I agree with you about the settlements. Get rid of them and return the land to a Palestine state. Once a Palestine State is established, let the EU in to start messing around with the structures, political, economical, cultural and security etc etc. Get a security system set up there that has control and authority. Meanwhile, establish very strong borders and defence. Make it clear that Israel recognises and respects the Palestine state and as such recognises their need to control any militants there.
If there is any renewed attacks on Israel…well if you’ve done everything possible to coexist you have the right to retribution. Got to wash your hands of the mess and sort a solution. Tricky
The purist approach to this question is no. Out of 5 billion people in the world some of them are bound to be nuts. I can tell you security is not the answer, it is a joke and a farce to let people think they are safer because you have more pimply faced kids doing cavity searches at the airport. The trick is to get rid of the majority of the assholes that wish to perpetrate the terror. The problem is that they are very protected by many different countries who do not like us. We need to ally with Russia and Isreal and open up holy unadulterated hell on any counties who do not comply with our every demand regarding terrorists. Then we can reduce the risk to a insignifigant level, otherwise this will keep slowly escalating
Enough name calling. The best thing for you to do is come up with a solution. I challenge you to give us an alternative solution. The question at hand is: “How do we minimize terror attacks?” You can’t redistribute wealth based upon population. That is called socialism and it doesn’t ever work. You don’t make a society better by hurting it’s brightest members. You encourage sloth.
Lion, you simply cannot reason with terrorists. They are beyond normal human interaction. They, therefore, do not have rights. They need to be exterminated immediately and with surgical precision. If we know where the camp is, use napalm. Use enough napalm. Use a lot of napalm. No warning, just napalm. We need to set up a “Tokyo Rose” on Al Jaezerra television. Start talking some serious shit in Arabic. Show pictures of pre and post napalm. If it makes you feel better, warn people that anyone near those camps will be considered accomplices in the terrorist activity and will be exterminated. How do you define a terrorist? Anyone that targets civilians as a primary goal in some sort of political agenda. No, we don’t target civilians. Therefore, we are not stopping “to their level.” I am very frightened by these extremists. I am willing to use a very harsh hand. Let’s make it very unprofitable to be a terrorist.
You know I just got to thinking (I study, to an extent, WWII). It is interesting how the arab world and Europe blame the Jewish nation for what the arabs are doing. Reminds me of how Hitler, even though it was CLEAR that the Wehrmacht invaded Poland in September 1939, blamed the Jews for “starting the war”. The “occupied territories” were not even occupied UNTIL Egypt, Jordan, and Syria all invaded Israel in the six-day war of 1967. What insued was one of the most incredible counter offensives in the history of the annals of war. Tiny little Israel delt a super quick and decisive blow to the Arab invaders (who were equpit with the latest soviet equipment. Yes I know Israel had some US equipment). What was the excuse of the Arabs invading Israel back then when no one was even “occupying” the West Bank, Golan Heights, or Gaza? Now in relation to what I stated earlier in this post. The parallel with Nazi Germany’s accusations of Israel’s so called “conspiracy for world dominance” (as related in the bogus “Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion”) resonates even today. Now what did we do to Nazi Gemrany in order to destroy its central power? I think that is too obvious to state. Was it pleasant? Of course not. But how does one negotiate with a suicide bomber? Not to mention nations completely bent on your destruction? We all know negotiating with Hitler certainly did not help. It only made him even more ambitious as he watched Europe bow to his every whem in the beginning. How long are we to wait until it gets to the point of yet ANOTHER possible global war? (or close to) Why do we close our eyes everytime an aggressor licks his chops?
LightandFluffy, a solution is using your head more than your brawn. Calling in a napalm strike on the “terrorist training camp” isn’t going to work. Most of these are in the middle of refugee camps. Do you kill everyone? Killing vunerable civilians is deplorable and in some twisted, sick way it is more humane to concentrate of the enemies forces, ie the Israeli army or the Palestinian militants.
I direct your attention to Northern Ireland and similar conflict. People hating each other over history, religion and land. It’s not ended but the progress has been staggering, most of it within the last five years. One of the issues is both sides are aggrieved, it needs to be recognised. People aren’t born evil or terrorists, they turn that way. Both sides believe they’re justified. Dehumanising one side is the easy way of dealing with the situation. One sides totally wrong, they’re responsible, the other are total victims. Unfortunately in these cases it doesn’t work that way. Many civilians have died on both sides, whether by deliberate intent of sucide bombers or misfiring, collateral damage of Israeli attack, it’s not going to matter to the victim. Jaw, Jaw is better than War, War…Tricky
When a baby cries and immediately gets comforted, then the baby learns that crying is the way to ge tthe parent’s attention.
