Avoiding Muscle Loss on the Arms

Training Bodybuilding
41

[quote]Professor X wrote:
dropshot001 wrote:
Sick Rick wrote:
dropshot001 wrote:
Carlitosway wrote:
dropshot001 wrote:
i would try to up my rowing and pressing movements ad those will be the exercises that put the most “pressure” on the bis and tris (and shoulders)
sigh here we go again…

seeing as i’m new i’m a bit confused about the reactions/responses to my post. anyone care to explain?

Back exercises are called BACK exercises for a reason. They work your back. If they would work your biceps directly, they’d be called bicep exercises. Doing pulling and pushing exercises won’t get your arms up to par, unless those pulling and pushing exercises are called curls, dips and close grip bench presses.

alright, i see your point. but why is it that the biggest people with the biggest biceps/triceps have some amazing pressing/rowing power? i mean, what will work your biceps, even if it is indirect more: rowing 315 for 10 or bb curling 115 for 10? obviously its the rowing, the bicep has to stay engaged, even if indirect, for 10 reps with heavier weight than with the 115 even though the 115 is a “direct” exercise.

its the same concept as why powerlifters have such big tris. they rarely do direct tri work, or at the very least, their direct tri work is significantly less than what a bb’er does, but they get big tri’s by working them indirectly through board presses, benching, etc.

This is getting retarded. I’m a big guy. I can row much more than the 315lbs you just spoke of. I also train biceps directly. Why the hell do some of you think in such a limited fashion that you believe this is some type of “either or” situation where you either row OR curl but never both?

I used to train with powerlifters…who also fucking trained biceps and triceps directly. That may be why they were so fucking huge.

Again, please post pics of your own well developed arms that you do not train directly.[/quote]

This be true. I for years have done Crossfit and made pretty significant gains in size and strength (once I started eating like a mad man - another story though). However, when I started focusing on strength skills like the one arm pull up I found my biceps were the limiting factor. I didn’t stop doing weighted pull-ups, etc. But I did start doing…CURLS. Yes, I said I did curls! It made all the difference in the world. I hit them hard with preacher curls, barbell curls, curls of every kind. Result, bigger biceps – and a one arm pull-up. So direct work can make you stronger and we know certainly does make you bigger. There is a place for all of it, depending on your goals.

42

“we all know how how much harder it is to cut than to bulk”
Really? I have found it much harder to put on weight than to lose fat. Sure its easier to put on fat, but to put on good quality muscle I find it much harder

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[quote]Getting Closer wrote:
“we all know how how much harder it is to cut than to bulk”
Really? I have found it much harder to put on weight than to lose fat. Sure its easier to put on fat, but to put on good quality muscle I find it much harder[/quote]

Cutting is fucking easy. I’m sorry (not really), but it is. It’s just not eating. I’m not eating right now. It just requires a certain amount of self control and discipline but no real physical effort.

I challenge anyone to “bulk” without putting out real physical effort. What you will wind up doing is not “bulking” but “getting fucking fat”. I guess we should be specific and say “add on appreciable muscle mass while not gaining a ludicrous amount of fat” instead of “bulking”.

I’ve done it, I know.

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[quote]conorh wrote:
Cutting is fucking easy. I’m sorry (not really), but it is. It’s just not eating. I’m not eating right now. It just requires a certain amount of self control and discipline but no real physical effort.

I challenge anyone to “bulk” without putting out real physical effort. What you will wind up doing is not “bulking” but “getting fucking fat”. I guess we should be specific and say “add on appreciable muscle mass while not gaining a ludicrous amount of fat” instead of “bulking”.

I’ve done it, I know.[/quote]

lol. i’d like to think i know a thing or two about bulking

45

i also have tried my hand at ‘cutting up’

it’s fucking hard. i think maybe i got a tad leaner than i did in this picture, and that was about it. haven’t tried it since.

IMO, it is MUCH harder to get ripped and cut up, than it is to get big and strong.

46

[quote]HolyMacaroni wrote:
conorh wrote:
Cutting is fucking easy. I’m sorry (not really), but it is. It’s just not eating. I’m not eating right now. It just requires a certain amount of self control and discipline but no real physical effort.

I challenge anyone to “bulk” without putting out real physical effort. What you will wind up doing is not “bulking” but “getting fucking fat”. I guess we should be specific and say “add on appreciable muscle mass while not gaining a ludicrous amount of fat” instead of “bulking”.

I’ve done it, I know.

lol. i’d like to think i know a thing or two about bulking[/quote]

Then you should know. Should I post pics too?

Dieting takes self control but it is not that damn hard. The hardest part of dieting…is dealing with losing some muscle fullness and size, not the work effort.

I mean, look at this site alone. There are TONS of people who have dieted down and lost fat. How many have gained 100lbs of muscle?

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Putting on muscle is far harder than losing fat. Just ask Subway Jared.

