t easy at all. I did my Masters at a smaller program and there it was a lot easier to get into the courses I needed.

110

And to add, even though I took late classes and slept in when I got the chance, I didn’t have trouble getting to my internship position at 9am every morning 5 days a week.

The belief that taking early classes will somehow better prepare you for work life is utter BS

111

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

From my experience not getting into a class is mostly a product of poor planning by the students and has little do with a course not being offered enough.

Life in college is nothing like life in the workforce. They do not resemble each other. I don’t think simply forcing students to take early class will somehow prepare them any better for work life.

I am not against early classes, but I don’t think there’s anything wrong with people opting for the later options.[/quote]

Did you go to a small or large university? The college I went to (Rutgers) had about 40,000 students and the scheduling was a logistical nightmare. Some buildings were over 5 miles apart with 20 minutes traffic between them during rush hour. I don’t know if it’s better now, but getting into the courses you wanted or needed wasn’t easy at all. I did my Masters at a smaller program and there it was a lot easier to get into the courses I needed.[/quote]

mid-sized (for Canadian standards) 20,000+ people. Yeah, I guess its probably different for people who have campuses like that.

112

[quote]therajraj wrote:
And to add, even though I took late classes and slept in when I got the chance, I didn’t have trouble getting to my internship position at 9am every morning 5 days a week.

The belief that taking early classes will somehow better prepare you for work life is utter BS[/quote]

I couldn’t care less about preparing for work life. I see a negative in some guy bullshitting through college and taking way longer to graduate because of it. Yes, that would stand out on a resume. A “4.0” GPA is way less impressive if it took 6 to 8 fucking years to earn it when it takes most focused people 4 or less.

It takes a shit load of course work to get a Biology degree and waiting until 10am for my first class would have insured it took way longer to earn that degree.

113

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:
And to add, even though I took late classes and slept in when I got the chance, I didn’t have trouble getting to my internship position at 9am every morning 5 days a week.

The belief that taking early classes will somehow better prepare you for work life is utter BS[/quote]

I couldn’t care less about preparing for work life. I see a negative in some guy bullshitting through college and taking way longer to graduate because of it. Yes, that would stand out on a resume. A “4.0” GPA is way less impressive if it took 6 to 8 fucking years to earn it when it takes most focused people 4 or less.

It takes a shit load of course work to get a Biology degree and waiting until 10am for my first class would have insured it took way longer to earn that degree.[/quote]

lol - yeah no shit, I’m not saying avoid early class at the expense of graduating on time.

I just took later classes when it was feasible. It read like Texag was suggesting students who opt for later classes are somehow lazy.

114

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:
And to add, even though I took late classes and slept in when I got the chance, I didn’t have trouble getting to my internship position at 9am every morning 5 days a week.

The belief that taking early classes will somehow better prepare you for work life is utter BS[/quote]

I couldn’t care less about preparing for work life. I see a negative in some guy bullshitting through college and taking way longer to graduate because of it. Yes, that would stand out on a resume. A “4.0” GPA is way less impressive if it took 6 to 8 fucking years to earn it when it takes most focused people 4 or less.

It takes a shit load of course work to get a Biology degree and waiting until 10am for my first class would have insured it took way longer to earn that degree.[/quote]

lol - yeah no shit, I’m not saying avoid early class at the expense of graduating on time.

I just took later classes when it was feasible. It read like Texag was suggesting students who opt for later classes are somehow lazy.

[/quote]

I think X puts my point well. If a student is going to carry a full load (5 or more courses a semester) he/she probably will be taking classes for most of the day and that will include morning courses. Students refusing to take morning courses are probably going to take longer to graduate (trends point to longer time to complete degrees). Given the increasingly rising cost of education, one might think the trend would be to maximize the number of course hours per semester but according to the posted studies, that is not the case. You can chose your own adjective to describe this.

There is a difference between preferring afternoon courses and refusing to take morning courses or courses on Friday.

115

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

Did you take courses during the internship? I am curious how this worked.
[/quote]

After my 2 academic years I did a full time of working in a position related to my field of study. There were no courses but I had weekly assignments I had to submit to my internship counsellor about my position and there was also a large final assignment.[/quote]

Did this experience help? I have read some about companies routinely breaking labor laws in these programs - usually demanding labor beyond what was described in the internship agreement, labor that should have been paid for, according to the courts. From what I hear from students there is pressure to do these because everyone else does but not much identifiable gains from having participated.

