Regarding AM wood. Sometimes I’ll get it but most of the time I need to pee so does this count as AM wood?
Alphagunner: I get what your thoughts are on am/pm wood etc, but I think sex drive is independent of that. That’s why I’d like to try a reduction in e2 to see if it affects things.
I know guys that get great wood but have zero sex drive and vice versa
I agree that sex drive is independent of your hormonal “morning wood” response.
The direction I’m trying to lead you is that your problem is mental.
Your plumbing works. But your not having any sexual thoughts. Think about it…
Do you watch porn/masturbate?
Oh I’m having sexual thoughts, etc. It’s just theres a disconnect between the thoughts and then my bodies response to it. I get a little blood flow and that’s it. There isn’t that drive, so to speak.
I have had a few days where my sex drive was indeed there for a few hours. It felt normal. I actually had the drive to pursue my gf. I don’t think it’s mental.
I don’t have the drive really to watch porn, so rarely.
Believe me, I am very attracted to females and my gf, but I WANT to want it. I just don’t seem to have the drive. That flushing feeling in your chest making you pursue it. Hard to explain.
I think I know what you mean. When I take ai and my e2 is on the way done and hits the sweet spot that libido is unforgettable. You want to bang the shit out of her and you have full penile sensation which feels really good. And when you see her you want to have sex like almost getting hard while dressed and no touching. And during this time it is a very hard erection.
I think those on trt reach this level but once in a while. Cause if u try to chase the perfect sweet spot you will be miserable keep trying. With that said I to lowered my dose to lower my e2 a bit and so far I think I am happier. I have better penile sensation. Though I don’t have that strong libido I do have a decent sex drive and want sex at least 2x a week.
I over respond to ai so I can’t mess with it just to have a day or 2 of strong libido. I actually get heart paps because the e2 swings to sharply.
I also take daily Cialis.
I get hard during the night and morning consistently.
So this may be too much info, but:
Last night, while receiving oral by my gf, I was able to finish. And it didn’t take long at all.
Generally I never finish with oral. I’m thinking the use of arimidex may be lowering my e2 and I’m getting some sexual increase.
Sorry mods if this is vulgar or too much info but it’s somewhat relevant.
Vulgar would be if you told us she swallowed 
Keep us updated. Most people pass right through their sweet spot while trying to dial in. So see how long this lasts. Keep notes or use this log to document changes.
Sometimes I think it’s the affect of e2 coming down that caused this sharp libido increase. Because it didn’t last.
I can say that I have felt “that feeling” ever so slightly since starting arimidex. Now remember I’m not too high to begin with. Starting at 27pg/ml of estradiol. So I think, if anything, I’m right on the cuff of getting in a good range.
Keep you guys posted. Fingers crossed.
you can’t really tell that a specific number is optimal because there’s a large genetic variance in genes that code for glucuronidation (peeing away the hormones). This is why many people (and most Asians) don’t get caught by a basic test/epitest urine test. Also why the hormones could be lower, but it doesn’t mean you’re dysfunctional.
https://academic.oup.com/jcem/article/91/2/687/2843517
I feel much better on the lower end of the range, although less than 12 pg/ml could be a bit low. But it doesn’t take much to make me feel high e2.
Many people respond very strongly to drugs because of that. Racial Glucuronidation and Sulfation differences are pretty much never discussed yet they are very influent.
Anyways. Your body knows better. You figure out what is your own E2 number that happens to be associated with “I feel great”. For me it could be 15. For others 35.
2 Likes
It’s defintely subjective.
In hindsight I wish I would’ve tested e2 when I was diagnosed secondary. Would’ve been helpful.
Just thought I’d post an update:
I have been experimenting with Arimidex to bring down my e2 that’s at 28ng/ml. I first tried lowering test dosage, but didn’t feel good with it.
Anyway, after a few weeks at .25mg arimidex e3d and a week at .33 e3d, I’m now upping dosage to @ksman recommended .50mg e3d.
During arimidex use, I’ve maintained wood at night and morning, but still haven’t felt much in terms of libido. My plan is to go a little lower to see if I feel any difference… and stopping (or at least decreasing) armidex dose if I feel any negative sides of low e2.
Should the lowering of my e2 not prove to find me any libido, I may try to go the opposite way and try increasing e2 all while keeping test level steady. Not quite sure how i’ll do so, as my TT is roughly 860ng/ml as is. Maybe dhea or preg?
