Black Teen Shot by Neighborhood Watch

Off Topic
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[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:

[quote]four60 wrote:
Just on my side and this may sound bias. But a kid was HUNTED because he was acting like a kid. Walking looking around. Hell I use to rap to myself or sing Luther songs when I was alone.

Hunted for being a Kid and walking in the rain from the store back to a house with skittles and ice tea.

Thats what he was. The shooter seen something else.[/quote]

Man, I don’t disagree with you at all. Zimmerman desperately WANTED this to be something. He was an overly aggressive and unstable man who had no business being captain of a neighborhood watch OR carrying a concealed weapon. I do think he deserves to go to jail for the rest of his life for this crime. My only problem with this thread has been the assumption that he did this because he was racist. My reading of the events involved have led me to the conclusion that the recent crime spree led him to be way too suspicious and angry at himself for not being able to stop the crimes. When he saw this kid, he projected his suspicions onto the kid and forced a confrontation. It is horrible, but I don’t think any of it was because of racism, and at the end of the day, he murdered an innocent kid.[/quote]

Come on now, you’re saying that had nothing to do with the kid being black? Like I said, there was surely white kids walking around why didn’t he hunt them? Sorry, I meant protect his community.

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[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:

[quote]four60 wrote:
Just on my side and this may sound bias. But a kid was HUNTED because he was acting like a kid. Walking looking around. Hell I use to rap to myself or sing Luther songs when I was alone.

Hunted for being a Kid and walking in the rain from the store back to a house with skittles and ice tea.

Thats what he was. The shooter seen something else.[/quote]

Man, I don’t disagree with you at all. Zimmerman desperately WANTED this to be something. He was an overly aggressive and unstable man who had no business being captain of a neighborhood watch OR carrying a concealed weapon. I do think he deserves to go to jail for the rest of his life for this crime. My only problem with this thread has been the assumption that he did this because he was racist. My reading of the events involved have led me to the conclusion that the recent crime spree led him to be way too suspicious and angry at himself for not being able to stop the crimes. When he saw this kid, he projected his suspicions onto the kid and forced a confrontation. It is horrible, but I don’t think any of it was because of racism, and at the end of the day, he murdered an innocent kid.[/quote]

I understand. Like I said I don’t think you are trying to swing one way or the other.
None of this makes that KID any less dead.

As far as Race goes we can’t say that it didn’t play a part.

I mean other than the store was still open so people are still out. The area had paved blocks for people to walk so I’m sure Zim seen people walk before.

What made this kid so special. Zim sounded sure this kid was up to something from the 911 call.

Walking
Hands in his waistband and something in his hands at the same time. Zim sounded mixed up on that part.
Zim said it was a Teen kid so what is acting funny for a teen?

What made this kid stand out?

Do I think he shot a kid because he was black…NO
Could the kid being black have added to Zims idea that he was up to no good…

Edit:

Kid is still dead.
With no proof he was anything other than a regular kid before he was shot.

423

Man…I sure as hell hope some of these people in the thread stay out of Third Ward Houston. You may see “suspicious activities” like “black people walking”…or my favorite, “black guy rapping to himself outloud so everyone can hear…in vague hopes of scoring a record deal while walking down the street”.

There may or may not be “black people playing basketball” and/or “black people walking to stores with hands in pockets”.

Good gawd…how does a white vigilante with a gun find the time to sleep?

424

[quote]Swolegasm wrote:

Come on now, you’re saying that had nothing to do with the kid being black? Like I said, there was surely white kids walking around why didn’t he hunt them? Sorry, I meant protect his community.
[/quote]

I don’t know if there were white kids there, and neither do you. It was raining so there was not likely to be very many people out. Listen to the recording that 460 was kind enough to post. Zimmerman wasn’t even sure the kid was black at first, and we have all pretty much agreed that he was likely to have been following the kid prior to this, which leads credence to my scenario. Just because a black kid dies does not mean it was racially motivated. I have drawn my conclusions based on what has been reported.

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[quote]Professor X wrote:
Man…I sure as hell hope some of these people in the thread stay out of Third Ward Houston. You may see “suspicious activities” like “black people walking”…or my favorite, “black guy rapping to himself outloud so everyone can hear…in vague hopes of scoring a record deal while walking down the street”.

There may or may not be “black people playing basketball” and/or “black people walking to stores with hands in pockets”.

Good gawd…how does a white vigilante with a gun find the time to sleep?[/quote]

LMAO

426

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Man…I sure as hell hope some of these people in the thread stay out of Third Ward Houston. You may see “suspicious activities” like “black people walking”…or my favorite, “black guy rapping to himself outloud so everyone can hear…in vague hopes of scoring a record deal while walking down the street”.

There may or may not be “black people playing basketball” and/or “black people walking to stores with hands in pockets”.

Good gawd…how does a white vigilante with a gun find the time to sleep?[/quote]

Zimmerman is not white.

