WTF Penn State?!?!?!

Off Topic
941

[quote]tom63 wrote:

[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:

[quote]tom63 wrote:
Paterno reported the incident that he was told about. He could not do more.[quote]

Bullshit. He didn’t want to do more.[/quote]

Ok, so explain what he should have done in detail according to the laws and including employment rules in regards to retirement packages and retirees and police reporting procedures. As in when you didn’t witness the crime, how do you exactly report it? And also fill us in on the entire grand jury testimony of Paterno, Curley, McQueary, and Schultz. And any conversations with Graham Spanier.

[/quote]

I just find it very interesting that Paterno, the Alpha Male, the master-of-his-ship, the coach that IS Penn State, who doesn’t need to report to anyone - - - - SUDDENLY became sensitive to protocol, took a back seat, and gingerly tapped the issue up the ladder.

Someone mentioned before that putting McQueery in a car and driving him down to the police station to give a police report MIGHT have been a good idea. He had to ask permission to do that? No–he turned a blind eye because it would have threatened his sacred image and the football money=machine.

942

[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:

[quote]tom63 wrote:

[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:

[quote]tom63 wrote:
Paterno reported the incident that he was told about. He could not do more.[quote]

Bullshit. He didn’t want to do more.[/quote]

Ok, so explain what he should have done in detail according to the laws and including employment rules in regards to retirement packages and retirees and police reporting procedures. As in when you didn’t witness the crime, how do you exactly report it? And also fill us in on the entire grand jury testimony of Paterno, Curley, McQueary, and Schultz. And any conversations with Graham Spanier.

[/quote]

I just find it very interesting that Paterno, the Alpha Male, the master-of-his-ship, the coach that IS Penn State, who doesn’t need to report to anyone - - - - SUDDENLY became sensitive to protocol, took a back seat, and gingerly tapped the issue up the ladder.

Someone mentioned before that putting McQueery in a car and driving him down to the police station to give a police report MIGHT have been a good idea. He had to ask permission to do that? No–he turned a blind eye because it would have threatened his sacred image and the football money=machine.[/quote]

The campus is a community unto itself with its own police department. Reporting it to your superior IS tantamount to reporting it to the police. There is no reasonable belief at that time it wouldn’t be handled properly. Ever think if he wanted to cover it up, or turn a blind eye, that he never reports it to begin with? Once he reports it, its out the box and beyond his control so your empty speculation that he didn’t want to threaten HIS image (as if HE committed the crimes alleged) and football money rings weak. And since we don’t know what transpired after the report, your thoughts are …speculation.

943

And by the way, the dumbest “theory” uttered here is that Paterno turned a blind eye to save the University. Penn State Football is huge. Big enough to survive an EX-coach abusing children. Are you telling me this machine can’t survive an abuser?

It’s tantamount to saying that a school would shut down b/c a teacher was accused of abuse.

The ONLY way to hurt the school IS to do what they are accused of doing; “turning a blind-eye” and engaging in a cover-up. Neither saves the school or the program.

944

The Secret Service are now investigating Bernie Fine. Now tell me how Jim Boheim didn’t know anything here and why didn’t he do anything?
It works both ways. Again Paterno did something. Boheim did nothing. Oh, that’s right . We don’t know what actually happened in each case yet.

See how that works.

945

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:

[quote]tom63 wrote:

[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:

[quote]tom63 wrote:
Paterno reported the incident that he was told about. He could not do more.[quote]

Bullshit. He didn’t want to do more.[/quote]

Ok, so explain what he should have done in detail according to the laws and including employment rules in regards to retirement packages and retirees and police reporting procedures. As in when you didn’t witness the crime, how do you exactly report it? And also fill us in on the entire grand jury testimony of Paterno, Curley, McQueary, and Schultz. And any conversations with Graham Spanier.

[/quote]

I just find it very interesting that Paterno, the Alpha Male, the master-of-his-ship, the coach that IS Penn State, who doesn’t need to report to anyone - - - - SUDDENLY became sensitive to protocol, took a back seat, and gingerly tapped the issue up the ladder.

