Someone is mad, lol. You dont even understand the study, do you? You literally interpret it as it takes 6 weeks each time to see if “it works” or not?
Lmfao, please continue to amuse me.
You know the worst kind of idiot? One with conviction. I won’t waste my time further as I’ve already helped the OP. Conversing with you is like pissing In the wind and I’m not fond of urine on my pants. If any other member in here who is actually intelligent thinks changing protocols after a couple weeks is wise… I’m all ears. Anybody?
@highpull @systemlord @swoops39 @mnben87 @hankthetank89 @Andrewgen_Receptors @unreal24278 @lordgains @now_i_care
Guys, love to know what you all think. I’m not wanting to misdirect people.
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Transdermal application takes about 3 months before T levels reach ‘normal’ range, so I don’t think it’s much of a stretch at all to say that 6 weeks is a minimum. The study you cited says average 3-4 months for muscle strength to improve, so I imagine that’s when you’d see full bloodwork changes such that they are stabilized.
Testing too soon will most likely show inaccurate values, as we all alluded to in this thread. Dunno what @equel’s deal is, but this isn’t the first comment/thread he’s interacted on where he’s a bit emotional. Maybe he should opt for Splenda instead of Equel in his coffee?
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I have heard of personal accounts of men after only their first injection are having hour long sex with their wife after a decade of no erections or sexual desire. A lot of the time it’s an initial reaction and most need to give it 4-6 weeks for consistency.
There was another member who after 13 months on TRT, libido suddenly came out of nowhere.
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Careful you’ll fry your circuits.
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Ok I totally had a moment wondering why I got tagged,then I read.
As I understand it the question is about changing the protocol after just four weeks on a given dose and the question is, is it a good idea?
My response must start with a question just to cover bases. What testosterone are you using? I assume given that it is trt type situation then it is test enanthate or cypionate.
Now with covering that base, NO!!! Do not mess with changes this soon unless it’s lowering a dose to try and address an issue. I did not see any serious issue, I just read the OP and a little more. The reason I say “NO” to adjusting the dose is simple, with long esters like enanthate or cypionate we really have not gotten to the “stable” level window (hormone levels) until almost possibly week 6-7 or even later in some extreme situations. Now again if there is a reason and you want to lower a dose then ok just keep in mind to have a true picture of what a given dose will do then you need those 6-7 weeks to just get stable then you need a little time for your body to really equalize at that level.
Now if you know you are doing something like starting at a low dose to test response then move up according in small properly timed steps the I would think that if you are ok at the end of week 5 then week six you could increase. But you would need another solid 5 weeks at that dose to see what it does to you. Keep in mind these are rough numbers and for a situation where you would be titrating on purpose to try and dial in a dose needed for a given response.
In other words this type of timing could be used if you were a serious body builder and you were trying to find the bare minimum dose to keep from loosing mass on a cruise.
If you are someone trying to dial in a trt dose then I would use 6-7 weeks at a given dose before titrating.
I really didn’t read enough because I am not sure what response level the OP is looking for. Like is he looking to just feel good at the lowest trt dose? Does he already feel good but wants the lowest dose where decent clean eating means he walks around with a six pack that they can see in outline through his tight shirt? I mean what is he looking for? Please don’t be looking for ifbb pro level physique and call it trt, we all want that but it doesn’t happen with trt doses.
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I dont have any science behind my way of thinking.
I upped my test from 290 to 800, its been 3 weeks and i dont see or feel ANY difference.
A few years back i would be against @blshaw and i would say that shit works after few days. And my bloodwork does show it also - when i jab tripple dose, my test is up the next morning in bloodwork.
But nowdays when i really go by feel, especially after my latest experiment, i am with @blshaw saying that even if your bloodwork says the test is there i dont think the body has adapted to it and works accordingly.
I would say its like with food when you eat fast - you stuff in more than you can eat and when it hits it its like : “oh shit, i cant even get off the chair”.
So to actually FEEL the effect, i would have to say that it is fully possible that you need 4-5 weeks.
I also dont see the point to actually argue about this - everyone can always up the dose and lower the dose.
In the long run it doesnt matter at all if someone found the right dose in first month or even first year.
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I have due to an adverse reaction. Otherwise, no, as response to testosterone is so varied and individual it is impossible to pick a date on the calendar when all symptoms are to be resolved and goals achieved.
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Very good point here. I also agree, we ALL respond differently. In the absence of an adverse reaction you end up chasing your tail by switching doses too soon. This is applicable to dialing in a feel good protocol for TRT of course, not steroids or gym performance. As the study shows, and there are outliers always, there are different mean time periods of response in libido, mood, lipids, and mass/fat loss.
This is spot on. Your blood work WILL read higher very quickly but your body’s physiological responses take time. He asked for a study, I posted one that spells it out but studies also have outliers as @highpull stated. We all respond different.
Thats ok, your response regarding the time it takes for protocol changes is what I was requesting. The problem is we get guys like Equel that provide poor information to new users and they don’t know what to make of it.
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Before I ever took Test, I had a perception that being on Test was similar to being on a stimulant. I think this is due to guys reporting feeling like superman and stuff like that. Then I tried it and noticed the effects were subtle and took a long time to “feel”. I was kinda hoping to feel all energetic, alpha, with a hard on 24/7, so that was a disappointment.
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Same dude. Although the ‘new me’ is still better than the low T me.
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I agree. For me, it’s mostly body composition.
I am looking for a number where i feel good at the lowest level of TRT.
I cycle 2 times a year and i always went back to TRT levels.
Why i want to go lower with my TRT is this reason:
One time i injected 250 mg test every 7 days for the whole summer just to build a little more muscle and help with my diet. After 4 months when I did the last shot i stopped cold turkey. The 3. Week after my last shot i Felt very good and my libido was the highest i ever had.
My through at 250 was 1200. So 3 weeks after the last shot my levels were somewhere around 400-500. Maybe even less. I wished I did a test back then. But this happened 2 times. That’s why I want to go low with TRT.
Thank you guys for all the information and links to studies
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You are asking the right questions. I believe the info you are looking for has been provided before getting derailed by a certain someone who I refuse to tag or engage with. If you are truly seeking to get dialed in on a healthy dose that feels good for you try each protocol switch for a period of 6-8 weeks minimum. It sounds like libido is your primary target and luckily this improves earlier than other areas. If you’ve already been on your current dose and want to switch it go for it, but I suggest you give it a little more time this next round. Ok?
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Yes definitely! I don’t have a problem with waiting. Not at all. I wouldn’t say libido is my goal. I just concentrate on libido because it’s a good factor for me that my test is in a good range. Most of the time when my libido is high i also feel good mentally.
I am not on TRT for building muscles. TRT for me is a time to give my body a rest from the 2 -3 short cycles a year. And i would like to have a healthy good range while resting my body.
But yeah that’s my plan now. I have to travel the next 2-3 months anyways. So i keep injecting 100 mg and when I get back home and i still don’t feel good i will up the dose to 120.
Thank you fellaz
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Just my personal experience but the waiting game doesnt work for me. Within the first month I already know what its going to be, as when ever I tried to wait it out things only got worse or stayed the same. Just me though.
No one size regimen fits all. Have you found what does work for you?
Interesting that you mention 500 TT as a good spot.
Yes of course we are all different, and maybe the protocol just wasn’t for me in general. For me luckily (?) I just tend to know more or less soon enough.