Carbs Cycling Experience

Anyone else have trouble going longer than two days low carb without there body simply craving all the carbs they can get their lips around.

I’ve done carb cycling in the past with a great deal of success, but lately I can’t seem to go any longer than two days without taking in a considerable dose of carbs. I have a feeling it’s the stress level that I experience at work, which is affecting my sleep, but I’m curious what others are dealing with at the moment.

Stats:
Age: 29 y.o.
WT: 196 lbs
BF%: 6-7% BF
HT: 5’11"
Training Style: Hybrid (mixed bodybuilding, sprints, crossfit, and endurance)

Training Volume: 2 x Day / Weights (AM) Light to HIT TRG (AM) / Light cardio or Crossfit (PM) @ 6 days / week

Sleep Cycle: 6 hours (normal)…lately sleep has been difficult to come by, often restless and don’t sleep well.

Supplements: Whey protein, creatine, L-glutamine, multivitamin, Mg+, Tribulus T-support, Black Powder.

Diet (Typical) Low CHO:
Protein shake Pre-TRG:
2 scopps whey + supps
Coffee w/ NSC
WO#1:
Protein shake Post-TRG
PT:
2 eggs / 4 egg beaters
4-5 oz ham / ground beef / turkey sausage
Mid-Morning:
6 oz protein / veggies
Lunch:
large salad (greens / fibrous veggies / low CHO-higher fat dressing) about 4 cups worth
6 oz protein
Mid-Afternoon:
6 oz protein source + veggies
(or)
2:4 egg ratio w/ 1 T Peanut Butter
3 oz ham / ground beef
1 sc BLK PDR (when needed b/f cardio or Crossfit)
Dinner:
2 T olive oil
6 oz steak / ground beef / chicken
1 lg salad (greens / fibrous veggies / low CHO-higher fat dressing) about 4 cups worth
2 cups beef broth + (steamed brocolli or cauliflower)
Pre-Bedtime: (sometimes)
2 cups Cottage cheese
1/2 cup mixed nuts
(or)
2:4 eggs
ham / ground beef /tofu

*On higher carb days I sometimes a banana in my Pre-WO protein shake. Post WO I’ll add 1 scoop Poweraide into my protein shake.
**Add in 1/2 cup oatmeal in the morning, post TRG.
***And either pancakes, waffles, or w/w bread before training at night with a scoop of PB/Jam.

Since I do so much volume training I’m pretty sure that’s why I’m battling the CHOs at night so much. It’s almost as if I can’t go below a certain threshold on my low calorie days otherwise I’m still hungry at night and craving whatever kind of junk I can get my hands on. The stress level also has to have some effect with limiting my sleep and recovery cycle. Generally I can do about 2 days of low CHOs before I start feeling crummy. Then if I try to push the envelope and go three days, I end up losing it at the end of the day because I’m still hungry.

At any rate, anyone have any good thoughts on this.

@ gremlin

"Anyone else have trouble going longer than two days low carb without there body simply craving all the carbs they can get their lips around.

I’ve done carb cycling in the past with a great deal of success, but lately I can’t seem to go any longer than two days without taking in a considerable dose of carbs. I have a feeling it’s the stress level that I experience at work, which is affecting my sleep, but I’m curious what others are dealing with at the moment."

Same problem for me…

How I mentioned above, Im training MMA year around and lifting too. My Low/No Carb day was planned for sunday but if I do a low carb day on monday, too, when I only got MMA without lifting I’m dying and want to eat any carbs I see around…

[quote]Dopamin wrote:
Hey I have a question…

I’m endomorph and I’m training MMA year round 4-5x per week and lifting ~3x per week.

Is it important to use the carbs only around my training when I’m going for weight loss or doesn’t it really matter at all?

Because I’m at home at 10pm and if I eat most of the carbs then I think most is going in my fat cells during sleep[/quote]

If you notice carbs are kept during the first few meals during a moderate and low days not around training. Read all the information carefully, the only meal you have (around) training with carbs is your pwo which is not a excessive amount.

