Zyzz Found Dead

Off Topic
281

Well, note that I said “[IF] we accept…and assume…must define his death as tragic.” If those things are either assumed or proven to be true, his death is tragic.

My ‘opening statement’ was dependent on a pretty heavy if.

I’m not saying definitively one way or the other, because I didn’t know him personally, BUT I have a hard time seeing how an affinity for drugs and having an personality which seems to require excess in all its form to function isn’t a flaw.

BTW - to your point that he was in Thailand and grown enough to know what he was getting into. You’re right. And yes, those are choices. That said, knowing the consequences of bad decisions and then undertaking the action anyway doesn’t disqualify the possibility that the decision-making itself could be a flaw in his character.

We all know people for whom epic lack of judgement is their greatest flaw.

282

I feel for the man’s family, but this was not some tragic accident. It’s him serving the role he’s apparently best suited for; a bad example. This is what a lack of humility and refusal to learn or recognize your limits does for you. Just because I have one thing in common with this guy doesn’t make me sympathetic to him.

And I really don’t give two shits how intelligent the guy was or how much of a ‘really great guy he was when you got to know him’. He was a dick. On purpose. And he had a big following of guys who want to be just like him. Which means his legacy to the world was leaving behind a bunch of fucktards that he influenced to be complete dickheads. Gee, thanks, guy. Just what we all needed.

283

[quote]JayPierce wrote:
I feel for the man’s family, but this was not some tragic accident. It’s him serving the role he’s apparently best suited for; a bad example. This is what a lack of humility and refusal to learn or recognize your limits does for you. Just because I have one thing in common with this guy doesn’t make me sympathetic to him.

And I really don’t give two shits how intelligent the guy was or how much of a ‘really great guy he was when you got to know him’. He was a dick. On purpose. And he had a big following of guys who want to be just like him. Which means his legacy to the world was leaving behind a bunch of fucktards that he influenced to be complete dickheads. Gee, thanks, guy. Just what we all needed.

[/quote]

I think the fucktards that he infuenced would have been fucktards anyway. It’s not a learned trait over the long term, it’s in their DNA.

284

[quote]JayPierce wrote:
This is what a lack of humility and refusal to learn or recognize your limits does for you.
[/quote]

every single one of these statements could be used to describe Arnold. Do you feel the same way about Arnold as you do this Zyzz kid?

(a lot, if not most, celebrities probably fit this bill as well)

this kid is getting so much internet hate for no reason. He never posted over here, most of you guys are claiming that you’ve never heard of him till this thread and then you go and talk shit about a man who’s passed away?

way to stay classy guys

285

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]JayPierce wrote:
This is what a lack of humility and refusal to learn or recognize your limits does for you.
[/quote]

every single one of these statements could be used to describe Arnold. Do you feel the same way about Arnold as you do this Zyzz kid?

(a lot, if not most, celebrities probably fit this bill as well)

this kid is getting so much internet hate for no reason. He never posted over here, most of you guys are claiming that you’ve never heard of him till this thread and then you go and talk shit about a man who’s passed away?

way to stay classy guys
[/quote]

You forgot the picture.

286

I read about him a bit…him and his brother claimed to be natty even tho they were on juice from day 1. According to people who met him he lied about his weight, height and lifts. He was the skinny kid with abs but then he bulked up while keeping low bf and I thought that was impressive but he was basically using an entire pharmacy to get his physique…meh.

The guy was funny. didn’t take himself seriously but I think it got to his head and became an egomaniac

287

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Honestly, for character flaws to have the power to give direct name to tragedy, then nearly every pro bodybuilder who ever died like Mentzer did was a tragedy as well…but I am betting few here would see it that way.[/quote]

Speaking of Mentzer, I remember the news went out the day after he died, and I felt deeply sad and numb all day. In some ways he was like a father figure to me, since he was a huge idol to me as a teen and onward.

Obviously, sometimes the depth of emotion has to do with some connection. In the case of this Zyzz kid, I’m old enough to be his dad, so yes, he’s a kid to me and I feel sad for the loss. Tragic? In that sense yes.

288

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]JayPierce wrote:
This is what a lack of humility and refusal to learn or recognize your limits does for you.
[/quote]

every single one of these statements could be used to describe Arnold. Do you feel the same way about Arnold as you do this Zyzz kid?

