Best Drummer Alive?

Off Topic
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[quote]PimpBot5000 wrote:
Ronsauce wrote:

Come on now. Rush is fantastic an’ all, but Dream Theater > Rush with regards to instrumental talent.

Lets dissect this…(for fun, after all the term “best” in regards to art is very subjective)

Geddy Lee is a far better bassist than John Myung. You would be very hard-pressed to find many bassists who would disagree with this. When Les friggin’ Claypool lists you as one of the best bassists to ever live it sets a pretty high standard, I think.

John Petrucci is better than Lifeson…much better. I’ll concede to this.

Without Peart, Portnoy would not exist. Hell, without Rush, Dream Theatre probably wouldn’t exist. They were “inspired” by Rush to such a degree that for all intents and purposes they started as a cover band. Peart simply blows Portnoy out of the water…the professor and the imitator. Neil studied (and studies) guys like Keith Moon and Buddy Rich, learns some of their theories and techniques and incorporated their influence into his own, completely unique style. Mike Portnoy studied Neil Peart. He can pull off a pretty nifty drum solo, but it reeks of Peart. He reminds me of some musically gifted Asian kid who studies Mozart diligently and is able to replicate his most difficult work on a piano. People often comment “that kid is the next Mozart”. Doesn’t work that way though. Innovation counts for a lot in music, and all art.

Just my opinion. [/quote]

Spot on.

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[quote]lostinthought wrote:
PimpBot5000 wrote:
Ronsauce wrote:

Come on now. Rush is fantastic an’ all, but Dream Theater > Rush with regards to instrumental talent.

Lets dissect this…(for fun, after all the term “best” in regards to art is very subjective)

Geddy Lee is a far better bassist than John Myung. You would be very hard-pressed to find many bassists who would disagree with this. When Les friggin’ Claypool lists you as one of the best bassists to ever live it sets a pretty high standard, I think.

John Petrucci is better than Lifeson…much better. I’ll concede to this.

Without Peart, Portnoy would not exist. Hell, without Rush, Dream Theatre probably wouldn’t exist. They were “inspired” by Rush to such a degree that for all intents and purposes they started as a cover band. Peart simply blows Portnoy out of the water…the professor and the imitator. Neil studied (and studies) guys like Keith Moon and Buddy Rich, learns some of their theories and techniques and incorporated their influence into his own, completely unique style. Mike Portnoy studied Neil Peart. He can pull off a pretty nifty drum solo, but it reeks of Peart. He reminds me of some musically gifted Asian kid who studies Mozart diligently and is able to replicate his most difficult work on a piano. People often comment “that kid is the next Mozart”. Doesn’t work that way though. Innovation counts for a lot in music, and all art.

Just my opinion.

Spot on. [/quote]

x2 - Just a good post, in general.

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Neil Peart of Rush and Jimmy Chamberlain formerly of Smashing Pumpkins

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When you said “instrumentally talented”, I took that to mean “technically proficient.”

As a whole, I still think Dream Theater is more technically proficient as a band. I’ve only ever seen crazier stuff from Myung compared to Lee, and Portnoy is comparable to Peart.

In this regard, the argument that Portnoy would not exist without Peart holds no weight for me. There are plenty of guitarists that I’m sure wouldn’t exist without Hendrix, but there are tons that still blow him away technically.

In any case, I still prefer Rush’s music to Dream Theater’s. It’s a bit more rock and a little less prog and is easier to listen to because of it.

Also, I’m only a guitar player, so my opinion on the drumming is largely based on some second-hand knowledge. Ignorance is largely affecting my view I’m sure.

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[quote]Ronsauce wrote:

When you said “instrumentally talented”, I took that to mean “technically proficient.”

As a whole, I still think Dream Theater is more technically proficient as a band. I’ve only ever seen crazier stuff from Myung compared to Lee, and Portnoy is comparable to Peart.

In this regard, the argument that Portnoy would not exist without Peart holds no weight for me. There are plenty of guitarists that I’m sure wouldn’t exist without Hendrix, but there are tons that still blow him away technically.

