Being a Newb

Training
21

[quote]flch95 wrote:
Hey now you guys are confusing me, lol. What ever happened to the “less is more”, “3 day/week fullbody/compound lift only, no isolation” crowd? Now you’re saying more volume in the beginning as well? If the “less is more” doesn’t work, why is it written about so much? Has this worked for anyone? Seems most of the people that made great progress here are talking about 5 days/wk.[/quote]

That TBT 3x week is still fine imo, I think part of it is about getting the newb immersed in the goals and the environment that can support it, at least I read it that way to some extent. Also there are lots of good program’s for 4,5 days too with similar no nonsense approaches

22

[quote]flch95 wrote:
Hey now you guys are confusing me, lol. What ever happened to the “less is more”, “3 day/week fullbody/compound lift only, no isolation” crowd? Now you’re saying more volume in the beginning as well? If the “less is more” doesn’t work, why is it written about so much? Has this worked for anyone? Seems most of the people that made great progress here are talking about 5 days/wk.[/quote]

I never understood the “less is more” thing.
No it’s not.
More is more.
That’s why it’s called more and not less.

23

[quote]flch95 wrote:
Hey now you guys are confusing me, lol. What ever happened to the “less is more”, “3 day/week fullbody/compound lift only, no isolation” crowd? Now you’re saying more volume in the beginning as well? If the “less is more” doesn’t work, why is it written about so much? Has this worked for anyone? Seems most of the people that made great progress here are talking about 5 days/wk.[/quote]

“Less is more” is for people who want to look like less than more.

24

I still consider myself a newb, but I’ll say I highly underestimated the importance of my diet and just winged it for a long ass time. End result, well over 8 months wasted. I also wish I had spent my money buying meat instead of supps. I REALLY screwed up when it came to protein specifically.

25

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]flch95 wrote:
Hey now you guys are confusing me, lol. What ever happened to the “less is more”, “3 day/week fullbody/compound lift only, no isolation” crowd? Now you’re saying more volume in the beginning as well? If the “less is more” doesn’t work, why is it written about so much? Has this worked for anyone? Seems most of the people that made great progress here are talking about 5 days/wk.[/quote]

“Less is more” is for people who want to look like less than more.[/quote]

Agree. Flch, the fullbody 3x type routines are not made to be ‘less is more’, they are made to to actually increase frequency and be more of ‘more in less time’ if that makes sense.

a 3x full body routine has you hitting chest/back/legs 3 times a week. That is not less.

26

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]flch95 wrote:
Hey now you guys are confusing me, lol. What ever happened to the “less is more”, “3 day/week fullbody/compound lift only, no isolation” crowd? Now you’re saying more volume in the beginning as well? If the “less is more” doesn’t work, why is it written about so much? Has this worked for anyone? Seems most of the people that made great progress here are talking about 5 days/wk.[/quote]

“Less is more” is for people who want to look like less than more.[/quote]
Haha, well it’s definitely looking like this is the case, lol.

27

I agree with a newb lifting more often then not, like 5x a week, maybe even 6. I wrote this in another thread but…

If I were just starting training ALL over again, and KNEW my goals were aesthetics, I would definitely emphasize

-Upper Chest
-Lat Width
-Medial Delts
-Quad Sweep

I’d still focus on those Big Lifts to get strong, but I would DESTROY those above, so at least my ‘dominant’ points would likely be those ‘trouble’ areas for people trying to get a solid X-frame.

I think that would be good as opposed to trying to play ‘catch up’ later. lol

I’d also say diet would just be 1g/lb BW, everyday. Make the guy count calories, and add 300 every week until they were gaining at about a 1lb a week or so.

28

Honestly what stronghold posted in a similar thread is exactly what I’d recommend to a friend just starting.

Take a few weeks to unfuck mobility, do stuff like goblet squats, pushups etc. Then starting strength (with arms and more back work thrown in) milk that as far as they can and if they want to go on to strenght goals something like texas method or madcows or switch to a more bodybuilding split (not the outdated bodypart once a week nonsense) something like push pull legs or upper lower.

29

At best, I consider myself an intermediate lifter. Maybe. Anyways, what I did to go from a pathetic 170-ish guy at 6’1" to a current 240-ish was as follows:

First, I really took the time to find my “sweet spots” for all the main lifts. Meaning, I decided whether or not high-bar and close stance or low-bar and wide stance on squat worked most for me. Things like that. This meant that my workout was centered around progressing on the compound movements: Squat, Bench, Deadlift, and Press. I did Starting Strength for many months. I know some seem to look down on the program, but it worked for me.
Second, I moved on to a more advanced progression program when it became too taxing to try and increase weight in three big lifts a day. This was 5/3/1 for me. I stayed with this long enough to get my strength levels to a place that I was happy with before moving to a bodybuilding program.

