[quote]Smashingweights wrote:
Things that I will go ahead and knock without ever trying:
Squats on an exercise ball
Meth/heroin
Eating poop
Gay sex
Dead lifts with 5 second negatives
Vegetarianism[/quote]
Smashing, you gotta start living my man!
[quote]bodies_beyond wrote:
you should of added a minimum of 4kgs of lean mass assuming youāre a natural lifter and ate well (if anabolically gifted, you can expect a hell of a lot more)[/quote]
Man I must not be eating well! I wanna get on this gainz train you speak of, the gaining at least 4 kg of lean mass in 12 weeks
[quote]pwolves17 wrote:
[quote]Smashingweights wrote:
Things that I will go ahead and knock without ever trying:
Squats on an exercise ball
Meth/heroin
Eating poop
Gay sex
Dead lifts with 5 second negatives
Vegetarianism[/quote]
Smashing, you gotta start living my man![/quote]
lol, Iāll pass on life I guess.
I canāt believe you teach your clients a 5 sec negative on deads. Thatās borderline negligence in my book.
Do you know of any other Strength & Conditioning coach that does? There might be some insight there.
Kewl
In the last 2 days Iāve seen a couple programās pop up on the net with other coaches using a long eccentric on deads, Charles Poliquinās AGVT involves deads at a 5010 tempo and just this morning I saw Vince Del Monteās 6/12/25 method with a 6010 tempo for deads. Iām not the only oneā¦ Like I said, donāt knock it till you try it.
[quote]bodies_beyond wrote:
In the last 2 days Iāve seen a couple programās pop up on the net with other coaches using a long eccentric on deads, Charles Poliquinās AGVT involves deads at a 5010 tempo and just this morning I saw Vince Del Monteās 6/12/25 method with a 6010 tempo for deads. Iām not the only oneā¦ Like I said, donāt knock it till you try it.[/quote]
You weigh like 150 lbsā¦
[quote]bodies_beyond wrote:
Charles Poliquinās AGVT involves deads at a 5010 tempo[/quote]
Poliquin also says in that article:
āIn the exercises that are prescribed for 10 sets, use a load with which youād normally be able to do 12 repetitions. The goal in this phase is to do 10 sets of 6 with that load.ā
So youāre using a dramatically lighter weight.
Again, he says to do them for sets of 6, and theyāre being supersetted with leg curls for 12 and hyperextensions for 25. Lighter weight, less inherent risk and more room to play with a slower tempo.
Youāre suggesting deficit deads for 9x3/2/1 with 4-second negatives and conventional deads 8x1 for 5-second negatives.
If you say youāve seen results and no problems (yet), fine enough. But it should be overwhelmingly clear to you that youāre playing with fire (and your clientsā spines).
[quote]bodies_beyond wrote:
In the last 2 days Iāve seen a couple programās pop up on the net with other coaches using a long eccentric on deads, Charles Poliquinās AGVT involves deads at a 5010 tempo and just this morning I saw Vince Del Monteās 6/12/25 method with a 6010 tempo for deads. Iām not the only oneā¦ Like I said, donāt knock it till you try it.[/quote]
I know tons of people who arenāt dead. Therefore, we donāt die!
The thing that I find strange, though, is that you identified yourself as a power athlete (strongman, soon to be a powerlifter).
Negatives training (which is essentially what you are advocating with a 9x1 scheme at 5010) is something that can be helpful but should definitely be done in moderation because of the ungodly microtrauma and neural fatigue youāll endure if you do that type of training too often. Furthermore, while negatives may (notice the āmayā since I donāt think evidence is clear on the issue) improve hypertrophy and strength in small doses when compared to quick eccentrics only, the need for power production is going to trump that benefit by far when competing in strength sports. IMO, a successful powerlfter would never do 5 second eccentrics on his deadlift unless done in moderation, and as an assistance move in the off season, since it is well known that eccentrics will drain power output, sometimes for up to multiple weeks.
That aside, I donāt think anyone is denying that negatives or long eccentrics can work (for hypertrophy especially), and I know Poliquin advocates them among others, but why do them on things like calf raises or curls? What is the perceived benefit? Do you think calves or biceps even require attention on an intesification block let alone at that rep scheme and tempo?
The criticisms arenāt leveled at the technique, so much as their application and seeming lack of purpose.
On a more serious note, Iām gonna give 2x bodyweight snatches with a 5 second negative a go. I need progress!
LOL
Since youāre quoting Piloquin on the merits of eccentric deadlifting, hereās a snippet about squats vs. deadlifts from his facebook just moments ago.
āĀ· Pure eccentric work is easier to perform safely in the squat that in the deadlift.ā
I donāt really understand ecentric deads. Why not just do RDLs or rack pulls? Nearly the same benefit and way less risk.
Well here, I tried it. Seemed fine I guess.
[quote]csulli wrote:
Well here, I tried it. Seemed fine I guess.[/quote]
Is that an okie bar? It looked like it had more flex than a texas power bar.
I actually like slower eccentrics on deads, but I never count time. I just control it so I can do touch and gos.
[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
Is that an okie bar? It looked like it had more flex than a texas power bar.
I actually like slower eccentrics on deads, but I never count time. I just control it so I can do touch and gos.[/quote]
Na itās a Texas. We musta got an extra bendy one lol.
OP, I started reading your post with great interest, I to try my best to be a strengthcoach in a comercial gym (this is tough) and alot of what you were saying seemed good----at first. You quoted some trueisms in strength training, but then you stomped on a bunch more āLess is moreāā " you canāt serve two masters" let alone five. and some more that donāt come to mind.
You talk about thinking outside the box, and keeping an open mind, Iāve been doing what you claim to do for 20+ years, I have one request/ piece of advice, might help you see the other side of training. Yesterdays article " Lift a day program" Try this for 4 weeks, as a strength coach you have to guinnie pig your self somtimes, to find ideas for your clients.
The lift a day program is the complete oppisite from how you train, but Iām willing to bet it will open your eyes, and you may find the answer some where in the middle.
When I was 24 I thought I knew it all, and now at 40 I realize how little I know, now, let alone then. I do know itās hard to be great at 1-2 things, let alone 30 things. Four weeks isnāt a big deal, try following yesterdays program for four weeks, I think it will change your mind, and mabey your life. If you truely want to be a great strength coach try learning, and mastering some simple basics first, than worry about the complicated stuff in years to come.
Remamber Iāve been doing what you do for almost as long as youāve been alive. Getting big, and strong is a simple process, and the only real way to screw it up is to over complicate it. 2centsāGoodluck
[quote]csulli wrote:
[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
Is that an okie bar? It looked like it had more flex than a texas power bar.
I actually like slower eccentrics on deads, but I never count time. I just control it so I can do touch and gos.[/quote]
Na itās a Texas. We musta got an extra bendy one lol.[/quote]
I meant to say deadlift bar instead of power bar, but Iām sure you meant the same, haha.
[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
[quote]csulli wrote:
[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
Is that an okie bar? It looked like it had more flex than a texas power bar.
I actually like slower eccentrics on deads, but I never count time. I just control it so I can do touch and gos.[/quote]
Na itās a Texas. We musta got an extra bendy one lol.[/quote]
I meant to say deadlift bar instead of power bar, but Iām sure you meant the same, haha.[/quote]
Oh yea lol, I didnt even notice. I knew you meant deadlift bar.