Right. There is no heavily muscled person that is weak.
This thread reminds me of the thread about a 600 deadlift being possible for all healthy men.
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That was a great thread.
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I still stand by that statement. Possible is not the same as probable!
Imagine we lived in a society where males were deemed worthless and decapitated if they didn’t achieve a 600lb deadlift by age 25. I imagine 600lb deadlifts would be quite common among men in the 20-25 range.
Back on topic, does anyone have an example of a muscular weakling?
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Some would be decapitated, but my feeling on it is a majority would pull 600. I also feel that AAS use would skyrocket if that policy were in place.
I will say body type plays into the deadlift a lot. Bench is largely influenced by body type, but in the opposite way of the deadlift. How about to make the decapitations fair to all body types it is deadlift and bench total at 900 lbs as the cutoff point (pun intended).
Surely if we’re discussing manliness and preventing decapitation we’ll use the overhead press rather than the bench, no?
Sorry, that will also be punishable by decapitation in the society I’m building.
Natty or nothing fellas. Make it happen. Or die on your knees. Choose wisely.
What total would you suggest? 900 for a strict over head press and deadlift total is pretty damn tough (the only people I currently know who can do this are on AAS).
Is that you King Leonidas.
I’d wager your typical adult Laconic male of that era could pull 400-500 lbs, without ever having seen a barbell.
That’s because the Spartans trained for strength, not bodybuilding.
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Not a good way to tell on that one. It seems like a pretty big lift for someone who has never done a deadlift. I would guess less than 5% of men now can pull 400 on their first try.
Nah. There’s plenty of hosses out there, and just big strong lads in addition to athletes and weakling bodybuilders who do not deadlift. I saw one of my gym denizens do it as I was unloading my barbell. With scattered plated and terrible form, he just bent over and stiff-legged it up with maximum back-rounding. It was one of the most cringe-worthy things I’ve seen in the gym, but he locked it out without working up to the weight at all.
He was about 6’1, 220 lbs or so, mostly bench and bicep kinda bro in his early 20’s with a max bench in the low 300’s. Small town that it is, I also had the pleasure of bouncing the largest man I’ve ever bounced on this guy’s behalf. This coked-up monster actually announced his intentions to beat this kid up as he was walking up to the door. He was expecting me to be excited for the spectacle, then got angry and confused when I denied entry.
I expect he could have deadlifted 405 pretty easily too.
May we live in interesting times…
Edit: A guy who has spent his entire life wrestling, running, training to fight with weapons, shields and armor and making that the focus of his being will be pretty strong. I think you have lots of 405-495 pullers among the ancient Spartan Hoplites. Probably some great physiques too.
Edit: I remember another guy who did it on his first deadlift workout. A guy about 6’00", 260lbs in my jiu jitsu class at the time. 405 no problem, on a really shitty bar too. No real background with strength training, just tradesman, jiu jitsu and big hoss strong.
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I’m sorry if this has been said already, I didn’t read through all the messages.
Anyway…
“Bodybuilders” is not a single person. You can’t generalize and say that all of them are weak, or not very strong, or whatever. You can say that all good bodybuilders have big muscles, because that’s pretty much what makes them bodybuilders in the first place.
And you can say that the strongest people are powerlifters (if we’re defining strength as “1rm on the big three”): that’s why they are powerlifters.
But bodybuilders don’t all train the same way, they probably don’t all eat the same way either; the only thing they have in common is they compete in bodybuilding (so they’re big, or whatever defines a good bodybuilder). Just like there are inhumanly strong powerlifters that are also very big, there are accomplished bodybuilders that are strong too.
Can we say bodybuilders, on average, aren’t strong? Compared to who? Compared to untrained people, or most people that train casually, the average bodybuilder is much stronger. If you take elite level powerlifters, maybe in their peak cycle, then of course bodybuilders tend to be weaker.
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I’m doubting 405 is done first time by more than 5 percent of makes without any training. Some will do it, I just feel they are outliers.
I have read that average men can expect to pull in the mid 100s on sites like livestrong. I feel that is probably too low, but 400 is a long ways away.
Depends on the population, but you’re probably right.
If we say 18-45 year old men with no disabilities in the USA, I’d say you’ve got quite a few out-of-the box 405 pullers.
I was 275 out-of-the-box.
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I don’t know where I was when I started as I did sets with about 225 for sets of 10 when I started. Probably in the low 300s if I had to guess.
To tie this back into the topic of the thread, it bears mentioning the relative rarity of people pursuing any of this stuff at even a semi-serious level. If this type of training was the norm for males a lot of these discussions would be very different.
Hence my question in this thread: Can someone name a muscular weakling? My best guess is still Fabio.
In the 600 deadlift thread, I posed a similar question: Who can say that they’ve trained seriously for a 600lb deadlift and fallen short? If so, how what deadlift did you end up with at what bodyweight?
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I train for strength. I have done 565, and was about an inch short of 585. I am built more for pressing. I am confident I’ll get past a 600 lb pull. Most likely this year.
Build is pretty important for this IMO. For people I know with about the same training time that have pulled 600 lbs and up, but are built for deadlift, I generally out bench them, but our push pull total is similar.
One individual I know pulls in the 900s, but only benches about 40ish pounds than I do.
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Then they would have thrown me down the Taygatos
I think you would believe in yourself more if you were properly motivated by fear of decapitation on your 25th birthday and had a lifetime to prepare for this crucial date.
Similar social ultimatums would give us better insight to what the average man could achieve physique-wise. Get a guy like @BrickHead in charge and we could end up needing a Natty Pro-Card physique (along with the 600lb deadlift, btw) before your 25th birthday or suffer the penalty of decapitation.
How common would such things be? How many severed heads? And, most importantly, how strong would this new breed of bodybuilders be?
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Well with such an incentive sure.
I mean I’m sure I could pull 600 if I would train PL for a few years, eat my face off and gain 60 lbs but I’m not going to do that ahah
That’s just the difference between possible and possible on your present terms.
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