Black Teen Shot 2

Off Topic
641

[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:

[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:

[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:

[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:

I agree. How the fuck can you conclude that someone following through with these actions is non threatening???[/quote]

Well, he isn’t young, black or hooded…[/quote]

Oh!!! That’s what I was missing![/quote]
We’re in deep, silly territory now for sure. What ever helps you guys sleep at night. Sucks you have to make shit up to support such a sad world view.[/quote]

Please guy. YOu wanna read that deep into sarcasm you can if you want to. What you don’t realize is some of the hateful comments you have spewed support a “sad world view” Saying you would’ve shot the kid yourself and on and on.

I do respect your debating power, for it is strong…but gimme a break with that comment.[/quote]
Hateful comments?

What I said was “given what we know, I would’ve shot Trayvon too” and I would have, if I were George. In reality if Trayvon had punched me I would have broken his jaw but in fat putz George’s situation I’d have shot so you can hold my statement for what it was.

What we know, and the context of my comment, is that according to evidence, Trayvon attacked George for asking him a question and was severely beating him.

I did not consider conjecture when making my statement, and won’t consider it now. I made my comment based on facts available.

I’ve also stated that if the facts show Zimmerman to be the aggressor and a murder, I hope he gets the death penalty but of course you focus on what you perceive to be negative hatred in support of your sad world view.

I’m going by fact, not emotion.

If you need to look up words I use in order to understand my context, please do so.

My “strong debate skills” are such because I am using facts. It’s not fancy word smithing or logical fallacies, unlike the emotionally driven but literally incorrect opinions flying around.[/quote]

My attempt in this thread is to debate the goings on of this case, not to villify it’s posters with insults. However…you insinuating that I do not understand the words you are using IS an insult.

I believe most of us in this thread are going by the “FACTS” that we know to be true so far. I’m not saying Tray was a Saint, but I believe in this situation the shooting wasn’t justified. And I also believe race played a factor. So you can continue to insult my reading comprehension and my understanding of words and what not. With that type of silly attitude I can’t even believe I bothered to pay you a compliment.

I already graduated college I have no need for further reading to "Grasp’ your context.

642

[quote]Professor X wrote:
But, of course, seeing as I said this…it will likely get brushed off as irrelevant despite the fact that I doubt most white people fear for their life if they get pulled over by a cop.[/quote]

Whatever.

I’m quite literally almost 7 feet tall and scare the shit out of police, who are shot and killed by illegals and Zeta drug smugglers out here who hire ex soldiers to smuggle for them.

I get the full get out of the car, get on your knees, business, unless I turn on the dome light, turn off the car, hang my hands with license, CCW license, registration and insurance out the window all in plain view.

No wonder you were a REMF. Complete wimp.

643

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

Using a physical description of a person isn’t racial profiling, it’s called following evidence and logic.
[/quote]

You know, a physical description is “height, weight, hair style, clothing, and finally skin color”.

A physical description is not “black”…uh, walking…in the rain". [/quote]

It was a comment to the general argument of race as part of a description. I have no idea, just like you, as to the true specifics of why he thought the kid was suspicious.

If it was young teen, black, in a hoodie, not part of the community it’s more reasonable. It is entirely possible he was checking out houses and thing in a way that by itself was suspicious. But I don’t know, and neither do you.

The ironic part is that entirely possible Trayvon was actually part of the group burglarizing the neighborhood and Zimmerman was correct in his suspicions.

644

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
But, of course, seeing as I said this…it will likely get brushed off as irrelevant despite the fact that I doubt most white people fear for their life if they get pulled over by a cop.[/quote]

Whatever.

I’m quite literally almost 7 feet tall and scare the shit out of police, who are shot and killed by illegals and Zeta drug smugglers out here who hire ex soldiers to smuggle for them.

I get the full get out of the car, get on your knees, business, unless I turn on the dome light, turn off the car, hang my hands with license, CCW license, registration and insurance out the window all in plain view.