Lastly, once I had figured out what type of training style worked for me, I chose a program that adhered to that style. For example, I have always preferred intensity over volume. I tend to agree that it is best to pick just a few exercises for each body-part and hammer the hell out of them. Quality over quantity. This lead me to adopting DC as my current training program. I had done massive amounts of research on it and found that it definitely suited my interests.

The way that I went about training could have been better, of course. However, it’s the journey, right? Focusing on the compound lifts taught me the value of simplicity in regards to the iron game. People try and make this shit rocket science when it isn’t. Just get in, do your thing, and make sure that by the time you leave the gym you know that you’ve used your time wisely.

Now, as far as nutrition goes, I admit that I was a bit lax at first. I just fucked around like many of us do, spinning my wheels, and going nowhere. Finally, once I realized that sacrifices needed to be made outside of the gym as much as in, I began to grow. I can’t tell you how many times I ate until feeling sick. My buddies joked around that I had to hibernate like a bear after eating, because I literally ate until it made me tired and I had to pass out for a bit. I have, for a long time, utilized milk in my growing endeavors. I love milk. I love what it does to the body. I did GOMAD for quite some time. I know people talk shit on GOMAD, but I just saw it as drinking a fuck-ton of milk to get that weight up.

Now, I have a bit more fat than I’d like, so I am tailoring my diet to handling that. I drink 1% now and stick to lean protein sources such as fish, chicken, etc. I’m not afraid to eat burgers every now and then, but I don’t make them the cornerstone of my diet. I use protein powder when I need to, but I don’t use it as a crutch. I take a multivitamin, fish oil, and that’s about it. I’m not sure what else to add, but I’m sure I’ll think of more later.

30

What all is the topic of this discussion? There seems to be multiple things going here?

31

Consistency, intensity, and nutrition.That’s the ticket.
Train heavy, hard, and often, eat enough to recover, simple.

Lets go a bit further:
Squats, presses at various angles, pulls at various angles, and a hinge variation of some sort, I like Snatch Grip Deadlifts, personally.
Curls too, everyone can use bigger guns. Throw in some GPP work, and you’ve got a program fit for just about anyone.

Frequency and volume depends on goals and the noobs schedule, but more is better. Always.
I might have a set split, probably push, pull, legs, but more likely is that I’d prioritize weaknesses on a week to week, month to month basis. So one week could be four days of squatting if that was my noobs weakness, could also be four days with four different types of press, all depending on what I’m trying to specifically accomplish.

In my experience though, the important part of coaching is the hands on portion, sets and reps are easy, but it is pivotal you teach a noob HOW TO LIFT. Explosive concentrics, controlled eccentrics, proper posture, technique, and the ability to reach vital positions have to take precedent over simply “doing more.”

Really, I train noobs just like everyone else, it’s often just more volume due to lighter weights, and a lot more teaching.

32

Its always easier to increase your commitment gradually as you start seeing results than go 0-100. Same with dieting- take someone very fat and cut them to 2k calories a day, see how long they stick to that…

Other than that not sure the point of this thread. It takes time to learn anything, hence the term beginner…

33

[quote]Mtag666 wrote:
Honestly what stronghold posted in a similar thread is exactly what I’d recommend to a friend just starting.

Take a few weeks to unfuck mobility, do stuff like goblet squats, pushups etc. Then starting strength (with arms and more back work thrown in) milk that as far as they can and if they want to go on to strenght goals something like texas method or madcows or switch to a more bodybuilding split (not the outdated bodypart once a week nonsense) something like push pull legs or upper lower.[/quote]

I totally agree with that.
It seems most other posts assumed the goal is to get big.

There should be a place to mention train smart. Do not believe the gain 60 ppounds fast.

34

Whether you prefer a 3x per week approach to training, or a 6x per week approach to training, it’s all about consistency, hard work, dieting, and preventing injury. There is a lot of conflicting information out there, i.e. “Why Working Out 3 Times a Week is Superior to Working Out 6 Times a Week” and vice versa. This causes a lot of confusion for a beginner, and leads to inconsistent training and jumping back and forth between different routines. The one thing to remember when you are a newb is that it’s all about consistently training, consistently getting stronger, and consistently getting bigger, and/or consistently getting closer and closer to your goal.

