[quote]Avoids Roids wrote:
Good points and I agree, BK. I pointed out that weekly volume usually does not change. Frequency can change but does not necessarily have to. If you look at the answers so far in the Frequency Poll, they tend to support what you are saying that frequency isn’t changing much with or without splits. That surprises me and seems to be saying that frequency plays a bigger role in workouts than I previously thought.[/quote]
Can you find the contradiction?
[quote]Go heavy fool wrote:
Please just quit before I destroy every ounce of sanity you had left. I don’t have a nice button. But, I am letting you off the hook because I do feel you are deeply disturbed.
I am ignoring all your posts as of now. So don’t post to me, I will not read them.
[/quote]
Oh - so now you are ignoring me? What a little whiny bitch.
If what you have posted so far in your short, but humiliating stay here at T-Nation is any indication - you have nothing that can even approach my skills in flaming.
Ignoring me won’t stop the assault you are about to endure. You have pulled the cork, dickwad. What happens now will only be stopped by the mods’ sense of compassion on your sorry ass.
As they say. Game On. Bitch.
[quote]Avoids Roids wrote:
Burger King wrote:
Avoids Roids wrote:
AR’s ‘diversionary’ comment of the day:
What does a split split?
Hmmmmm. A full body work out!
Does weekly volume change in a split versus FB workout?
Not usually.
Then what does change?
Frequency, of course.
LOL. Hold on guys. I will save you the typing. “I am an asshole.” How do I know. Why, my wife told me so. LOL.
Frequency does NOT have to be reduced on a split.
If you do TBT on Mon/Wed/Fri, you could split that up into upper body Mon/Wed/Fri and lower body Tues/Thurs/Sat.
Or you can have Upper Pull in AM sessions Mon/Wed/Fri, Upper Push in PM Mon/Wed/Fri, Lower Hip AM Tues/Thurs/Sat and Lower Quad PM Tues/Thurs/Sat.
Again ,just because you split it in more sessions doesnt mean that the overall volume has to change.
Good points and I agree, BK. I pointed out that weekly volume usually does not change. Frequency can change but does not necessarily have to. If you look at the answers so far in the Frequency Poll, they tend to support what you are saying that frequency isn’t changing much with or without splits. That surprises me and seems to be saying that frequency plays a bigger role in workouts than I previously thought.[/quote]
Can you tell me the difference between the frequency of a chest fly and a bench press? Now what does that have to do with whether or not I do the bench 3 times a week or a fly & a bench press and a cable cross over.
You’re missing the forest Avoids Roids. But keep typing please. Your feuling my conclusion with every post.
Just a random thought, but if somebody did actually have all the answers I’d imagine they’d be proud to display the results of their work and they’d be too busy making wads of cash from those secrets to give away the knowledge in the forums here.
Carry on.
[quote]Avoids Roids wrote:
Go heavy fool wrote:
Avoids Roids wrote:
Does weekly volume change in a split versus FB workout? Then what does change? Frequency, of course.
Yes, volume changes, and load volume changes. And, stressload volume changes. Also direct volume changes. Direct stress changes. Direct stress load changes. Isolation volume changes. Isolation stress changes. Isolation stress load changes.
You left alot out there. At least you avoid roids. Good man.
Actually I have been on Androgel for about 18 months. My Test bottomed out at under 80 ng/dl and so an Endo suggested Androgel or the shots. I chose the gel for several reasons. Now my test runs around 600 ng/dl…not high but very comfortable for me. My moniker is a hangover from several years ago when this site first got a forum and is probably technically incorrect now.
I don’t think load or volume change much from FB to splits. I’m sure they do for some individuals but not as a generalization. I don’t know what those other terms mean so I can’t agree or disagree.[/quote]
Dammit, I wish you knew shit. Now I will have to break this fucker down and type forever. think about it. It just a measurment of stress(LOAD) on the muscle. The TBT will stress more indirectly and the split more directly. You’re trying to trade volume for a direct load on the muscle when its being intentionally hit and hit with more intensity. This is overall stress per workout.
Three 75% indirect intensity workouts(TBT) a week on a muscle, don’t exactly break the muscle down the same way in just one all out 100% intensity(Split) workout does. Especially when the muscle is isolated and stressed to the max.
[quote]vroom wrote:
Just a random thought, but if somebody did actually have all the answers I’d imagine they’d be proud to display the results of their work and they’d be too busy making wads of cash from those secrets to give away the knowledge in the forums here.