No wonder you were a REMF. Complete wimp.[/quote]

LOL at leaving out everything written before the last sentence.

You aren’t good at this…and the insults suck.

645

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

You’d be wrong in your racial stereotyping assumptions. As usual.
[/quote]

Ok…so if I am wrong…you are saying most white people fear for their life when pulled over by a cop?[/quote]

I have on multiple occasions. I’ve had a cop threaten to beat the shit out of me because he didn’t like the way I looked at him. I’ve had another one refer to me as “boy” (I was 23) throughout his time talking to be and threaten me after I was hit my another driver that wasn’t paying attention and had done nothing wrong.

646

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

You’d be wrong in your racial stereotyping assumptions. As usual.
[/quote]

Ok…so if I am wrong…you are saying most white people fear for their life when pulled over by a cop?[/quote]

I have on multiple occasions. I’ve had a cop threaten to beat the shit out of me because he didn’t like the way I looked at him. I’ve had another one refer to me as “boy” (I was 23) throughout his time talking to be and threaten me after I was hit my another driver that wasn’t paying attention and had done nothing wrong.[/quote]

I didn’t say YOU. I asked you if MOST white people fear for their life when they get pulled over by a cop.

I know this happens in the black community.

But clearly you will claim that everyone is scared of dying when being pulled over.

647

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

You’d be wrong in your racial stereotyping assumptions. As usual.
[/quote]

Ok…so if I am wrong…you are saying most white people fear for their life when pulled over by a cop?[/quote]

I have on multiple occasions. I’ve had a cop threaten to beat the shit out of me because he didn’t like the way I looked at him. I’ve had another one refer to me as “boy” (I was 23) throughout his time talking to be and threaten me after I was hit my another driver that wasn’t paying attention and had done nothing wrong.[/quote]

I didn’t say YOU. I asked you if MOST white people fear for their life when they get pulled over by a cop.

I know this happens in the black community.

But clearly you will claim that everyone is scared of dying when being pulled over.[/quote]

Oh, now I get to make up your stance. Clearly you will just claim that all white people are bad. See how unintelligent that makes me sound to do that?

What you are claiming is also not unique to being black. But, yes, there are many places where it’s just plain scary to get pulled over if you are white.

648

[quote]Professor X wrote:
The qualifiers here were “young and black”. I do believe that equals a few million of us at least.

So…again…how is this NOT “racial profiling”?

I posted the link to the Amadou Diallo shooting…which was a death caused because, being black, he fit the description…despite not even being from this country and SELF IDENTIFYING as non-American.

When blacks have to worry about dying by the hands of those chosen to protect, it is NOTHING like worrying about getting shot by some random gang member.

The Police are a way bigger and more powerful “gang”.

But, of course, seeing as I said this…it will likely get brushed off as irrelevant despite the fact that I doubt most white people fear for their life if they get pulled over by a cop.[/quote]

Shhhhh… you’re showing too much emotion there, Professor X. Please be rational for once.

649

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]red04 wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
2. Does Zimmerman do anything if Martin isn’t black? … And I think that this is what angers blacks the most about the whole thing; the idea that it all stemmed from racial profiling. [/quote]

Couple things:

Racial profiling is going, hmmmm, we have some burglaries . . . lets go question all the black folk.

Rocial profiling is NOT going, hmmmm, we have some burglaries, eyewitnesses saw youngish black men breaking in, all wearing hoodies, let’s be on the look out for youngish black men wearing hoodies who don’t live in the neighborhood.[/quote]

Actually, it is. Why? Because race is part of the profile. It is also racist because it assumes that only young blacks in hoodies are committing, and even capable of committing, those crimes.If you were looking for a particular person and gave race as part of the description that would be different. 911 was committed by men from the ME; let’s be on the lookout for men from the ME. That will work. [/quote]

Nope. You might want to go read the law, perhaps a guidebook for police, before proving yourself an idiot like you just did.

