An Example of Non-T Behavior

Off Topic
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[quote]Professor X wrote:
Joe Weider wrote:
ProfX, I don’t think I’ve seen your take on the potential/possible racial nature of the attack.
Where the girlfriend is clearly singling Joe out as “that white mother fucker” etc, what would have happened had the roles–and complexions–been reversed?

If you haven’t seen it, then you haven’t read this thread. We have already discussed that. You have obviously come in on the tail end of a discussion trying to point out fault. Too late. I already went down that road. What do you have to say to the issue I just brought up? Are you blind to that with only the sight to see one aspect in the thinking surrounding this incident?[/quote]

I’m not completely sure what you’re referring to, honestly.
If you’re talking about the guy that called that area of town “Little Africa” nudge wink, since we have input from a couple of other people who’re familiar with the area who say that it’s not like that and he’s from some ritzy-fitzy suburb somewhere, then I guess the answer has to be that the Little Africa guy obviously has an axe to grind, and it doesn’t seem to be a very appealing axe at that.
If he doesn’t know any better, that’s different. But it sure doesn’t sound like that’s the case.

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A quick dodge to the right as soon as the woman moved would have helped. Knowing that he attacked to the left from right, I would circle right towards the striking hand, hit low at the knees( big guys that come from the top NEVER cover the knees), and make it an out fight from there.Stay out of range and strike at only the most valuable targets.Break down the joints(knees), get a throat shot if possible, and get the hell out!

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Watching the video enraged me. If two guys start talking shit at each other and then get physical, and it’s a fairly even match, that’s one thing. This guy is a bully. I would have grabbed something solid and smashed him.

I like Larkin’s idea of the best defense being an attack (when you can’t run away). Just a guess, but 95% of people here in the US probably can’t really fight, so an aggresive attack will take care of things.
I really don’t have a clue, though. But I would have smashed that guy with something.

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Like the knees idea mindeffer…but imagine you were intervening- would you feel free to smash the guys knees to make him stop?

I am asking an honest question here. Does anyone have any highly effective ways to stop attackers without doing them lasting damage?

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Prof X, I think you have done a good job calling people on theri generalizations. And I’m really glad that you (having high status on this forum) have brought up the offensiveness of many of the things said in this thread. All the while, some people insist this was racism, that this was worse than Rodney King, and that all blacks should be put in prison so they can’t hurt our precious white children.

You think that last part is going to far? It hasn’t been said explicitly, but just take a look at these…

Now, why do you suppose they have to throw in “black” so many times? There is no need to use it to identify the guy, “the attacker” or “the huge guy” would work just as well. So why is race being mentioned so many times? Because like “vicious”, “savage”, “crazy” and “merciless”, the adjective “black” is used to denote that the person is exceptionally threatening. In fact, it’s usage suggests that being black is in itself an offense. As such, this thread has had racist undertones for quite some time.

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Despite the fact that, logically, and, in a combat situation, the best defense may be an attack, that does not apply in a civilian case such as this.

If the man with the cell phone had, for instance, turned and kicked the giant in the groin, gave him a good right hook, and gotten the hell out, then he would have been liable for assault under the law. Despite what he(or we in hypothetical situations) may know or think he knows is going to happen, that is not defensable in a court of law.

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I would tend to think a swift strike to the head would somewhat dizzy the large aggressor, (although I can’t be sure with all the adrenaline that would no doubt be flowing) and than since he looks more fat than built, a shove or hit to the knees would make him fall. I am assuming of course that he is top heavy and his legs won’t be quick or strong enough to stop his fall. But than again, I have never been in a situation like that…in fact never in a situation even resembling that. Makes you wonder if the old Tyler Durden saying is correct, “How
much can you know about yourself if you’ve never been in a fight?”

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I assume you’re talking about what I said. I was getting slightly off topic and was talking about the Larkin article. And don’t forget the first objective is to try and run.

[quote]Moon Knight wrote:
Despite the fact that, logically, and, in a combat situation, the best defense may be an attack, that does not apply in a civilian case such as this.