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[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:

[quote]Swolegasm wrote:

Come on now, you’re saying that had nothing to do with the kid being black? Like I said, there was surely white kids walking around why didn’t he hunt them? Sorry, I meant protect his community.
[/quote]

I don’t know if there were white kids there, and neither do you. It was raining so there was not likely to be very many people out. Listen to the recording that 460 was kind enough to post. Zimmerman wasn’t even sure the kid was black at first, and we have all pretty much agreed that he was likely to have been following the kid prior to this, which leads credence to my scenario. Just because a black kid dies does not mean it was racially motivated. I have drawn my conclusions based on what has been reported.
[/quote]

I understand where your heart is at in the issue, and I don’t believe we are too far away from agreeing, the only thing that seperates us is the race issue. Can you deny the fact that if it was a White kid dressed the same way Zimmerman would have reacted in a similar fashion? If you can’t you gatta see its racial profiling man. And furthermore shame on the kids commiting crime in the area…they are partly responsible for the sentiment carried on in that community. Still doens’t make it right for Zimm to assume every black kid is up to no good in his neighborhood.

428

[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Man…I sure as hell hope some of these people in the thread stay out of Third Ward Houston. You may see “suspicious activities” like “black people walking”…or my favorite, “black guy rapping to himself outloud so everyone can hear…in vague hopes of scoring a record deal while walking down the street”.

There may or may not be “black people playing basketball” and/or “black people walking to stores with hands in pockets”.

Good gawd…how does a white vigilante with a gun find the time to sleep?[/quote]

Zimmerman is not white.[/quote]

Not that it matters but you can be both Latin American and White.

429

[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Man…I sure as hell hope some of these people in the thread stay out of Third Ward Houston. You may see “suspicious activities” like “black people walking”…or my favorite, “black guy rapping to himself outloud so everyone can hear…in vague hopes of scoring a record deal while walking down the street”.

There may or may not be “black people playing basketball” and/or “black people walking to stores with hands in pockets”.

Good gawd…how does a white vigilante with a gun find the time to sleep?[/quote]

Zimmerman is not white.[/quote]

I really don’t care what he is. A kid is dead because he decided to read all kinds of bullshit negative intentions into the actions of a kid that by all accounts WAS ACTING LIKE A FUCKING KID WALKING HOME.

I could see if he was smashing mail boxes, but he wasn’t.

He was apparently executed for having his hands in his pockets and daring to look at houses he walked past.

Upon noticing a strange SUSPICIOUS car, he walks near it, sees someone in it who looks strange and RUNS THE FUCK HOME…but gets stopped by Dirty Harry and taken out.

How anyone sees something else is beyond me.

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[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:

[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:

[quote]Swolegasm wrote:

Come on now, you’re saying that had nothing to do with the kid being black? Like I said, there was surely white kids walking around why didn’t he hunt them? Sorry, I meant protect his community.
[/quote]

I don’t know if there were white kids there, and neither do you. It was raining so there was not likely to be very many people out. Listen to the recording that 460 was kind enough to post. Zimmerman wasn’t even sure the kid was black at first, and we have all pretty much agreed that he was likely to have been following the kid prior to this, which leads credence to my scenario. Just because a black kid dies does not mean it was racially motivated. I have drawn my conclusions based on what has been reported.
[/quote]

I understand where your heart is at in the issue, and I don’t believe we are too far away from agreeing, the only thing that seperates us is the race issue. Can you deny the fact that if it was a White kid dressed the same way Zimmerman would have reacted in a similar fashion? If you can’t you gatta see its racial profiling man. And furthermore shame on the kids commiting crime in the area…they are partly responsible for the sentiment carried on in that community. Still doens’t make it right for Zimm to assume every black kid is up to no good in his neighborhood.[/quote]

I don’t deny that racial profiling happens, especially in gated communities and it could have happened here. It is also not limited to black people and non-whites. I get stares and weird looks all the time in my neighborhood because I am Russian. Everyone seems to think that all Russians are communists out to destroy America. But the fact that Zimmerman wasn’t sure the kid was black at first doesn’t lend itself to that view. He wasn’t certain the kid was black until after he had called 911, so he thought the kid was suspicious before he knew he was black. He did know the kid was black when he started running after him, so race can’t be ruled out there.

431

[quote]four60 wrote:

[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Man…I sure as hell hope some of these people in the thread stay out of Third Ward Houston. You may see “suspicious activities” like “black people walking”…or my favorite, “black guy rapping to himself outloud so everyone can hear…in vague hopes of scoring a record deal while walking down the street”.

There may or may not be “black people playing basketball” and/or “black people walking to stores with hands in pockets”.

Good gawd…how does a white vigilante with a gun find the time to sleep?[/quote]

Zimmerman is not white.[/quote]

Not that it matters but you can be both Latin American and White.[/quote]

True, but I saw a picture on one of the news sites, and he is not white. Again, not that it matters.