[/quote]

Breaking down any semantics, what I meant was “good at their instruments”. I still think Geddy and Neil are superior to John and Mike at what they play. Rush also has much better fusion. When you see Dream Theatre play there is no cohesion…its almost like each member is trying to outdo his bandmates with his virtuosity. Rush takes their insane instrumental skills and makes them synergistic. Check out this song if you like, La Villa Strangiato, incidentally recorded on the studio album in a single take. Forgive the old video…Geddy looks like a middle-aged woman in it…

As for Geddy vs. John, again, hard to compare because its a.) so subjective and b.) they’re both so good.

Here’s Geddy rocking out on a 4 string

Geddy has played a Rickenbacher 4 string fretted bass for the vast majority of his career, but he got a Jaco Pastorius 6 string fretless as a promo. Here’s an instrumental he wrote on it a few weeks after. Keep in mind that he has had NO experience with this bass prior…

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[quote]PimpBot5000 wrote:
Ronsauce wrote:

Come on now. Rush is fantastic an’ all, but Dream Theater > Rush with regards to instrumental talent.

Lets dissect this…(for fun, after all the term “best” in regards to art is very subjective)

Geddy Lee is a far better bassist than John Myung. You would be very hard-pressed to find many bassists who would disagree with this. When Les friggin’ Claypool lists you as one of the best bassists to ever live it sets a pretty high standard, I think.

John Petrucci is better than Lifeson…much better. I’ll concede to this.

Without Peart, Portnoy would not exist. Hell, without Rush, Dream Theatre probably wouldn’t exist. They were “inspired” by Rush to such a degree that for all intents and purposes they started as a cover band. Peart simply blows Portnoy out of the water…the professor and the imitator. Neil studied (and studies) guys like Keith Moon and Buddy Rich, learns some of their theories and techniques and incorporated their influence into his own, completely unique style. Mike Portnoy studied Neil Peart. He can pull off a pretty nifty drum solo, but it reeks of Peart. He reminds me of some musically gifted Asian kid who studies Mozart diligently and is able to replicate his most difficult work on a piano. People often comment “that kid is the next Mozart”. Doesn’t work that way though. Innovation counts for a lot in music, and all art.

Just my opinion. [/quote]

Great Post!

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This guy is pretty sweet:

These vids you guys are posting look cool but the beats don’t even flow. Doesn’t do much for me.

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[quote]bond james bond wrote:
When I went to see Jeff Beck and Stevie Ray Vaughn many moons ago(Cobo Hall) it was to see two guitar gods play. After the show all we could talk about was the drummer for Jeff Beck and how you couldn’t take your eyes off him…Terry Bozzio.

Best drummer alive who knows, I’m sure there are alot of session players who kick ass but will never be household names. One thing I do know for sure…they all play better than I do:D
[/quote]

I was at that show! Amazing, and your right about Bozzio as with all of Jeff Becks drummers. Bozzio’s the drummer on the guitar shop disc.

First time I saw Beck was at Cobo around 81’, just a great venue for a show. Too bad there are not many shows there.

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[quote]BradTGIF wrote:
Ronsauce wrote:
PimpBot5000 wrote:He probably belongs to the most instrumentally talented rock band in history and even in that company he still manages to outshine his band mates.

Come on now. Rush is fantastic an’ all, but Dream Theater > Rush with regards to instrumental talent.

Yeah but there has to be a reason I’ve got a slew of Rush on my Ipod and absolutely zero Dreamtheater.

Know what I mean dude? Rush is much more listenable I guess is what I’m trying to say.[/quote]

Rush is much more accessible. Dreamtheater is an great collection of musicians but they lack the cohesion of Rush.

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[quote]Testy1 wrote:

I was at that show! Amazing, and your right about Bozzio as with all of Jeff Becks drummers. Bozzio’s the drummer on the guitar shop disc.

First time I saw Beck was at Cobo around 81’, just a great venue for a show. Too bad there are not many shows there.[/quote]

Small world man. The sound at Cobo was amazing. Glad I got to see SRV before he died.

I know this is for the living but Keith Moon was one of a kind.
Saw Ozzy in 84’or 85’ with Tommy Aldridge at Kalamazoo and he did a solo with his bare hands… sounded huge.

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[quote]polo77j wrote:
Neal “Motherfuckin’ sickest drum set in Rock” Peart[/quote]

I knew I liked you.