Someone mentioned before that putting McQueery in a car and driving him down to the police station to give a police report MIGHT have been a good idea. He had to ask permission to do that? No–he turned a blind eye because it would have threatened his sacred image and the football money=machine.[/quote]

The campus is a community unto itself with its own police department. Reporting it to your superior IS tantamount to reporting it to the police. There is no reasonable belief at that time it wouldn’t be handled properly. Ever think if he wanted to cover it up, or turn a blind eye, that he never reports it to begin with? Once he reports it, its out the box and beyond his control so your empty speculation that he didn’t want to threaten HIS image (as if HE committed the crimes alleged) and football money rings weak. And since we don’t know what transpired after the report, your thoughts are …speculation. [/quote]

Exactly. I love how people that know nothing think they know so much.

My wife was married to a dirtbag. She had to deal with the police multiple times. She also knows that you can’t report to the police hearsay from someone else. You report it to who you are supposed to and it is reasonable to assume they are going to do their job.

Saying this person told me that they saw this go do this doesn’t hold a lot of water. And pursuing it it further isn’t going to do anythiNG since YOU DIDN’T WITNESS IT.

946

What if Paterno had put McQueery in the car and drove him to the police to give a statement? Campus police, state police, municipal police…doesn’t matter. McQueery’s the so-called eye witness. Police say he never reported it. That’s the first and primary disconnect.

All of this ‘report it to your immediate supervisior and you’re OK’ bullshit…IS BULLSHIT! If a child is being raped…call 911…call police. What is so fucking difficult about that?

Paterno suddenly lost his balls and, excuse me…tells his supervisor?

947

[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:
What if Paterno had put McQueery in the car and drove him to the police to give a statement? Campus police, state police, municipal police…doesn’t matter. McQueery’s the so-called eye witness. Police say he never reported it. That’s the first and primary disconnect.

All of this ‘report it to your immediate supervisior and you’re OK’ bullshit…IS BULLSHIT! If a child is being raped…call 911…call police. What is so fucking difficult about that?

Paterno suddenly lost his balls and, excuse me…tells his supervisor? [/quote]

Yep. And it seems that those people did not do their job. So if he holds McQueary’s hand and walks him to the campus police station and they don’t do their job what is the difference. And Paterno did not witness anything. So what’s the difference?

948

[quote]therajraj wrote:
One of Sandusky’s alleged victims had leave Penn State because he is being bullied by his fellow classmates. Unbelievable.

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2011/11/alleged_jerry_sandusky_victim.html[/quote]

Did you read the article?

“Officials at Central Mountain High School in Clinton County…”

How many 17 year old college seniors do you know?

Think/read before you bash my school, please.

949

People aren’t smart. They just want to get all excited.

[quote]Raging_Teddy wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:
One of Sandusky’s alleged victims had leave Penn State because he is being bullied by his fellow classmates. Unbelievable.

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2011/11/alleged_jerry_sandusky_victim.html[/quote]

Did you read the article?

“Officials at Central Mountain High School in Clinton County…”

How many 17 year old college seniors do you know?

Think/read before you bash my school, please.[/quote]

950

[quote]tom63 wrote:

[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:
What if Paterno had put McQueery in the car and drove him to the police to give a statement? Campus police, state police, municipal police…doesn’t matter. McQueery’s the so-called eye witness. Police say he never reported it. That’s the first and primary disconnect.

All of this ‘report it to your immediate supervisor and you’re OK’ bullshit…IS BULLSHIT! If a child is being raped…call 911…call police. What is so fucking difficult about that?

Paterno suddenly lost his balls and, excuse me…tells his supervisor? [/quote]

Yep. And it seems that those people did not do their job. So if he holds McQueary’s hand and walks him to the campus police station and they don’t do their job what is the difference. And Paterno did not witness anything. So what’s the difference?[/quote]

So, you’re saying what if the police don’t do their jobs? Then, they need to be fired too…just like Paterno, his supervisor and the president of Penn State.

So, one good thing that will come out of this mess is it will be crime NOT report this to the authorities, immediately. (As if we needed a new law to compel the obvious in decency)

And you ask what difference it makes? It’s the difference between a sexual predator continuing his attacks or not. That’s the difference. Passive, pass-the-buck, not-my-job assholes make quite a difference, don’t they?

951

You aren’t really paying much attention to this case are you? Sandusky was investigated by the now declared da Gricar and no charges were filed in 98. Then since 09 our esteemed governor, Tom Corbett, then the state AG was investigating the case and didn’t seem to rushed to get a child predator off the street along with the head of the state police. Common thread with them and the media? They all placed the blame on Paterno .

