[quote]Vegita wrote:
You are a fag, go suck a dick popsicle.
V[/quote]
The win is strong with this post.
Someone should close this thread, it’s getting pathetic.
This is/was a pretty entertaining thread until thebodyguard came rolling in to make sure we all understood that none of us are “qualified” to have this conversation.
I was completely unaware that there was a “qualification” needed to have ANY conversation…hmm, anyway.
I think this thread can be revived and I don’t think we should let one person with small dick syndrom ruin it.
Do aliens exist?
Circle one
YES NO MAYBE
Back on topic, hopefully the science police don’t come in and crucify me for “blasphemy”. I think the gravity drive has the most potential as far as “IF UFO’s turn out to be a real phenomenon” and what people have been whitnessing turns out to be actually true, and flying discs which accelerate with mind boggling speeds, change directions at very high speed, etc… The gravity drive (If it could be a real drive per my last psuedoscientific post) would explain it nicely.
No visible or audible thrust from a motor or rocket. accelleration which would crush any organic body into mush, Seemingly this is not happening inside the crafts, one would think if it happened once that would be the end of the craft. So if we believe in UFO’s then we must also believe that they have an advanced drive, and the ability to isolate the effects of gravity from large bodies. Remember, when flying around earths atmosphere, they are experiencing our gravity.
Yet if they were to go to a planet say twice our mass, just walking around would be 2G’s and any acceleration would have an increased effect. Say on earth driving your car you experience 2g’s, well on a double mass planet it would be 4. What if they visited a planet with 4X the mass of earth. In any event, I think it’s likley they would need gravitational shielding. And if they can create a gravitational shield, then why would they not also use it for propulsion?
V
In terms of probability, considering the size of the universe, yes life I exists.
[quote]Mettahl wrote:
Lifting a weight is a far stretch from understanding the biological processes behind the gain of strength and/or size, from exactly what your muscles are doing, to exactly what your nutrition is doing to your body. Some of the articles on here begin to dig in to some semi-deep stuff, of which most of us only know the basics.
You having used a computer for T-Nation and World of Warcraft is a pretty far stretch from being able to understand, design, and correctly apply software.
So they were decent analogies after all.
Stop being so “complex and smart” and go away.[/quote]
You obviously have no clue just how complex theoretical physics is. Pick up a few books and report back. They were terrible analogies. And you’re a little idiot - Your first photo said backstreet (backdoor?) boy and you think if you put on 15lbs of muscle, a baseball cap and a scowl that you’re not in the group any longer? Now that’s trying to hard. LOL Run along Spritle.
[quote]Vegita wrote:
Back on topic, hopefully the science police don’t come in and crucify me for “blasphemy”. I think the gravity drive has the most potential as far as “IF UFO’s turn out to be a real phenomenon” and what people have been whitnessing turns out to be actually true, and flying discs which accelerate with mind boggling speeds, change directions at very high speed, etc… The gravity drive (If it could be a real drive per my last psuedoscientific post) would explain it nicely. No visible or audible thrust from a motor or rocket. accelleration which would crush any organic body into mush, Seemingly this is not happening inside the crafts, one would think if it happened once that would be the end of the craft. So if we believe in UFO’s then we must also believe that they have an advanced drive, and the ability to isolate the effects of gravity from large bodies. Remember, when flying around earths atmosphere, they are experiencing our gravity. Yet if they were to go to a planet say twice our mass, just walking around would be 2G’s and any acceleration would have an increased effect. Say on earth driving your car you experience 2g’s, well on a double mass planet it would be 4. What if they visited a planet with 4X the mass of earth. In any event, I think it’s likley they would need gravitational shielding. And if they can create a gravitational shield, then why would they not also use it for propulsion?
V
[/quote]
So lemme ask; do you believe in UFOs?
