Article on Hardgainers

Bigger Stronger Leaner Competitive Bodybuilding
1

I am reffering to this one.

http://www.T-Nation.com/article/bodybuilding/all_hardgainers_are_not_created_equal

One of the best reads on this subject as it describes me to a T. I have read the solutions to overcoming this and making decent gains, however I thought it was a little vague. I have been training 8 years and tried tons of different routines, some recommended from supposed know it alls from the internet. I would purchase training and nutrition programs from them and they would never pan out. Some of these guys are natural pro bodybuilders.

I would like to see a full in depth discussion covering all the problems with being this kind of lifter. Only way I have ever made gains is using Prohormones. But within a few months the weight goes back to normal. Normal being 6’3" 210-215lbs 12%BF. At best I was 230 12%BF, I held that weight two times for about 12 weeks each time.

Sure everyone says your diet must be off, this is the response I have been getting from posting over the last 6 years in varios bodybuilding forums. I can post my diet and everyone will say it looks good. I read many different books on dieting and bodybuilding nothing ever really panned out. Most guys like me do not stay in bodybuilding because of its frustration, so thier are few who actually succeeded, if any are out there it would be nice for a contritbution of knowledge.

2

[quote]chainsaw1 wrote:
I am reffering to this one.

http://www.T-Nation.com/article/bodybuilding/all_hardgainers_are_not_created_equal

One of the best reads on this subject as it describes me to a T. I have read the solutions to overcoming this and making decent gains, however I thought it was a little vague. I have been training 8 years and tried tons of different routines, some recommended from supposed know it alls from the internet. I would purchase training and nutrition programs from them and they would never pan out. Some of these guys are natural pro bodybuilders.

I would like to see a full in depth discussion covering all the problems with being this kind of lifter. Only way I have ever made gains is using Prohormones. But within a few months the weight goes back to normal. Normal being 6’3" 210-215lbs 12%BF. At best I was 230 12%BF, I held that weight two times for about 12 weeks each time.

Sure everyone says your diet must be off, this is the response I have been getting from posting over the last 6 years in varios bodybuilding forums. I can post my diet and everyone will say it looks good. I read many different books on dieting and bodybuilding nothing ever really panned out. Most guys like me do not stay in bodybuilding because of its frustration, so thier are few who actually succeeded, if any are out there it would be nice for a contritbution of knowledge.[/quote]

For ~75% of the people, the diet sucks. No matter how good it looks or they say it is, there is usually some fundamental flaw in it. Most common mistake is lack of calories, followed by too long pauses between meals, not enough fat/carbs, breakfast too small, bad pre/post workout meal choices, lack of consistency, fail to count all the snacks/chocolate bars/etc, not knowing whether they are carb tolerant/intolerant and so on

For the rest, its either their lifestyle (the 23 hours not lifting per day have just as much if not a bigger impact on your body than the 1 hour lifting does), too much stress, not enough sleep, too much party/alcohol/weed/whatever

If thats not the case, it becomes real easy, because the last factor would be the workout itself. Aside from wrong set/rep schemes and poor exercise selection (bounce bench-momentum curls-37383 situps programs), people slack off while training. They are not pushing themselves enough, stop when it starts to hurt a little, making too long pauses, chatting for 15 minutes, whatever.

I have yet to meet my first hardgainer :slight_smile:

3

Whoever coined the term ‘hardgainer’ effectively gave everyone who doesn’t put in the time or effort to learn what to do, and actually push themselves to do it an easy all around excuse. People at my gym see the way I look now, and don’t realize that gaining a couple of lbs each year over 15 years is a damn slow process. However, if you’re not willing to put the time in, pick another pursuit and stop whining how you’re a ‘hard gainer’ because you can’t put on 15 lbs each year like your favorite prob BBer.

S

4

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
Whoever coined the term ‘hardgainer’ effectively gave everyone who doesn’t put in the time or effort to learn what to do, and actually push themselves to do it an easy all around excuse. People at my gym see the way I look now, and don’t realize that gaining a couple of lbs each year over 15 years is a damn slow process. However, if you’re not willing to put the time in, pick another pursuit and stop whining how you’re a ‘hard gainer’ because you can’t put on 15 lbs each year like your favorite prob BBer.

