Yeah, never again. I think I’ll just eat like 6 bags of Fiddle Faddle.
[quote]JamesBrawn007 wrote:
Hi mate
- Certain fruits function like the veggies, i.e. low GI and good fibre source. Rasperries and blueberries are my choice. Together with the yogurt, it equals around 12g carbs. Recall that Berardi doesn’t actually recommend per se going keto. He believes the carbs and calories are so low anyway that fat loss is inevitable on GSD, and that ketosis may or may not be a byproduct of the diet. In addition, CT also states that green veggies, etc, (unless your consuming vast portions) don’t actually count towards your daily carb intake. In addition to green veggies and the morning fruit, I consume only trace carbs. Therefore, my daily carb total from all sources is probably 30-50g. I stick to this because (a) I want to be in ketosis for maximal fat-burning effect; (2) I don’t really feel the need to use my 20g or so daily allowance on a starchy carb source to curb a craving. I can live without it.
[/quote]
3.5oz. of berries + yogurt only has 12g of carbs? Hm, I thought it was significantly more than that. How many grams in the yogurt? Cause I think the berries would be about 12-15g by themselves
as for the green veggies, yea CT has said that. I think I generally end up counting all of it and then subtracting the fiber from the greens from the total carbs. Not like it makes much of a difference.
[quote]
2) I was doing the strength workout every 5 days but I wanted to budget in 2 lactate sessions a week. The logic being this was that these sessions, contrary to some belief, can actually lead to lean muscle gain and are not solely there as fat-burners. I’ve felt this during previous diet phases that body comp has improved via high-rep, lactate sessions. Therefore, I’m moving the strength session to once per week to accommodate these.
In regards to metabolic pairings, I’ve read CT’s stuff on this and quite fancy it. However, there are many ways to train to achieve this, e.g. complexes. I stick to what I think works for me with the equipment set-up I have. However, I’m flexible. Today in the Big Lats article there is a standing compound row which I’m thinking of incorporating because it looks perfect for a lactate session.
- I will likely move to a carb-up every 7 or 10 days at some stage. As a natural endomorph, I find fat loss a perennial issue. In the 4 years I’ve been training most of it has been some diet programme. I’m kind of determined now to stick as far as I can to GSD to try and get as far as I can to achieving a 6-pack (something I’ve never had in my 38 years of life!).
If I did go to weekly refeeds I know I would have to budget in as many clean foods as possible with a calorie ceiling of 3000 or so.[/quote]
I don’t think you’d have to limit it to 3000. I’m lighter than you, have higher bodyfat, and higher weekly calories and as I mentioned before these last 2 weeks went great with 350g in the carb up and 3200 calories went great. For someone like you with high activity and such low calories I bet you could have higher carb ups even if it was every week. I’m endo too (extreme endo 
) so I definitely get the concern about it but who knows, you might have more energy and strength.
Just thought I’d update people-
I’m doing an U/L split training every other day. On training days I shoot for ~400g carbs over the course of 12 hours. So I’ll wake up, PC breakfast, train 2 hours or so after that, with Surge peri-WO, big carb meal an hour after, and then 1-2 more moderate carb meals after that. During these high carb stints I keep fat as low as possible. Then, from 6-8pm on or my last 2 meals of the day are PF; cottage cheese/casein/natty PB.
Off days start with 20-30 mins fasted cardio, and eat PF call day, and in slightly smaller portions than on workout days. Workout days hit ~3500 cals, off days ~2500 cals. Fat intake is actually pretty constant all days, slightly higher on off days, and the bulk of my calorie shift is made up in carbs. I also give myself one free cheat night a week, in addition to my high carb days where I’ll have pizza, cookies, and a few beers with friends.
Weight has been steadily increasing (+3-4 lbs in 2 weeks), and based off the mirror very little is fat gain. I’m guessing most of the fat I have gained is from my cheat nights, but hey- gotta live a little right? Been killing my lifts in the gym too, workouts have felt great.
[quote]spadesofaces wrote:
Just thought I’d update people-
I’m doing an U/L split training every other day. On training days I shoot for ~400g carbs over the course of 12 hours. So I’ll wake up, PC breakfast, train 2 hours or so after that, with Surge peri-WO, big carb meal an hour after, and then 1-2 more moderate carb meals after that. During these high carb stints I keep fat as low as possible. Then, from 6-8pm on or my last 2 meals of the day are PF; cottage cheese/casein/natty PB.
Off days start with 20-30 mins fasted cardio, and eat PF call day, and in slightly smaller portions than on workout days. Workout days hit ~3500 cals, off days ~2500 cals. Fat intake is actually pretty constant all days, slightly higher on off days, and the bulk of my calorie shift is made up in carbs. I also give myself one free cheat night a week, in addition to my high carb days where I’ll have pizza, cookies, and a few beers with friends.