When a toddler has a tantrum and gets what he/she wants to quiet him/her down, then the toddler very quickly learns that tantrums are acceptable ways to get what they want. (I’m sure you’ve all seen the results in shopping malls.)
When terrorists murder civilians in cold blood and commit atrocities against humanity, then, in return, are rewarded with seats at a negotiating table, what does the terrorist learn?
To those who think talking and understanding are the way to go:We’ve been trying for years-it hasn’t worked.
Oh no, if we get tough on them we’ll be STOOPING TO THEIR LEVEL!!!
My god how terrible! Never mind that it actually might work, as NOTHING ELSE HAS.
You have to understand how they see the situation-their culture is violent, aggressive, misogynistic and intolerent. They attack us, we retaliate by criminally prosecuting them a la Lockerbie. Weak, weak, weak. And that is how they see us.
In fact I would say that just as big a threat to us is from within. From pseudo-intellectual, left-wing, cardigan wearing LEMMINGS who crap on about peace and understanding. FUCK OFF. Go and live with your eastern “brothers” and see how much they love you back.
Blood for blood, eye for an eye. The budgie is dead, long live the hawk.
Dude I don’t have a solution. Otherwise I’d have suggested it. As far as I’m concerned though if you ‘re going to suggest foolish and impractical ideas like killing the offenders family and everyone connected with them …then you might as well just shut the fuck up.
So when the baby is stuck in the cot, uncomfortable and hungry, it cries for attention. The all powerful parent then tells the baby to shut up you’re disturbing my TV time and make yourself an omelette, there’s eggs in the kitchen! To which the baby cries a little more!
If the would be terrorist have no hope of anything else, they might as well kick up a fuss. And whilst you have a couple of million begrudging people living in squallor and destitution, you’re not going to be short of recruits. Imagine how you would feel at say 16 or 18, born into a goddamn refugee camp, there all your life, with SFA chance of improving things. Paying for what? the sins of your fathers? I don’t think any of us can imagine it or judge on what we don’t know.
Whilst I readily concede that you have a very strong point, I still believe that talking has to be the way forward.
Apollo, the Infitada or whatever it’s called, only kicked off two years ago, when Sharon went up the Mount or whatever fucking religious place it was. Before that there was aggression, but not at the same intensity that is now. The whole camp David talks, wasn’t great, but again at least it was something. A lull with lots of caution and resentment, but much less killing. So when well mediated talks are in place you’ve got a chance - but you obviously prefer the current situation. Are you really that blood hungry? Do you really think you can wipe them all out and batter them into non-existence. Get real, it’s not a solution.
Hey! I have a great idea!!! There’s a tiny group who represent less than 1% of moslems, arabs, persians, and afghanis, who believe that America is an evil repressive force and must be destroyed, so let’s transform America into an evil, repressive, genocidal force so we can destroy it before they get the chance!!
Well, I have to say I absolutely agree with you, there should be an uncompromising policy of complete destruction to terrorists. For those terrorist recruitment camps that are within refugee camps, I say start with efficient surgical strikes and a very well announced promise of retribution to any who harbor terrorists…that is, kill who we can who we know is responsible, give a couple weeks notice to let the innocent have at least some chance to escape, and then finish the job completely and absolutely. There will be some innocent killed, which to me is very sad, but at least we will have done as much as possible to give those people a chance without rolling over on our bellies to any terrorist threat. At least in my opinion, I’m open to other suggestions. It just pisses me off when some morons talk about killing every moslem, arab, or whatever (in an extremely non-specific and ignorant fashion) I see this country betraying its own principles just because of a few piss-ants who caught us by surprise. For fuck sake, if we kill every moslem, or arab, or whatever, who is going to sell me slurpees at the nearby 7-11…
hey…wait a second…maybe 7-11’s are a moslem plot to decrease the insulin sensitivity of Americans, thus destroying us in our own body fat…
Well it’s nice to see that a few people like Richard Stroeker can reply to a subject with intelligent rationality to their arguments instead of the “gung-ho-kill-em-all” rhetoric and hyperbole spouted by the naive and immature. Sadly, I admit that I too used to think the same way, until I did some research and reading in order to develop some sort of systemic understanding of the situation. The kill em all approach is exactly what terrorists/Bin Laden/Whoever anticipate because it martyrs those at fault and recruits members to the cause against the “perceived” oppressors. I say “perceived” because in the terrorist’s eyes the West and particularly the U.S are the terrorists. And who could argue with their logic when you research the U.S’s direct support and involvement in perpertrating some of the most heinous international terrorist activities. I for one realise that there are no quick fix solutions available. However I think the dynamic of escalation that is present in these situations must be stopped if rationality is to prevail. Will the terror ever stop? As long as their are people with opposing viewpoint’s, probably not. I do think that both parties need to start looking in the mirror before they go pointing the finger of blame.