116

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

I think X puts my point well. If a student is going to carry a full load (5 or more courses a semester) he/she probably will be taking classes for most of the day and that will include morning courses. Students refusing to take morning courses are probably going to take longer to graduate (trends point to longer time to complete degrees). Given the increasingly rising cost of education, one might think the trend would be to maximize the number of course hours per semester but according to the posted studies, that is not the case. You can chose your own adjective to describe this.

There is a difference between preferring afternoon courses and refusing to take morning courses or courses on Friday.

[/quote]

I agree if the college isn’t offering later courses. But where I went, I believe the last course was offered at 9pm. With offerings that late, you can easily carry a full course load without getting up 7am in the morning. Personally, I think the more flexibility the better. I worked 12 miles off campus at a restaurant so I appreciated the both late and early offerings. But if I had to choose one, it’d be the later option. I started off as an EE major, so I can appreciate what people who took on an 18-21 course load go through.

Edit: Actually I just checked and Rutgers last period is 9:40 till 11pm.

117

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

Did you take courses during the internship? I am curious how this worked.
[/quote]

After my 2 academic years I did a full time of working in a position related to my field of study. There were no courses but I had weekly assignments I had to submit to my internship counsellor about my position and there was also a large final assignment.[/quote]

Did this experience help? I have read some about companies routinely breaking labor laws in these programs - usually demanding labor beyond what was described in the internship agreement, labor that should have been paid for, according to the courts. From what I hear from students there is pressure to do these because everyone else does but not much identifiable gains from having participated.[/quote]

We have hygiene students come in all of the time and work for free as an internship. I have them do what my other assistants are doing. You can call that free labor if you want, but if you are doing an internship, expect to be put to work doing some of the shit that older employees may not want to do. That’s life.

I could only see someone filing a law suit if they made them do something crazy…like clean the doc’s house, wash his car or pick up his kids.

I think this world is way too sue happy. No one is hiring an intern to sit there and look cute…unless she is REAL cute.

118

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

Did you take courses during the internship? I am curious how this worked.
[/quote]

After my 2 academic years I did a full time of working in a position related to my field of study. There were no courses but I had weekly assignments I had to submit to my internship counsellor about my position and there was also a large final assignment.[/quote]

Did this experience help? I have read some about companies routinely breaking labor laws in these programs - usually demanding labor beyond what was described in the internship agreement, labor that should have been paid for, according to the courts. From what I hear from students there is pressure to do these because everyone else does but not much identifiable gains from having participated.[/quote]

I definitely heard of people in BS positions that just wanted cheap labour. But I got a good internship with Brookfield Properties and it gave me a glimpse into the Real Estate Market. I was happy with the experience and even though I was paid a measly $12.50/hour in 2006.

If I was only offered some bullshit position I would’ve just dropped out of the Internship and into the regular program.

The hardest part believe it or not, was coming back to school after I finished my internship. I definitely felt out of “school mode”

119

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:

[quote]Tex Ag wrote:

I think X puts my point well. If a student is going to carry a full load (5 or more courses a semester) he/she probably will be taking classes for most of the day and that will include morning courses. Students refusing to take morning courses are probably going to take longer to graduate (trends point to longer time to complete degrees). Given the increasingly rising cost of education, one might think the trend would be to maximize the number of course hours per semester but according to the posted studies, that is not the case. You can chose your own adjective to describe this.

There is a difference between preferring afternoon courses and refusing to take morning courses or courses on Friday.

[/quote]

I agree if the college isn’t offering later courses. But where I went, I believe the last course was offered at 9pm. With offerings that late, you can easily carry a full course load without getting up 7am in the morning. Personally, I think the more flexibility the better. I worked 12 miles off campus at a restaurant so I appreciated the both late and early offerings. But if I had to choose one, it’d be the later option. I started off as an EE major, so I can appreciate what people who took on an 18-21 course load go through.[/quote]

My point about extra curriculars is that you won’t be playing football if your class ends at 9pm. Hell, you won’t be involved in much school life at all of your classes are that late.

I was usually done by 3:30-4 most days and usually tried to schedule a bullshit class that late anyway. That was because I was involved in a lot of shit…from starting my own after school program to help local kids finish homework with tutors while they waited on their parents to sports, band and finally just chilling out late at night. I doubt I went to sleep before 1 o2 all of the way through college.

That is the point we were making about someone who acts like they have the option of not waking up til damn near noon, going to two classes and then fucking around all day. Some bullshit majors may allow that…but employers aren’t blind to some guy half assing his way through school and yes, that would imply a poor work record.

Simply going to class later is not the issue in itself.

120

I definitely had to fax and collate my share of documents during my internship.