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[quote]B.L.U. Ninja wrote:
[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
FL state rep Dennis Baxley said, “This is about the application of that law,” Baxley said. "The first thing I thought of when news came out about this is that there’s nothing in the statute that authorizes pursue and confront. That’s a disqualifying factor.
“When a law-abiding citizen is confronted with attack, he should be able to defend himself. But (Zimmerman) was told by police he shouldn’t pursue. Once he did that, he was on thin ice as far as this statute is concerned.”
So Zimmerman went after Trayvon, Trayvon saw this as a threat and DEFENDED HIMSELF and lost is life for it.
Place this scenario in any other situation without the stand your ground law, and it’s clear who instigated the events leading to Trayvon’s death. AN innocent kid with candy and tea, on his way home, being himself. It’s been said over and over again here.
Zimmerman chose to play cop, and ended up being judge, jury, and executioner.
[/quote]
Exactly the point I’ve been trying to make. It’s not hard to see this, and there really is nothing more to it than a guy playing cop when really, he was just a hall monitor. (Points for South Park reference?)
[/quote]
According to you. Baxley’s opinion is really pretty irrelevant when considering the arena and I’d be curious to hear his thoughts post “initial” exposure to the story, with more facts and testimony to consider.
I’m also curious just how much of a PR stunt politician Baxley is manipulating for his voters, a shame really.
Either way, Baxley has an irrelevant personal opinion. We don’t need to break down US govt branches and their responsibilities do we?
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Furthermore, concealed carry licenses grant more authority than just “stand your ground”. There are castle protection rights as well as others granted to licensed individuals. You do have the right to intervene on anothers behalf, personal or property crime.
Even the “stand your ground” twist is an assumption.
We still don’t know what caused zimmerman to exit his vehicle. The racist assumption is pretty well dead now, on to the next I guess but nobody knows what transpired. Not the general public anyways.
This is still a matter of emotional knee jerking vs. innocence until proven guilty. I still have more faith in due process than conjecture.
[quote]anonym wrote:
[quote]Swolegasm wrote:
They are kinda the same thing…
To say someone looks like they are on drugs must mean that they use drugs yes?[/quote]
Saying someone looks like they are on drugs is a subjective conclusion reached by making observations of their behavior and mentally cross-referencing those characteristics with reasons that would likely explain them. This is an interpretive process that is very much open to opinion and speculation.
Stating outright that someone is a drug user is a statement of fact.
Someone can be a drug user without either being on anything at that moment or showing any indications of use even with drugs being active in their system. Conversely, someone can appear to be on drugs without actually having taken anything.
Make sense? If so, can you see where the logic breaks down in X’s dismissal of Zimmerman’s account of events?
No? OK – just because Zimmerman reached an incorrect conclusion about the cause of what he perceived to be irregular behavior from Martin doesn’t necessarily mean he is lying about… pretty much anything. Zimmerman’s ACTUAL quote indicates that he was MISTAKEN… X’s version of his quote makes him a LIAR.
I’d explain further, but I am going to wait to see just how many people misinterpret that statement to mean I’m claiming Zimmerman is being truthful about everything that happened.[/quote]
I understand what you are saying and I know zimmerman said ‘‘or something’’ but he did presume martin was looking for a place to rob and he looked like he was trying to hide his face so in zimmerman’s mind martin being on drugs is not much further of a stretch to conclude.
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DN, you realize your comics are like 5 days behind story revelations right?
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[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
DN, you realize your comics are like 5 days behind story revelations right?[/quote]
implying that making irrelevant contributions to this thread is out of character for her
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
DN, you realize your comics are like 5 days behind story revelations right?[/quote]
I would say not really but i’m sure someone would accuse me of jumping mindlessly to her defence just because she is a girl ( a girl i will never meet or care about in anyway)
[quote]Swolegasm wrote:
I understand what you are saying and I know zimmerman said ‘‘or something’’ but he did presume martin was looking for a place to rob and he looked like he was trying to hide his face so in zimmerman’s mind martin being on drugs is not much further of a stretch to conclude. [/quote]
Yes, but the point being made is that he didn’t LIE about Martin being on drugs. He said he looked like he was on drugs.
So, to say we can’t trust Zimmerman’s account of events because he lied about Martin being a drug user is an incorrect statement to make.
Being mistaken does not equal lying.
The leader of the Black Panthers should be arrested for inciting violence.
[quote]JesseS wrote:
The leader of the Black Panthers should be arrested for inciting violence. [/quote]
He likely will be. I mean…he IS black and all.