Racial profiling is when you suspect of class of people of criminal behavior because of their race.

Racial profiling is not looking for people who match a suspect’s description.

Big difference.

If a blond white soldier raped someone at a party, blond white soldiers should expect to get questioned from the police. Saw this happen outside Fort Bragg, BTW. All the blond white enlisted who had privileges that weekend were pulled out for ID by partygoers.[/quote]
That’s different than all blond white soldiers are suspected rapists, everyday from that point on, and thus are treated as such. You are describing a case that involved the search for a particular individual. Zimmeran was not looking for anyone in particular. Sorry, but you failed. [/quote]

You don’t have to be looking for an individual, especially when the previous crimes weren’t committed by an individual but multiple people, who all happen to have the description of ‘black’ in common. It is 100% legitimate profiling to be suspicious of a black person you don’t recognize in your gated neighborhood, when previous break-ins were committed by black people unrecognized in your gated neighborhood.

I’m sure Trayvon’s father has no problems walking around the community without being followed/harassed/whatever description you wish to input here, because unlike Trayvon, he is recognized as a member of the community and thus doesn’t ‘fit the description’ of prior break-ins.

It really does make sense, and isn’t racial profiling.[/quote]

LOL.

So…what IS racial profiling?[/quote]

If other black people in the community have no problem walking the streets without drawing attention ‘for being black’ (at least we know this includes Trayvon’s father, possibly other black members of the community as well), then racial profiling is not occurring in that community.

It really is that simple.

650

[quote]Professor X wrote:

When blacks have to worry about dying by the hands of those chosen to protect, it is NOTHING like worrying about getting shot by some random gang member.

The Police are a way bigger and more powerful “gang”.

But, of course, seeing as I said this…it will likely get brushed off as irrelevant despite the fact that I doubt most white people fear for their life if they get pulled over by a cop.[/quote]

White people are murdered WAY more often by Black people than Black people are murdered by cops. There is no denying that.

651

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

You’d be wrong in your racial stereotyping assumptions. As usual.
[/quote]

Ok…so if I am wrong…you are saying most white people fear for their life when pulled over by a cop?[/quote]

I have on multiple occasions. I’ve had a cop threaten to beat the shit out of me because he didn’t like the way I looked at him. I’ve had another one refer to me as “boy” (I was 23) throughout his time talking to be and threaten me after I was hit my another driver that wasn’t paying attention and had done nothing wrong.[/quote]

I didn’t say YOU. I asked you if MOST white people fear for their life when they get pulled over by a cop.

I know this happens in the black community.

But clearly you will claim that everyone is scared of dying when being pulled over.[/quote]

Oh, now I get to make up your stance. Clearly you will just claim that all white people are bad. See how unintelligent that makes me sound to do that?

What you are claiming is also not unique to being black. But, yes, there are many places where it’s just plain scary to get pulled over if you are white.[/quote]

“All white people are bad?”

What the hell does that have to do with what I am asking?

The fact that you dance all around the question is enough.

I would dare say that most white people do NOT fear for their life when they get pulled over by a cop.

I would say most black people do…out of fear for being taken as “fitting the description”.

The real questiion is why so few will admit that?

Why would that make “white people bad”?

652

[quote]Proud_Virgin wrote:
LOL ok you win…Gorge Killerman (how’s that? maybe not insulting enough?)[/quote]

HAHAHA!! No you win. I’ll call him Killerman from now on.

[quote]Proud_Virgin wrote:
…was a highly trained killing machine, weighing in at a lean, mean 220. He killed Trayvon and then inflicted the injuries on himself to make it look like a fair fight. [/quote]

Hahahahahaha!!

This is likely. There’re actually conspiracy theories out there that suggest his ‘‘injuries’’ may have been self inflicted.