Regards,

[quote]nickh2308 wrote:
TEKEN - how often do you take progress pics? I am using the lowest values Shelby reccomends, with 2 high days and doing cardio about 3 x a week with weight sessions about 3 x a week and seem to have put on 1kg or 2.2lb this week according to scales :frowning:

I don’t know what is happening! its not very motivating lol…[/quote]

Dont need to freak out just adjust, you should evaluate your progress weekly, if ou want to lose fat shoot for 1-2 lb drop per week. If you weihgt more it means that you are not in calorie deficit, simply remove a high day, add another cardio sessions and re evaluate your progress…

Use this to track your progress:

http://www.stevenscreek.com/goodies/pi.shtml

Take the second value.

Keep us posted !

[quote]Dopamin wrote:
@ gremlin

"Anyone else have trouble going longer than two days low carb without there body simply craving all the carbs they can get their lips around.

I’ve done carb cycling in the past with a great deal of success, but lately I can’t seem to go any longer than two days without taking in a considerable dose of carbs. I have a feeling it’s the stress level that I experience at work, which is affecting my sleep, but I’m curious what others are dealing with at the moment."

Same problem for me…

How I mentioned above, Im training MMA year around and lifting too. My Low/No Carb day was planned for sunday but if I do a low carb day on monday, too, when I only got MMA without lifting I’m dying and want to eat any carbs I see around…[/quote]

If you have such a high activity level why are you going no carbs at all? Hahaha if your training and practicing MMA 6 days a week you should only have 1 low day, other days would be moderate and high… just one would be a low day which could be from 40-150 gr depending on your size.

[quote]Dopamin wrote:
@ gremlin

"Anyone else have trouble going longer than two days low carb without there body simply craving all the carbs they can get their lips around.

I’ve done carb cycling in the past with a great deal of success, but lately I can’t seem to go any longer than two days without taking in a considerable dose of carbs. I have a feeling it’s the stress level that I experience at work, which is affecting my sleep, but I’m curious what others are dealing with at the moment."

Same problem for me…

How I mentioned above, Im training MMA year around and lifting too. My Low/No Carb day was planned for sunday but if I do a low carb day on monday, too, when I only got MMA without lifting I’m dying and want to eat any carbs I see around…[/quote]

Dopamine,

It’s got to be the extra training incorporated into our schedules that’s burning off way too much calories to not be replaced by CHOs. I’ve been trying to get adequate levels of fat into my diet and protein stays pretty close to the same at about 1.5-2.0 g/lb of bodyweight. But after those two days I just can’t stick with going low CHOs.

At times I get to the point where I’m just so fatigued that I just can’t manage to train intensely. At least not to the point where I’m satisfied with my progress. Not to mention the injuries that magically seem to appear out of nowhere when low CHOing.

Then if I add in a CHO day after two days I feel better and can keep training hard. I guess it’s just a management level, but it seems odd to be so fatigued even after two days of training to be so drained and unable to continue on with low CHO dieting.

v/r

Gremlin

[quote]yusef wrote:
Teken that seems quite low, for example the CT carb cycling codex calculations for 80kg bodyweight would look like this:

High:
Carbs: 275g
Protein: 260g
Fat: 55g

Moderate:
Protein: 260g
Carb 220g
Fat: 55g

Low:
Carbs: 165g
Protein: 260g
Fat: 55g

Even the low day has 165g, and I’m NOT a heavy guy!

Do you find the way you arrange the days throughout the week to be critically important?

Mon: Mod
Tues: High
Wed: Low - Rest
Thu: High
Fri: Mod
Sat: Low - Rest
Sun: Low - Rest[/quote]

He mentioned a no-carb day ! Im actually telling him to add some carbs, Im just giving him a starting point he has to do the rest of the homework and find his sweet spot. Im not saying he can not go above 150. Also as he has a high level of activity and only has 1 low day it should be very low to kind of reset his insulin sensitivity.

The way you arrange your physical activity is important, you dont want your high days to be back to back you should spread them as far as you can or at least with a low day in between as you have it.