Yes of course, it’s our fault this is all happening. If we just mind our own business and bury our heads in the sand like ostriches it will all go away.
Wake up lemmings. It’s either us or them. They’re not targeting you because of politics or any other practical reason-they are doing it because they hate us. They want to destroy the US and it’s allies.
Recently in Sydney, a group of 15 muslim Lebanese men were jailed for pack raping 7 women based on the fact that they were white and christian. If the situation were reversed, the rapists would have been despised by even their own families. But the Muslim Lebanese community HID them from police and refused to co-operate with investigations.
But of course if only those women had not provoked them, and the US had stayed out of Arab affairs, these rapes never would have occurred…
Don’t tell me I’m uninformed and immature you ignorant fuckhead. I’ve got a honours degree in Political Science, and I guarantee have read more than you on this subject.
Once again most people are missing the simple issue here. We must become a society that never tolerates any form of crime, terrorism or anything trully evil. With that punish all who do these things in an equal manner. For example regardless of wealth, education or even if you have a family of four to feed anyone who for example gets caught robbing someone gets the exact same punishment black or white, hispanic or muslim it does not matter. Same punishment. Now as for terrorism same deal. Everyone involved from the terrorist, to the supporters whether they be everyday people or entire nations they get punished equally. In my mind this means Saudi Arabia gets the same punishment as Iraq, Iran or Syria. And please do not respond to this with a bunch of P.C. the world isn’t so black and white BullS**t that a post like this usually gets. It is this black and white approach that will make this world a safer place. One last note is that all crime and terror does not get the proper punishment. All forms of crime need to have the penalties increased dramatically. People no longer fear getting in trouble.
People don’t just hate us for no reason whatsoever. They hate us because we’ve fucked them over in the past, long and hard and on numerous occassions. Stop believing the BS spouted by the government propaganda machine.
You know what tough Sh*t if they don’t like the past. Boy they sure do all have their hands out taking our money to help them out. Hey I understand alot about the libertarian view and at times I like it but don’t try spinning this back on us. Tell me how we screw them. For example all these people in saudi arabia that hate us. If it wasn’t for us they would have no economy. The only reason they have any industries over there at all is because of the amount of money they make off selling us their oil. If we stopped buying oil from the middle east they would all be on their hands and knees in a matter of weeks kissing our asses begging for forgiveness. You want to wake up the young people over there. You want to wake up the open minded people of that part of the world. Take away the income those governments make off selling us and our friends oil. If just the USA and Canada stopped buying any oil from that part of the world they would all realize how screwed up their way of life is. How their govenments have no ability to provide any security for them in anyway. That is the bottom line about it. It is that cut and dry. Anyone on this planet that hates us is JEALOUS because we have the most freedom, the best education, the best economy, the best entertainment, the best food on and on and on I could go. Instead of being jealous they should be envious and use that as a catalyst to improve their own lives instead of being such pieces of S**t and trying to pull the rest of the world down to their pathetic level. Oh and one more thing. These countries over there allow women and children to raped and abused in such high numbers. The percentages are staggering. The amount of interviews done by the United Nations showing that the men over their rape their daughters regularly is disgusting. ONE more then I am done. In Iran a few weeks ago they raised the legal age for a female to get married from 9 to 13 years old. READ THAT AGAIN PEOPLE THEY USED TO ALLOW GIRLS TO BE MARRIED AT 9 YEARS OLD AND ITS STILL AT 13 YEARS OLD. And people say we should be tolerant. Sorry not it you are conducting yourselves in that manner.
they may hate us now for past and current wrongs. but no matter what theyll probably continue to hate us. envy is one of the “original sins” right? we’re rich and gluttonous while most of those countries that breed terrorism have a few aristocrats and everyone else is poor as shit. As long as our media and corporations have an international precesnce at all, people will have contempt and jealousy directed at us. the soviet tactic of killing terrorists families is EXTREMELY shakey ground though. i think there is an olde english claus in the constitution forbidding it specifically because of abuse potential. theres good reason to NOT trust the government. who will be labeleda terrorist next- if such criteria as no trial and systematic killings of “terrorists’” families were implemented. Authoritarianism made a strong showing in Brittain around WWII time and orwell wrote in the appendix of Animal Farm, about the proponents that “These people don’t see that if you encourage totalitarian methods, the time may come when they will be used against you instead of for you.”
“The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.” Vigilance is necessary to ensure that government is not becoming totalitarian, and that we are not giving up our rights, but what else do we need to be vigilant of?
We need to be vigilant that our enemies are not sneaking up on us. We need to be vigilant that our own actions are not pissing somebody off. We need to be vigilant that we are sending the right message about ourselves. We need to be vigilant that we are educating our children properly. We need to be vigilant that our actions reflect our morals. Frankly, I think that, as a country, we’ve sucked at most of this.