My advice for the newbs out there:
Find a decent routine, stick to it until you stop seeing results (give it some time, don’t give up because you didn’t get huge in one week), and stop overthinking everything.

35

Consistency in diet and training are the primary focus. No supplements. Whole foods. Focus each workout on at least one compound exercise that is focused on strength with good form. But time should also be taken to develop an Mmc with each muscle. I neglected this and regret it. Don’t be afraid to do cardio.

36

Some beginners have such a low work capacity that they can’t endure a highly intensive 60 to 90 minute workout, let alone five of them in one week.

And I believe there are different types of beginners. There are beginners who are naturally muscular and/or athletic and coordinated, who can build up their fitness and strength levels and learn exercise form very quickly and soon more onto an intermediate upper-lower or bodypart split. Then there are beginners who have little fitness experience of any sort and/or are uncoordinated and nebbishy and will likely have to spend more time on a noob program.

I’ve always been of the school of thought that progresses from a full body program with little volume per lift and/or bodyparts at each workout and progressing to an upper-lower split while adding more volume per lift and bodypart, and then finally after a great deal of strength and muscle are built to polish off the physique and make further progress. This is for bodybuilding that is. Most powerlifting programs are a variations of an upper-lower split and many gym rats who aren’t concerned with “capped delts”, “thigh sweep”, and “teardrops” and other details and just want to be big and strong can stay on a full body or upper-lower split indefinitely.

A noob can start out on full body program with a handful of exercises with a relatively high amount of sets per exercise, a la Bill Starr or Starting Strength or one of Chad Waterbury’s or Casey Butt’s beginner programs, or use some program that has a lot of exercises (7 to 10) with a small amount of sets per exercise (1 to 3), like a HIT or HST or ACSM guidelines workout.

We also have to take into account what exactly some skinny, inexperienced noob is gonna do with a 5 day regimen. Usually such regimens have a low frequency, when a beginner will do better with size and strength with a high frequency. They can’t even make much of an inroad into their recovery or the compensation curve that they will need a low to moderate frequency.

37

I never got the whole “less is more” thing either considering there are times when to progress someone will need… uh… MORE than what they were doing before! With that said, I don’t see a need for anyone but the most advanced or those who compete in bodybuilding to weight train 5 to 6 times a week. Four times a week is enough for most, I believe.

I’ve heard some of John Meadows’ programs have seven days of lifting per week, and although I love the gym and exercising (I lift or do something else 6 days a week), I can’t see myself only lifting seven days in a row without snapping mentally or physically.

38

[quote]BrickHead wrote:
I never got the whole “less is more” thing either considering there are times when to progress someone will need… uh… MORE than what they were doing before! With that said, I don’t see a need for anyone but the most advanced or those who compete in bodybuilding to weight train 5 to 6 times a week. Four times a week is enough for most, I believe.

I’ve heard some of John Meadows’ programs have seven days of lifting per week, and although I love the gym and exercising (I lift or do something else 6 days a week), I can’t see myself only lifting seven days in a row without snapping mentally or physically. [/quote]

Frequency can also change when you are enhanced with lots of chemicals.

39

Less is more, as in, pressing instead of pec-deck, extensions, and raises.
Squatting instead of leg extensions, leg curls, and pull throughs.
Sprinting instead of steady state cardio.
Heavy rowing instead of pull aparts, curls, and forearm work.

Training economy is another term I’ve heard.

That was my understanding of the term “less is more.”

I mean, who would really think working less would equate to more results?
Unless you we’re overtraining, but, that’s pretty tough to do given certain prerequisite recovery needs are met.
Like, really tough. Unless the noob is an older lifter.

40

I guess you could say I’m in the crowd who endorses starting off 3 days a week. It’s in fact how I started for my first year of lifting actually.

I fucked around in college in the gym training 5-6 days a week and never made the progress I made when I switched to 3 days a week. For me it was a slap in the face regarding intensity. Train 3 days a week and you sure as hell learn how to make the most out of those days because you only get 3. Eventually 3 became 4 became 5 and is now 6 and at times 7. Good times.

But yes, learning how to GET MORE OUT OF LESS (seems some are confusing this concept in here) was a very valuable lesson learned. Later on it leads to getting more out of more!

Prof X talks about results. What if someone finds they get more results out of training fewer days? Some guys like to train with retarded levels of intensity like Meadows. How else would a program like DC be born?