I read and saw earlier today that some news people were already calling it a video-game induced slaughter, before any facts had been released.
It is a horrible horrible tragedy though, regardless of the cause. I am dreading the incoming fear-mongering, blaming, media whoring by so-called experts.
[quote]Ren wrote:
I read and saw earlier today that some news people were already calling it a video-game induced slaughter, before any facts had been released. [/quote]
Isn’t it disgraceful that when things like this happen people immediately look for ways to use it to further their own agendas.
I’m sure he played videogames. Everyone I know plays videogames.
Videogames are not the problem. It’s all the guns in your society as well as the mentality that it’s a way to solve problems. But I’m sure that 90% of people would never dream of doing something like this.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
jjoseph_x wrote:
<<< Only you paraphrased the quote and got its meaning completely wrong: >>>
Yes, I cited it from memory, forgive me Ben. I consider the “right to keep and bear arms” an essential freedom as did the founders of this country. If someone were to actually to read what they said it would be revealed that the 2nd amendment was added to the constitution as a measure to prevent tyranny.
In other words to ensure that the citizenry had a way to protect itself against governmental oppression such as what they had just fought to be free from. This raises a bunch of other modern twists that will not be solved here.
In any case, we may not agree, but you seem a decent, level headed feller which is appreciated.[/quote]
It’s always good when people can have a good, civil, disagreement… there’s nothing wrong with sharing differing points of view.
I used to be more anti-gun, until I had a conversation with a police officer in Wisconsin. We chatted for a bit, and I started to undertand better why people would want to arm themselves.
But, as for the citizenry, they won’t be able to protect itself from the goverment unless they had the same kinds of weapons… which they don’t (a cruise missle always beats Glock).
Still it’s in the constitution so guns aren’t going anywhere.
While I’m not crazy about guns, you can’t just blame the problem on the guns… If a guy wants to kill people, he’ll find a way (plowing your car into a student really could kill more than 33 people).
Also drunk drivers probably a fair amount of people each year, that doesn’t mean that you should ban alcohol.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
Professor X wrote:
<<< Again, if he was an illegal immigrant, would this be the fuel for more laws against them? If so, why would this be the major factor as if there are no individuals and everyone’s actions are a representation of their entire race?
The person’s race is irrelevant. The fact that they were in this country illegally, if they were, is not.
How do you have more laws against people who’s very presence here is already illegal? I don’t care what color ya are… or where ya come from, but it is outrageous that I, as a natural born citizen, am bound on pain of prosecution to obey our laws and someone who shows up on an inner tube or sneaks over a border is not.
It is also unjust to those who do seek to come here by the rules.
Check the FBI statistics on violent crime committed by illegal aliens of whatever race. It’s bad enough when our own citizens want to kill or rape us. Are we further obligated to house the rest of the worlds butchers?
This has nothing to do with race… not to me.[/quote]
This shooter apparently came here LEGALLY from China (at least according to what I just heard). I am still asking how this shooting, if performed by an illegal immigrant, would mean ANYTHING as far as illegal immigrants are concerned. What difference would it have made if the shooter was straight from Mexico?
[quote]SWR-1240 wrote:
I won’t go into a schpiel about how revenge won’t solve anything, but to go after and kill their relatives, who may have had absolutely nothing to do with it, would make the authorities as bad and as wrong as the shooter.
In my opinion, I think just getting the person off of the face of the Earth as quickly and inexpensively as possible is the best answer. A bullet to the head or a mask full of lethal gas works well enough for me.
No long, drawn out appeal after appeal, unless they’re not sure who really did it. [/quote]
Total agree about executing as soon as possible. I don’t agree with the quick part. I think they should be made to suffer as long as possible. One idea I have is to strap them to a table and inject that flesh eating bacteria into their big toes and let them lay there and suffer.
Or, you could take them out into the desert, cut off their eyelids (so the sun burns their eyes out) and stake them to the ground face up for three days. On the fourth day, cover them in syrup and pour fire ants all over him, but get the ants off of him before they have a chance to kill him. Let him lay there for another two days. On the seventh day, cover him in kerosene (b/c it burns slower) and set the mother fucker on fire. Maybe if we did this instead of letting people flounder around in jail for years, then it may make some of these assholes think twice about doing such horrible acts.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Tiribulus wrote:
Professor X wrote:
<<< Again, if he was an illegal immigrant, would this be the fuel for more laws against them? If so, why would this be the major factor as if there are no individuals and everyone’s actions are a representation of their entire race?
The person’s race is irrelevant. The fact that they were in this country illegally, if they were, is not.
How do you have more laws against people who’s very presence here is already illegal? I don’t care what color ya are… or where ya come from, but it is outrageous that I, as a natural born citizen, am bound on pain of prosecution to obey our laws and someone who shows up on an inner tube or sneaks over a border is not.
It is also unjust to those who do seek to come here by the rules.
Check the FBI statistics on violent crime committed by illegal aliens of whatever race. It’s bad enough when our own citizens want to kill or rape us. Are we further obligated to house the rest of the worlds butchers?