S
[/quote]

I agree, though there likely are actually people who would classify as “hard gainers” (such as people with protein wasting diseases, or other genetic defects which prevent their body from performing protein synthesis). But, those individuals are probably about as common as “easy gainers” (people with myostatin mutations or growth hormone conditions which allow them to grow big and strong without much if any effort).

This probably accounts for like .00001% of the population though, on both sides of the coin.

5

I’m still confused about what a “hardgainer” is. Is there an exact definition? That’s the problem…the term is pretty vague to begin with.

6

It’s getting to the point where I’m almost ready to expunge traditional bodybuilding terminology from my vocabulary due to lost understanding.

Even the word “progress” can be discussed for 3 pages before realizing that everybody is talking about something different.

Hardgainer has lost any usefulness it may have ever had.

7

hi im new been reading articles and post for a while tho,
I am a hardgainer, but only in the last year or so have a realized that just means i can eat a weight gainer shake 3 times a day and still have a six pack, I went from 135 to just over 175 and 185 was my heaviest. I started noticin gains with quality cuts of meat, weight gainers,eating in the middle of the night and not partying, hoping to be 200 in a couple years and still call myself a “hardgainer”

8 
I use to think i was a hard gainer. During High school i had the skinny body type. Then i went to college and i drank...alot...and started to get a bit of some love handles and could no longer see my abs! Furthermore, my diet and training knowledge back in high school/ college sucked. I just got back into working out and i have gained 9 lbs of muscle in 9 weeks. With the proper diet ( prolly could be even better but it is still solid), right exercises (compound movements, low reps or bust!), i have been seeing results like i never have before. I don't think i am a true ectomorph. No genes that my smart training can overcome.

ps. I also use a lean gainer shake twice a day (when i wake up, and after my work out)

9

[quote]Petrichor wrote:
chainsaw1 wrote:
I am reffering to this one.

http://www.T-Nation.com/article/bodybuilding/all_hardgainers_are_not_created_equal

One of the best reads on this subject as it describes me to a T. I have read the solutions to overcoming this and making decent gains, however I thought it was a little vague. I have been training 8 years and tried tons of different routines, some recommended from supposed know it alls from the internet. I would purchase training and nutrition programs from them and they would never pan out. Some of these guys are natural pro bodybuilders.

I would like to see a full in depth discussion covering all the problems with being this kind of lifter. Only way I have ever made gains is using Prohormones. But within a few months the weight goes back to normal. Normal being 6’3" 210-215lbs 12%BF. At best I was 230 12%BF, I held that weight two times for about 12 weeks each time.

Sure everyone says your diet must be off, this is the response I have been getting from posting over the last 6 years in varios bodybuilding forums. I can post my diet and everyone will say it looks good. I read many different books on dieting and bodybuilding nothing ever really panned out. Most guys like me do not stay in bodybuilding because of its frustration, so thier are few who actually succeeded, if any are out there it would be nice for a contritbution of knowledge.

For ~75% of the people, the diet sucks. No matter how good it looks or they say it is, there is usually some fundamental flaw in it. Most common mistake is lack of calories, followed by too long pauses between meals, not enough fat/carbs, breakfast too small, bad pre/post workout meal choices, lack of consistency, fail to count all the snacks/chocolate bars/etc, not knowing whether they are carb tolerant/intolerant and so on

For the rest, its either their lifestyle (the 23 hours not lifting per day have just as much if not a bigger impact on your body than the 1 hour lifting does), too much stress, not enough sleep, too much party/alcohol/weed/whatever

If thats not the case, it becomes real easy, because the last factor would be the workout itself. Aside from wrong set/rep schemes and poor exercise selection (bounce bench-momentum curls-37383 situps programs), people slack off while training. They are not pushing themselves enough, stop when it starts to hurt a little, making too long pauses, chatting for 15 minutes, whatever.

I have yet to meet my first hardgainer :)[/quote]

Maybe the term hardgainer is a little missused. Maybe I am just max out on my potential, and a subject of poor genetics. When I left boot camp 8 years ago I was 6’3" 165lbs I was 170 when I went in. I carried that weight for about 5 months until I started lifting. I made it to 215 in under a years time, pretty good. In the following years I was more refining my frame better muscular development, more leaness. But I am still stuck on that weight. I used PH and got up to 230 and still pretty lean 10% BF but that weight came back down. I up my calories but I just got soft.

