I have consistently noticed that when I eat a half cup of almonds with a glass of milk about an hour before I go to sleep, I wake up feeling incredibly well rested. A half cup of almonds (if my source is correct) has about 312 mg of magnesium, compared to 450mg in ZMA (and 300mg in the woman’s dose). I know that ZMA is all about the perfect combination of Zinc, magnesium, and B6; but I feel so much better in the morning with almonds and milk than I do ZMA.
Has anyone else compared the two?
I haven’t compared those particularly, but you’re kinda comparing apples to oranges; a 400+ calorie meal to a non-caloric supplement. So there could be more at work here than just the magnesium from the almonds (especially since, in that form and taken with the calcium in milk, absorption is likely impaired to some degree).
On a related note, I’ve noticed that when I have 2-3 raw eggs a half-hour or so before bed, I sleep just as soundly as when I take a full ZMA dose (and both are significantly better sleep than when I have neither).
Not sure of the exact mechanisms at play, but I’ll take results when I can get them. Now I’ll rotate through a bottle of ZMA, then the pre-bed eggs when the bottle’s done, and then back to ZMA after a while. Before I started experimenting with raw eggs, ZMA was an absolute staple (and still is).
Ahh, I really have to try this one. I have no means of getting ZMA, or anything similar, but almonds I can have in abundance.
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
I haven’t compared those particularly, but you’re kinda comparing apples to oranges; a 400+ calorie meal to a non-caloric supplement. So there could be more at work here than just the magnesium from the almonds (especially since, in that form and taken with the calcium in milk, absorption is likely impaired to some degree).
On a related note, I’ve noticed that when I have 2-3 raw eggs a half-hour or so before bed, I sleep just as soundly as when I take a full ZMA dose (and both are significantly better sleep than when I have neither).
Not sure of the exact mechanisms at play, but I’ll take results when I can get them. Now I’ll rotate through a bottle of ZMA, then the pre-bed eggs when the bottle’s done, and then back to ZMA after a while. Before I started experimenting with raw eggs, ZMA was an absolute staple (and still is).[/quote]
How’d you come across that discovery about the eggs?
I tried it last night and my sleep was noticeably better. Granted I mixed it with some whey because raw eggs aren’t terribly pleasant.
^^ Why do they have to be raw??
[quote]chimera182 wrote:
How’d you come across that discovery about the eggs?[/quote]
The same way most great realizations occur… dumb luck. I thought I just wanted a protein/fat meal and was out of hard-boiled eggs. A happy accident, definitely.
I’ll try picking some brains to see if anyone has a better idea why. Is it the choline? The Bs? Some as-of-yet unidentified mystery factor? Something even more obvious that I’m just not seeing?
Meh, as Tony Robbins might say, for now, I’m not worried about understanding how electricity works. I’m content just flipping the switch and seeing the light go on. (Yeesh, that was a stretch of an analogy).
Frank’s Red Hot, man. One or two dashes per egg in the glass, swirl it, down it.
[quote]spyoptic wrote:
Why do they have to be raw??[/quote]
'Cuz I’m old school and that’s how we roll, son. 
But yeah, really I don’t know if they “have to be” raw, it’s just that I happened to notice a more pronounced effect with them raw versus boiled.
Also, raw eating in general has been on my mind ever since I read Muscle, Smoke, and Mirrors, and I’ve been ever-so-gradually trying to incorporate it. I’m up to four raw eggs three times a day, and had raw steak for the first time today at lunch (1/3 pound of top round. Not terrible, but not amazing.) I’ll see how things go in the gym tonight.
So I used to think that this whole “crazy dreams” thing was a myth until I started taking ZMA.
My Fucking Goodness - I’ve been in two plane crashes, murdered a man, been attacked by a fucking ten-headed snake and chased by a psychotic prostitute.
And that’s in one night’s dreaming. No joke. ZMA is so much fun.
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
[quote]chimera182 wrote:
How’d you come across that discovery about the eggs?[/quote]
The same way most great realizations occur… dumb luck. I thought I just wanted a protein/fat meal and was out of hard-boiled eggs. A happy accident, definitely.