(a lot, if not most, celebrities probably fit this bill as well)[/quote]
To a certain extent, yes. His physique is something to aspire to, and some of the characters he’s played in movies are awesome, but I can’t see a reason for anyone to be so stuck on themselves that they insult people with complete disregard.

I have no use for celebrities. I place no value on them or their opinions.

[quote]this kid is getting so much internet hate for no reason. He never posted over here, most of you guys are claiming that you’ve never heard of him till this thread and then you go and talk shit about a man who’s passed away?

way to stay classy guys
[/quote]
I’m not hating on him. It just aggravates me that people die every day - people who have the potential to be useful to the world - and here are a bunch of people who have never met this guy, mourning over him as if he was some great loss.

289

^^I wasnt specifically addressing you with that last part… I agree with your assessment though. I dont understand why people idolize “celebrities” so much and cry over their deaths. It just doesnt really make sense to me.

When MJ died there were all kinds of people holding memorials and crying in the streets??? I dont get it. Yeah its a bummer that the world lost one of the music industries greatest performers but its nothing to cry about in the streets if you didnt know the person.

290

[quote]gregron wrote:
Yeah its a bummer that the world lost one of the music industries greatest performers but its nothing to cry about in the streets if you didnt know the person.[/quote]

Greg

Sometimes people connect with lyrics, or something in the way a star expresses themselves. This connection sometimes is in sync with the listener’s experiences at that time of their lives. Often you’ll hear someone say “So-and-so’s music helped me get through a really rough time in my life”. I do believe in the power of art (especially music and literature), and in these types of cases, the loss of the artist is like a small blow to those whose lives had been so directed/affected by the artists’ craft.

291

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]DTP88 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
Prof X, you just reminded me of an odd thing that maybe others can relate to.

At around 22-24, a whole assload of people I knew started dropping like flies. Either by straight up overdose or some other careless drug related misadventure.

Right around 30-33, a whole other wave of people started dropping off with car wrecks and the occasional homicide.

Now at 39 it’s more sporadic but more deliberate. People dying of hard life heart failure or cirrhosis/pancreatic failure, some eating a gun and a couple others hanging themselves.

Its like it comes in waves or stages of life. These age ranges seem like transitional periods in life where some people move through them and on to better things or stop permanently.

[/quote]

I agree with this. However, I knew a lot of people who died around the age of 20-25. I had one friend who died of a heart attack at 27. My best friend when I was a kid died before we were 8 years old. I grew up around it…and as a result, if I had to tell the truth, I was shocked I reached 30 years of age on some level.

But, my main point is that people now consider grown men “too young to die”…when death is going to take every single one of us and 100 years ago, 23 years of age wasn’t even considered young. You were old by then.

It just struck me as odd that a grown man of 23 can die, especially under the circumstances here. He had money. He had fun. He died partying. Where is the TRAGEDY?[/quote]

That he’s dead :[/quote]

Well, that is more natural than a tragedy. People who overdose on drugs in Thailand are likely to die.

People who ride motorcycles increase their chances of going out that way.

That’s life.

I ride a motorcycle.

If I die today, don’t say it was tragic.

Say, “That fucker did what he wanted to do and died that way too…let’s go eat a hamburger in his honor”.[/quote]

I like that mind-set!

YOU HAVE MY BURGER!

292

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:
Yeah its a bummer that the world lost one of the music industries greatest performers but its nothing to cry about in the streets if you didnt know the person.[/quote]

Greg

Sometimes people connect with lyrics, or something in the way a star expresses themselves. This connection sometimes is in sync with the listener’s experiences at that time of their lives. Often you’ll hear someone say “So-and-so’s music helped me get through a really rough time in my life”. I do believe in the power of art (especially music and literature), and in these types of cases, the loss of the artist is like a small blow to those whose lives had been so directed/affected by the artists’ craft. [/quote]

Exactly.

People worship these artists. They read everything they can about them, own all their albums, follow them from concert to concert etc. Have you ever seen a fan’s reaction to meeting Michael Jackson? Some of them start crying and lose control just from being so close to him.

293

[quote]JayPierce wrote:
I feel for the man’s family, but this was not some tragic accident. It’s him serving the role he’s apparently best suited for; a bad example. This is what a lack of humility and refusal to learn or recognize your limits does for you. Just because I have one thing in common with this guy doesn’t make me sympathetic to him.