Weight has been steadily increasing (+3-4 lbs in 2 weeks), and based off the mirror very little is fat gain. I’m guessing most of the fat I have gained is from my cheat nights, but hey- gotta live a little right? Been killing my lifts in the gym too, workouts have felt great. [/quote]
Sounds like a good solid plan. How many days are you working out? So 3-4 high days, 2-3 no carb days, and 1 day with a cheat night?
[quote]pumped340 wrote:
JamesBrawn007 wrote:
Hi mate
- Certain fruits function like the veggies, i.e. low GI and good fibre source. Rasperries and blueberries are my choice. Together with the yogurt, it equals around 12g carbs. Recall that Berardi doesn’t actually recommend per se going keto. He believes the carbs and calories are so low anyway that fat loss is inevitable on GSD, and that ketosis may or may not be a byproduct of the diet. In addition, CT also states that green veggies, etc, (unless your consuming vast portions) don’t actually count towards your daily carb intake. In addition to green veggies and the morning fruit, I consume only trace carbs. Therefore, my daily carb total from all sources is probably 30-50g. I stick to this because (a) I want to be in ketosis for maximal fat-burning effect; (2) I don’t really feel the need to use my 20g or so daily allowance on a starchy carb source to curb a craving. I can live without it.
3.5oz. of berries + yogurt only has 12g of carbs? Hm, I thought it was significantly more than that. How many grams in the yogurt? Cause I think the berries would be about 12-15g by themselves
as for the green veggies, yea CT has said that. I think I generally end up counting all of it and then subtracting the fiber from the greens from the total carbs. Not like it makes much of a difference.
-
I was doing the strength workout every 5 days but I wanted to budget in 2 lactate sessions a week. The logic being this was that these sessions, contrary to some belief, can actually lead to lean muscle gain and are not solely there as fat-burners. I’ve felt this during previous diet phases that body comp has improved via high-rep, lactate sessions. Therefore, I’m moving the strength session to once per week to accommodate these.
In regards to metabolic pairings, I’ve read CT’s stuff on this and quite fancy it. However, there are many ways to train to achieve this, e.g. complexes. I stick to what I think works for me with the equipment set-up I have. However, I’m flexible. Today in the Big Lats article there is a standing compound row which I’m thinking of incorporating because it looks perfect for a lactate session. -
I will likely move to a carb-up every 7 or 10 days at some stage. As a natural endomorph, I find fat loss a perennial issue. In the 4 years I’ve been training most of it has been some diet programme. I’m kind of determined now to stick as far as I can to GSD to try and get as far as I can to achieving a 6-pack (something I’ve never had in my 38 years of life!).
If I did go to weekly refeeds I know I would have to budget in as many clean foods as possible with a calorie ceiling of 3000 or so.
I don’t think you’d have to limit it to 3000. I’m lighter than you, have higher bodyfat, and higher weekly calories and as I mentioned before these last 2 weeks went great with 350g in the carb up and 3200 calories went great. For someone like you with high activity and such low calories I bet you could have higher carb ups even if it was every week. I’m endo too (extreme endo ) so I definitely get the concern about it but who knows, you might have more energy and strength.
[/quote]
You’re probably right about the higher calorie/carb count. However, I’m mindful that by carbing up on Sunday, it could be Wednesday before you get back into ketosis meaning optimum fat-burning is only occuring Wednesday to Saturday. That’s how I previously soon discovered the Anabolic Diet wasn’t working for me. The weekend carb-up was too much so I cut it back to one day and that was a bit better. However, my progress seemed to halt on that also.
I’m also mindful about Berardi’s advice that more activity is not better on GSD and that you should allow the low calories of the diet to account for the fat loss.
So I’ll continue as true as I can on GSD. If fatigue/muscle loss becomes a issue I’ll either bring in the carb frequency, or up daily calories and/or adjust training frequency/volume.
New E-book if anyone is interested:
http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&cid=370&pid=3050
[quote]ShelbyStarnes wrote:
New E-book if anyone is interested:
http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&cid=370&pid=3050
[/quote]
anyone get this yet… what did you think?
[quote]ShelbyStarnes wrote:
New E-book if anyone is interested:
http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&cid=370&pid=3050
[/quote]
Is different than the carb cycling book you mentioned in your interview, the one that tells you numbers to start with for carb cycling? Or is it the same one?
For $15 I’ll probably buy it.
It’s different. I just bought it.