Carry on.[/quote]
Funny thing about know-it-alls…They know way way less than most people.
Below is a quote from Staley in another thread. I post this just so others might see the difference between a professional trainer and an asshole who plays one on the internet:
[b][i]The bottom line, quite simply, is this:
In the quest to educate yourself on a particular topic matter, there’s no way to bypass the learning curve…you have to start off knowing nothing, and then traverse the path of knowing a little, being confused, then gaining confidence, then realizing that what you thought you know was wrong, etc., etc.
I’ve been in this industry since about 1963, and I haven’t reconciled it all yet, so give yourself another 20 years or so before you get too frustrated!
It’s vital that you can be “OK” with not knowing…to be OK about being confused. [/b][/i]
Avoids Roids… you CAN’T compare frequency of two different routines and count them as equal. then say, well since this routine is done 3 times a week, and this routine is done 6 times a week than the 6 times must be better right. WRONG!
Example:
If I do a bench press 3 times a week for chest for 5x5 lets say. Now compare to a routine that does chest once for 15 sets. Are they equal? Equal in sets? ~ yes Equal in volume lets just say ~ yes. Now equal in intensity? Hell NO!
Split trainers have showed tho bodies of what kind of damage and rebuilding is done when worked at a higher intensity + amore isolation and direct work = more aesthetics and more growth for the bodybuilder. The powerlifter may get more strength, but that is not the application of the intended TBT(for comparing against splits for bodybuilding purposes), so why use it for bodybuilding purposes.
TBT is great for strength Hence… Chad Waterbury(Strength coach).
[quote]vroom wrote:
Just a random thought, but if somebody did actually have all the answers I’d imagine they’d be proud to display the results of their work and they’d be too busy making wads of cash from those secrets to give away the knowledge in the forums here.
Carry on.[/quote]
We have the answers vroom. All of us do. Its just a matter of proving it. Some people just know thru experience. I will explain why. I’m getting to that. I need to get people to stop thinking in terms of volume, frequency, sets and so forth. Muscle does not break down on any of that. It breaks down on overload. If the overload is not stressful enough … IT WILL NOT CHANGE. The greater the stress, the greater the change.
More to follow…
GHF,
I think you actually know your stuff about training, and have offered some good advice. As far as this flame war is going however, you are getting absolutely destroyed and are ranting like a lunatic. You are constantly contradicting yourself and are really destroying your reputation.
I think it would be a good idea to actually stop posting here, like you keep saying you will, and continue to offer useful advice in some other threads.
I’m running out of time. I will pick up where I left off unless someone can take over on “STRESS”. There is not a scientific calculation for the total damage done in volume or sets or reps or frequency… its only done in total amount of stress the muscle was put under. The TUT can factor positive or negative. More TUT doesn’t mean more stress. I will have to explain this too.
Somebody take over. I don’t have time. But diffrential types of stress is where the two training styles drasticly differ. Now your effort and intensity only complicate this. Because I can get more results with a TBT done 100% effort and a split done half assed.
BUT, done the same effort… the SPLIT wins huge over TBT for bodybuilders because the stress is more based on hypertrophy than strength.
[quote]Bootsie wrote:
GHF,
I think you actually know your stuff about training, and have offered some good advice. As far as this flame war is going however, you are getting absolutely destroyed and are ranting like a lunatic. You are constantly contradicting yourself and are really destroying your reputation.
I think it would be a good idea to actually stop posting here, like you keep saying you will, and continue to offer useful advice in some other threads.[/quote]
I could give a fuck less about a rep.
Or this site. I will do what i do best then leave. You can flame me later.
[quote]Bootsie wrote:
GHF,
I think you actually know your stuff about training, and have offered some good advice. As far as this flame war is going however, you are getting absolutely destroyed and are ranting like a lunatic. You are constantly contradicting yourself and are really destroying your reputation.
I think it would be a good idea to actually stop posting here, like you keep saying you will, and continue to offer useful advice in some other threads.[/quote]
Bootsie, if I were you and had that build… I’d listen to everything i got to say, then you can join the flame train of idiots and have a field day trying to insult someone with a better graps on training then you could possibly know. I have 2 more topics to cover and they’re not on splits vs fullbody’s then Im outta here.
I’ll release the epiphany… there are no secrets.
[quote]Go heavy fool wrote:
I will do what i do best then leave. You can flame me later.
[/quote]
I think you already have. Being a a chicken shit fucking prick is indeed an art form you have mastered.
Now - don’t let the door hit you on your ass as you leave.
