2010-2011 NBA Season 2.0

scj119 · February 9, 2011, 2:56pm

[quote]LarryDavid wrote:

[quote]scj119 wrote:

[quote]TommyGunz32 wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]TommyGunz32 wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]TommyGunz32 wrote:
Breaking News:

Lakers and Nuggets are talking trade.

Bynum for Melo straight up.

Knicks, twolves, and nuggets still talking as well[/quote]

That’s not breaking news, that’s called rumours.[/quote]

Unlikely, sure.

The nuggets are going to move melo its just a matter of where.

knicks or lakers either one would be awesome.
[/quote]

I’m sure many teams have inquired about Melo. GMs talk trade all the time. It’s just normal course of business.
[/quote]

I agree, in the ordinary course of business

However, I feel the nuggets have no choice but to move melo. They don’t want to let him walk away with nothing in return ala cleveland. He said he wont sign the extention with denver so they don’t really have a choice.

do you think he is gonna stay in denver?
[/quote]

Here’s the flaw in that logic: it takes two teams to make a trade. Of course Denver would love to move him, but that’s irrelevant since

a) he won’t sign an extension anywhere but NYK (making NYK the only trade target)
b) NYK knows this, so they won’t trade valuable pieces for him this year when they can sign him outright and lose no one if they wait 1 season

So does it make more sense for Denver to trade him for a penny on the dollar, or to hold out for a playoff and hold out for the very real possibility of a sign-and-trade after the season?[/quote]

The longer they hold out to trade deadline the more they’ll scare him into accepting a trade elsewhere than to the NYK. He could lose a lot of money trying to sign a new contract, especially after the new CBA, where he may even lose salary he could have made in a lockout.

He’ll cave eventually and they’ll actually be able to get something decent for him. [/quote]

Ok first of all Melo doesn’t have a no-trade clause and can’t “accept” or “reject” a trade - it’s the fact that no team will trade FOR him knowing they can’t sign him.

If he cared about money he would’ve just taken the Nuggets’ lucrative extension offer.

He’s made it clear he values going to NYK over money (though I agree he’d prob accept LAL, and just didn’t think of them as a possibility). If he does go to LAL, I sincerely hope everyone who vilified LeBron comes out against Melo. I mean really.

randman · February 9, 2011, 2:57pm

[quote]Gettnitdone wrote:

[quote]randman wrote:

[quote]Gettnitdone wrote:
Um why aren’t you mentioning the fact that Melo and Kobe would have to share the “it guy” status. If you’re a Lakers fan and rooting for this you need to get the fuck out for being a hypocrite and all the shit that was said about LeBron going to Miami.

If Kobe was “Kobe” he wouldn’t want this to happen, neither would 'Melo who would rather have a greater role in NY with a chance to reestablish a franchise.[/quote]

Kobe is a smart player. He knows the only way he could even be considered one of the greatest is to get to 7 to 8 championships. He’s already won 5 and won 2 as the undisputed man. I think Kobe would definitely welcome this.

It’s Carmelo, believe it or not, that I don’t think would want to adjust. They both take 19.5 shots a game. Kobe wants to win more championships than MJ and doesn’t care how it gets done at this point in his career is my pure speculative point of view.

And with regards to being a hypocrite, not the same scenario. Couldn’t be further in difference. Kobe’s won 5 championships. It’s not like he didn’t have any, left his team to go onto another stud’s team that already won 1 championship as the “man” and try to get some himself. Completely, completely different situations.

If Lebron attracted to Bosh and whoever else to HIS team, then so be it. Hell, Jordan had freaking Pippen (one of the 50 greatest of all time) and Rodman for God sakes. [/quote]

I’m looking at it more from the vantage point of 'Melo. If he leaves and goes to LA there should be attacks on his character (a player who hasn’t won a ring looking for an “easy way in” - even though he’d actually be going into a BETTER situation then what LeBron is in right now) the same way their were attacks on LeBron. If you’re a Lakers fan and you see this how can you want him to come to your team but hate what the move represents. In the end 'Melo would be the antithesis of the supposedly “pure I’ll stick with this team” Kobe.

