I love wrestling cause I think it is the toughest, mentally and well as physically, and fairest high school sport. In no other sport you can dominate because you are 300 lbs, or win because you have a great teammate, but in wrestling it is you and another man almost the same weight. No other HS sport do you have to diet and cut water to an extreme degree to wrestle in a given weight class, and nothing replicates the strength/aneorobic demands of wrestling.
[quote]KombatAthlete wrote:
I love wrestling cause I think it is the toughest, mentally and well as physically, and fairest high school sport. In no other sport you can dominate because you are 300 lbs, or win because you have a great teammate, but in wrestling it is you and another man almost the same weight. No other HS sport do you have to diet and cut water to an extreme degree to wrestle in a given weight class, and nothing replicates the strength/aneorobic demands of wrestling.[/quote]
I agree 200%.
I feel that the best way for wrestlers to train is by prioritizing the muscles used in the sport. In my humble opinion, i would rank Leg training first, pulling second, and pushing third. obviously there are cross over movements that work more than one group but its generally in that order. in such a short time as high school,workouts need to be optimized with fatigue in mind. try doing GVT, or 100 reps to bigger muscles or a westside program durring wrestling season and you will hate yourself.
westlers are not porwerlifters. porwerlifting is a sport and powerlifting programs are designed assuming that the trainer is not doing 2-4 hours a day of wrestling!! its just madness to try to do both. its like trying to join the wrestling team and basketball team at the same time and be very good at either one. it just wont happen.
another optimization theory that I have used and have seen other, consistantly successful teams use is the following:
-
technique- gotta learn the sport if you want to be good at it.
-
conditioning- if you are strong but cant keep up you are as good as pinned
-
explosiveness- if you could be the fastest guy on the team or the strongest, which would you be? explosiveness means better positioning and better positioning means better leverage so who cares who is stronger? get better position and you can exert twice the force you normally would.
-
strength- this includes static and dynamic strenth. holding a position or just out muscling someone is very handy and can make the difference when all other qualities are very similar.
-
flexibility- the ability to slip out of holds, reduce lactic acid build up, increase rate of contraction and speed of contraction, and injury prevention are all good reasons to work on this one.
[quote]UB07 wrote:
I feel that the best way for wrestlers to train is by prioritizing the muscles used in the sport. In my humble opinion, i would rank Leg training first, pulling second, and pushing third. obviously there are cross over movements that work more than one group but its generally in that order. in such a short time as high school,workouts need to be optimized with fatigue in mind. try doing GVT, or 100 reps to bigger muscles or a westside program durring wrestling season and you will hate yourself.
westlers are not porwerlifters. porwerlifting is a sport and powerlifting programs are designed assuming that the trainer is not doing 2-4 hours a day of wrestling!! its just madness to try to do both. its like trying to join the wrestling team and basketball team at the same time and be very good at either one. it just wont happen.
another optimization theory that I have used and have seen other, consistantly successful teams use is the following:
-
technique- gotta learn the sport if you want to be good at it.
-
conditioning- if you are strong but cant keep up you are as good as pinned
-
explosiveness- if you could be the fastest guy on the team or the strongest, which would you be? explosiveness means better positioning and better positioning means better leverage so who cares who is stronger? get better position and you can exert twice the force you normally would.
-
strength- this includes static and dynamic strenth. holding a position or just out muscling someone is very handy and can make the difference when all other qualities are very similar.
-
flexibility- the ability to slip out of holds, reduce lactic acid build up, increase rate of contraction and speed of contraction, and injury prevention are all good reasons to work on this one.[/quote]
I agree with you on the prioritization of movemements and physical capacities, althoughI would place explosiveness before conditioning, for if you are explosive you make your opponent work more than you. I am planning on doing something Westside based during the off-season, but I don’t know what to do in season.
[quote]Monster Wong wrote:
I’m not a wrestler, but i’m very interesting how to build a body a wrestler have, such as explosive power, endurance, strength…etc.
my idol is the WWE World Heavyweight Champion Dave Batista.
anyone have his training program?
if yes, then can you send me through e-mail? thankyou very much.
[/quote]
WWE is not real wrestling!! those guys are pumped full of steroids and other drugs. Also it is all staged. No real wrestler would ever compare themselves to those fakes. If you want to be like that Dave Batista then go to Mexico and get some roids.