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
Vegita wrote:
Back on topic, hopefully the science police don’t come in and crucify me for “blasphemy”. I think the gravity drive has the most potential as far as “IF UFO’s turn out to be a real phenomenon” and what people have been whitnessing turns out to be actually true, and flying discs which accelerate with mind boggling speeds, change directions at very high speed, etc… The gravity drive (If it could be a real drive per my last psuedoscientific post) would explain it nicely. No visible or audible thrust from a motor or rocket. accelleration which would crush any organic body into mush, Seemingly this is not happening inside the crafts, one would think if it happened once that would be the end of the craft. So if we believe in UFO’s then we must also believe that they have an advanced drive, and the ability to isolate the effects of gravity from large bodies. Remember, when flying around earths atmosphere, they are experiencing our gravity. Yet if they were to go to a planet say twice our mass, just walking around would be 2G’s and any acceleration would have an increased effect. Say on earth driving your car you experience 2g’s, well on a double mass planet it would be 4. What if they visited a planet with 4X the mass of earth. In any event, I think it’s likley they would need gravitational shielding. And if they can create a gravitational shield, then why would they not also use it for propulsion?
V
So lemme ask; do you believe in UFOs?
[/quote]
I have never first hand seen one. I am very open to the idea that they do exist, based on in part to the thousands of reported sightings per year in the US alone. Seeing as I do not have first hand knowledge or experience with a UFO I cannot say I “believe” they exist. And also by UFO I am assuming you mean alien space craft, as UFO’s certainly do exist.
Anything (flying) that is unindentified to the observer is technically a UFO. I believe the probablility of aliens existing is very high, and I believe them being able to fly or better yet be transported to our planet via a craft of some sort also very highly probable but less than the probability that they actually exist.
V
[quote]Vegita wrote:
Anything (flying) that is unindentified to the observer is technically a UFO. I believe the probablility of aliens existing is very high, and I believe them being able to fly or better yet be transported to our planet via a craft of some sort also very highly probable but less than the probability that they actually exist.
V[/quote]
They were probably testing early designs of what we now know as the stealth fighter and bomber in the late 70’s early 80’s. Don’t you think that an encounter with such a craft then would surely elicit an “alien craft sighting”? Don’t you believe we are now testing unmanned craft at this time that to us now may seem out of our technology? We’re already heavily involved with unmanned craft and heavily invested toward that technology in the future. What seems more plausible?
An alien craft from deep space from a race that chooses not to reveal itself to us directly (a construct that is the basic underpinnings of all our religious models that renders such an idea almost cliched) or, a combination of natural phenomena and worldly secret technology? Do you really think the countless potential explorers in the universe (if they or the capability exists) have become signatories to some star trek like dictum of the prime directive? We are very much explorers. We’ve sent craft off to deep space. Did we ever concern ourselves with the prospect of one our craft crash landing on another distant planet with a less advanced civilization?
Even assuming a prime directive type edict, would an alien craft then play cat and mouse with fighter jets, airliners or othewise reveal itself at all when its supposed technology would seem to be able to completely avoid detection? Does any of that make sense?
[quote]Richard Smoker wrote:
Vegita wrote:
Anything (flying) that is unindentified to the observer is technically a UFO. I believe the probablility of aliens existing is very high, and I believe them being able to fly or better yet be transported to our planet via a craft of some sort also very highly probable but less than the probability that they actually exist.
V
They were probably testing early designs of what we now know as the stealth fighter and bomber in the late 70’s early 80’s. Don’t you think that an encounter with such a craft then would surely elicit an “alien craft sighting”? Don’t you believe we are now testing unmanned craft at this time that to us now may seem out of our technology? We’re already heavily involved with unmanned craft and heavily invested toward that technology in the future. What seems more plausible?
An alien craft from deep space from a race that chooses not to reveal itself to us directly (a construct that is the basic underpinnings of all our religious models that renders such an idea almost cliched) or, a combination of natural phenomena and worldly secret technology? Do you really think the countless potential explorers in the universe (if they or the capability exists) have become signatories to some star trek like dictum of the prime directive? We are very much explorers. We’ve sent craft off to deep space. Did we ever concern ourselves with the prospect of one our craft crash landing on another distant planet with a less advanced civilization?
Even assuming a prime directive type edict, would an alien craft then play cat and mouse with fighter jets, airliners or othewise reveal itself at all when its supposed technology would seem to be able to completely avoid detection? Does any of that make sense?[/quote]
I do believe that MANY UFO sightings are weather baloons, government craft, or just atmospheric anomolies. That doesn’t mean I DON’t believe the other possibility is possible. I can imagine other entities acting exactly the way they supposedly behave, like what you just wrote, yes I can believe that is a possible reality.