Regardless it’s a bit weird how even some Laker fans are championing this trade when they were so confident at the beginning of the season they’d win another ring. Upgrades are always welcome but really?[/quote]

Point taken. I’m one of the Laker fans that is NOT welcoming it. I have serious reservations about it. It potentially messes up chemistry; you give up your 5 spot with no true center to backfill; you get Melo for the 3 spot and then what do you do with Artest?; it changes the whole identity of the team; etc.

That being said, if the Lakers can’t beat either the Celtics or the Magic in the next week here it may not matter. The team I thought was so great simply would not have beaten any of the contenders in the regular season as of yet and that is concerning and may propel a change from Buss. This next week will be very telling…

scj119 · February 9, 2011, 3:05pm

[quote]randman wrote:

[quote]Gettnitdone wrote:
Um why aren’t you mentioning the fact that Melo and Kobe would have to share the “it guy” status. If you’re a Lakers fan and rooting for this you need to get the fuck out for being a hypocrite and all the shit that was said about LeBron going to Miami.

If Kobe was “Kobe” he wouldn’t want this to happen, neither would 'Melo who would rather have a greater role in NY with a chance to reestablish a franchise.[/quote]

Kobe is a smart player. He knows the only way he could even be considered one of the greatest is to get to 7 to 8 championships. He’s already won 5 and won 2 as the undisputed man. I think Kobe would definitely welcome this.

It’s Carmelo, believe it or not, that I don’t think would want to adjust. They both take 19.5 shots a game. Kobe wants to win more championships than MJ and doesn’t care how it gets done at this point in his career is my pure speculative point of view.

And with regards to being a hypocrite, not the same scenario. Couldn’t be further in difference. Kobe’s won 5 championships. It’s not like he didn’t have any, left his team to go onto another stud’s team that already won 1 championship as the “man” and try to get some himself. Completely, completely different situations.

If Lebron attracted to Bosh and whoever else to HIS team, then so be it. Hell, Jordan had freaking Pippen (one of the 50 greatest of all time) and Rodman for God sakes. [/quote]

This is the dumbest post I’ve read in this thread. Well, the last two sentences anyway.

First off - LBJ, Bosh and Wade agreed to play together a long time ago - the location is totally irrelevant. Wade didn’t “recruit” LBJ to play there - it was the only location of the three that they could all end up (salary tax rules). And since they had already agreed they’d play together SOMEWHERE, that’s where they went. They COULDN’T sign all three in CLE so that point is completely irrelevant.

And you’re comparing this to JORDAN AND PIPPEN? Dear god dude… Jordan didn’t “woo” Pippen to the bulls… Pippen didn’t “ask” to join the bulls… he was traded for fucking Olden Polynice before he’d played a single minute of NBA basketball. I honestly can’t figure out how you could even think that’s related to this conversation.

Of course you can’t win without help, we all know that… what we’re talking about is the similarities between a superstar asking to join another superstar because he can’t win in his home town. Neither Jordan nor Pippen did that.

scj119 · February 9, 2011, 3:31pm

Yeah I think Melo’s camp floated this whole Bynum roomer to create leverage with NYK…I’m not buying it. Let’s look at the flip side of this… why the hell would Denver do it? Trade Melo for an injury-plagued young center, when Center is one of the only positions they have a good young player? I mean you’d give up melo to have Nene and Bynum on the same team? Makes no sense.

randman · February 9, 2011, 4:41pm

[quote]scj119 wrote:
First off - LBJ, Bosh and Wade agreed to play together a long time ago - the location is totally irrelevant. Wade didn’t “recruit” LBJ to play there - it was the only location of the three that they could all end up (salary tax rules). And since they had already agreed they’d play together SOMEWHERE, that’s where they went. They COULDN’T sign all three in CLE so that point is completely irrelevant.
[/quote]

No, it’s not. The fact that Lebron had to sign up with someone who already led a team to a championship is VERY relevant. You have to remember the measuring stick everyone has heaped upon Lebron. He’s already GOAT, he will be GOAT, etc, etc. That’s why I’m always looking at his moves closely. You can’t be considered GOAT in the NBA of all time when you collude with other players that have already won a championship.