If the man with the cell phone had, for instance, turned and kicked the giant in the groin, gave him a good right hook, and gotten the hell out, then he would have been liable for assault under the law. Despite what he(or we in hypothetical situations) may know or think he knows is going to happen, that is not defensable in a court of law.[/quote]

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Two bullets, one for him and one for her; just what the doctor order and the world would be a better place.

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I’m not sure…why did she have to yell “white motherfucker” over and over?
That was my question to Prof X. Why couldn’t she just say “motherfucker”, and why can’t we just say “the big guy that beat the shit out of the other guy”?
On the other hand, perhaps simply noticing someone’s color isn’t racist?
That’s a real question, btw, one I’ve posed to other people including college professors over the years.

[quote]Aleksandr wrote:
Prof X, I think you have done a good job calling people on theri generalizations. And I’m really glad that you (having high status on this forum) have brought up the offensiveness of many of the things said in this thread. All the while, some people insist this was racism, that this was worse than Rodney King, and that all blacks should be put in prison so they can’t hurt our precious white children.

You think that last part is going to far? It hasn’t been said explicitly, but just take a look at these…

In no way do I want to take the big black coward’s side

I’d probably still be in shock if I watched some huge black dude stick up for his girlfriend

The guy on the phone should have started apologising as soon as he saw the massive black dude coming in.

Not true, because there will always be people like that big black dude that other countries will fear.

Now, why do you suppose they have to throw in “black” so many times? There is no need to use it to identify the guy, “the attacker” or “the huge guy” would work just as well. So why is race being mentioned so many times? Because like “vicious”, “savage”, “crazy” and “merciless”, the adjective “black” is used to denote that the person is exceptionally threatening. In fact, it’s usage suggests that being black is in itself an offense. As such, this thread has had racist undertones for quite some time.[/quote]

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[quote]Aleksandr wrote:
Prof X, I think you have done a good job calling people on theri generalizations. And I’m really glad that you (having high status on this forum) have brought up the offensiveness of many of the things said in this thread. All the while, some people insist this was racism, that this was worse than Rodney King, and that all blacks should be put in prison so they can’t hurt our precious white children.

You think that last part is going to far? It hasn’t been said explicitly, but just take a look at these…

In no way do I want to take the big black coward’s side

I’d probably still be in shock if I watched some huge black dude stick up for his girlfriend

The guy on the phone should have started apologising as soon as he saw the massive black dude coming in.

Not true, because there will always be people like that big black dude that other countries will fear.

Now, why do you suppose they have to throw in “black” so many times? There is no need to use it to identify the guy, “the attacker” or “the huge guy” would work just as well. So why is race being mentioned so many times? Because like “vicious”, “savage”, “crazy” and “merciless”, the adjective “black” is used to denote that the person is exceptionally threatening. In fact, it’s usage suggests that being black is in itself an offense. As such, this thread has had racist undertones for quite some time.[/quote]

I agree with you. I also know how people think and had this been mentioned before we covered the issue of her racial slur, many would have been completely blind to it. It doesn’t surprise me because any black person in America right now knows that racism isn’t dead…it has simply changed, gone underground, hidden itself behind different meanings and undertones, yet maintained its sting. Sometimes you have to let people see the words coming out of their own mouths formed by their own thoughts before they even realize there is a problem. I had an issue with several things mentioned in this thread, some of which you listed. I just held my tongue until that last one. His was probably the most blatant considering he actually thought that way of thinking was OK since other people in his suburban community spoke that way.

As far as this incident…due to the responses in this thread, now maybe some of you can understand the pressures on many black people in society today. I feel that my actions on a daily professional basis not only speak of me as a person, but for my entire race at times. That is because of the thought processes that occured in this thread. It seems to be some underlying complex that any negative action by a black person is representative of an entire race of people…instead of it being one person who did something wrong. Hopefully this brought at least some light to that to those who have previously acted as if there is no problem.

As far as the fat hoe and her even more rotund bodyfriend, they committed a crime. They need to be punished for it. To relate this crime to the Rodney King case is misguided and a failed attempt at trying to make it seem as if these actions are equally distributed throughout society. I personally disagree with that concept.