Basically, I don’t assume to know the person next to me and thier intentions, especially if they are a stranger, let alone trying to decide that I KNOW or BELIEVE that I know how an alien race would behave. There very well could be more than one alien race who is interacting with our planet. What if there is some type of league of races who have put a no contact with earth rule in place? What if some races disobey those orders in a mild way by flying into our airspace, Picking up some random nobody, grabbing some animals from the surface including cattle. What if they bend the rules but don’t want the concequences of all out breaking them and landing on the lawn of the white house.
I mean seriously it took me 20 seconds to think up that possible scenario. Open your mind up a little man, you can still dream while being a mostly serious adult. Everything doesn’t have to be inside the fucking box. I kinda feel bad for you now, I mean jesus do you get pleasure out of anything in life except being a pessemistic know it all?
V
Also here are some possible UFO sightings from before Humans had air travel, so your theory that “ONLY GOVERNMENT CRAFT ARE RESPONSIBLE” doesn’t hold much water.
http://www.crystalinks.com/ufohistory.html
V
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
Vegita wrote:
Anything (flying) that is unindentified to the observer is technically a UFO. I believe the probablility of aliens existing is very high, and I believe them being able to fly or better yet be transported to our planet via a craft of some sort also very highly probable but less than the probability that they actually exist.
V
They were probably testing early designs of what we now know as the stealth fighter and bomber in the late 70’s early 80’s. Don’t you think that an encounter with such a craft then would surely elicit an “alien craft sighting”? Don’t you believe we are now testing unmanned craft at this time that to us now may seem out of our technology? We’re already heavily involved with unmanned craft and heavily invested toward that technology in the future. What seems more plausible?
An alien craft from deep space from a race that chooses not to reveal itself to us directly (a construct that is the basic underpinnings of all our religious models that renders such an idea almost cliched) or, a combination of natural phenomena and worldly secret technology? Do you really think the countless potential explorers in the universe (if they or the capability exists) have become signatories to some star trek like dictum of the prime directive? We are very much explorers. We’ve sent craft off to deep space. Did we ever concern ourselves with the prospect of one our craft crash landing on another distant planet with a less advanced civilization?
Even assuming a prime directive type edict, would an alien craft then play cat and mouse with fighter jets, airliners or othewise reveal itself at all when its supposed technology would seem to be able to completely avoid detection? Does any of that make sense?[/quote]
Bodyguard you make some good points, but let me ask you this. I’m sure you’ve read of the cattle mutilations in the southwest which go hand in hand with UFO sightings? If our Gov. was actually doing these (the black helicopter theory) what purpose would it serve. They could just experiment on their own cattle at military installations. Why stir up a ruckus with the ranchers and media by doing this. I ask because there’s been a recent reemergence of these activities in the SouthWest states. They are truly without explanation in my view.
D
Theres a lot of metaphoric speculation about the existence of aliens. I think the whole subject is a waste of time and pretty stupid but I know that some nerdy guys are really into crop circles and stuff and some of it is pretty wacky but I think “Aliens” would fall into a national security threat. If theres such thing as aliens I think that they are probally already here cloaked or something.
Who knows. The Truth Is Out There. and I dont know either which way nor do I hold the perspectives of other people who are radically interested in these matters.
If I saw a stealth fighter or bomber 40 years ago, I would of thought wow, cool looking plane.
People try to apply what we know today about science/physics/the universe to the alien topic and interstellar travel. sometimes the more we know makes us realize how much we dont know. 20 years ago i was working on computers that didnt have hard drives. I had to swap out 5 inch floppy disks to load the operating system and then the word processing application. Now I am working on a quad core pc with a gig of ram and a 160 gig hard drive–who would have thought.
check out these links, it is a long interview but it is interesting.
http://www.projectcamelot.org/bob_dean_interview_transcript_1.html
http://www.projectcamelot.org/bob_dean_interview_transcript_2.html
it is an interview with Command Sergeant Major robert dean, ex military for 27 years and he
was assigned to Supreme Headquarters Allied Powers Europe. He claims NATO has known about aliens for 50 years.
-g
[quote]Vegita wrote:
I do believe that MANY UFO sightings are weather baloons, government craft, or just atmospheric anomolies. That doesn’t mean I DON’t believe the other possibility is possible. I can imagine other entities acting exactly the way they supposedly behave, like what you just wrote, yes I can believe that is a possible reality.