[quote]Proud_Virgin wrote:
I mean, I agree with most of what you have to say, but it just seems like you are willfully ignoring some facts. When you say stuff like “There’s no way Trayvon knocked George down with one punch” it just makes me think you’ve never been in a fight or had any experience in those kind of matters.

Hell yeah a good punch will knock somebody down…probably not knock them unconscious, but knock them off-balance and to the ground. Did Trayvon hit him first? Nobody knows, but if he did and Zimmerman wasn’t expecting it, George would have found himself on the floor. [/quote]

Big fighter here. Martial Artist. over 15 years of experience in that field. I’ve brawled with men and women alike. I know what a powerful punch feels like. I agree with you that a well connected punch to the face will knock someone off balance. But in this situation Killerman outweighed Martin by 100 more pounds. And I take the point Tray was more athletic than him. Was that enough to propel Killerman to the ground? Shook him a little, perhaps, but caused him to hit the canvas? We don’t know.

But let’s say that happened. For a big guy with a history of violent behaviour, and with adrenaline pumping through his veins after chasing and cornering the boy, Killerman must’ve been one weak motherfucker. No wonder carrying a gun gave him that extra bit of courage.

Anyway, as you said, and that was originally my main point in my other post, there’s no proof that Trayvon threw the first punch. There are no proof of broken nose or bashed up back of the head so far. We only go with what Killerman had stated, although other witnesses 'accounts contradict him. ie: his neighbour, Mary - now shut down – recalling seeing him on top of Trayvon that night.

653

[quote]doogie wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

When blacks have to worry about dying by the hands of those chosen to protect, it is NOTHING like worrying about getting shot by some random gang member.

The Police are a way bigger and more powerful “gang”.

But, of course, seeing as I said this…it will likely get brushed off as irrelevant despite the fact that I doubt most white people fear for their life if they get pulled over by a cop.[/quote]

White people are murdered WAY more often by Black people than Black people are murdered by cops. There is no denying that.

[/quote]

Once again, wouldn’t “getting murdered by cops” be a worse social experience been being murdered by a “criminal”?

654

[quote]doogie wrote:

White people are murdered WAY more often by Black people than Black people are murdered by cops. There is no denying that.

[/quote]

Black people killing white people get arrested WAY more often and are sent to jail without any hesitation.

There’s no denying in that.

655

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

You’d be wrong in your racial stereotyping assumptions. As usual.
[/quote]

Ok…so if I am wrong…you are saying most white people fear for their life when pulled over by a cop?[/quote]

I have on multiple occasions. I’ve had a cop threaten to beat the shit out of me because he didn’t like the way I looked at him. I’ve had another one refer to me as “boy” (I was 23) throughout his time talking to be and threaten me after I was hit my another driver that wasn’t paying attention and had done nothing wrong.[/quote]

I didn’t say YOU. I asked you if MOST white people fear for their life when they get pulled over by a cop.

I know this happens in the black community.

But clearly you will claim that everyone is scared of dying when being pulled over.[/quote]

Oh, now I get to make up your stance. Clearly you will just claim that all white people are bad. See how unintelligent that makes me sound to do that?

What you are claiming is also not unique to being black. But, yes, there are many places where it’s just plain scary to get pulled over if you are white.[/quote]

“All white people are bad?”

What the hell does that have to do with what I am asking?

The fact that you dance all around the question is enough.

I would dare say that most white people do NOT fear for their life when they get pulled over by a cop.

I would say most black people do…out of fear for being taken as “fitting the description”.

The real questiion is why so few will admit that?

Why would that make “white people bad”?[/quote]

You missed my point on the “white people bad” comment.

I didn’t dance around anything. there is no blanket statement you can make about either race. You are wrong to do so. Every individual has different personal experience. Period.

656

[quote]DarkNinjaa wrote:

[quote]doogie wrote:

White people are murdered WAY more often by Black people than Black people are murdered by cops. There is no denying that.

[/quote]

Black people killing white people get arrested WAY more often and are sent to jail without any hesitation.