I’ll try picking some brains to see if anyone has a better idea why. Is it the choline? The Bs? Some as-of-yet unidentified mystery factor? Something even more obvious that I’m just not seeing?
Meh, as Tony Robbins might say, for now, I’m not worried about understanding how electricity works. I’m content just flipping the switch and seeing the light go on. (Yeesh, that was a stretch of an analogy).
Frank’s Red Hot, man. One or two dashes per egg in the glass, swirl it, down it.
[quote]spyoptic wrote:
Why do they have to be raw??[/quote]
'Cuz I’m old school and that’s how we roll, son.
But yeah, really I don’t know if they “have to be” raw, it’s just that I happened to notice a more pronounced effect with them raw versus boiled.
Also, raw eating in general has been on my mind ever since I read Muscle, Smoke, and Mirrors, and I’ve been ever-so-gradually trying to incorporate it. I’m up to four raw eggs three times a day, and had raw steak for the first time today at lunch (1/3 pound of top round. Not terrible, but not amazing.) I’ll see how things go in the gym tonight.[/quote]
Thanks for the reply, I appreciate it! And the tips, my sleep’s definitely noticeably better.
Let us know if you solve the mystery.
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
Not sure of the exact mechanisms at play, but I’ll take results when I can get them. Now I’ll rotate through a bottle of ZMA, then the pre-bed eggs when the bottle’s done, and then back to ZMA after a while. Before I started experimenting with raw eggs, ZMA was an absolute staple (and still is).[/quote]
I popped into my regular supp shop yesterday to get some whey and as I had some time to burn while my buddy was getting a new X-Box, I looked around and was pleasantly surprised to stumble across some ZMA. Very rare to find anything but the absolute basics around here so I decided to buy a bottle to try it out.
However, as great as ZMA might be for me, the price is crazy. A small bottle was about a months worth and that cose 30 euro(about $36US). I can’t really afford to keep buying that, has anyone found anything to even be close to the effects of ZMA without breaking the bank in the past
[quote]Jereth127 wrote:
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
Not sure of the exact mechanisms at play, but I’ll take results when I can get them. Now I’ll rotate through a bottle of ZMA, then the pre-bed eggs when the bottle’s done, and then back to ZMA after a while. Before I started experimenting with raw eggs, ZMA was an absolute staple (and still is).[/quote]
I popped into my regular supp shop yesterday to get some whey and as I had some time to burn while my buddy was getting a new X-Box, I looked around and was pleasantly surprised to stumble across some ZMA. Very rare to find anything but the absolute basics around here so I decided to buy a bottle to try it out.
However, as great as ZMA might be for me, the price is crazy. A small bottle was about a months worth and that cose 30 euro(about $36US). I can’t really afford to keep buying that, has anyone found anything to even be close to the effects of ZMA without breaking the bank in the past[/quote]
Try almonds or eggs; the almonds might just be something that works for me, I am going to try some eggs at night when I get home from college and finally have access to a kitchen.
Would the eggs have to be raw? I’m already eating three boiled eggs a day.
Also I’m curious, why is ZMA not to be taken with calcium?
[quote]Jereth127 wrote:
A small bottle was about a months worth and that cose 30 euro(about $36US).[/quote]
Just to note, that sounds expensive. ZMA should be around half that much, in US$. If a formula is much more expensive than that, it probably has other “stuff” in it that you don’t necessarily need.
Again, this gets a big question mark from me too. It’s just something I’ve personally noticed.
Magnesium and calcium can compete for absorption in the body. Separating them by an hour or so should be fine. For example, instead of washing down your ZMA capsules with a protein shake, have one or the other about an hour earlier.
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
[quote]Jereth127 wrote:
A small bottle was about a months worth and that cose 30 euro(about $36US).[/quote]
Just to note, that sounds expensive. ZMA should be around half that much, in US$. If a formula is much more expensive than that, it probably has other “stuff” in it that you don’t necessarily need.[/quote]
Actually even in Canada, ZMA is $25 (Canadian) (so $22-23USD) for the same product in the USA at about $12-15. Same goes for most supplements…or prices of anything in general.