[quote]Swolegasm wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
DN, you realize your comics are like 5 days behind story revelations right?[/quote]
I would say not really but i’m sure someone would accuse me of jumping mindlessly to her defence just because she is a girl ( a girl i will never meet or care about in anyway)[/quote]
They absolutely are.
They portray a grossly inaccurate account of the events that showcase Zimmerman as being a predatory racist out to get his rocks off by killing a darky.
The KKK outfit doesn’t acknowledge his black friends commenting on his behalf in the media.
The chasing-while-shooting comic doesn’t address the fact that two eyewitnesses reported Martin was on top of Zimmerman right about when the shot was fired.
The Skittles/iced tea comic has no bearing on the issue of whether or not Martin was the aggressor under Florida law. It’s an appeal to emotion in the exact same vein as newspapers harping about “gun vs Skittles”.
The picture of Zimmerman shooting a baby with a lollipop… well, you get the point. These comics are all caricatures of the events that transpired and are being blatantly and unapologetically used as pro-Martin propaganda.
Again, though, arguing this further would imply DN has made a relevant or insightful contribution to this thread at some point that warrants further discussion.
[quote]anonym wrote:
[quote]Swolegasm wrote:
[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
DN, you realize your comics are like 5 days behind story revelations right?[/quote]
I would say not really but i’m sure someone would accuse me of jumping mindlessly to her defence just because she is a girl ( a girl i will never meet or care about in anyway)[/quote]
They absolutely are.
They portray a grossly inaccurate account of the events that showcase Zimmerman as being a predatory racist out to get his rocks off by killing a darky.
The KKK outfit doesn’t acknowledge his black friends commenting on his behalf in the media.
The chasing-while-shooting comic doesn’t address the fact that two eyewitnesses reported Martin was on top of Zimmerman right about when the shot was fired.
The Skittles/iced tea comic has no bearing on the issue of whether or not Martin was the aggressor under Florida law. It’s an appeal to emotion in the exact same vein as newspapers harping about “gun vs Skittles”.
The picture of Zimmerman shooting a baby with a lollipop… well, you get the point. These comics are all caricatures of the events that transpired and are being blatantly and unapologetically used as pro-Martin propaganda.
Again, though, arguing this further would imply DN has made a relevant or insightful contribution to this thread at some point that warrants further discussion.[/quote]
When have comics ever been accurate or totally true? Their only portraying what the media and people are seeing/feeling at the moment and exaggerating this to get a point across.
Regardless of how right these are, its gonna be hard for a jury not to be affected by this kind of thing if//when their is a trial.
Regardless of how right these are, things lik
I normally don’t post here, but those cartoons are so far off topic that I’m having a hard time taking them seriously. No one … not Zimmerman, not his lawyer, not Jeb Bush, not the police, are claiming that his actions were even remotely protected under the Stand Your Ground laws. I’m not saying Zimmerman is at fault or not, and I’m not downplaying the shittiness of Martin’s death … and I’m not even asserting that this was or was not racially driven. But one thing is known FOR SURE: Stand Your Ground does not apply.
LOl at “CSI accurate POLITICAL COMICS”.
I guess one I saw last week where our debt was represented as an tidal wave was inaccurate also.
[quote]njrusmc wrote:
I normally don’t post here, but those cartoons are so far off topic that I’m having a hard time taking them seriously. No one … not Zimmerman, not his lawyer, not Jeb Bush, not the police, are claiming that his actions were even remotely protected under the Stand Your Ground laws. I’m not saying Zimmerman is at fault or not, and I’m not downplaying the shittiness of Martin’s death … and I’m not even asserting that this was or was not racially driven. But one thing is known FOR SURE: Stand Your Ground does not apply.[/quote]
Well, there is actually still MUCH debate about whether it applies or not.
Jeb Bush has stated he does not think it should…and it probably won’t, but that hasn’t been decided yet.
I’ll agree with X that political comics are, by nature, subjective and often inaccurate. But to make an argument that is known to be false doesn’t accomplish much in terms of provocative thought or usefull discussion. Blaming the Stand Your Ground laws in these comics is about as relevant as making an argument that 2+2=4. No one is debating that point … just like no one is debating that Martin’s death was a tragedy. Zimmerman’s guilt and whether his actions were racially driven or not are certainly not known and it makes sense that comics would poke at these questions (the KKK and racism comics). The Stand Your Ground comics are useless.
EDIT: Perhaps I stand corrected, X. I really hope that this doesn’t turn into a Stand Your Ground argument because Zimmerman wasn’t doing that in the least. I hope his defense has something better than dragging down a sensible law to protect bad decisions.