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[quote]PimpBot5000 wrote:
Neil Peart…he still manages to outshine his band mates.

[/quote]

Careful pal.

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[quote]Ronsauce wrote:
Dream Theater > Rush with regards to instrumental talent.[/quote]

^^^ Goes double for you pal.

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[quote]PimpBot5000 wrote:
John Petrucci is better than Lifeson…much better. I’ll concede to this.

[/quote]

You just made the list pal !

Alright…all joking aside…good post, but I disagree about Petrucci being ‘better’ than Lifeson. Just because someone plays MORE notes than someone doesn’t mean they are a better guitar player.

Look at Lifeson’s body of work. Almost every single RUSH album has at least one song that any and every kid that picks up a guitar learns at least one riff from.

RUSH = Working Man
Fly by Night = Fly by Night
Caress of Steel = Ummm…

Okay…so chronologically might not be best

A Farewell to Kings = Closer to the Heart
Permanent Waves = Spirit of Radio
Moving Pictures = Tom Sawyer and Limelight

Anyway… I know pimply kids in a garage copping your licks isn’t evidence of being a great guitar player…but I would argue that the Spirit of Radio lick will go down in the annals of rock history.

Also, Alex has spoken often about how he feels constrained by the music he has to play. I’m curious why if he’s so damned constrained he doesn’t put out a solo album, but the fact remains there’s only so much he can do within the context of the band. Petrucci has no similar restrictions. The flashier he plays, the more 'me, me, me" he puts into it, the better the Dream Theater song.

RUSH is and always will be (someone cue the Canadian National Anthem and actually the U.S. also by God !) a 3 piece band making the noise of a much larger band. I think a large reason why Geddy and Neil get more accolades is the competition is honestly not as great as what Alex faces.

In summation…where is that damn analog_kid when I need him ???

For drummers? Here’s some list I found…be careful…they list fucking Phil Collins ahead of Alex Van Halen !

http://digitaldreamdoor.nutsie.com/pages/best_drummers.html

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I like Clive Burr, Maiden’s original drummer -definitly has none of the technical prowess of some of the names in this thread but gave albums like Number of the Beast a lot of power and aggression

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More interesting list…but Neil comes in at numero 22

http://www.stylusmagazine.com/articles/weekly_article/stylus-magazines-50-greatest-rock-drummers.htm

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[quote]sen say wrote:

You just made the list pal !

[/quote]

LOL, Ok whenever I leave my house I’ll be on the lookout for a big, pissed off Welsh guy wearing a 2112 T-Shirt from 1976 :slight_smile:

Yeah, see its hard ranking musicians. People are really adamant about their picks but its really hard to quantify musical excellence when you’re talking about top tier musicians like Alex Lifeson and John Petrucci. I personally enjoy Alex’s playing a lot more than John’s, but John has made me say “holy shit!” with his skill more than Alex…if that makes any sense. Alex plays better within the confines of the band in that he creates synergy with them, but John (like Mike Portnoy) seems to be a soloist in a group of soloists.

Anyway, you’re preaching to the choir here about how awesome Rush is…I believe I’m probably the biggest Rush fan on this board (yep, thems fighting words!).

BTW, The Necromancer from Caress of Steel is an awesome song that Alex shreds in. CoS is a really underrated album that has some amazing tunes, save the unfortunate “I think I’m going bald”. The album gets a bad rap because it sold next to nothing and almost caused the band to break up and “pursue other career endeavors”.

You must know about Alex’s solo project, Victor. It was mostly a collaboration with other musicians, but I wish he set aside a few tracks just to jam on.

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[quote]sen say wrote:
More interesting list…but Neil comes in at numero 22

http://www.stylusmagazine.com/articles/weekly_article/stylus-magazines-50-greatest-rock-drummers.htm[/quote]

not really impressed with this list, but it did make me recall Billy Cobham. He did some great stuff with Tommy Bolin in Spectrum.

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How HOW, is it possible that this thread went THIS, long with out this Family Guy clip???

If its good for Chester its good for me.

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[quote]Pootie Tang wrote:
How HOW, is it possible that this thread went THIS, long with out this Family Guy clip???

If its good for Chester its good for me.[/quote]

I was going to mention that clip too. Funny as hell.