This entire incident has exposed many problems in society if people are willing to see ALL of them. The couple’s actions in the pizza place were not the only negative in that situation. Anytime a group of people that large resists responding to someone in need, it shows a huge problem with that society. Someone should have yelled. Someone should have screamed. But they did nothing…but watch. Then one guy even steps over the guy on the ground as if it is simply now time for pizza.

The bottom line is, the couple needs to go to jail. The pussies need to be exposed or their lack of action. People need to realize the differences in perception surrounding a crime when race issues are involved. If this had been a black on black crime…we never would have heard about it. That is the truth and something worth thinking about.

Oh, and while my mind is on it…has anyone wondered why those Amber Alerts seem to be so racially biased as far as the exposure they get? Gee, didn’t think so.

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[quote]Joe Weider wrote:
I’m not sure…why did she have to yell “white motherfucker” over and over?[/quote]

For the record, if “white motherfucker” is a racial slur, then there have been racial slurs all of the way through this thread. I never got the memo that stated, “If you mention a person’s skin tone before you call them a nasty name, it then becomes a racial slur”. Is Cajun Dumbass a racial slur? How about German Nitwit? Maybe Italian Fat ass? None of those are racial slurs, so why is “white motherfucker” now considered a racial slur?

Some of y’all can kiss my black ass. Whoops…I just insulted myself.

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JW, I don’t know why SHE said it, and I can’t ask her. But what’s going on here, it’s much more than “noting his race”. It is an adjective that evokes certain emotions and imagery, and they aren’t positive (I know this, because if they WERE positive, or neutral, it wouldn’t make sense in the context it’s being used in).

Further, to the people saying that if he (the attacker) were white, he would have been sentenced more harshly, that’s ridiculous. Not to get into who gets sentenced how, or who even gets arrested (racial profiling plays a huge part in this, I’m sure), let’s look at the US gov’s track record:

a) Groups, such as KKK do nothing but terrorize minorities, commit gruesome murders and repress human rights, nothing happens, except for the odd arrest if there is overwhelming evidence

b) Groups, such as the Panthers and the NOI try to teach self-defense, drug abstinence, feed the poor, and help their communities, and the government declares war on them. What follows is assassination, false arrests, disappearances and defamation.

But it takes a lot of balls to compare a beating in a pizza shop to the systematic racism shown by the LAPD, including brutalizing citizens, planting evidence and forcing false confessions. Although corruption and drug traffiking are probably the primary causes, racism has played a major part in the means employed. It must take brass balls to think you could pull off a comparison like that with no one noticing.

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ProfessorX-

Yhis will be the third time that this question has been asked of you, and the second time I have asked it. Please try and address it.

What would be your response if the colors were reversed? What if it was a 300-pound white-trash bubba, and a gnarly fat-assed white woman - you know the type if you’ve ever watched “Cops”? What if the victim was a normal sized black guy?

What if said white woman started yelling ‘you black motherfucker’ over and over?

What if the black guy was sucker punched and seriously injured by the big white bubba?

What would your reaction to that be? I say what happened was a hate crime, because I promise you if it had been a white piece of shit doing that to a black man, the white piece of shit would’ve done a hell of a lot more time than 4 years.

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First, those bystanders are a bunch of pussies. Second, IMHO this wasn’t a racial issue but more the actions of selfish, messed up people. Third, those bystanders are a bunch of pussies. Forth, those bystanders are a bunch of pussies. Fifth, those bystanders are a bunch of pussies…

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[quote]
As far as the fat hoe and her even more rotund bodyfriend, they committed a crime. They need to be punished for it. To relate this crime to the Rodney King case is misguided and a failed attempt at trying to make it seem as if these actions are equally distributed throughout society. I personally disagree with that concept.[/quote]

I would have to agree with you on the Rodney King issue. Why did that even get dragged into this, those were police officers that took an oath to protect and serve that ganged up on one man and sadisticly beat him because of his skin color.I don’t see any connection to this situation.
I think they were looking for trouble and anyone in that room could have gotten beat down for opening there mouth regardless of their race. Just a bad situation all around, all though after the first punch somebody should have done something to help.Its sad no one did anything it was like they were afraid to lose their place in line.

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[quote]rainjack wrote:
ProfessorX-

Yhis will be the third time that this question has been asked of you, and the second time I have asked it. Please try and address it.