[quote]Go heavy fool wrote:
Avoids Roids… you CAN’T compare frequency of two different routines and count them as equal. then say, well since this routine is done 3 times a week, and this routine is done 6 times a week than the 6 times must be better right. WRONG!
I don’t think I said that. I believe I indicated that many recent published sciencific studies have concluded that working a bodypart 2 to 4 times per week appears to be ideal for strength and hypertrophy. All I have ever really intimated is that working a muscle group only once per week is not ideal.
Example:
If I do a bench press 3 times a week for chest for 5x5 lets say. Now compare to a routine that does chest once for 15 sets. Are they equal? Equal in sets? ~ yes Equal in volume lets just say ~ yes. Now equal in intensity? Hell NO!
Actually, I have to agree with you. The intensity with one workout per week will be less IF you measure intensity by load only because you can move more weight over, lets say, 3 workouts than you can in one workout because of the fatigue factor. However, I can’t really make any statement about intensity without knowing other variables such a % of max reps performed, rest between sets, etc.
Split trainers have showed tho bodies of what kind of damage and rebuilding is done when worked at a higher intensity + amore isolation and direct work = more aesthetics and more growth for the bodybuilder. The powerlifter may get more strength, but that is not the application of the intended TBT(for comparing against splits for bodybuilding purposes), so why use it for bodybuilding purposes.
TBT is great for strength Hence… Chad Waterbury(Strength coach).[/quote]
Your two statements above seem, I think, to be based on the assumption that iso’s can only be done in a split workout and not a FB workout. That, of course, is not true and I have never indicated otherwise. I use some isolations.
GHF, I am glad you are happy with your workout scheme and the results you have acheived with it. I admire your passion. I wish I could bottle it and compete against Biotest.
[quote]Go heavy fool wrote:
a whole nother page of bull-shit (and I’ve only been gone for less than 1 day!)
[/quote]
Yet, still, no pics.
I can delete all of my pics and start making all the claims you do, and more. That doesn’t make them true.
You’ve NEVER proven yourself here.
[quote]SWR-1240 wrote:
I can delete all of my pics and start making all the claims you do, and more. That doesn’t make them true.
[/quote]
Maybe so, but you gotta admit it’s cheaper than buying film.
I can’t believe you guys are arguing with the Fool. You do realize he is some teenage kid, right? How can you try to have a serious discussion with someone who thinks he knows more than all the T-Nation writers combined?
Isn’t this the same guy who said Arnold had bad genetics and he also apparently is a better guitarist than Clapton, Hendrix, Van Halen, etc, but that was another topic.
Don’t even get him started on his “iron will” or better yet do. Rev him up and watch him go. Arnold is his biggest hero, but he hates “drug users”. LOL
Well Rainjack, I am very glad you told me you were juicin. I admire your honesty, and it shows you are a stand up guy. And I agree with Vroom, it was a stand up move to say it would not be a fair competition, and also not cool to use it to continue a flame war.
I did some test cyp. about 10 years ago. I see no problem with it.
[quote]Go heavy fool wrote:
buffalokilla wrote:
Go heavy fool wrote:
Avoids Roids wrote:
Does weekly volume change in a split versus FB workout? Then what does change? Frequency, of course.
Yes, volume changes, and load volume changes. And, stressload volume changes. Also direct volume changes. Direct stress changes. Direct stress load changes. Isolation volume changes. Isolation stress changes. Isolation stress load changes.
There is one factor inexperienced guys don’t take into account and that is load and direct stress(this is all bodybuilding is in a nutshell) on that muscle. This will destroy your entire volume calculation for intensity and effectiveness of the routine.
[/quote]
You didn’t answer my question, GHF. What is “isolation stress?” What is “direct stress?” I understand load. I calculate volume as number of reps X number of sets per ‘muscle group’, for lack of a better term there. Tonnage to me is reps X sets X load.
What do the terms you mentioned mean?
-Dan
[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
jp_dubya wrote:
splitters, please answer
- Explain the reason why there are so many splitters who fail?
- Explain the tremendous results of SOME that use TBT like HST, max stim, dogcrapp
TBT’ers
-
Explain why so many people fail to progress with a TBT
-
Explain the success of split routines.
No one has sold me yet the superiority of their choice. I see personal preferences defended with anecdotal evidence
I would propose that neither one is superior by concept or design, and that neither system has any inherent failure.
It is the people that implement them that fail.
[/quote]
5 star response.
I am curious how the direct arm work arguement hasn’t popped up yet in this thred.