[quote]KombatAthlete wrote:
I love wrestling cause I think it is the toughest, mentally and well as physically, and fairest high school sport. In no other sport you can dominate because you are 300 lbs, or win because you have a great teammate, but in wrestling it is you and another man almost the same weight. No other HS sport do you have to diet and cut water to an extreme degree to wrestle in a given weight class, and nothing replicates the strength/aneorobic demands of wrestling.[/quote]
VERY well said.
[quote]KombatAthlete wrote:
True about wrestlers diets. So many could benefit from a diet education course or something, they don’t realize how much muscle they lose with ‘starvation’ diets. [/quote]
I definitely came from that boat. I came from a small powerhouse school in Wisconsin but our coaches didn’t have a lot of information in the way of nutrition so we really didn’t know. We swould start to cut 8-12wks before our skin-fold which would tell us how far we can cut down to.
I would starve, be dehydrated etc all the time. I was doing that since the 6th grade through most of college when I retired the competitive shoes, now I put on the coaching ones. What I do now, and a lot of it is because of this website, is teach the guys about nutrition as part of practice and an overall year-long conditioning. My guys have not only benefited from it in wrestling but in other sports as well.
Trust me, the years of cutting 10lbs a week after binge eating, and cutting an initial 30 to get to prime rate has taken it’s toll on a body. All of my joints are sore & grind. Metabolism, is just slow and most things I’ve tried doesn’t boost it much anymore and it’s a ton easier to pack on a lot of fat than muscle. The diet has to be very strict.
But would I do it over again, you’re f*kn right I would. You can never question a wrestlers dedication.
Good Post Idea on Wrestler Kombat!
[quote]KombatAthlete wrote:
I love wrestling cause I think it is the toughest, mentally and well as physically, and fairest high school sport. In no other sport you can dominate because you are 300 lbs, or win because you have a great teammate, but in wrestling it is you and another man almost the same weight. No other HS sport do you have to diet and cut water to an extreme degree to wrestle in a given weight class, and nothing replicates the strength/aneorobic demands of wrestling.[/quote]
Spoken Like a True Wrestler! I think we all love it and miss it for that reason.
Don’t forget about the grip strength. I was always crunching away on hand grips in class. There is just something about locking your hands around your opponents… wrists and squeezing so tight he has to drop to his kneeds.
Plus, having a good grip transfers to other areas :), like construction.
[quote]winchell_j wrote:
Don’t forget about the grip strength. I was always crunching away on hand grips in class. There is just something about locking your hands around your opponents… wrists and squeezing so tight he has to drop to his kneeds.
Plus, having a good grip transfers to other areas :), like construction.[/quote]
Good point. Grip and neck work, considered a nice accesory but not necessary in most programs, is actually very important in wrestling. It seems like cruishing grip is used most in wrestling, so I would reccomend using heavy grippers.
[quote]UB07 wrote:
another optimization theory that I have used and have seen other, consistantly successful teams use is the following:
-
technique- gotta learn the sport if you want to be good at it.
-
conditioning- if you are strong but cant keep up you are as good as pinned
-
explosiveness- if you could be the fastest guy on the team or the strongest, which would you be? explosiveness means better positioning and better positioning means better leverage so who cares who is stronger? get better position and you can exert twice the force you normally would.
-
strength- this includes static and dynamic strenth. holding a position or just out muscling someone is very handy and can make the difference when all other qualities are very similar.
-
flexibility- the ability to slip out of holds, reduce lactic acid build up, increase rate of contraction and speed of contraction, and injury prevention are all good reasons to work on this one.[/quote]
I would add timing and balance to this fine list. Wrestling is one the most demanding of all athletic sports.
of course one wants technique but we cant train technique without actually wrestling.
when i was wrestling i got the best results training for strength only in the gym. 3x3 and the like. training frequently (4+) times a week but with very low volume and heavy wts.
big exercises. deads, bench , chins, cleans, squats. and heavy on all core training as well:heavy side bends, twists, “bruce-lees” , etc.
i never saw the point in training for conditioning in the weight room. you are going to get so much conditioning training on the mat and with running programs anyway.
my favorite conditioning program was doing 30-100 yd, sprint/runs and then at the end of the sprint, dropping for sets of pushups or doing chins on a tree or bike rack, jump squats or 1 legged squats (try this one!). i would do around 10 sprints with some easy jogging in between sets. very practical for how i like to wrestle.
i also might add that conditioning and overall strength are still tremendous advantages on the mat. ive taken plenty of guys who had better technique, better explosive strength (which doesnt always help, especially if you "explode"into someone a lot stronger than you—yes, i do agree it helps for positioning) and beaten them because i had superior conditioning and strength. i was strong enough to make them really have to strain against me and had more wind so i ended up outlasting them while their superior technique fell apart because they werent as conditioned as me. when their teqhnique gets sloppy it then becomes even more of a strength match…
cool thread.