[quote]JamesBrawn007 wrote:
You’re probably right about the higher calorie/carb count. However, I’m mindful that by carbing up on Sunday, it could be Wednesday before you get back into ketosis meaning optimum fat-burning is only occuring Wednesday to Saturday. That’s how I previously soon discovered the Anabolic Diet wasn’t working for me. The weekend carb-up was too much so I cut it back to one day and that was a bit better. However, my progress seemed to halt on that also.
I’m also mindful about Berardi’s advice that more activity is not better on GSD and that you should allow the low calories of the diet to account for the fat loss.
So I’ll continue as true as I can on GSD. If fatigue/muscle loss becomes a issue I’ll either bring in the carb frequency, or up daily calories and/or adjust training frequency/volume.[/quote]
What were your calories like for your 6 days a week of low carbs on the AD and how about the 1-day carb up? I think you mentioned it already but is your GSD carb up really big? I know personally I’m gonna end up going all out on those days haha
As for the activity on the GSD thats probably how I’m going to go about it. I don’t know if I could take such low calories with really high activity without some really bad consequences so I’ll likely do 4 strength workouts a week followed by one “Metabolic Pairing” after each workout. That should only add another 8 minutes (all of my metabolic workouts have taken 24 min doing 3x that) so no more than a total of 1 hour. If for some reason fat loss stalls (which I can’t see happening since I’m only going to do it a max of 6 weeks) I’ll add in a little SS cardio.
[quote]pumped340 wrote:
What were your calories like for your 6 days a week of low carbs on the AD and how about the 1-day carb up? I think you mentioned it already but is your GSD carb up really big? I know personally I’m gonna end up going all out on those days haha
As for the activity on the GSD thats probably how I’m going to go about it. I don’t know if I could take such low calories with really high activity without some really bad consequences so I’ll likely do 4 strength workouts a week followed by one “Metabolic Pairing” after each workout. That should only add another 8 minutes (all of my metabolic workouts have taken 24 min doing 3x that) so no more than a total of 1 hour. If for some reason fat loss stalls (which I can’t see happening since I’m only going to do it a max of 6 weeks) I’ll add in a little SS cardio. [/quote]
I was less organised on the AD. But my calories were closer to 2800. I also initially paid less attention to ‘what’ fat I consumed and, as a result, I was eating sausages and all sorts. Following CT’s advice, my fat intake now is based on nuts, fish and olive oil, with some from eggs and low fat cheese. My carb up day used to sometimes turn into a muffin mission. The main advantage of the diet was that I was in a relationship at the time and it allowed me to let the hair down a bit on a Saturday without it overly-affecting my body comp.
Regarding GSD, I’m more determined to keep the carb up cleaner because it is so easy for the day to turn into a food feast. Will I still be having some cheat foods? Damn right, just to keep my sanity!
Regarding your training schedule, I agree that you need to be prepared to be flexible. I think you generally get away with a high volume/frequency approach for the first 7-14 days assuming you are sleeping well in between times.
I now feel that my fat loss is slowing and I think it’s going to get harder from here on in. I’m not due to weigh-in until Friday but I don’t feel any change, so I’m sure any change will be slight. The temptation is to do more to keep the fat flying but I know I need to be patient because my activity levels are pretty much at the max and calories damn low.
[quote]JamesBrawn007 wrote:
I was less organised on the AD. But my calories were closer to 2800. I also initially paid less attention to ‘what’ fat I consumed and, as a result, I was eating sausages and all sorts. Following CT’s advice, my fat intake now is based on nuts, fish and olive oil, with some from eggs and low fat cheese. My carb up day used to sometimes turn into a muffin mission. The main advantage of the diet was that I was in a relationship at the time and it allowed me to let the hair down a bit on a Saturday without it overly-affecting my body comp.
Regarding GSD, I’m more determined to keep the carb up cleaner because it is so easy for the day to turn into a food feast.
[/quote]
hm…you dropped calories way down and had a cleaner carb up less frequenty…I wonder why fat loss happened so much faster when you switched to the GSD 
lol
[/quote]
Regarding your training schedule, I agree that you need to be prepared to be flexible. I think you generally get away with a high volume/frequency approach for the first 7-14 days assuming you are sleeping well in between times.
I now feel that my fat loss is slowing and I think it’s going to get harder from here on in. I’m not due to weigh-in until Friday but I don’t feel any change, so I’m sure any change will be slight. The temptation is to do more to keep the fat flying but I know I need to be patient because my activity levels are pretty much at the max and calories damn low.
[/quote]
Yea you certain are at a point where it would be tough to do more. If you feel progress is seriously slowed down I could see a big benefit from taking a week off, starting at square 1 as far as the amount of exercise goes, and then continuing the diet if you feel you want to get leaner.