Basically, I don’t assume to know the person next to me and thier intentions, especially if they are a stranger, let alone trying to decide that I KNOW or BELIEVE that I know how an alien race would behave. There very well could be more than one alien race who is interacting with our planet. What if there is some type of league of races who have put a no contact with earth rule in place? What if some races disobey those orders in a mild way by flying into our airspace, Picking up some random nobody, grabbing some animals from the surface including cattle. What if they bend the rules but don’t want the concequences of all out breaking them and landing on the lawn of the white house.
I mean seriously it took me 20 seconds to think up that possible scenario. Open your mind up a little man, you can still dream while being a mostly serious adult. Everything doesn’t have to be inside the fucking box. I kinda feel bad for you now, I mean jesus do you get pleasure out of anything in life except being a pessemistic know it all?
V[/quote]
Why are you so small that you have to resort to insults? I posed a serious question to you and a serious retort. Do you always talk online in a manner that you wouldn’t dare speak in real life? Because I’m one of the few guys that will give you the opportunity.
Next, I see that my comment about believing in this “prime directive” type behavior has some (or all) underpinnings in our religous constructs that play so well to the way we are wired flew right by you - probably because you were in that 20 second rush to be an unecessary smart ass. It’s not that I don’t believe or that I think inside a box - and it’s not that I haven’t considered the possiblity - it’s that having considered the possibility and weighing that against likely explanations and likely behavior of a far far advanced race, I remain very skeptical. As if you could breach the laws of physics as we know it, and be rendered no more advanced than some privitive hunting party going to the jungle, with a need to seize life forms for study. Ya think they might be able to just scan with all that advanced technology to get what they need? That took me about 5 seconds to refute for the record.
In one breath, you propose otherwordly technology, a league of nations (planets) and then undetected, serripticious fly-bys and abductions committed without this league detecting it. And all the while, you have imposed your current wordly ethics on a race that would have to be eons advanced beyond us. We’re barely out of caves on a cosmological clock scale, and the guys that have advanced so far as to conquer the physics of our universe, are still operating with our ape like brains with all the shortcomings that go along with it - engaging in primitive manner of deceipt and study.
Yes sir, you DID think that one up in about 5 minutes didn’t you?
[quote]Dedicated wrote:
Bodyguard you make some good points, but let me ask you this. I’m sure you’ve read of the cattle mutilations in the southwest which go hand in hand with UFO sightings? If our Gov. was actually doing these (the black helicopter theory) what purpose would it serve. They could just experiment on their own cattle at military installations. Why stir up a ruckus with the ranchers and media by doing this. I ask because there’s been a recent reemergence of these activities in the SouthWest states. They are truly without explanation in my view.
D[/quote]
I haven’t studied any of that or given it any serious consideration because I think it deserves none. Are you ready to accept that a race so advanced that it has conquered inter-gallactic travel is so primitive that it needs to abduct and experiment on our cattle and then leave behind the evidence? Does that make sense? Either they are operating in secret or they are not. Either they are unimaginably advanced or not? Why not just vaporize the evidence? Cattle get lost to predators all the time. Do ya get where I’m coming from?
I think people who are on TV talking about Aliens and alternate dimensions and shit should be shot in the face personally or quarantined. This is planet earth and on Planet Earth we are pretty uncomfortable with people being invasive. We have enough of an immigration problem already.
[quote]Richard Smoker wrote:
Vegita wrote:
I do believe that MANY UFO sightings are weather baloons, government craft, or just atmospheric anomolies. That doesn’t mean I DON’t believe the other possibility is possible. I can imagine other entities acting exactly the way they supposedly behave, like what you just wrote, yes I can believe that is a possible reality.
Basically, I don’t assume to know the person next to me and thier intentions, especially if they are a stranger, let alone trying to decide that I KNOW or BELIEVE that I know how an alien race would behave. There very well could be more than one alien race who is interacting with our planet. What if there is some type of league of races who have put a no contact with earth rule in place? What if some races disobey those orders in a mild way by flying into our airspace, Picking up some random nobody, grabbing some animals from the surface including cattle. What if they bend the rules but don’t want the concequences of all out breaking them and landing on the lawn of the white house.
I mean seriously it took me 20 seconds to think up that possible scenario. Open your mind up a little man, you can still dream while being a mostly serious adult. Everything doesn’t have to be inside the fucking box. I kinda feel bad for you now, I mean jesus do you get pleasure out of anything in life except being a pessemistic know it all?