The same measuring stick doesn’t apply to Melo or much of anyone else for that matter until the next “Lebron” comes around where everybody starts throwing out GOAT labels like their candy.

[quote]f
And you’re comparing this to JORDAN AND PIPPEN? Dear god dude… Jordan didn’t “woo” Pippen to the bulls… Pippen didn’t “ask” to join the bulls… he was traded for fucking Olden Polynice before he’d played a single minute of NBA basketball. I honestly can’t figure out how you could even think that’s related to this conversation.
[/quote]

You obviously didn’t understand my point. Your absolutely right, Jordan didn’t collude or even have to woo Pippen in this case. I was making another point of the superior talent he had around him. So IF Kobe got Melo on his team so be it.

[quote]
Of course you can’t win without help, we all know that… what we’re talking about is the similarities between a superstar asking to join another superstar because he can’t win in his home town. Neither Jordan nor Pippen did that.[/quote]

Agreed. That IS my point. Lebron has done this however. So let’s not hear anymore GOAT labels with this guy until he wins his 8, cough, championships.

scj119 · February 9, 2011, 5:07pm

[quote]randman wrote:

[quote]scj119 wrote:
First off - LBJ, Bosh and Wade agreed to play together a long time ago - the location is totally irrelevant. Wade didn’t “recruit” LBJ to play there - it was the only location of the three that they could all end up (salary tax rules). And since they had already agreed they’d play together SOMEWHERE, that’s where they went. They COULDN’T sign all three in CLE so that point is completely irrelevant.
[/quote]

No, it’s not. The fact that Lebron had to sign up with someone who already led a team to a championship is VERY relevant. You have to remember the measuring stick everyone has heaped upon Lebron. He’s already GOAT, he will be GOAT, etc, etc. That’s why I’m always looking at his moves closely. You can’t be considered GOAT in the NBA of all time when you collude with other players that have already won a championship.

The same measuring stick doesn’t apply to Melo or much of anyone else for that matter until the next “Lebron” comes around where everybody starts throwing out GOAT labels like their candy.

[quote]f
And you’re comparing this to JORDAN AND PIPPEN? Dear god dude… Jordan didn’t “woo” Pippen to the bulls… Pippen didn’t “ask” to join the bulls… he was traded for fucking Olden Polynice before he’d played a single minute of NBA basketball. I honestly can’t figure out how you could even think that’s related to this conversation.
[/quote]

You obviously didn’t understand my point. Your absolutely right, Jordan didn’t collude or even have to woo Pippen in this case. I was making another point of the superior talent he had around him. So IF Kobe got Melo on his team so be it.

[quote]
Of course you can’t win without help, we all know that… what we’re talking about is the similarities between a superstar asking to join another superstar because he can’t win in his home town. Neither Jordan nor Pippen did that.[/quote]

Agreed. That IS my point. Lebron has done this however. So let’s not hear anymore GOAT labels with this guy until he wins his 8, cough, championships.[/quote]

Ok, well, we have different starting points then. I don’t personally think of LeBron as the GOAT nor did I think anyone else does.

I’d like him to become the GOAT, just because I like watching greatness… but to do that he’d need to win a few titles with Wade, then lead some team to a few more after Wade’s body breaks down (which IMO it will fairly soon, and that makes me sad).

FWIW, all the Kobe-LeBron arguments we had before, I was talking about their CURRENT skill level, not their place in bball history. Obviously, if I made a top-50 list of all-time players, Kobe would be ahead of LBJ.

scj119 · February 9, 2011, 5:14pm

Just want to put this out there… maybe LBJ did go to “Wade’s team”… but watch their games and look at their stats, LeBron is having another ridiculous season, especially since December. If you came into this season having never watched an NBA game or read a single headline, you’d think this was LeBron’s team.

No disrespect to Wade, but LBJ is just something else right now. I mean shit, the Magic taunted him pregame last week and he just threw up a 51-11-8 on a whim. Twice in 6 days he’s thrown up at least 40pts, 11reb and 8ast in a game. Hate to say it but LBJ deserves MVP, even over my boy D-Rose.

randman · February 9, 2011, 6:34pm