And I really don’t give two shits how intelligent the guy was or how much of a ‘really great guy he was when you got to know him’. He was a dick. On purpose. And he had a big following of guys who want to be just like him. Which means his legacy to the world was leaving behind a bunch of fucktards that he influenced to be complete dickheads. Gee, thanks, guy. Just what we all needed.

[/quote]

Again, you’re assuming you know what happened to him. Because someone on the internet said he did tons of coke, doesn’t make it the truest statement. I’m sure steroids, and drugs did play a part in his death, but plenty of people did way worse and survived. Take it for what it is… He time and time again said “Zyzz” was just a character that he played and was not his real personality. He inspired me with his physique, and philosophy on life / lifting… and oddly enough I’m not an asshole to women etc. He was entertaining, if you read his real thoughts on lifting and life he can be somewhat motivating, and to me his “antics” were hillarious.

Anyway, when John Romaniello starts debating shit gets serious… Don’t think I can keep up with this all. All I have to say Prof X is if you can tell me you had lived your life and were ready to die by 23 then you win. Nothing tragic about this. If not, then to me it is a tragic and sad to see someone this young pass. As a 23 year old personal trainer, and aspiring amateur bodybuilder I feel like I have much more to do before I die.

It is what it is. Just pretty trashy to shit talk someone who has passed. Just like you didn’t know him so you don’t want to grieve for him, you didn’t know him so you shouldn’t disrespect his memory. shrug

294

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:
Yeah its a bummer that the world lost one of the music industries greatest performers but its nothing to cry about in the streets if you didnt know the person.[/quote]

Greg

Sometimes people connect with lyrics, or something in the way a star expresses themselves. This connection sometimes is in sync with the listener’s experiences at that time of their lives. Often you’ll hear someone say “So-and-so’s music helped me get through a really rough time in my life”. I do believe in the power of art (especially music and literature), and in these types of cases, the loss of the artist is like a small blow to those whose lives had been so directed/affected by the artists’ craft. [/quote]

Exactly.

People worship these artists.[/quote]

^^thats the problem right there IMO.

I see what your saying ID and I’ve got quite a few songs/albums that I really relate to and connect with because they helped me out through tough times (family dying, long term girlfriend cheating on me while I was deployed, ect…) but I wouldn’t cry if that artist died.

Is it a big loss for the community? Yes of course. Is it something that I personally think is worth shedding tears over? Absolutely not lol… But to each their own I guess. I have no vested interest in celebrities other than enjoying what they produce. I’d be bummed if a celebrity that I really liked died but I wouldn’t start shedding actual tears over it… That’s crossing over into obsession territory if you ask me.

295

[quote]DTP88 wrote:
All I have to say Prof X is if you can tell me you had lived your life and were ready to die by 23 then you win. Nothing tragic about this. [/quote]

That wasn’t what I said. Anyone can SAY they are ready for death, but no one really is ready for the discontinuation of all things they experience in this existence. That goes for 40 year olds just like it goes for those who are 23. Why are you making some distinction based on him being 23? Most of the soldiers killed in Iraq were younger than that I imagine.

My point was that I grew up around death. It wasn’t some distant concept that ONLY happened to people over 40. It was happening to kids my age at EIGHT YEARS OLD.

I think some of you have been sheltered in the sense that you really still see yourselves as “kids” even though you already grew up.

296

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:
Yeah its a bummer that the world lost one of the music industries greatest performers but its nothing to cry about in the streets if you didnt know the person.[/quote]

Greg

Sometimes people connect with lyrics, or something in the way a star expresses themselves. This connection sometimes is in sync with the listener’s experiences at that time of their lives. Often you’ll hear someone say “So-and-so’s music helped me get through a really rough time in my life”. I do believe in the power of art (especially music and literature), and in these types of cases, the loss of the artist is like a small blow to those whose lives had been so directed/affected by the artists’ craft. [/quote]

Exactly.

People worship these artists.[/quote]

^^thats the problem right there IMO.

I see what your saying ID and I’ve got quite a few songs/albums that I really relate to and connect with because they helped me out through tough times (family dying, long term girlfriend cheating on me while I was deployed, ect…) but I wouldn’t cry if that artist died.