The shitty part about low e2 is that it can creep up. You could be slowly TANKING yourself. Cant tell the negative effects just yet because they are cumulative.
I will leave you to your experiment, but I just had to get my last input.
My advice: You aren’t going to “fix” your libido by lowering your e2. Have you been reading any of the stuff lately by physio in other threads? High Test needs high e2. If your e2 was at 28, while on TRT, you have no business messing with an AI. Period.
This is a dangerous rabbit hole. For all you know, your low e2 right now, and you have no libido because of it. But you want to increase the dose, without checking bloods?
Anyway, I’m done. I just cant stand to see someone suffer the way I did with low e2 for so long. Peace.
Totally appreciate the response and the thoughts.
And you’re right… I could be low e2 and that’s been the problem all along. However, I don’t know. I do know this site recommends e2 closer to 22pg/ml. Other sites say look at the ratio… and physio recommends a MUCH higher e2 level. SO who do I believe!?
So I’m left with being somewhat my own guinea pig.
My question is this: should lowering e2 fail, and I want to try going the other way, how does one increase e2 WITHOUT increasing test dosage too much? I know about moving to less frequent shots, but isn’t there another way? Like dhea or preg?
Thank you for taking the time to respond here.
Not a problem. So really quickly, let me say this.
I fell for the “22” number bullshit when I first got on this site. It was the single most damaging piece of bad info on the internet regarding TRT, in my experience.
I spend my first year on TRT chasing 22. I kept mistaking high e2 symptoms and low e2 symptoms.
Then I realized what I was doing, but it was too late, I hurt my knees, and wasted a year of my life.
I decided that I was going to drop the AI, and see what happened on 50mg twice a week.
I did it and my e2 came back at 32, and my nipples were a little itchy, had some slight limp dick, and some acne, little bit emo. But now I knew that I could “survive” without an AI.
Once I backed off, my e2 came back, and now it is always between 29-30, and I keep it there.
I take 90 a week, but have been messing around with the staggered dosing method and will go up to 100 a week for a week, then back. (wait until your zeroed to even think about this).
Anyway, when I stopped messing with my e2, everything came together.
When you were a teenager, you had high testosterone, and you also had a similarly high estrogen level. It happens.
By increasing your testosterone, you would ideally put yourself back into the high T (higher) E2 range to feel that way again.
My TRT started WORKING when I stopped fucking with my e2. If anything, you adjust your dose like I did.
There are plenty of more natural ways to control E2 also if you end up having some bad symptoms.
Do you take anything that affects dopamine?
I have manipulated dopamine in the past. Tried wellbutrin, mucuna, selegiline and caber, all without any effect.
I do know that when I originally started trt a year and a half ago, I was placed on 300mg test every other week. I did, at times, feel a little burst of libido. I don’t know if it was bc of the ratio (at the time of feeling the burst) was correct for libido or whether it was just that my e2 was higher at that present time. That’s why I may try to go higher with e2. I just don’t know how without increasing test, which I don’t want to do.
Just stop messing with the AI. You need to be stable for a few months bro. Stay consistent for a few months then go from there.
Do you have an update? How have you dialed in your protocol?
I know I’m new at this but I have a few thoughts.
-
Have you had your prolactin checked? Just asking because elevated prolactin seems to affects libido.
-
You’re on an antidepressant? Some antidepressants lower libido and/or raise prolactin.
-
I think what I would do is to check blood levels when you’re feeling really good. That would give you a baseline. I agree with those who say you shouldn’t chase numbers, but I think how you feel should correspond to numbers that are right for you.
Because there are online companies that offer such services, you could order lab work and have it done almost immediately.
Right now I’m on 25-35mg test EOD. Really responding well to it. My shbg is a little lowish, around 22. So this is a good protocol I believe.
My prolactin was check awhile back before trt and was really low. It was right at the cut off. I’m trying some buspar right now. It’s for anxiety but used off label for sex drive. Seems to be helping. It’s that, or the new protocol of EOD. Not sure which yet. But buspar has been known to raise prolactin up. Generaly not a good thing (unless, like me, it’s super low)
How powerful of an effect are we talking here? I take Zinc off and on and wonder if it’s contributed to any of my issues.