Boxing Help

Bigger Stronger Leaner
21

While I agree that punching power can’t be taught, I believe it can be improved, at least to a small degree, by adding weight.

You’re not going to turn Paulie Malignaggi into a Castillo, granted. But at the same time, it’s simple physics that taking a pure puncher and throwing fifteen more pounds on him will make him hit harder. The difference, however, is that the people he’s punching are bigger, so it’s not directly measurable- that KO power is different because the guys are the same size.

The big guys that the dude above has talked about are guys that are not trained fighters. So yes, I believe that there are huge guys who hit like crap, because they’re not boxers. But the heavier the boxer, the heavier the blow.

Like I said- guys are born to one style or another. No one is going to replicate Joe Frazier’s hook, and no one is going to hit like Foreman unless they’re coming out of the gate doing it. However, I think it’s irrational to think that being a heavier guy isn’t going to help your power- that’s just not true.

22

great post.the last line you said

“, I think it’s irrational to think that being a heavier guy isn’t going to help your power- that’s just not true.”

weight,size,has nothing to do with pound for pound power…as I said…bodybuilders are well over 250lbs…they cant punch…fighters in history who moved up in weight,have never punched harder,you are born with your ‘punch’ and can sharpen this up at best,but there is no exercise nor diet that will make you punch harder,and thats a fact.

23

[quote]fightu35 wrote:
great post.the last line you said

“, I think it’s irrational to think that being a heavier guy isn’t going to help your power- that’s just not true.”

weight,size,has nothing to do with pound for pound power…as I said…bodybuilders are well over 250lbs…they cant punch…fighters in history who moved up in weight,have never punched harder,you are born with your ‘punch’ and can sharpen this up at best,but there is no exercise nor diet that will make you punch harder,and thats a fact.
[/quote]

First, take bodybuilders out of the equation. That’s not what we’re talking about here- we’re talking about trained fighters. I agree that there are big guys who don’t know how to punch. However, there are also big guys that do know how to punch.

Now, on top of this, how do you know they never punched harder? When De La Hoya moved up in weight, he may have brought his power with him. However, there’s a big difference between fighting at 140 and fighting BHop at 160 or 168 (I forget what he fought him at).

If he fought a 140 pounder when he was at his middlweight days, he’d be killing them. That’s why there’s weight classes. LIke I said- it’s physics. You’ll never take a boxer and make him into a puncher, but you can take a puncher and make him hit a little bit harder by throwing extra weight on him.

24

well i hope i’m not that wrong, but i’ve improved my punching by technique, i mean using more my core, exploding with my legs, trying to push my body, so i now i really hit harder that when i began boxing, but i dount that my punching power increased. (i got sore abs when i started to use my core in the right way)

it’s all on the hips and core.

You have everything planed, until you get punched in the face.
Mike Tyson

25

damn, i didn’t notice the date of the las post, i brought to live a death treath.

let it die

26

I’d like to believe I’m a born puncher. But born punchers are naturally strong. You have a natural strength in your body.
When I was 15 with one punch in a fight I knocked down a 210lb man who was 19-20 at the time. I was only 155lbs.
Now I could hit hard back then, and always had that snap to my punches…and I learned this when I was young cause all my friends just didn’t have that.
We would all do stuff and none of them had the speed or pop to their punches like me.
Now that I’m older and weigh much more (207) I can definately hit harder…I still have a pop and snap to my punches.

I wish I had the vid…in my 2nd muay thai fight I fought in the 200lb weight class…well I’m just under 5’9 and I fought a guy 6’4-6’5.
If it wasn’t for my natural power I probably woulda been crushed…but it’s the fact that my hooks were just too much for him and when I connected with a few of them in the 2nd round (1st round was a feeler bceause of his mass height/reach advantage)
and the man was all over the place from a few shots that I placed and got the standing 8 count.
It all depends how you train…if you gain relative strength, and some weight to add with it…keep training your punches and skills…and if your a puncher…well being a puncher and having skills is somethin dangerous.

27

I have been told by numerous people over my life that I can hit hard, and when I’ve sparred either formally or informally, I’ve dropped people from single punches and definitely hurt them. My more notable ones were a left uppercut to the ribcage (which dropped a guy) and a stiff jab that nearly put someone out. I’ve good at the Dempsey kind of jab, the one that hits almost like a left cross.

Without gloves, either fucking around or in serious fights, I think its more about knowing where to hit instead of how hard. I’ve dropped people with straight shots to the floating ribs, hooks to the liver and kidney, etc.

Thanks to Rocky for making me a bodypuncher…

28

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
I have been told by numerous people over my life that I can hit hard, and when I’ve sparred either formally or informally, I’ve dropped people from single punches and definitely hurt them. My more notable ones were a left uppercut to the ribcage (which dropped a guy) and a stiff jab that nearly put someone out. I’ve good at the Dempsey kind of jab, the one that hits almost like a left cross.

Without gloves, either fucking around or in serious fights, I think its more about knowing where to hit instead of how hard. I’ve dropped people with straight shots to the floating ribs, hooks to the liver and kidney, etc.