Mine looks like this, to give you an idea

Mon-High
Tue-Low
Wed-Moderate
Thu-Low
Friday-High
Sat- Low
(Repeat)

I workout 4 times which rotates every 6 days.

Guys we have to understand that no program fits all, not everybody is going to have the same diet ! If I were to use the macros outlined by Thibaudeau I would actually start to gain weight, but those are the macros he found effective, Shelby provides other macros. It does not matter, the important thing is to understand the concencpt and how it works then apply that to your own circumstances.

I totally agree with you Teken, I was just seeing if anyone else was facing similar problems with Low CHOing periods. As CT says, sometimes some people just don’t do well on low CHO dieting plans. I’m pretty sure I fall into that category, although a couple of years ago I had great success with carb cycling. I figure I just need to get my ratios right IOT match my training style.

v/r

Gremlin

[quote]TEKEN wrote:

[quote]nickh2308 wrote:
TEKEN - how often do you take progress pics? I am using the lowest values Shelby reccomends, with 2 high days and doing cardio about 3 x a week with weight sessions about 3 x a week and seem to have put on 1kg or 2.2lb this week according to scales :frowning:

I don’t know what is happening! its not very motivating lol…[/quote]

Dont need to freak out just adjust, you should evaluate your progress weekly, if ou want to lose fat shoot for 1-2 lb drop per week. If you weihgt more it means that you are not in calorie deficit, simply remove a high day, add another cardio sessions and re evaluate your progress…

Use this to track your progress:

http://www.stevenscreek.com/goodies/pi.shtml

Take the second value.

Keep us posted ![/quote]

I have only lost about 2lb’s or 1kg in a month on using the lowest values or shelby’s reccomendations. I might increase the carbs from 0.5 x bw to 1 or 1.3 x bw and see how that goes.

[quote]TEKEN wrote:
Guys we have to understand that no program fits all, not everybody is going to have the same diet ! If I were to use the macros outlined by Thibaudeau I would actually start to gain weight, but those are the macros he found effective, Shelby provides other macros. It does not matter, the important thing is to understand the concencpt and how it works then apply that to your own circumstances.
[/quote]

This is all you need to understand guys. No one gets their number perfect right out of the gate,… just be smart enough to see when something is working and when it needs tweaking.

S

[quote]nickh2308 wrote:

[quote]TEKEN wrote:

[quote]nickh2308 wrote:
TEKEN - how often do you take progress pics? I am using the lowest values Shelby reccomends, with 2 high days and doing cardio about 3 x a week with weight sessions about 3 x a week and seem to have put on 1kg or 2.2lb this week according to scales :frowning:

I don’t know what is happening! its not very motivating lol…[/quote]

Dont need to freak out just adjust, you should evaluate your progress weekly, if ou want to lose fat shoot for 1-2 lb drop per week. If you weihgt more it means that you are not in calorie deficit, simply remove a high day, add another cardio sessions and re evaluate your progress…

Use this to track your progress:

http://www.stevenscreek.com/goodies/pi.shtml

Take the second value.

Keep us posted ![/quote]

I have only lost about 2lb’s or 1kg in a month on using the lowest values or shelby’s reccomendations. I might increase the carbs from 0.5 x bw to 1 or 1.3 x bw and see how that goes.

[/quote]

Sorry Im lost, first you said you gained 1 kg now you mentioned you have only lost 1kg ? Whats your goal ?

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:

[quote]TEKEN wrote:
Guys we have to understand that no program fits all, not everybody is going to have the same diet ! If I were to use the macros outlined by Thibaudeau I would actually start to gain weight, but those are the macros he found effective, Shelby provides other macros. It does not matter, the important thing is to understand the concencpt and how it works then apply that to your own circumstances.
[/quote]

This is all you need to understand guys. No one gets their number perfect right out of the gate,… just be smart enough to see when something is working and when it needs tweaking.

S[/quote]

Thats right, thanks Stu :stuck_out_tongue: !