This has nothing to do with race… not to me.
This shooter apparently came here LEGALLY from China (at least according to what I just heard). I am still asking how this shooting, if performed by an illegal immigrant, would mean ANYTHING as far as illegal immigrants are concerned. What difference would it have made if the shooter was straight from Mexico?[/quote]
it shouldn’t. its faulty logic to link the two.
here’s our good friend bill o’reilly using a drunk diving case to further his talking points. the principle is exactly the same as the issue in discussion.
also, why am i not surprised that all the pro-gun/anti-gun folks are using this event to further their agendas? it seems every time a gun crime comes up, camp A claims that all problems could have been prevented if everyone had a gun, while camp B alleges the crime was impossible if guns were not so readily available. cut it out and have some sympathy for these kids ffs.
[quote]SWR-1240 wrote:
What does everyone think about all the media attention these shootings get?
We have a right to know about it, but is if over-glorified?
What about the loser kid who’s parents never paid attention to him, and who gets picked on all through his grade-school and high-school life?
He sees all of this attention that the gunman is getting, gets the idea from seeing it, and has a vendetta against everyone in his school (in his mind), and he wants that attention.
Had he not seen all of the attention Columbine was getting, could it have made a difference?[/quote]
It depends on why he did it… either for attention or he just lost it and wanted to hurt people.
But the attention doesn’t help… if you’re a loner and you’re picked-on and your want to kill yourself… maybe if you see all of the attention that you’ll get and how your name will go down in infamy, maybe you decide to kill a few people too?
If these guys are ready to kill themselves, they probably don’t care if they take people with them.
For the media, it’s ratings for their news shows, so they’ll milk the coverage for all that they can.
Then they’ll bring in experts who’ll say that it’s because of guns, rap music, heavy metal, single mothers, video games, and violent movies.
[quote]obatiger11 wrote:
SWR-1240 wrote:
I won’t go into a schpiel about how revenge won’t solve anything, but to go after and kill their relatives, who may have had absolutely nothing to do with it, would make the authorities as bad and as wrong as the shooter.
In my opinion, I think just getting the person off of the face of the Earth as quickly and inexpensively as possible is the best answer. A bullet to the head or a mask full of lethal gas works well enough for me.
No long, drawn out appeal after appeal, unless they’re not sure who really did it.
Total agree about executing as soon as possible. I don’t agree with the quick part. I think they should be made to suffer as long as possible. One idea I have is to strap them to a table and inject that flesh eating bacteria into their big toes and let them lay there and suffer.
Or, you could take them out into the desert, cut off their eyelids (so the sun burns their eyes out) and stake them to the ground face up for three days. On the fourth day, cover them in syrup and pour fire ants all over him, but get the ants off of him before they have a chance to kill him. Let him lay there for another two days. On the seventh day, cover him in kerosene (b/c it burns slower) and set the mother fucker on fire. Maybe if we did this instead of letting people flounder around in jail for years, then it may make some of these assholes think twice about doing such horrible acts.
[/quote]
but some violent acts are impulsive. What if you come home from work and find your wife in bed with another (man, woman or beast) and kill them both? torture shouldn’t be justified for some crimes and not for others.
Whole lot of speculation at this point, from multiple gunmen to terrorist related.
I would think that part of prevention of another incident would be to inform the public on exactly what happened. What is taking so long?
Yea, either way, both sides defiently try to further their agendas. WHen you really look at it, no gun control law will matter, b/c they really aren’t enforced, and you are in effect, punishing many law abiding gun owners. On the other hand, getting rid of guns totally makes little sense too.
Canada probaly has more guns/population than america does. Yet , they have less shootings. I’m not saying college shootings don’t happen there, but it happens a lot less. The media also blows this out of proprtion. Soon, isntead of blaming video games , they’re gonna tell kids to not attend college.
[quote]archiewhittaker wrote:
but some violent acts are impulsive. What if you come home from work and find your wife in bed with another (man, woman or beast) and kill them both? torture shouldn’t be justified for some crimes and not for others.[/quote]
Thanks for NOTHING!!! That’s the kind of mentality that lets fuckers like Charles Manson sit on death row whistling Dixie, eating free meals, writing books, and watching free color TV. While those of us are out busting our assess each day working to pay tax dollars to support these shitbags all the while worrying about which future fuckup is going to shoot us in the fucking head for doing nothing but being honest, hard-working citizens.
Anyways if I caught my wife fucking another guy I would first break his back with a baseball bat and then crush every bone in his lower half so every time he took a step (if he ever could again) he would remember the mistake he made. As for her, I’d make her watch and tell her next time she gets the same!!!
[quote]meat1wad wrote:
This is no ones fault except the man who did the shooting.
Its not because guns are easy to get.
[/quote]
Sure, it’s not the gun’s fault insofar as a gun is an inanimate object - but if the availability of weapons is such that someone precipitating such an action can easily access a weapon then something needs to be investigated.
However, that is around process, nothing more.