V
Why are you so small that you have to resort to insults? I posed a serious question to you and a serious retort. Do you always talk online in a manner that you wouldn’t dare speak in real life? Because I’m one of the few guys that will give you the opportunity.
Next, I see that my comment about believing in this “prime directive” type behavior has some (or all) underpinnings in our religous constructs that play so well to the way we are wired flew right by you - probably because you were in that 20 second rush to be an unecessary smart ass. It’s not that I don’t believe or that I think inside a box - and it’s not that I haven’t considered the possiblity - it’s that having considered the possibility and weighing that against likely explanations and likely behavior of a far far advanced race, I remain very skeptical. As if you could breach the laws of physics as we know it, and be rendered no more advanced than some privitive hunting party going to the jungle, with a need to seize life forms for study. Ya think they might be able to just scan with all that advanced technology to get what they need? That took me about 5 seconds to refute for the record.
In one breath, you propose otherwordly technology, a league of nations (planets) and then undetected, serripticious fly-bys and abductions committed without this league detecting it. And all the while, you have imposed your current wordly ethics on a race that would have to be eons advanced beyond us. We’re barely out of caves on a cosmological clock scale, and the guys that have advanced so far as to conquer the physics of our universe, are still operating with our ape like brains with all the shortcomings that go along with it - engaging in primitive manner of deceipt and study.
Yes sir, you DID think that one up in about 5 minutes didn’t you?
[/quote]
My insulting behavior is truthfully in jest. I’m just messin with ya, even though you are a dickbag. And yes I would say it to your face, because you have demonstrated your strict logical/rational thinking and you would not physically harm me because of any verbal abuse I might unleash upon you. You would then go to jail, and I would file a lawsuit, therefore you would make the logical and rational decision to ignore me. Which is also what I would do.
Back to the topic at hand Richard, Again with your assumptions. For all you know, humans could develop the gravity drive or some similar technology in the next 50 years. Would we as a species be any more evolved socially or emotionally? I tend to doubt it. One cannot assume just because a race discovers a technology, that they use it responsibly, or are somehow more evolved socially because of such a discovery. There that took me 1 second to refute what you just said because you are speculating as much or more than I am. BTW 1 second wins, no using half second intervals for response times.
Now on to another point you tried to make. You mentioned them having technology to “scan” what they would need, so why pick stuff up? More assumptions. If we develop a gravity drive in 50 years, that does not mean we also develop advanced scanning technology in 50 years, 100 years, 1000 years. There is no way to say they have to have one if they have the other. Maybe some alines have it and use it and remain invisible to us and maybe other races who are only slightly ahead of us on a specific technology continuum do not have that technology and break the rules set upon them to gather information and explore, much as I am sure the human race would if some pompus space federation told us not to explore. Eventualy we would probably test the waters.
Anxiously waiting for your next pessimistic reply.
V
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
Dedicated wrote:
Bodyguard you make some good points, but let me ask you this. I’m sure you’ve read of the cattle mutilations in the southwest which go hand in hand with UFO sightings? If our Gov. was actually doing these (the black helicopter theory) what purpose would it serve. They could just experiment on their own cattle at military installations. Why stir up a ruckus with the ranchers and media by doing this. I ask because there’s been a recent reemergence of these activities in the SouthWest states. They are truly without explanation in my view.
D
I haven’t studied any of that or given it any serious consideration because I think it deserves none. Are you ready to accept that a race so advanced that it has conquered inter-gallactic travel is so primitive that it needs to abduct and experiment on our cattle and then leave behind the evidence? Does that make sense? Either they are operating in secret or they are not. Either they are unimaginably advanced or not? Why not just vaporize the evidence? Cattle get lost to predators all the time. Do ya get where I’m coming from?
[/quote]
Yes, I do and I understand you like to defer to what is rationale and I agree with you for the most part. In my view, and it’s only my view, from the evidence that has been reported their isn’t a rationale explanation and it does make me consider the possibilities as wild as some may be. If it was something as wildly outlandish as an alien force doing it maybe we are so insignificant they feel no need to vaporize the evidence. Thank you for your answer and view on the matter.
