[quote]forbes wrote:
I don’t know the words for it, but how important is a “jump starting” phase. What I mean is, should one go low carb for a week or 2 before doing carb cycling?
Thanks.[/quote]
Jump starting is needed. If you’re talking about a typical moderate carb cycle, you can just get right into it. If you’re interested in doing a refeed, then I would suggest at least a week of low carbs (depending on your current diet) before refeeding.
On a side note. I’ve been eating 90-120 carbs on most days lately. I have a planned high carb day (420 CHO) on friday which is also my back day (my hardest training day). I’m thinking about skipping this high day, keep carbs low and aim for another epic refeed for Sunday. What do you guys think? lol.
[quote]phatkins187 wrote:
spadesofaces wrote:
thanks for the feedback man. Thats exactly why I asked in the first place- trying to determine how low I need to go to really earn the carb ups. I’m doing moderate cardio after all my lifting sessions for ~20 mins, and fasted cardio every other day or so for about ~20 mins as well. I think I might cut out the peri workout carbs a day or two before the refeed to make sure I’m depleted, but otherwise so far so good.
With another carb up comin up, ive been lookin around for good low-fat high carb snacks. Problem is, everything carby also seems to have a decent amount of fat as well, short of plain bread. What are your guys’ favorite carb up snacks so far?
Oh man the low fat craze is alive and well my friend! Just browse any cookie, cracker, cereal, dessert, frozen food aisle in the grocery store and you’ll find all kinds of deliciousness to get your share of carbs with. Fruits, yogurts, potatoes, yams, oats, rice, bagels, are lower GI carbs but try to get whatever you can to keep the insulin high during the refeed day. Look back in the thread for some of elusive and ajwein’s epic refeed menus for more ideas.[/quote]
Well I got some good solid meals down- pancakes and syrup for breakfast, big chicken bean and rice burrito for lunch, and gyros and white rice from this greek restaurant down the street from me. And then 2 doses of surge planned, but this still leaves me ~300g carbs short, and I’ve pretty much hit my protein and fat limit (~40g fat so far and 250g protein) and I want snacks throughout the day. I went down the snack aisle at my local safeway, and even the “low fat” snacks had 2-3g/serving, with 8-12 servings per package. So I guess my next question is, how low does “as low as possible” really mean?
And elusive- you know you want the big refeed. There are carb depleted kids in india! do it for them!
[quote]elusive wrote:
forbes wrote:
I don’t know the words for it, but how important is a “jump starting” phase. What I mean is, should one go low carb for a week or 2 before doing carb cycling?
Thanks.
Jump starting is needed. If you’re talking about a typical moderate carb cycle, you can just get right into it. If you’re interested in doing a refeed, then I would suggest at least a week of low carbs (depending on your current diet) before refeeding.
On a side note. I’ve been eating 90-120 carbs on most days lately. I have a planned high carb day (420 CHO) on friday which is also my back day (my hardest training day). I’m thinking about skipping this high day, keep carbs low and aim for another epic refeed for Sunday. What do you guys think? lol.[/quote]
I think you’re the fucking man, son. That’s what I think.
I agree with jump starting, but I would prefer to drag it out to TWO weeks; I don’t think two weeks of low cal is long enough to cause damage and you get to utilize one more week of (hopefully) effective fat loss before throwing in a refeed to trick your body.
When I start cycling, my initial refeed will be at the 2 week mark, then 1 week from there on out.
Browsing this topic with great interest. I’ve been planning carb cycling for the next 4-6 months. I’ve read Shelby’s and Thibs’ methods concerning carb cycling. A couple of questions popped in my mind:
Shelby adviced to keep fats as low as possible when carbs are high. On the other hand in Carb Cycling Codex I calculated my fat intake would be steady ~140g every day
In CCC carb meals are divided in three. Shelby recommends to divide them evenly on every meal
[quote]elusive wrote:
forbes wrote:
I don’t know the words for it, but how important is a “jump starting” phase. What I mean is, should one go low carb for a week or 2 before doing carb cycling?
Thanks.
Jump starting is needed. If you’re talking about a typical moderate carb cycle, you can just get right into it. If you’re interested in doing a refeed, then I would suggest at least a week of low carbs (depending on your current diet) before refeeding.
On a side note. I’ve been eating 90-120 carbs on most days lately. I have a planned high carb day (420 CHO) on friday which is also my back day (my hardest training day). I’m thinking about skipping this high day, keep carbs low and aim for another epic refeed for Sunday. What do you guys think? lol.[/quote]
I don’t plan on having a refeed day, just intend to have “high” “moderate” and “low” days thats all. So in that case I don’t need to go low carb for a week?
[quote]forbes wrote:
elusive wrote:
forbes wrote:
I don’t know the words for it, but how important is a “jump starting” phase. What I mean is, should one go low carb for a week or 2 before doing carb cycling?