I am judging my progress off of others. Guys who I lift with. Guys who smoke, drink, stay up to all hours at night partying. I am married with kids and the most I drink a year is maybe one or two occasions. I work in a prison and I see guys on a restricted diet, horrible food, no free weights just machines that are homemade and max out a 200lbs, look better than some so called bodybuilders.

Things I am still trying to learn now is about the carb sensitive I have never thought about that before and this article shead new light on that. Training routines are tough for me as well. I tried some of the more popular ones that are being used and they sucked. 5x5, Upper-Lower, Brawny Books, TUT. I am currently using PRRS I have been using it principles for the last 3 months but nothing worth noting. Sure my strength is up back if I stay on any routine my stength goes up according to the exercises.

I posted my diet on another thread I will paste it over hear but the main discussion is over thier in the article discussions.

10

[quote]chainsaw1 wrote:
In the following years I was more refining my frame better muscular development, more leaness. But I am still stuck on that weight. I used PH and got up to 230 and still pretty lean 10% BF but that weight came back down. I up my calories but I just got soft. [/quote]

Let me guess, you don’t think your focus on how lean you are has anything to do with why you aren’t gaining much weight.

11

[quote]Professor X wrote:
chainsaw1 wrote:
In the following years I was more refining my frame better muscular development, more leaness. But I am still stuck on that weight. I used PH and got up to 230 and still pretty lean 10% BF but that weight came back down. I up my calories but I just got soft.

Let me guess, you don’t think your focus on how lean you are has anything to do with why you aren’t gaining much weight.[/quote]

What do you mean? If I have anything going for me is that I can get very lean, I have 6 brothers and they all have the same build except they are like 23-30 lbs lighter than me but they are incredibly lean year round no matter what they eat. I don’t really focus on leaning out because I start to look real skinny. Plus I like to have size on me because of my job, its good to have weight on you when you have to through people around.

12

You said while pursuing more leanness you’re stuck at that weight.

As for this article, I would have preferred it to just not address the hardgainer debate at all.

From what you describe you ain’t no hardgainer (God, I hate even typing that word anymore) you just need more food. It doesn’t matter how much you eat now, you need more if you plan on gaining which I have no doubt you can still do.

13

[quote]chainsaw1 wrote:
Professor X wrote:
chainsaw1 wrote:
In the following years I was more refining my frame better muscular development, more leaness. But I am still stuck on that weight. I used PH and got up to 230 and still pretty lean 10% BF but that weight came back down. I up my calories but I just got soft.

Let me guess, you don’t think your focus on how lean you are has anything to do with why you aren’t gaining much weight.

What do you mean? If I have anything going for me is that I can get very lean, I have 6 brothers and they all have the same build except they are like 23-30 lbs lighter than me but they are incredibly lean year round no matter what they eat. I don’t really focus on leaning out because I start to look real skinny. Plus I like to have size on me because of my job, its good to have weight on you when you have to through people around.
[/quote]

Wow. What do I mean? I meant exactly what I wrote. You are so concerned with how lean you are that you won’t eat enough to grow. It is that simple. People like you blame every reason under the sun for their lack of progress BUT the one staring them right in the face.

14

I asked the question because I did understand the way you explained it first. I see what you are reffering to know. Staying leanhasn’t been a goal of mind I was just saying I stay naturally lean if I cut out my carbs and did cardio I would be down to 8% but I don’t do that because it waste muscle. My calorie intake according to fit day is about 4600, if I add my pre/postworkout drink it is around 5000.

Now if you read the article guys like me have a very hard time digesting food our GI is not that efficient. Anything above 5000 cals it really starts to become hardon digestion. I have tried different strategies to help with this. I tried not eating foods that contain fiber because fiber is hard to digest and would just make me feel full. I took a fiber supplement instead to get the daily amount of fiber needed in a day. I have swithced to a program where I only ate 4 times a day but used the same amount of calories, hoping this would lower my metabolism instead of the 2 hour feedings I am used to.