I had to laugh at the person who said that it wouldn’t have happened if all the students staff etc were legally carrying…
No, what would have happened, if the person was seriously about going out in a blaze of glory/ suicidal etc would have been a firefight with people with no real training in firearms control being involved and heaps of collateral damage to bystanders from al;l the extra bullets flying around.
Can someone tell me if there is a requirement for someone purchasing a firearm to go through a firearms safety and usage course??
Errr no. These peopel had various forms of personality disorder, but were not insane - that would be why they ended up in prison and not in an asylym (They did try to play the insane card though).
Go to www.crimelibrary.com and read their serial killers section; you’ll see how few serial killers are genuinely insane.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
<<< This shooter apparently came here LEGALLY from China (at least according to what I just heard). I am still asking how this shooting, if performed by an illegal immigrant, would mean ANYTHING as far as illegal immigrants are concerned. What difference would it have made if the shooter was straight from Mexico?[/quote]
It wouldn’t have mattered if he came here straight from Ireland, or anywhere else. What WOULD have mattered is that he would’ve been yet another example of what happens when you don’t enforce anything even resembling sane immigration law, which the previously mentioned FBI stats generously illustrate.
If we had the same good sense policies that my great grandparents were subject to at Ellis Island when they came here from Hungary even legal immigrants would be much less likely to turn out to be murderous nut cases.
Again, I don’t care what color somebody is or where they come from. I do care that play by the same rules I’m subject to and that reasonable screenings are done to ensure, as best we can, that we aren’t welcoming homicidal monsters into our midst
[quote]obatiger11 wrote:
violent pleasantries
[/quote]
Do you know what impulsive means? Did you understand my post? I didn’t understand yours. What about color-TV??
[quote]AdamC wrote:
steadfastred wrote:
Its a shame that students and faculty are barred from pleading the 2nd on colleges in Virginia. The death toll could have been much lower, still a tragedy; we know now how many can die when people are prevented self defense:
32 innocent lives…
…And one room temperature wack-job who killed himself at the end.
Maybe I don’t get it because i’m British, but that point of view seems wacky to me.
Isn’t the fact that guns are so poorly controlled the reason some wacko can walk in to a school and fire a weapon and kill so many poor people?
Rather than arming everyone to the teeth shouldn’t you be trying to stop people getting hold of weapons so easily. Maybe it’s too late for that, i don’t know.
All i know is, I wouldn’t know where to get a gun and I have absolutely no fear of anyone pulling a gun on me.[/quote]
I’m not for strict gun regulation, but there’s no evidence that being armed for ‘self-defense’ saves any lives [except perhaps in an indiivual burglary situation and even there the evidence is questionable]. And logic dictates otherwise. When was the last time crossfire saved any lives?
[quote]jsbrook wrote:
AdamC wrote:
steadfastred wrote:
Its a shame that students and faculty are barred from pleading the 2nd on colleges in Virginia. The death toll could have been much lower, still a tragedy; we know now how many can die when people are prevented self defense:
32 innocent lives…
…And one room temperature wack-job who killed himself at the end.
Maybe I don’t get it because i’m British, but that point of view seems wacky to me.
Isn’t the fact that guns are so poorly controlled the reason some wacko can walk in to a school and fire a weapon and kill so many poor people?
Rather than arming everyone to the teeth shouldn’t you be trying to stop people getting hold of weapons so easily. Maybe it’s too late for that, i don’t know.
All i know is, I wouldn’t know where to get a gun and I have absolutely no fear of anyone pulling a gun on me.
I’m not for strict gun regulation, but there’s no evidence that being armed for ‘self-defense’ saves any lives [except perhaps in an indiivual burglary situation and even there the evidence is questionable]. And logic dictates otherwise. When was the last time crossfire saved any lives?[/quote]
If logic dictates otherwise, why do these shootings never happen at gun shows?
I’m sorry to hear this has happened again…it’s really sad that we have to deal with this kind of shit in life.
What’s mad, is that each time the shootings seem to be getting worse and worse - I just don’t know anymore. 
All foreigners who enter this country should have to provide documentary evidence of mental stability — letters from local officials showing no criminal record for one.
We are FAR too lenient in who we let into this country. A bunch of Somali Muslims in Minnesota voted a Muslim into our Congress. In 15 or 20 years, this dude will have seniority to sit on powerful committees. Where will his loyalties lie?
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
All foreigners who enter this country should have to provide documentary evidence of mental stability — letters from local officials showing no criminal record for one.
We are FAR too lenient in who we let into this country. A bunch of Somali Muslims in Minnesota voted a Muslim into our Congress. In 15 or 20 years, this dude will have seniority to sit on powerful committees. Where will his loyalties lie?[/quote]
To whatever company that sponsors his re-election…
Duh…
[quote]obatiger11 wrote:
I am losing faith in the goodness of mankind. Why would someone commit such an awful act? Maybe their should be a law that if you kill someone, you and both your parents will be executed. And if you don’t have parents, then your next two closest relatives will be executed. EXTREME-HELL YES!!! But if you are plotting to kill someone, then it may cause you to think twice about committing your own family to a death sentence. [/quote]
Amen. An eye for an eye plus an ear and a nose.