[quote]Jereth127 wrote:
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
Not sure of the exact mechanisms at play, but I’ll take results when I can get them. Now I’ll rotate through a bottle of ZMA, then the pre-bed eggs when the bottle’s done, and then back to ZMA after a while. Before I started experimenting with raw eggs, ZMA was an absolute staple (and still is).[/quote]
I popped into my regular supp shop yesterday to get some whey and as I had some time to burn while my buddy was getting a new X-Box, I looked around and was pleasantly surprised to stumble across some ZMA. Very rare to find anything but the absolute basics around here so I decided to buy a bottle to try it out.
However, as great as ZMA might be for me, the price is crazy. A small bottle was about a months worth and that cose 30 euro(about $36US). I can’t really afford to keep buying that, has anyone found anything to even be close to the effects of ZMA without breaking the bank in the past[/quote]
you should look for a zinc and magnesium supp its basically the same thing but its not as expensive.
The nutrients in eggs are more available when they are cooked. Are they not?
[quote]mallen5 wrote:
The nutrients in eggs are more available when they are cooked. Are they not?[/quote]
As far as I’m aware, yes. But it might just be one of those things where everybody is different.
[quote]Magicpunch wrote:
So I used to think that this whole “crazy dreams” thing was a myth until I started taking ZMA.[/quote]
You know, I had some more creative dreams at first, but that effect has actually gone away over time. Go figure.
[quote]Jereth127 wrote:
[quote]mallen5 wrote:
The nutrients in eggs are more available when they are cooked. Are they not?[/quote]
As far as I’m aware, yes. But it might just be one of those things where everybody is different.[/quote]
The trypsin in egg whites does seem to impede maximum protein absorption, but anecdotally at least, this isn’t of primary importance because you’re still getting at least half the protein plus the fat, cholesterol, and other nutrients.
Raw eggs were staples for lifters and bodybuilders back in the day. If they were ultimately ineffective, Vince Gironda wouldn’t have regularly had his guys drinking raw eggs by the dozens. (Though it’s probably relevant that Gironda was also a big advocate of liver tablets, which likely supplemented any B vitamins that weren’t gotten from the eggs.) As I said, when I have some time, I’ll be looking into it with guys who know what’s what on the raw front.
Also, I didn’t really mean to hijack this thread into raw talk. If someone wanted to start a new thread about all things raw, I’m sure we could get input from more folks.
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
[quote]Jereth127 wrote:
[quote]mallen5 wrote:
The nutrients in eggs are more available when they are cooked. Are they not?[/quote]
As far as I’m aware, yes. But it might just be one of those things where everybody is different.[/quote]
The trypsin in egg whites does seem to impede maximum protein absorption, but anecdotally at least, this isn’t of primary importance because you’re still getting at least half the protein plus the fat, cholesterol, and other nutrients.
Raw eggs were staples for lifters and bodybuilders back in the day. If they were ultimately ineffective, Vince Gironda wouldn’t have regularly had his guys drinking raw eggs by the dozens. (Though it’s probably relevant that Gironda was also a big advocate of liver tablets, which likely supplemented any B vitamins that weren’t gotten from the eggs.) As I said, when I have some time, I’ll be looking into it with guys who know what’s what on the raw front.
Also, I didn’t really mean to hijack this thread into raw talk. If someone wanted to start a new thread about all things raw, I’m sure we could get input from more folks.[/quote]
Not my thread but I think everyone appreciates the info, I know I do.
Thanks Chris, you’ve been a big help. (Yet again!)
That’s interesting Chris. I had consistently been having 50g whey with 2 raw eggs before bed and sleep has been awesome. I met with a nutritionist/prep coach and was asked to switch my prebed meal to cottage cheese and PB/almonds and it had been taking me much longer to fall asleep nor do I sleep as deeply. I didn’t even make the connection until you brought it up though…hmmmmm