I don’t care what anyone says about defensive training and mindset. It favors the young, male and in good shape. How does a woman defend herself against a guy like that…or his woman who in nearly as big as him!
They don’t. Nor do smaller men or the elderly. What defends them is the great equalizer as Mr. Wieder mentioned. A concealed pistol. It has a great deterrent effect and in the right hands is a useful tool. Darwinism at work would be that schmucko picking on someone, being warned and then being shot. End of story. Sorry but it is a tough world and wishing for a perfect society and politeness doesn’t work.
Gun Control is a fallacy and a failed one at that.
I’ve enjoyed reading the opinions of everyone on this issue. I live near where this happened and know some people involved. Couple things not mentioned in the articles from the paper explain the lack of reaction by the other patrons… this pizza place is right downtown in the bar hopping strip. Not a bad area, I walk around there by myself and I’m a small female. The bars were letting out and the patrons were mainly 19-20something guys, many college students, most intoxicated to some degree. The attorneys had diff using them as witnesses as a couple couldn’t even remember what they did that night.
What a small world… I was at the best buy in Parma, OH last night looking for a washer and dryer for one of my rental properties and who comes up to assist me? Joe Scarpino. Unbelieveable… We talked for about 20 minutes about what happened. What a small world.
Originally I found out about this on Friday night while reading T-Nation. I didnt know where the event had took place, but later that evening while watching the news I was stunned, well not really, to learn that it had occured in Akron, Ohio. Then on Saturday I meet the guy at Best Buy. He looks ok now. He said the event happened last July.
The part of Akron where this took place is commonly refered to as “LA” “Lower Akron” while in the presence of mixed company or “Lower Africa” by those in the know… And now a nation knows why.
[quote]MDLP wrote:
The part of Akron where this took place is commonly refered to as “LA” “Lower Akron” while in the presence of mixed company or “Lower Africa” by those in the know… And now a nation knows why.[/quote]
Huh? I’ve never heard anyone refer to downtown as that…
[quote]MDLP wrote:
What a small world… I was at the best buy in Parma, OH last night looking for a washer and dryer for one of my rental properties and who comes up to assist me? Joe Scarpino. Unbelieveable… We talked for about 20 minutes about what happened. What a small world.
Originally I found out about this on Friday night while reading T-Nation. I didnt know where the event had took place, but later that evening while watching the news I was stunned, well not really, to learn that it had occured in Akron, Ohio. Then on Saturday I meet the guy at Best Buy. He looks ok now. He said the event happened last July.
The part of Akron where this took place is commonly refered to as “LA” “Lower Akron” while in the presence of mixed company or “Lower Africa” by those in the know… And now a nation knows why.[/quote]
Excuse me while I challenge this line of thought. For one, the poster before you is from the same area and described this part of town as not being a bad area. Second, the world knows why it is called “Little Africa” because two mentally screwed up black people went crazy? Let me be a little more clear…if the roles were reversed, and the victim had been black, would you be using this incident to describe an entire part of town or an entire group of people? Just to make it more clear, other posters have made comments along the lines of “so this is what it is like in the ghetto”? You will have to pardon my take on this, however, I seriously doubt that when a negative act is committed by a white person, that the majority say, “See, look at those crazy white people at it again”. Maybe the next time a watch COPS on FOX I will utter that statement loudly as soon as they run across yet another white guy in a wife beater dressed from the waist down as a woman. The majority of the people in that place were white. I don’t know what “ghettos” you all have been to, but I can’t go to too many places in Third Ward Houston, Tx where all of the patrons at a store are white yet it is referred to as “a ghetto”. Bottom line, I think some of the thinking here is off. Excuse me if I read you wrong. Discuss.
[quote]Bodhisattva wrote:
MDLP wrote:
The part of Akron where this took place is commonly refered to as “LA” “Lower Akron” while in the presence of mixed company or “Lower Africa” by those in the know… And now a nation knows why.
Huh? I’ve never heard anyone refer to downtown as that…
[/quote]
Yet, if anyone were to point out the biased nature of that remark, I assume that many here wouldn’t be able to see the problem. For the record…that is a problem.
I did not make the name up, yet I’ve heard it dozens of times and I don’t even live in Akron.
Normally, I would not even have commented on this incident as it did not directly involve me, but hearing it was close to home, and the fact that I randomly ran into the subject last night prompted me to respond.
Thank you Prof X for saying what I was too angry to say after I read MDLP’s post. So, MDLP, you live near Parma, a nice white bread suburb a good hour by car away, yet you’re a cultural authority on this area and can warn the world how scary it is? The only scary thing I see is the homogeneity in your thinking
The guy who got hit the and people watching: dulled senses. This society does that: dulls the senses, numbs.
I’ve been thinking about quickness lately. I was cleaning yesterday and I was thinking about how it’s true what the experts say: its all about bar speed, quickness. And I was trying to be quiker, and it made such a huge difference. And I realized how much quicker I can be if I am conscious about it and I make and effort. This applies to all aspects of being.
I surf too and that is REALLY a sport that is about quickness. The level of alertness on land will not work in the water.
An alert person would have been much more likely to have acted decisivly and defused the situtation.
Everyone in there was numb, waiting for their fat and carb fix.
Would I have done anything?
That is the question we all ask. You can help it. I think a person concerned with strength and quickness would be more likely to react.
I did not make the name up, yet I’ve heard it dozens of times and I don’t even live in Akron.