What would be your response if the colors were reversed? What if it was a 300-pound white-trash bubba, and a gnarly fat-assed white woman - you know the type if you’ve ever watched “Cops”? What if the victim was a normal sized black guy?

What if said white woman started yelling ‘you black motherfucker’ over and over?

What if the black guy was sucker punched and seriously injured by the big white bubba?

What would your reaction to that be? I say what happened was a hate crime, because I promise you if it had been a white piece of shit doing that to a black man, the white piece of shit would’ve done a hell of a lot more time than 4 years.

[/quote]

I disagree with that (as far as how you seem to think a white offender would have been sentenced more harshly) because our own history shows otherwise. What happened to the cops originally in the Rodney King trial? On average far fewer whites get severely punished for the same crimes that are committed by blacks. I can’t believe that you see the judicial system differently.

As far as how I would feel, I would be just as enraged as I was when I saw the guy get beat up…only it would have an added offense due to the spin the media would probably attempt to put on it. That doesn’t mean it is a race crime and I have answered this already. If they had walked in and went straight for the white guy, THAT would be a race crime. What you have here is one crazy fat bitch going off on everyone, her huge boyfriend stepping up for her, and then taking advantage of what he clearly saw as weakness in his opponent. That is not a hate crime and if it were reversed, it would still not be a hate crime.

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[quote]Professor X wrote:
Joe Weider wrote:
I’m not sure…why did she have to yell “white motherfucker” over and over?

For the record, if “white motherfucker” is a racial slur, then there have been racial slurs all of the way through this thread. I never got the memo that stated, “If you mention a person’s skin tone before you call them a nasty name, it then becomes a racial slur”. Is Cajun Dumbass a racial slur? How about German Nitwit? Maybe Italian Fat ass? None of those are racial slurs, so why is “white motherfucker” now considered a racial slur?

Some of y’all can kiss my black ass. Whoops…I just insulted myself.[/quote]

Thing is, Prof, if it’s racist to refer to the big fat guy doing the hitting as “the big black guy” than it’s racist to call the white guy a “white mother fucker.”
I dont’ think noticing skin color is necessarily racist.

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[quote]Joe Weider wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Joe Weider wrote:
I’m not sure…why did she have to yell “white motherfucker” over and over?

For the record, if “white motherfucker” is a racial slur, then there have been racial slurs all of the way through this thread. I never got the memo that stated, “If you mention a person’s skin tone before you call them a nasty name, it then becomes a racial slur”. Is Cajun Dumbass a racial slur? How about German Nitwit? Maybe Italian Fat ass? None of those are racial slurs, so why is “white motherfucker” now considered a racial slur?

Some of y’all can kiss my black ass. Whoops…I just insulted myself.

Thing is, Prof, if it’s racist to refer to the big fat guy doing the hitting as “the big black guy” than it’s racist to call the white guy a “white mother fucker.”
I dont’ think noticing skin color is necessarily racist.
[/quote]

Gee, then that means it was not a race hate crime and any talk of it being related to Rodney King has been utter bullshit. Thanks for pointing that out.

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Rainjack, what if the supreme court had ruled that white people were never intended to be citizens, and therefore the constitution did not apply to them? What if white people had been enslaved for a few hundred years, then after “emancipation” whites were not only denied the vote (and if the got it, racist groups of blacks suppressed it, so it did not matter), but were falsely accused of murder, so as to be imprisoned and forced to work for free?

What if there had never been a white president, and the only whites in office were bafoons whose only job is to take the heat when something goes wrong? What if white people were forced into ghettos, denied opportunities, brutalized, incarcerated and ridiculed by the rest of society?

What if the white unemployment rate was nearly triple the black unemployment rate? What if white communities were intentionally flooded with drugs in order to destroy white nationalism? What if the government then declared a “war on drugs”?

In your hypothetical scenario, are all the above true also? I mean, if you are going to flip races in the situation, you have to go all the with it, or else it wouldn’t make any sense, would it?

My point is, don’t make it something it’s not. Like Prof X said, if it had been black on black, you never would have heard of it; the police would have probably decided it was a drug deal gone bad and that would have been the end of it.