[quote]pumped340 wrote:
ShelbyStarnes wrote:
New E-book if anyone is interested:
http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&cid=370&pid=3050
Is different than the carb cycling book you mentioned in your interview, the one that tells you numbers to start with for carb cycling? Or is it the same one?
For $15 I’ll probably buy it. [/quote]
Totally different. Read the description - it tells what’s in it.
Hey Shelby,
What are your thoughts on using R-ALA or fenugreek or cinnamon (even adding apple cider vinegar to the mix) for carb laden meals?
Do you feel they are unnecessary with proper carb cycling and depletion workouts? Have you used any of those substances in the past?
I’ve used r-ALA and like it. I don’t think GDAs are required at all though.
OK I’m about to buy the book.
Shelby, I’m basically doing a CKD now and about to switch to Berardi’s Get Shredded diet. When I start bulking again I plan to follow carb cycling but had some questions I’d appreciate if you could answer when you have time
-
I am a definite endo, how would you go about gradually going from no carbs during the week to the higher carbs of carb cycling?
-
I was thinking of 250-300g for high days, 150g on medium days, and trace carbs on low days. 2 high, 2 medium, 3 low. What do you think?
By the way I’m 6ft, only 170lb. and 14% bf right now and like I said I gain fat very easily
Thanks!
I have a question Shelby. For your carb cycling plan, what does your breakdown look like for grams of protein/fat/carbs look like on your high, medium, and low days?
Also for an endomorph (Like I think you said you are in an interview) what meals would you allow fast digesting/high GI carbs (like cereal 
)? only PWO?
I hope that isn’t asking to much, thanks!
[quote]Needmassquick wrote:
I have a question Shelby. For your carb cycling plan, what does your breakdown look like for grams of protein/fat/carbs look like on your high, medium, and low days?
Also for an endomorph (Like I think you said you are in an interview) what meals would you allow fast digesting/high GI carbs (like cereal )? only PWO?
I hope that isn’t asking to much, thanks![/quote]
A very generic base template for macros is included in the Macronutrient Guidebook I wrote, I believe there is a link in the first post of this thread. It’s available at Elitefts.com along with my other books.
I generally only use “fun” carbs like cereal, etc. in the offseason, and even then I only include them on very high carb days. When dieting, and on low and medium days in the offseason, I prefer to stick to lower GI, slower digesting sources.
[quote]ShelbyStarnes wrote:
Needmassquick wrote:
I have a question Shelby. For your carb cycling plan, what does your breakdown look like for grams of protein/fat/carbs look like on your high, medium, and low days?
Also for an endomorph (Like I think you said you are in an interview) what meals would you allow fast digesting/high GI carbs (like cereal )? only PWO?
I hope that isn’t asking to much, thanks!
A very generic base template for macros is included in the Macronutrient Guidebook I wrote, I believe there is a link in the first post of this thread. It’s available at Elitefts.com along with my other books.
I generally only use “fun” carbs like cereal, etc. in the offseason, and even then I only include them on very high carb days. When dieting, and on low and medium days in the offseason, I prefer to stick to lower GI, slower digesting sources. [/quote]
Yeah, Shelby I remember you specifically saying this during your podcast and was wondering your reasons. Is it just because the lower GI, fibrous carbs keep you fuller and have a higher micronutrient content? Or do you not believe in the carb is a carb is a carb rationale where it doesn’t matter where you get them from? Personally, I’ve been able to cut by eating cookies and ice cream (low fat)!
[quote]pumped340 wrote:
OK I’m about to buy the book.
Shelby, I’m basically doing a CKD now and about to switch to Berardi’s Get Shredded diet. When I start bulking again I plan to follow carb cycling but had some questions I’d appreciate if you could answer when you have time
-
I am a definite endo, how would you go about gradually going from no carbs during the week to the higher carbs of carb cycling?
-
I was thinking of 250-300g for high days, 150g on medium days, and trace carbs on low days. 2 high, 2 medium, 3 low. What do you think?
By the way I’m 6ft, only 170lb. and 14% bf right now and like I said I gain fat very easily
Thanks![/quote]
Start off on the lower end for carbs (the numbers you have listed look like a decent start)… run it for a week or two and see how things go. You’ll put on some water weight initially so be ready for that. You’ll probably want to have at least one day a week where you go quite a bit higher on carbs though, especially if you’re looking to gain weight. Somewhere closer to 3-4g per pound of bw.
Don’t go too low on the low days either - they shouldn’t be zero carb days. Still have a small amount of starchy carbs in your earlier meals of the day.