For me thats the secret to this game hehe.

What are you up to nowadays ?

I have been using carb cycling to do a slow, clean bulk any advice would be greatly appreciated.

High days around 400c/320p/30-50f for 3150 to 3330 calories
Medium days 200-220c/320p/110f for 3070 to 3150 calories
Low days 75-100c/320p/130f for 2750 to 2875 calories

Currently I am doing 1 high day, 3 medium days, and 3 low days. I use a upper lower split based on ws4sb3 and have the high day on my heavy lower body day. My maintenance is around 2,800 calories and body weight started at around 188 11% bf. After a couple months I’m at 193. I am pretty content to gain weight slowly until I hit around 210 then I will reassess and decide what to do from there. I will probably add another high day if my weight gain slows any more.

[quote]TEKEN wrote:

Sorry Im lost, first you said you gained 1 kg now you mentioned you have only lost 1kg ? Whats your goal ?

[/quote]

Sorry. I meant in 1 month I have lost about 1KG. But then in 1 week I gained 1KG. I know it could be water weight but not sure.

Goal is fat loss. Trying to start sprint training/interval training as well as steady state cardio soon.

[quote]devman wrote:
I have been using carb cycling to do a slow, clean bulk any advice would be greatly appreciated.

High days around 400c/320p/30-50f for 3150 to 3330 calories
Medium days 200-220c/320p/110f for 3070 to 3150 calories
Low days 75-100c/320p/130f for 2750 to 2875 calories

Currently I am doing 1 high day, 3 medium days, and 3 low days. I use a upper lower split based on ws4sb3 and have the high day on my heavy lower body day. My maintenance is around 2,800 calories and body weight started at around 188 11% bf. After a couple months I’m at 193. I am pretty content to gain weight slowly until I hit around 210 then I will reassess and decide what to do from there. I will probably add another high day if my weight gain slows any more.

[/quote]

Looks good, just try to train hard, rest and make the scale move 0.5 lb a week thats it !

[quote]nickh2308 wrote:

[quote]TEKEN wrote:

Sorry Im lost, first you said you gained 1 kg now you mentioned you have only lost 1kg ? Whats your goal ?

[/quote]

Sorry. I meant in 1 month I have lost about 1KG. But then in 1 week I gained 1KG. I know it could be water weight but not sure.

Goal is fat loss. Trying to start sprint training/interval training as well as steady state cardio soon.
[/quote]

This is exactly why you have to track your progress, buy a measure tape and take weekly measures of your waist, usually 1 in represents 4lbs of fat or buy a caliper.

If you have a take visit the link I provided earlier to track your progress. For example the week you noticed you gained weight if you measure your waist and it drops it means you made progres.

Weight fluctuation is normal, but if after a few days you still carry the same amout of weight then you should create an energy deficit, it is that simple.

Hope this helped !

Regards

okay guys have read through the thread

this is my plan WEEKS 1 - 5,
below is the breakdown of how many high, med, low meals, I have reduced the high meals and moderate meals as the weeks get closer to the end

I am 182 pounds @ 16% bf
i plan on carb cycling for 5 weeks for maximum fat loss.

Week 1 150, 100, 150, 50, 150, 50, refeed = 3 high, 1 mod, 2 low
week 2 150, 100, 1500, 50, 150, 50, refeed = 3 high, 1 mod, 2 low
week 3 50, 100, 50, 150, 100, 50, refeed = 1 high, 2 mod, 3 low
week 4 50, 100, 50, 150, 50, 50, refeed = 1 high, 1 mod, 4 low
week 5 50, 100, 50, 150, 50, 50, refeed = 1 high, 1 mod, 4 low

High: CHO 150, FAT 15
Mod: CHO 100, FAT 30
Low: CHO 50, FAT 45
Refeed: CHO 500+, FAT 0

How does this look? is there any tweaking that can be done?

Thanks guys in advance

another thing

I am thinking about changing my re-feed to a training day and leaving my weekends on low carb?

would this be the best strategy for fat loss?