There’s no denying in that.[/quote]

So are Hispanics…

Shouldn’t that be an argument for MORE prudence in the judicial process?

657

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:
Following and asking questions are not illegal activities whether you like it or not. I’m not going to keep playing broken record with you.
[/quote]
Because Americans don’t have the right to not be followed and questioned by strangers?

If I follow a woman and ask her all sorts of questions about her sex life I’m not breaking any laws, right?

[/quote]
Show me the mysterious law where following a person and/or asking questions is illegal.

Your strawman examples are in no way even closely related to the Zimmerman case.

658

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:

If I saw a stranger (of any color) following an 8 year old girl (of any color) I wouldn’t like it but I also wouldn’t run up and start attacking, it wouldn’t be justified; not even if he spoke to her.

Now, I would watch, [/quote]
Why? It isn’t a crime. [/quote]
So?

659

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

I didn’t dance around anything. there is no blanket statement you can make about either race. You are wrong to do so. Every individual has different personal experience. Period.[/quote]

Wait…so NOW we are individuals again?

LOL

Dude, seriously, you really can’t see the problem with what you are saying? If I am an individual, then why I am being harassed because some other black guy did something who ONLY matches me because of skin color?

I mean, that IS what we are arguing here.

If the practices of racial profiling are causing this much of a rift in racial relationships…to the point that people will straight up deny that it happens…even WHILE it is happening…why wouldn’t you listen to the people targeted most?

You really think my opinion, dealing with this through my own experiences, mean nothing?

You have several black people on this board all saying the same thing…so we are all crazy?

660

[quote]red04 wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
2. Does Zimmerman do anything if Martin isn’t black? … And I think that this is what angers blacks the most about the whole thing; the idea that it all stemmed from racial profiling. [/quote]

Couple things:

Racial profiling is going, hmmmm, we have some burglaries . . . lets go question all the black folk.

Rocial profiling is NOT going, hmmmm, we have some burglaries, eyewitnesses saw youngish black men breaking in, all wearing hoodies, let’s be on the look out for youngish black men wearing hoodies who don’t live in the neighborhood.[/quote]

Actually, it is. Why? Because race is part of the profile. It is also racist because it assumes that only young blacks in hoodies are committing, and even capable of committing, those crimes.If you were looking for a particular person and gave race as part of the description that would be different. 911 was committed by men from the ME; let’s be on the lookout for men from the ME. That will work. [/quote]

Nope. You might want to go read the law, perhaps a guidebook for police, before proving yourself an idiot like you just did.

Racial profiling is when you suspect of class of people of criminal behavior because of their race.

Racial profiling is not looking for people who match a suspect’s description.

Big difference.

If a blond white soldier raped someone at a party, blond white soldiers should expect to get questioned from the police. Saw this happen outside Fort Bragg, BTW. All the blond white enlisted who had privileges that weekend were pulled out for ID by partygoers.[/quote]
That’s different than all blond white soldiers are suspected rapists, everyday from that point on, and thus are treated as such. You are describing a case that involved the search for a particular individual. Zimmeran was not looking for anyone in particular. Sorry, but you failed. [/quote]

You don’t have to be looking for an individual, especially when the previous crimes weren’t committed by an individual but multiple people, who all happen to have the description of ‘black’ in common. It is 100% legitimate profiling to be suspicious of a black person you don’t recognize in your gated neighborhood, when previous break-ins were committed by black people unrecognized in your gated neighborhood.

I’m sure Trayvon’s father has no problems walking around the community without being followed/harassed/whatever description you wish to input here, because unlike Trayvon, he is recognized as a member of the community and thus doesn’t ‘fit the description’ of prior break-ins.

It really does make sense, and isn’t racial profiling.[/quote]
And insert white instead of black.

If the crimes had been committed by multiple white males in hoodies, checking in to strange white males in hoodies would be totally fine too.

In this scenario, looking for young black males would be fucked up but that just wasn’t the case.