Thanks.
Jump starting is needed. If you’re talking about a typical moderate carb cycle, you can just get right into it. If you’re interested in doing a refeed, then I would suggest at least a week of low carbs (depending on your current diet) before refeeding.
On a side note. I’ve been eating 90-120 carbs on most days lately. I have a planned high carb day (420 CHO) on friday which is also my back day (my hardest training day). I’m thinking about skipping this high day, keep carbs low and aim for another epic refeed for Sunday. What do you guys think? lol.
I don’t plan on having a refeed day, just intend to have “high” “moderate” and “low” days thats all. So in that case I don’t need to go low carb for a week?[/quote]
Nope. Theres no need to prepare for this diet. I’m assuming fat loss is your goal? Set up your days and get at it.
[quote]heavyset wrote:
Browsing this topic with great interest. I’ve been planning carb cycling for the next 4-6 months. I’ve read Shelby’s and Thibs’ methods concerning carb cycling. A couple of questions popped in my mind:
Shelby adviced to keep fats as low as possible when carbs are high. On the other hand in Carb Cycling Codex I calculated my fat intake would be steady ~140g every day
In CCC carb meals are divided in three. Shelby recommends to divide them evenly on every meal
Would like to hear your opinions and experiments :)[/quote]
I’ve never done the CCC. All I know is that Shelby has used his carb rotation with great results on MANY clients. I would go with Shelby’s lay out. Also, he only recommends dividing carbs evenly on your high carb day. On medium and low days, he suggest you split your carbs amongst your first meal(s) and your post workout meal. He also recommends that you remove shakes while dieting (cutting?) and have all your meals whole food meals.
Also, counting macros on Shelby’s diet is VERY easy. I feel like this is a big plus for people that aren’t as OCD with their macronutrient counting. All you count is the protein in protein foods, carbs in the carb foods and fats in fatty foods. For example, 1/2 cup of dry rolled oats may be 6 grams of fat, 54 carbs and 10 grams protein. However, you would just count it as 54/55 carbs, with no fat or protein. Very easy to follow.
[quote]elusive wrote:
I’ve never done the CCC. All I know is that Shelby has used his carb rotation with great results on MANY clients. I would go with Shelby’s lay out. Also, he only recommends dividing carbs evenly on your high carb day. On medium and low days, he suggest you split your carbs amongst your first meal(s) and your post workout meal. He also recommends that you remove shakes while dieting (cutting?) and have all your meals whole food meals.
Also, counting macros on Shelby’s diet is VERY easy. I feel like this is a big plus for people that aren’t as OCD with their macronutrient counting. All you count is the protein in protein foods, carbs in the carb foods and fats in fatty foods. For example, 1/2 cup of dry rolled oats may be 6 grams of fat, 54 carbs and 10 grams protein. However, you would just count it as 54/55 carbs, with no fat or protein. Very easy to follow.
[/quote]
Tanks for the reply! The thing is I’m trying to gain mass. Never really paid attention to macros - just protein, carbs and cals. Should I avoid foods that consist evenly from different macros? The biggest problem I’m having with Shelby’s methods is the cals seem a bit low. It doesn’t seem to take into account one’s daily activity.
[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:
elusive wrote:
forbes wrote:
I don’t know the words for it, but how important is a “jump starting” phase. What I mean is, should one go low carb for a week or 2 before doing carb cycling?
Thanks.
Jump starting is needed. If you’re talking about a typical moderate carb cycle, you can just get right into it. If you’re interested in doing a refeed, then I would suggest at least a week of low carbs (depending on your current diet) before refeeding.
On a side note. I’ve been eating 90-120 carbs on most days lately. I have a planned high carb day (420 CHO) on friday which is also my back day (my hardest training day). I’m thinking about skipping this high day, keep carbs low and aim for another epic refeed for Sunday. What do you guys think? lol.
I think you’re the fucking man, son. That’s what I think.
I agree with jump starting, but I would prefer to drag it out to TWO weeks; I don’t think two weeks of low cal is long enough to cause damage and you get to utilize one more week of (hopefully) effective fat loss before throwing in a refeed to trick your body.
When I start cycling, my initial refeed will be at the 2 week mark, then 1 week from there on out.[/quote]
This is what I am doing with Berardi’s get shredded diet. You get pretty drained to where your just a pissed off zombie by the end of the two weeks, but it works.
I’ve never done the CCC. All I know is that Shelby has used his carb rotation with great results on MANY clients. I would go with Shelby’s lay out. Also, he only recommends dividing carbs evenly on your high carb day. On medium and low days, he suggest you split your carbs amongst your first meal(s) and your post workout meal. He also recommends that you remove shakes while dieting (cutting?) and have all your meals whole food meals.