Thanks to Rocky for making me a bodypuncher…[/quote]

well,you are right,it does not take much power to stop someone with a liver shot…or ribs…or throat…but the other guy who said a hard puncher means they are ‘strong’ is 100% false…I cant bench press much…nor more then my friends…but they cant hit no where as hard as me…case in point…bob sap benches 500 lbs…cant crack on egg…tim slyvia,‘strong’ guy,cant crack an egg (and was just knocked out cold ,by ray mercer,50 yrs old…lol with 1 shot)
there is strenght…and punching power…and they do not go together at all, punchers are born,not made…

29

a hard puncher doesn’t neccessarily mean they are strong as in they can bench a ton amount of weight. I meant in the fact that they have natural strength…it’s hard to explain really…take a guy like Melvin Manhoef…he is naturally strong and very built…can only bench 330 at a BW of 205…but he puts people to sleep from punches.

Someone give me a hand here to define natural strength lol someone’s gotta know what I mean…because I don’t mean it in the context of being able to bench a ton of weight.

30

[quote]fightu35 wrote:
FightinIrish26 wrote:
I have been told by numerous people over my life that I can hit hard, and when I’ve sparred either formally or informally, I’ve dropped people from single punches and definitely hurt them. My more notable ones were a left uppercut to the ribcage (which dropped a guy) and a stiff jab that nearly put someone out. I’ve good at the Dempsey kind of jab, the one that hits almost like a left cross.

Without gloves, either fucking around or in serious fights, I think its more about knowing where to hit instead of how hard. I’ve dropped people with straight shots to the floating ribs, hooks to the liver and kidney, etc.

Thanks to Rocky for making me a bodypuncher…

well,you are right,it does not take much power to stop someone with a liver shot…or ribs…or throat…but the other guy who said a hard puncher means they are ‘strong’ is 100% false…I cant bench press much…nor more then my friends…

but they cant hit no where as hard as me…case in point…bob sap benches 500 lbs…cant crack on egg…tim slyvia,‘strong’ guy,cant crack an egg (and was just knocked out cold ,by ray mercer,50 yrs old…lol with 1 shot)
there is strenght…and punching power…and they do not go together at all, punchers are born,not made…[/quote]

I get what your saying in that the most effective way to add punching power is not to add weight, however, a punch uses muscles, so making those muscles stronger will naturally make the punches stronger.

Me for example, Im not a trained fighter outside 4 or 5 boxing lessons, but I fight on a regular basis. A majority of the time its on skates. When I started playing hockey in highschool i weighed 155 pounds and used to get dropped in fights because my punches had no power. Now at 185 its very rare im the first to hit the ice.

If you’ve ever watched hockey you know theres little technique to a fight on skates, so I can tell you with 100% certainty the only thing that improved my power was the added 30 lbs of muscle.

You cant teach knockout power, you can train that snap on your punches that Archie Moore had, but you can improve punching power by adding weight.

31

[quote]rasturai wrote:
a hard puncher doesn’t neccessarily mean they are strong as in they can bench a ton amount of weight. I meant in the fact that they have natural strength…it’s hard to explain really…take a guy like Melvin Manhoef…he is naturally strong and very built…can only bench 330 at a BW of 205…but he puts people to sleep from punches.

Someone give me a hand here to define natural strength lol someone’s gotta know what I mean…because I don’t mean it in the context of being able to bench a ton of weight.[/quote]

It isn’t very clear to anyone what punching power comes from. It doesn’t come from being strong in a particular exercise of being tall or being short… no one is sure.

Kelly Pavlik puts people to sleep at 160. At 170, people are much less wary. That goes against conventional logic. Mike Tyson was quickest, and hit the hardest, before he started lifting. Once he began lifting, his career went down the toilet.

You could have Paulie Malignaggi lift weights all day for three years, and I bet you he wouldn’t have any more power than he has right now.

There is something to be said for a guy who commits to his punches, like Gatti used to, and turns into every one and tries to knock you out with it. Has nothing to do with bench pressing, just mechanics and will.

32

[quote]rasturai wrote:
a hard puncher doesn’t neccessarily mean they are strong as in they can bench a ton amount of weight. I meant in the fact that they have natural strength…it’s hard to explain really…take a guy like Melvin Manhoef…he is naturally strong and very built…can only bench 330 at a BW of 205…but he puts people to sleep from punches.

Someone give me a hand here to define natural strength lol someone’s gotta know what I mean…because I don’t mean it in the context of being able to bench a ton of weight.[/quote]

I know what you mean, but it is difficult to put into words.

It’s similar to the concept of “mat strength” in wrestling. Or “farm boy”, or “old man” strength. From my experience it basically has to do with being able to coordinate the whole body into producing for very efficiently. In other words the person is pretty much strong in all possible directions and usually has very strong grip.

One thing that no one has talked about in terms of punching power is hand size. The bigger the hands, usually the harder the puncher. If you get someone who can also throw those hands very quickly, and learns good technique, then you’ll have a very hard puncher.

I for one believe that punching power (as in the amount of force that is transfered into the target) can be improved. Especially if you are talking about a rank beginner.