Is it a big loss for the community? Yes of course. Is it something that I personally think is worth shedding tears over? Absolutely not lol… But to each their own I guess. I have no vested interest in celebrities other than enjoying what they produce. I’d be bummed if a celebrity that I really liked died but I wouldn’t start shedding actual tears over it… That’s crossing over into obsession territory if you ask me.[/quote]

Dude, first off, MJ was a SUPERstar. You don’t even have any of those today. Usher and Justin Beiber are NOT SUPERstars. MJ conquered the whole world before he lost it to the same people who praised him before. To anyone who wasn’t at least old enough to understand in 1985, this may seem strange…because you have never seen anyone taken to that height.

People would live outside for days just to see Michael exit a hotel room.

The only people to reach that level are groups like The beatles of maybe Elvis.

You have to understand this to know why people cried.

297

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Dude, first off, MJ was a SUPERstar. You don’t even have any of those today. Usher and Justin Beiber are NOT SUPERstars. MJ conquered the whole world before he lost it to the same people who praised him before. To anyone who wasn’t at least old enough to understand in 1985, this may seem strange…because you have never seen anyone taken to that height.

People would live outside for days just to see Michael exit a hotel room.

The only people to reach that level are groups like The beatles of maybe Elvis.

You have to understand this to know why people cried.
[/quote]

did you cry when you heard that MJ died? Did you go buy some flowers and sit in on the curb outside, make a memorial and cry about him dying?

(completely serious question cause thousands, if not millions, of people did this)

298

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Dude, first off, MJ was a SUPERstar. You don’t even have any of those today. Usher and Justin Beiber are NOT SUPERstars. MJ conquered the whole world before he lost it to the same people who praised him before. To anyone who wasn’t at least old enough to understand in 1985, this may seem strange…because you have never seen anyone taken to that height.

People would live outside for days just to see Michael exit a hotel room.

The only people to reach that level are groups like The beatles of maybe Elvis.

You have to understand this to know why people cried.
[/quote]

did you cry when you heard that MJ died? Did you go buy some flowers and sit in on the curb outside, make a memorial and cry about him dying?

(completely serious question cause thousands, if not millions, of people did this)[/quote]

I damn near cried when Mitch Hedberg died. My wife’s mother had been fighting cancer the month prior, and listening to Hedberg’s comedy was SO needed for my wife and myself. Helped us get through the tough times. Then her mom died. Then 3 weeks later Mitch Hedberg died from a drug OD, and it was just too much NOT to be distraught over.
Call me weird. :slight_smile:

299

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Dude, first off, MJ was a SUPERstar. You don’t even have any of those today. Usher and Justin Beiber are NOT SUPERstars. MJ conquered the whole world before he lost it to the same people who praised him before. To anyone who wasn’t at least old enough to understand in 1985, this may seem strange…because you have never seen anyone taken to that height.

People would live outside for days just to see Michael exit a hotel room.

The only people to reach that level are groups like The beatles of maybe Elvis.

You have to understand this to know why people cried.
[/quote]

did you cry when you heard that MJ died? Did you go buy some flowers and sit in on the curb outside, make a memorial and cry about him dying?

(completely serious question cause thousands, if not millions, of people did this)[/quote]

You want the truth? yeah, I did. I dropped a tear when he died because I grew up as a kid hearing Billy Jean on the radio trying to sing along. I dropped a tear because I remember my parents when I was a kid reminiscing about how great his music was with the jackson 5. I dropped a tear because I was in diapers when he had his own cartoon show called The Jackson 5 that was showing in reruns I believe. That dude’s music was freaking everywhere at one time.

He was the first black person MTV ever allowed to play on their network. He opened doors that many of you probably aren’t aware of…so yeah, the day I heard he died, I felt something was lost…because I remember people buying leather jackets and going to school with one glove on.

You can laugh all you want, but that’s real and it’s the truth.

300

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
I damn near cried when Mitch Hedberg died. My wife’s mother had been fighting cancer the month prior, and listening to Hedberg’s comedy was SO needed for my wife and myself. Helped us get through the tough times. Then her mom died. Then 3 weeks later Mitch Hedberg died from a drug OD, and it was just too much NOT to be distraught over.
Call me weird. :slight_smile:
[/quote]

^^ you had TONS of other family issues (real issues… which i’m sorry to hear about my friend. my condolences) but you didnt even cry… cause thats what regular people do! lol

feeling sad over the loss of an entertainer which you liked/admired is normal and to be expected. To be so distraught over it that you’re crying hysterically? that gets a “come on sooooon” from me :slight_smile: