A Scientific Look at Toxic Masculinity

I guess I’ve seen you post things along these lines before and if this is how you feel about it then I’m not sure I could really understand you. Not said angrily or anything, haha, but we’re coming at this from wildly different places and viewpoints.

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You say you don’t believe in it: what do you mean by that? You don’t believe it exists?

By extension: do you believe that “biological obligation” is a guarantee for unconditional love?

I can tell you the answer to this is a resounding NO from what I have seen in the court system.

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I don’t believe I am able to love anyone who isn’t family unconditionally, and if I’m being honest, only immediate family. If I can’t, it is unfair for me to expect that of someone else.

I think it is a necessary but not sufficient condition for me.

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Do you feel like “unconditional love” is a requirement for a satisfying and mutually beneficial relationship? Unconditional is a very loaded word. I love my other half more than anyone apart from my kids. I wouldn’t describe it as Unconditional though.

no. I think it is a requirement for me to feel safe enough to give up a career/be financially dependent.

Mum gave up her career to move to China with dad. She has a job, but it doesn’t pay much. There’s a good chance that if I were to get a husband, I’d be put in a similar situation. I would not make the choice mum made (of course children complicate this, but that’s not a concern for me). I would leave the husband even if he were to go on to become a billionaire. I didn’t earn the money. that money isn’t mine.

I think i get what you’re saying.

If your career is that important to you, i strongly suggest you don’t enter into a relationship that would require you to give it up.

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I think you are confusing femininity with feminism. Or you are into dudes…not that there is anything wrong with that.

Great post overall, but IMO you really should believe in unconditional love a little bit more. Don’t take my word for it, take it from the 1980’s.

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Based on the examples you are bringing up in the first half of your post, I think some clarification is needed in regards to what is meant by toxic masculinity/femininity. I see that there are two concepts that are related, but nonetheless confusing if used interchangeably.

On the one hand, you have the concept that societal expectations of and pressures on members of one of the sexes are themselves toxic. In other words, toxic expectations that are bad for the people that those expectations are placed on. It’s interesting to note that many of these expectations are regulated by same gender enforcers. For instance, it’s mostly women that expect women to dress a certain way and it’s mostly men who expect men to meet certain standards of masculinity.

Obviously, members of the opposite sex have influence in what they find attractive, but they don’t generally regulate actively. This sort of cross gender passive regulation of behavior is arguably less toxic, or at least not directly toxic. That is to say, men don’t try to force women to be a certain way but rather they just pay attention and express attraction to women that are a certain way. (And vice versa women do the same thing). Collectively, this might feel oppressive to people that are effectively invisible to the opposite gender, but most people can improve their attractiveness at least somewhat through exercise, grooming, and/or developing useful skills.

The second concept of toxic masculinity/femininity would be when individuals behave in a toxic manner and those toxic behaviors are associated mostly with one gender. For men this might be aggressive, risky, or violent behavior. For women, this would more likely be manipulative, passive aggressive, or deceptive behaviors. Obviously none of these behaviors are exclusive to one gender or the other, but they are stereotyped more towards one than the other. These toxic behaviors are also often associated with self destructive behaviors, both emotionally and physically.

TL:DR: We should differentiate between toxic behavior and toxic expectations.

And those behaviors are not always bad or inappropriate.

You should get a dog.

Might change your mind.

Dogs are family.

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clearly. I’ve always treated my pets as family

In much the same way that manipulative or deceptive behavior might be appropriate in certain situations. Exactly when these types of behaviors become toxic is not a straightforward question.

Those things are fast. I totaled a brand new ported & polished 2000 CR 250 out of sheer surprise at the power. The 500’s were just monsters.

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Is it true that they go up in value every year?

I dont know. I havent looked at them since then. That was it for me. I wrecked every motorcycle I ever rode, and after that I gave up.

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My last bike was a cr250 and that was plenty of power. My uncle had a kx500 and wow, talk about torque.

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