Also, counting macros on Shelby’s diet is VERY easy. I feel like this is a big plus for people that aren’t as OCD with their macronutrient counting. All you count is the protein in protein foods, carbs in the carb foods and fats in fatty foods. For example, 1/2 cup of dry rolled oats may be 6 grams of fat, 54 carbs and 10 grams protein. However, you would just count it as 54/55 carbs, with no fat or protein. Very easy to follow.
[/quote]
Is there a more conclusive site to get some of Shelby’s info? I just have the article from Elite. Also, it is almost impossible to get all my foods from whole sources so I do at least 2 shakes a day, what do you think about this? MD
[quote]heavyset wrote:
elusive wrote:
I’ve never done the CCC. All I know is that Shelby has used his carb rotation with great results on MANY clients. I would go with Shelby’s lay out. Also, he only recommends dividing carbs evenly on your high carb day. On medium and low days, he suggest you split your carbs amongst your first meal(s) and your post workout meal. He also recommends that you remove shakes while dieting (cutting?) and have all your meals whole food meals.
Also, counting macros on Shelby’s diet is VERY easy. I feel like this is a big plus for people that aren’t as OCD with their macronutrient counting. All you count is the protein in protein foods, carbs in the carb foods and fats in fatty foods. For example, 1/2 cup of dry rolled oats may be 6 grams of fat, 54 carbs and 10 grams protein. However, you would just count it as 54/55 carbs, with no fat or protein. Very easy to follow.
Tanks for the reply! The thing is I’m trying to gain mass. Never really paid attention to macros - just protein, carbs and cals. Should I avoid foods that consist evenly from different macros? The biggest problem I’m having with Shelby’s methods is the cals seem a bit low. It doesn’t seem to take into account one’s daily activity.[/quote]
I’ve never seen him say NOT to have foods with evenly spread macros, however I’ve never seen him recommend them. He usually suggests foods that favor one macro pretty highly. I’m actually curious of his opinion on something like whole eggs.
Cals may seem low, but you would have at least 3-4 high days a week (depending on your training). Even sometimes, VERY high days.
As a matter of fact. I was browsing Q&As and he was recommending whites:whole eggs ratio of 6:1 or something along the line.
So basically if you aren’t gaining any weight you increase high days up to 3(maybe even 4)? And if that’s not enough you keep upping the carbs on high days?
I’m working the summer in constructions and training 5 days a week. Depending on the calculator I’d need about (175lbs) 3600kcal a day. Don’t I still need a caloric surplus to gain weight even if I’m getting all those carbs?
Okay dudes. I’m planning a Sunday, MAYBE Saturday refeed. We’ll see what happens. I may train my back and shoulders together tomorrow to finish depletion so I can eat on Saturday (I realize at upwards of 120 carbs a day, I may not be depleted anyway). I just got back from the supermarket and bought some goodies. Roughly 1,400 carbs worth of stuff and I got some bagels available that I may or may not eat that will add to that total.
-Breyer’s Fat Free French Chocolate Ice cream
-Low Fat Vanilla ice cream saucers
-2 12inch Boboli Pizza Crusts
-2 cans tomato sauce
-Fat free mozzarella cheese (guess what I’m making)
-French Bread pre made dough
-Lean Pockets Philly Cheese Steak
-Lean Pockets Pepporoni Pizza
-Texas Toast
-Low Fat Waffles
-Maple Syrup (I didn’t add this to the total)
-Fat free Ruffle potato chip
-Fat free Pringles
This list is tenative and is likely to be added to. I was on the prowl for some low fat Pop-Tarts (in honor of our very own Might Stu) but no luck there. I may make some pasta and maybe have a rice a roni meal somewhere. Who knows, we’ll see.
Well as a pre CC experiment (had to stay on a split for another week before hitting EDT next week) I had a few extra carbs yesterday, talking only an extra 100g CHO really, as it was legs day and I was determined to get my 130kgx8, which i’d shit out on previous weeks.
Nailed the lift! Had a bit of hulk rage shaking for the last two reps, but stoked I got it, missing it 2 weeks ago hurt my lower back, which is still a bit tender, but getting it this week felt good. I can fully see how adding extra CHO on the toughest days works now!
Going for a carb load tomorow, after 10 days of 50g and under carbs.
Already looking for fat free ice cream and pancakes(waffles too, as I cannot pick one or the other) with maple syrup. I actually had a dream eating this last night, so I might as well fulfill it.
[quote]MikiB wrote:
Going for a carb load tomorow, after 10 days of 50g and under carbs.
Already looking for fat free ice cream and pancakes(waffles too, as I cannot pick one or the other) with maple syrup. I actually had a dream eating this last night, so I might as well fulfill it.[/quote]
Thats the spirit. If you dreamt it, its meant to be. lol.