Learning correct technique, improving speed, and working on relaxation/whipping the punch will all add to the amount of power that is generated into the target. Beyond a certain point though the only way you’ll be able to add more power is by gaining weight, but it might not result in more KO’s due to having to fight bigger opponents (if we’re talking about competitive boxing).

33

well guys, i’m taking boxing seriously, but now im sitting at 247lbs (clearly overweight), and the guys that help me to do pad work said that i punc pretty hard, do you think that my punchicg power will decrease as i lose weight?? (i have lost almost 8 kg in 7 weeks).

and while i’m focusing on hiting as hard as i can, i gotta focus more on my technique, footwork, my guard and improving a lot my cardiovascular endurance.

34

[quote]tuchavito wrote:
well guys, i’m taking boxing seriously, but now im sitting at 247lbs (clearly overweight), and the guys that help me to do pad work said that i punc pretty hard, do you think that my punchicg power will decrease as i lose weight?? (i have lost almost 8 kg in 7 weeks).
.[/quote]

Once you’re over about 180 it doesn’t really matter- you’re going to have the juice to knock a guy out; that’s why heavyweight fights are slow-going, one punch could put you out.

Don’t worry about losing power when you’re weighing in that heavily- your power won’t do shit if you gas out from being too heavy.

35

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
tuchavito wrote:
well guys, i’m taking boxing seriously, but now im sitting at 247lbs (clearly overweight), and the guys that help me to do pad work said that i punc pretty hard, do you think that my punchicg power will decrease as i lose weight?? (i have lost almost 8 kg in 7 weeks).
.

Once you’re over about 180 it doesn’t really matter- you’re going to have the juice to knock a guy out; that’s why heavyweight fights are slow-going, one punch could put you out.

Don’t worry about losing power when you’re weighing in that heavily- your power won’t do shit if you gas out from being too heavy.
[/quote]

thanks irish, hey man another question, do you think that dropping 2-3 pounds a week is too much?, i’m training my ass off, i always get my roadwork, i do padwork with the most experimented heavyweight on the gym, i’ve got a lot of endurance on my shoulders, but i get really tired after the second round (3-5 mins).

36

i did boxing for 3 years,personally…not saying this is fact or anything but i found working lats,shoulders + tris for straight boxes a great help.

37

i do train then man, i’m on 5/3/1, and i don’t think my punching or my strength is a problem on the ring, i think it’s my endurance, i’ll look for some drills to do, my training partner told me that we’ll start sparring on 2-3 weeks

38

[quote]tuchavito wrote:
FightinIrish26 wrote:
tuchavito wrote:
well guys, i’m taking boxing seriously, but now im sitting at 247lbs (clearly overweight), and the guys that help me to do pad work said that i punc pretty hard, do you think that my punchicg power will decrease as i lose weight?? (i have lost almost 8 kg in 7 weeks).
.

Once you’re over about 180 it doesn’t really matter- you’re going to have the juice to knock a guy out; that’s why heavyweight fights are slow-going, one punch could put you out.

Don’t worry about losing power when you’re weighing in that heavily- your power won’t do shit if you gas out from being too heavy.

thanks irish, hey man another question, do you think that dropping 2-3 pounds a week is too much?, i’m training my ass off, i always get my roadwork, i do padwork with the most experimented heavyweight on the gym, i’ve got a lot of endurance on my shoulders, but i get really tired after the second round (3-5 mins).[/quote]

I don’t think it’s too much, especially if you’ve just begun to train regularly after being sedentary for a long time. If you think about it, 2 lbs. a week is 8 lbs. a month. That’s not crazy (as long as you’re not burning off muscle, which, at 247, you’re not.)

You get tired like winded or tired like your hands start slowing down?

39

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:

I don’t think it’s too much, especially if you’ve just begun to train regularly after being sedentary for a long time. If you think about it, 2 lbs. a week is 8 lbs. a month. That’s not crazy (as long as you’re not burning off muscle, which, at 247, you’re not.)

You get tired like winded or tired like your hands start slowing down?[/quote]

i get winded, at the end of the round i’m still hiting pretty hard, but i’m out of breath, and that’s anoying, specially while doing pad work, my partner makes me to follow him and chase him, not just stand up.

40

[quote]tuchavito wrote:
FightinIrish26 wrote:

I don’t think it’s too much, especially if you’ve just begun to train regularly after being sedentary for a long time. If you think about it, 2 lbs. a week is 8 lbs. a month. That’s not crazy (as long as you’re not burning off muscle, which, at 247, you’re not.)

You get tired like winded or tired like your hands start slowing down?

i get winded, at the end of the round i’m still hiting pretty hard, but i’m out of breath, and that’s anoying, specially while doing pad work, my partner makes me to follow him and chase him, not just stand up.[/quote]

Just keep at it. I wouldn’t expect you to have great conditioning weighing in at what you are.

Go to rosstraining.com for some sport specific conditioning drills- some of them are killers. Keep up with the padwork, don’t neglect shadowboxing, and keeping working your skills. Shit don’t come overnight.