Normally, I would not even have commented on this incident as it did not directly involve me, but hearing it was close to home, and the fact that I randomly ran into the subject last night prompted me to respond.[/quote]
I’m not saying that you were the person who made the name up. That didn’t stop you from continuing to use it even though this part of town apparently isn’t even a majority black area. Further, if you don’t live there but use this name, while someone who does live there has never heard of it, it strikes me as not only biased but without any base in reality. It only shows that there seems to be some underlying mentality that if a crime is committed by a black person that this is seen by many as indicative of an entire race or an entire area of people while the same thought process doesn’t seem to work when the crime is committed by a white person. Considering you just fell into that trap yourself, you aren’t exactly the best person to argue against it. Prove me wrong.
ProfX, I don’t think I’ve seen your take on the potential/possible racial nature of the attack.
Where the girlfriend is clearly singling Joe out as “that white mother fucker” etc, what would have happened had the roles–and complexions–been reversed?
[quote]assenvy wrote:
On another note. I agree that I rather have my dignity taken away peacefully than through violence. I used to go clubbing a lot and stopped because I had nothing but guys trying to pick fights with me. I’m a magnet for fights. Some guy tried to start a huge fight with me saying I “wanted to steal his girlfriend” because she kept staring at me.[/quote]
What makes you, and not the next regular guy at the club, such a magnet for fights? Everyone’s a psycho but you?
In a crowded pizza place, you would’nt have gotten ‘too close’ to the behemoth, but you’ld talk him down? There’s no confrontation, he just punishes the victim w/o discussion, and doesn’t seem to care about witnesses. I, for one, would really like to know the magic words to calm the beast. But not from too close.
[quote]Most of you are trying to give reason as to why these people didn’t do anything. It has nothing to do with them thinking about all the scenarios that could possibly happen. It’s called natural instinct. Your sub-conscience takes over and you don’t think what so ever. You just want the situation to be over. And it does end fast for you. As soon as your insticts are off and you’re back to your normal self, it feels like a split second. If your sub-conscience didn’t take over, you’d probably do something even dumber and end up hurting yourself. Your body’s natural instinct to survive won’t allow that.
I bet most of those people regained their regular conscience and started thinking up of things that they could have done.
Everyone on the board is thinking about what they would do. But our sub-conscience would control otherwise.
Now in a situation where a guy is beating on a girl and you see it from afar. You are in full control. Your not thinking about your own safety at that moment. Your cosncience is fully aware. Especially if the guy doesn’t look threatening (Wow i’m bigger than him, I can take him). So you think “i’m going to help that girl”. It’s not until something unexpected happens that gives off threat that your sub-conscience kicks in.[/quote]
So you’re saying that all the bystanders freeze and can’t think because of their natural instincts to preserve their own safety. But YOU would spring to action by trying to calm the guy down, going against natural instincts which you say prevent you from doing “something even dumber and end up hurting yourself.” So either you aren’t that scared, or you’re supressing your inclination toward self-preservation in favor of trying to help someone else…while everyone is sticking their head in the sand because their brains collectively froze at once. Interesting. I’ll ask the cops and bouncers I know how it feels to know that they’ve acted stupidly by overridng their natural urges toward self-preservation, in attempts to help strangers with no substantive benefits for themselves.
Read up on the Rodney King case. There was more evidence of racism than just the tape. They had transcripts of racist remarks over the police radio. Several of the police involved had a history of racism. There was more evidence than just the video. You said it yourself when you said you didn’t know the details of the Rodney King beating. That’s probably why you can’t see how the racism case was made.
[quote]Joe Weider wrote:
ProfX, I don’t think I’ve seen your take on the potential/possible racial nature of the attack.
Where the girlfriend is clearly singling Joe out as “that white mother fucker” etc, what would have happened had the roles–and complexions–been reversed?[/quote]
If you haven’t seen it, then you haven’t read this thread. We have already discussed that. You have obviously come in on the tail end of a discussion trying to point out fault. Too late. I already went down that road. What do you have to say to the issue I just brought up? Are you blind to that with only the sight to see one aspect in the thinking surrounding this incident?
In reply to what jaimeo wrote
Yeah, his line of thinking is based on your attacker starting things off by slashing rather than stabbing. Of course, it also assumes running away or grabbing a weapon is out, too.
Just to clarify, no I hadn’t read the whole thread. I guess I missed that part. I read the first couple of pages, then the stuff posted today. I’m sorry, I didn’t mean anything by it.
Not trying to find fault–just honestly curious.
Most of those people are trained to get out of those situations. They are trained to try and gain control of a situation where control doesn’t exist.
And not everyone freezes up. Every mind is different. But it’s a good explanation for why those people would just sit there doing nothing. They really can’t think about the situation. Or they can think about how they will survive the situation, but not how the other person will. But everyone always has the right plan right after the situation has ended. Just like everyone here has the right plan. I wonder if one of those guys in the pizza place goes to t-mag on a regular basis.
And I don’t mention that i would definitely try to talk him out of it. I use the word “probably”. Because, it’s only probable that I will actually do it.
Just for the record- I’ve seen this move done on blacks by blacks, on whites by whites, and any other color combo you can think of.
I doubt that race really played a part. I have been called whitey,cracker, and every other name in the book by the same person who then turned and attacked someone of his own race.
I don’t know if there is any psycholocical research to back it up, but I would theorise that the racial comments were to de-humanise the victim in the eyes of the attacker, not make the victim feel bad or less than because he is white.
This is the cornerstone of racial propaganda.It isn’t intended for the victim, it is intended for the attacker.This makes the victim easier to beat on. It was one of the Nazis’ greatest strategies.
Just try pummeling someone while screaming “We are equal as human beings!”.