train hard,
ryan b.
damn… didn’t know there was already a Kombatathlete here… I need to change my name
right now im doing Chads program with different reps cause i dont have enough weight to get 80% 1RM, and i sub in some olympic movements for bodyparts…like shoulders: push press, sumo high pulls Chest-bench and incline back- pullups and bent over rows with lots of core training
its been pretty good so far at increasing my functional strength as well as giving me the muscle gains i want, since they are all good compound movements…i use the tabata method alot as well as plyometrics
I just wanted to give you guys props…Ive always admired the work ethic and determination that wrestlers have…it carries over into other sports or challenges they have in life, you dont forget how to work hard. If I ever have a son, Ill be hoping he gets into wrestling. I always secretly hated it when the ex wrestlers on my college football teams would grab you in the locker room or practice field and start tossing you around…Id play it off like “knock if off man we gotta be serious” but I really just hated not being able to hang with them grappling!!
Take an ex high school or college wrestler, add a few months boxing or muay thai lessons, and you have a dangerous man on your hands…Id say ex wrestlers with some MMA or boxing under their belt are the masters of real self defense…they know how to work hard, they know not to quit, they know how to take a hit and are used to close physical contact…
kudos to you all, hope I never meet you on the street when Im not on your side!
I tell you fellas, I used to break my buddies’ balls all the time about wrestling, you know that whole “groping other dudes in spandex” thing. But looking back, its the only thing that I regret out of high school was not wrestling at some point. It is great knowledge to have, and a great competitve sport. Good luck to you guys who are in competition now.
[quote]rich44 wrote:
Monster Wong wrote:
I’m not a wrestler, but i’m very interesting how to build a body a wrestler have, such as explosive power, endurance, strength…etc.
my idol is the WWE World Heavyweight Champion Dave Batista.
anyone have his training program?
if yes, then can you send me through e-mail? thankyou very much.
WWE is not real wrestling!! those guys are pumped full of steroids and other drugs. Also it is all staged. No real wrestler would ever compare themselves to those fakes. If you want to be like that Dave Batista then go to Mexico and get some roids.
[/quote]
::cough::kurt::cough::angle::cough
whoa i better get this cold checked out
[quote]bikemike wrote:
UB07 wrote:
another optimization theory that I have used and have seen other, consistantly successful teams use is the following:
-
technique- gotta learn the sport if you want to be good at it.
-
conditioning- if you are strong but cant keep up you are as good as pinned
-
explosiveness- if you could be the fastest guy on the team or the strongest, which would you be? explosiveness means better positioning and better positioning means better leverage so who cares who is stronger? get better position and you can exert twice the force you normally would.
-
strength- this includes static and dynamic strenth. holding a position or just out muscling someone is very handy and can make the difference when all other qualities are very similar.
-
flexibility- the ability to slip out of holds, reduce lactic acid build up, increase rate of contraction and speed of contraction, and injury prevention are all good reasons to work on this one.
I would add timing and balance to this fine list. Wrestling is one the most demanding of all athletic sports.[/quote]
good point, but i assumed that came with training/technique. how could you not improve those qualities when you are learning the sport? i mean do you do any special things for them? set ups, and controlling the body are all timing and those are incorporated into most practices
This is the template that I had my son use this spring:
3 or 4 times per week:
- An explosive pull from the floor.
- Some type of squat.
- An upper body pull.
- An upper body push(press).
- A HOC “finisher”
An example workout:
- Power Cleans
- Front Squats
- Weighted Pull Ups
- Log Clean and Press
- Sled Drag/Sandbag Walks
He went from 160 to 196 pounds bodyweight before he got invited to Fargo. Had to diet back down to 189. I just hope that the bone head doesn’t go on a starvation diet (AGAIN) at the end of Football and lose all of his muscles.
I started wrestling last year. We had a small team so I wrestled varsity 189, while weighing around 170 the whole season. Basically I didnt do too good wrestling the bigger, more experienced guys, so that motivated me to work harder now. I do power cleans and deadlifts along with some hamstring work on one day, another day I squat and do more straight legged deadlifts. I do lower back and ab work, and wrestlers bridges. I’m trying to put on muscle and burn off that fat (I was around 18-20% bf last year), so I’m keeping my workouts short and intense.