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Let’s not forget time-frames

cutting up can vary from 8-16 weeks for most people

bulking up to gain significant size takes that many months leading to years

i really don’t get how anyone can say dieting is harder compared to bulking

49

[quote]forlife wrote:
Putting on muscle is far harder than losing fat. Just ask Subway Jared.[/quote]

And Richard Simmons.

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The only thing I can say for dieting is that you have to be more precise.

Bulking is simpler but adding muscle is definitely harder than losing fat.

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It’s easy to say for naturally lean/skinny people that dieting is WAY easier than bulking. That is simply not true for many people.

52

[quote]Josh Rider wrote:
It’s easy to say for naturally lean/skinny people that dieting is WAY easier than bulking. That is simply not true for many people.[/quote]

Please. How many of those people have also gained a very large amount of muscle? Most of the people you are speaking of are either beginners or sedentary. There are many pro bodybuilders who manage to get lean in spite of not being naturally lean. Trey Brewer is one. Even Cantopini(sp?) is another.

53

This is just getting to be semantics. For me getting fatter is way easier than getting skinnier. I don’t have experience in adding muscle so I will not comment on that.

Jarod and Richard Simmons are not “cut”. They are just not obese. Is there a difference? Yes.

I lost weight and Stu/Hussayn lost weight. Is there a difference? Hell Yes.

I gained weight (in the past) and Mac/Prof. X gained weight? Is there a difference? HELL YES.

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[quote]hawaiilifterMike wrote:
This is just getting to be semantics. For me getting fatter is way easier than getting skinnier. I don’t have experience in adding muscle so I will not comment on that.

Jarod and Richard Simmons are not “cut”. They are just not obese. Is there a difference? Yes.

I lost weight and Stu/Hussayn lost weight. Is there a difference? Hell Yes.

I gained weight (in the past) and Mac/Prof. X gained weight? Is there a difference? HELL YES.
[/quote]

I can’t even begin to comment on this. You really felt the need to point out that there’s a difference between adding fat and adding muscle?

Well thank you, I was unaware.

55

hey man, i thought bulking was all about becoming a BEEEFCAKEEEEEEEEEE

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[quote]LankyMofo wrote:
The only thing I can say for dieting is that you have to be more precise.

Bulking is simpler but adding muscle is definitely harder than losing fat.[/quote]

x2

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[quote]Professor X wrote:
Josh Rider wrote:
It’s easy to say for naturally lean/skinny people that dieting is WAY easier than bulking. That is simply not true for many people.

Please. How many of those people have also gained a very large amount of muscle? Most of the people you are speaking of are either beginners or sedentary. There are many pro bodybuilders who manage to get lean in spite of not being naturally lean. Trey Brewer is one. Even Cantopini(sp?) is another.[/quote]

Evan Centopani

but yeh … he’s a perfect example to show newbies that some people need to be a certain level of bodyfat to gain optimally

there was a video on MD about his off-season cooking and he eats very clean, lean meats, veggies, sweet potatoes, etc …

so i find it funny how some people just because someone isn’t under 10 or even 15% BF whilst bulking must be ‘dirty bulking’

as for dieting, in the video he goes “I gain it easy, but lose it easy too” however ‘easy’ for evan would be hard to most cos he loves what he does and doesn’t seem as much of an effort for him

58

It’s a little late to be working on the beach muscles…

59

just another 2cents. I agree with Waylanderxx, voting against traditional cutting and bulking cycles only because I get too fat or lose too much muscle that was too hard to come by. Slow, steady, consistent hard work pays off. Clarence Bass advocates same in his “Ripped” books, just tweaking as you go (like adding 1 more egg to your breakfast a day and 1 tbsp peanut butter a day for a week and seeing the difference). I lose tons of size in my arms when I cut, but probably because I changed the workout around too much and didn’t eat enough and right macros.

For maintaining arm size, my only recommendation is that you follow X’s advice and train the arms directly, and separate them from chest/back, using those as indirect or “feeder” workouts. one good one is
mon chest/bis
tues quads/calves/abs
thur shoulders/tris
fri back/hams/abs
that way you are hitting them 2x a week, once directly, once indirectly.

Ironically I was going to start a more traditional strength routine like Rippetoe’s starting strength with less direct arm work, thanks counting beans for the heads up, I will continue to include direct arm work.

60

[quote]HolyMacaroni wrote:
i also have tried my hand at ‘cutting up’

it’s fucking hard. i think maybe i got a tad leaner than i did in this picture, and that was about it. haven’t tried it since.

IMO, it is MUCH harder to get ripped and cut up, than it is to get big and strong.[/quote]

i’m with you on that one. i tried getting ‘ripped’ before too. fuck my life what a fail.

maybe next time i’ll have better results given i have a better head on my shoulder now in regards to dieting and training whilst dieting.