D
[quote]Vegita wrote:
Richard Smoker wrote:
Vegita wrote:
I do believe that MANY UFO sightings are weather baloons, government craft, or just atmospheric anomolies. That doesn’t mean I DON’t believe the other possibility is possible. I can imagine other entities acting exactly the way they supposedly behave, like what you just wrote, yes I can believe that is a possible reality.
Basically, I don’t assume to know the person next to me and thier intentions, especially if they are a stranger, let alone trying to decide that I KNOW or BELIEVE that I know how an alien race would behave. There very well could be more than one alien race who is interacting with our planet. What if there is some type of league of races who have put a no contact with earth rule in place? What if some races disobey those orders in a mild way by flying into our airspace, Picking up some random nobody, grabbing some animals from the surface including cattle. What if they bend the rules but don’t want the concequences of all out breaking them and landing on the lawn of the white house.
I mean seriously it took me 20 seconds to think up that possible scenario. Open your mind up a little man, you can still dream while being a mostly serious adult. Everything doesn’t have to be inside the fucking box. I kinda feel bad for you now, I mean jesus do you get pleasure out of anything in life except being a pessemistic know it all?
V
Why are you so small that you have to resort to insults? I posed a serious question to you and a serious retort. Do you always talk online in a manner that you wouldn’t dare speak in real life? Because I’m one of the few guys that will give you the opportunity.
Next, I see that my comment about believing in this “prime directive” type behavior has some (or all) underpinnings in our religous constructs that play so well to the way we are wired flew right by you - probably because you were in that 20 second rush to be an unecessary smart ass. It’s not that I don’t believe or that I think inside a box - and it’s not that I haven’t considered the possiblity - it’s that having considered the possibility and weighing that against likely explanations and likely behavior of a far far advanced race, I remain very skeptical. As if you could breach the laws of physics as we know it, and be rendered no more advanced than some privitive hunting party going to the jungle, with a need to seize life forms for study. Ya think they might be able to just scan with all that advanced technology to get what they need? That took me about 5 seconds to refute for the record.
In one breath, you propose otherwordly technology, a league of nations (planets) and then undetected, serripticious fly-bys and abductions committed without this league detecting it. And all the while, you have imposed your current wordly ethics on a race that would have to be eons advanced beyond us. We’re barely out of caves on a cosmological clock scale, and the guys that have advanced so far as to conquer the physics of our universe, are still operating with our ape like brains with all the shortcomings that go along with it - engaging in primitive manner of deceipt and study.
Yes sir, you DID think that one up in about 5 minutes didn’t you?
My insulting behavior is truthfully in jest. I’m just messin with ya, even though you are a dickbag. And yes I would say it to your face, because you have demonstrated your strict logical/rational thinking and you would not physically harm me because of any verbal abuse I might unleash upon you. You would then go to jail, and I would file a lawsuit, therefore you would make the logical and rational decision to ignore me. Which is also what I would do.
Back to the topic at hand Richard, Again with your assumptions. For all you know, humans could develop the gravity drive or some similar technology in the next 50 years. Would we as a species be any more evolved socially or emotionally? I tend to doubt it. One cannot assume just because a race discovers a technology, that they use it responsibly, or are somehow more evolved socially because of such a discovery. There that took me 1 second to refute what you just said because you are speculating as much or more than I am. BTW 1 second wins, no using half second intervals for response times.
Now on to another point you tried to make. You mentioned them having technology to “scan” what they would need, so why pick stuff up? More assumptions. If we develop a gravity drive in 50 years, that does not mean we also develop advanced scanning technology in 50 years, 100 years, 1000 years. There is no way to say they have to have one if they have the other. Maybe some alines have it and use it and remain invisible to us and maybe other races who are only slightly ahead of us on a specific technology continuum do not have that technology and break the rules set upon them to gather information and explore, much as I am sure the human race would if some pompus space federation told us not to explore. Eventualy we would probably test the waters.
Anxiously waiting for your next pessimistic reply.
V[/quote]
You’re just being contrarian and that doesn’t take much effort. Like I said in my first post - mental masturbation. And by the way, I have no problem taking a charge but the way you come off, I’d have thought you’d man up. I tried to appeal to your claimed intellect, and invited you to engage in some critical thought. Somehow that has reduced you to just claiming black when I claim white. And by the way, we’ll be lucky to even understand gravity in the next 50 years.