432

Ok so Dr Matt you don’t believe he was being racist, most people do however (not saying you’re wrong) and if he goes to jail, where most I bet will believe he is a racist, he is going to get one hell of a butt raping.

433

[quote]Swolegasm wrote:
Ok so Dr Matt you don’t believe he was being racist, most people do however (not saying you’re wrong) and if he goes to jail, where most I bet will believe he is a racist, he is going to get one hell of a butt raping.[/quote]

And racist or not, he deserves far worse then a butt raping :slight_smile:

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I like how the the NYT turned the Hispanic shooter into a white person so that they’d have the black against white angle to report on. All the news that fits.

435

[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:

[quote]Swolegasm wrote:
Ok so Dr Matt you don’t believe he was being racist, most people do however (not saying you’re wrong) and if he goes to jail, where most I bet will believe he is a racist, he is going to get one hell of a butt raping.[/quote]

And racist or not, he deserves far worse then a butt raping :)[/quote]

They may also kill him…lol

436

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]Swolegasm wrote:
Is it not standard procedure to detain/arrest someone when they killed someone else, if only to question them and make certain of events? [/quote]

Apparently not here. We must first make sure that no one sees this as “racist” so every white person at risk of being seen that way can sleep easy.

I mean, that seems to be what the argument is about…because I don’t see how describing the black kid walking home singing to himself looking at houses in his dad’s neighborhood as a criminal because he is black and walking can be seen as anything but.

Unless this kid was breaking into a house, this is bullshit.

I mean, damn, if I walk around my neighborhood tonight looking at the nice houses…this is now SUSPICIOUS?[/quote]

Preach!

So am I expected to be subjective, give the benefit of the doubt and shut my mouth when I see unfairness? Kiss my fucking black ass.

This is Emett Till all over again. I mean, civil right activists fought their ass off so this this kinda of shit stop happening. 2012, a black kid is killed and his murderer is walking free.

The day a black man is not arrested on the spot after murdering a white person because the police trust him, based on his ‘‘history’’ – even though he was arrested for beating the shit out of cop – and for being a criminalogy student, or for his apparent ‘‘connections’’, the day that will happen in America, then damn right, I’d be willing to give the police and the murderer the benefit of the doubt.

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[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:
Zimmerman is not white.[/quote]

He looks white enough to me.

438

[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
All I know is a kid is dead. All of this bullshit is irrelevant if we now live in a country where I can get shot walking to my house because some jackass is carrying a gun and is too scared to NOT use it as a first resort.

Whether he was racist or not does not eclipse the bigger issue.

[/quote]
Yeah, the bigger issue of self defense to a perceived threat as defined by law in a case where we have limited detail.[/quote]

I think if you put yourself in the way of danger with the intent of stopping a perceived threat as a vigilante wannabe, your ability to scream self defense should be compromised.
[/quote]
I’ll have to re-read the Florida link but I know that in Texas, you have the legal ability to self defense, defense of another and the right to stop a crime from happening as a responsible citizen and a state “licensed” individual may use a firearm to do so.

I know this because I have the license, took the class, learned the law and passed the test.

I also have interjected on behalf of another, though I didn’t use my gun, sans punishment.

At the shell station on the NE corner of I-45 and Rayford/Sawdust in the Woodlands, I was buying gas one morning when I heard a cry for help from around the building on the other side of the station. I went to look out of curiosity and saw a guy pulling an old woman, late 70’s at least, from her car to steal it, a group of people shaking their heads at a safe distance on the phone with 911.

The police still had to arrive though and this sweet grandma was getting carjacked. So I confronted the guy, pulled him out of the driver seat as seat and dragged him inside to hold him for the police. He punched me, technically the aggressor who didn’t wait, and I beat the shit out of him.

When the police showed up he was bloody, crying a little and most likely had a broken jaw. (lots of tough guy stuff I know flame away but…it was IRL).

I gave my statement, it was verified by witnesses, I got a smile, was thanked for the help and told to have a nice day. Never heard anything else.

Now, I saw suspicious activity, knew the police were on the way, played the hero anyways and it was all legal. I hope if my dear old grandmother is ever in a similar situation, some one will help and I’m glad the law would support it.

What we still don’t know in regards to the OP is why zimmerman chose to pursue but evidence so far is backing him.[/quote]
Bump

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paste:

I just can’t believe any Gun Advocate/Owner would think this has anything to do with GUN LAWS?

Self Defense is NOT EVEN AN ISSUE with this. Not sure why you think it is. Unless you want this to be a conversation about self defense?

The Right to Self Defense is NOT the Right to put yourself in HARMS way. Its one of the Major things we talk about when we go to get our CCW permit. We (gun owners/carriers) do not put ourselves in a postion to allow this to happen. WE avoid it.

This is has nothing to do with Stand your Ground if you are moving towards A CONFRONTATION.

I’m not going to debate this. If you believe this then ok. But Hunting is not Self Defense.

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cheese