I know what you are saying “up your calories, and yes you will get fat but some of that will be muslce” I have tried that and yes I got fat. However I used that method, for about 4 months and seen my BF go from 12% to 16% I gained about 12 lbs (210-222) I stopped when I got sick. It was stripped off in a weak and half, was I left with some more muslce than before, I would say no. Was I stronger at that weight, certainly but pushing over 5000 cals with this type of body is incredibly hard. I know when I tried a cycle of PH my appetite went throught the roof. But I don’t want to take PH’s,PS’s,AAS just to get an appetite. I can go a day without eating and still not feel hungry.

I appreciate your comments.

15

[quote]chainsaw1 wrote:

Now if you read the article guys like me have a very hard time digesting food our GI is not that efficient.[/quote]

I haven’t read the article so my response is only based off of what you have written, but I take large issue with someone making a statement like that. Your body is adaptive. There isn’t one of us on the planet that could have jumped into eating 5,000cals a day without it being hard on our digestive systems. If someone is making a claim that people who have made more progress are doing so because they digest food better, I would call that claim false. I take that position because for most people, you will adapt and be able to digest more food if your body actually needs that much to grow on.

16

[quote]chainsaw1 wrote:
I asked the question because I did understand the way you explained it first. I see what you are reffering to know. Staying leanhasn’t been a goal of mind I was just saying I stay naturally lean if I cut out my carbs and did cardio I would be down to 8% but I don’t do that because it waste muscle. My calorie intake according to fit day is about 4600, if I add my pre/postworkout drink it is around 5000.

Now if you read the article guys like me have a very hard time digesting food our GI is not that efficient. Anything above 5000 cals it really starts to become hardon digestion. I have tried different strategies to help with this. I tried not eating foods that contain fiber because fiber is hard to digest and would just make me feel full. I took a fiber supplement instead to get the daily amount of fiber needed in a day. I have swithced to a program where I only ate 4 times a day but used the same amount of calories, hoping this would lower my metabolism instead of the 2 hour feedings I am used to.

I know what you are saying “up your calories, and yes you will get fat but some of that will be muslce” I have tried that and yes I got fat. However I used that method, for about 4 months and seen my BF go from 12% to 16% I gained about 12 lbs (210-222) I stopped when I got sick. It was stripped off in a weak and half, was I left with some more muslce than before, I would say no. Was I stronger at that weight, certainly but pushing over 5000 cals with this type of body is incredibly hard. I know when I tried a cycle of PH my appetite went throught the roof. But I don’t want to take PH’s,PS’s,AAS just to get an appetite. I can go a day without eating and still not feel hungry.

I appreciate your comments.[/quote]

proof read much?

17

sorry for the previous comment man. sorta; it just kills me to read stuff that is so grammatically botched up.

i too am a tall lean person; but i know that i wasn’t eating enough.

so i’m slowly adding calories to my diet to see how/when i react.

18

Chainsaw you said you can go all day without eating and not feel hungry, but your not eating because your hungry, your eating because your trying to get big right ? Am I right ? So that means you have to eat even when you dont feel like it.

19

[quote]triple-10sets wrote:
Chainsaw you said you can go all day without eating and not feel hungry, but your not eating because your hungry, your eating because your trying to get big right ? Am I right ? So that means you have to eat even when you dont feel like it. [/quote]

I eat on a somewhat loosely regimented schedule no matter what. Meaning I have food ready beforehand and eat at ABOUT the same times everyday. I don’t obsess over being off a bit here and there, but I never miss a meal and keep pretty much to that schedule at all times.

20

[quote]triple-10sets wrote:
Chainsaw you said you can go all day without eating and not feel hungry, but your not eating because your hungry, your eating because your trying to get big right ? Am I right ? So that means you have to eat even when you dont feel like it. [/quote]

True, yes you have to force feed. But I am comparing myself with most people I know that workout, it is easier for them of all my lifting buddies I am the only one who maintains a 4500-5000 cal diet. I wish I could get away with 3500 cals like most of the guys I workout with that is easy to eat in a day I wouldn’t have to force that down. Thanks for all your help guys, no I don’t proof read this is the internet so I will misssppell I am not turning this into my english teacher.