That’s what people like me have a gripe with. You and many others are placing all the blame on the one person who did what ge was supposed to do. The governor and head of the state police are now hemming and hawing about their roles while saying Paterno didn’t do enough “morally”. Meanwhile other DAs and AGs are on record that they have never seen such a case where an AG didn’t get the accused off the street sooner.

Might have something to do with the money donated by the second mile to corbett’s campaign or the three million dollars he approved for the second mile, all while Sandusky was being investigated. But you don’t care about that. You’d just rather squeal about Paterno like a little girl than being patient, learning a little and waiting until you get all the facts.

[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:

[quote]tom63 wrote:

[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:
What if Paterno had put McQueery in the car and drove him to the police to give a statement? Campus police, state police, municipal police…doesn’t matter. McQueery’s the so-called eye witness. Police say he never reported it. That’s the first and primary disconnect.

All of this ‘report it to your immediate supervisor and you’re OK’ bullshit…IS BULLSHIT! If a child is being raped…call 911…call police. What is so fucking difficult about that?

Paterno suddenly lost his balls and, excuse me…tells his supervisor? [/quote]

Yep. And it seems that those people did not do their job. So if he holds McQueary’s hand and walks him to the campus police station and they don’t do their job what is the difference. And Paterno did not witness anything. So what’s the difference?[/quote]

So, you’re saying what if the police don’t do their jobs? Then, they need to be fired too…just like Paterno, his supervisor and the president of Penn State.

So, one good thing that will come out of this mess is it will be crime NOT report this to the authorities, immediately. (As if we needed a new law to compel the obvious in decency)

And you ask what difference it makes? It’s the difference between a sexual predator continuing his attacks or not. That’s the difference. Passive, pass-the-buck, not-my-job assholes make quite a difference, don’t they?[/quote]

952

^^^Jesus dude, I’ve been saying ALL ALONG that this is a massive cover-up. This goes way past just Paterno, but that doesn’t change that he could’ve and should’ve done more. Don’t know how many times I can say that we’re gonna be surprised how far down the rabbit hole this goes.

953

[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:
What if Paterno had put McQueery in the car and drove him to the police to give a statement? Campus police, state police, municipal police…doesn’t matter. McQueery’s the so-called eye witness. Police say he never reported it. That’s the first and primary disconnect.

All of this ‘report it to your immediate supervisior and you’re OK’ bullshit…IS BULLSHIT! If a child is being raped…call 911…call police. What is so fucking difficult about that?

Paterno suddenly lost his balls and, excuse me…tells his supervisor? [/quote]

In fairness, and again, we’re assuming some shit here, I think Paterno would like to have done just that…WITH THE BENEFIT OF HINDSIGHT. The point is, we don’t know what he was thinking or what his impression of the situation was because we don’t yet have all the details. When we have the details, we can start making judgments. It’s pretty simple.

954

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:
^^^Jesus dude, I’ve been saying ALL ALONG that this is a massive cover-up. This goes way past just Paterno, but that doesn’t change that he could’ve and should’ve done more. Don’t know how many times I can say that we’re gonna be surprised how far down the rabbit hole this goes.[/quote]

It doesn’t have to be a cover up. SMH

Did it ever occur to you that the case didn’t have legs in the beginning? That it wasn’t strong? You (and others) look at this with the benefit of hindsight and that’s when puzzle pieces start fitting nicely together. When you’re actually doing the puzzle, you’re struggling…you think a piece fits, only to find it doesn’t. This is what happens in an investigation. Something you think has legs, doesn’t. When shit accumulates, a case gets stronger. People just don’t up and confess to a whodunit. Witnesses/victims recant or do not want to testify and cooperate (common in an abuse case). My guess is they didn’t have what they needed to indict early on. They had already taken one crack at it and didn’t have enough. They had to impanel a grand jury to investigate the thing…this was not some ABC color-by-the-numbers investigation.

I’ll say it again…molesters are everywhere in this society, including churches and schools. PSU could have easily survived an EX coach being a molester. PSU would not even have suffered a case of hiccups. You out the fucker, and it’s news for a bit and then people are moving on to the next football game. That’s the reality. Something like this would have never taken down the PSU machine. There is no need for a cover-up unless you believe that the average Joe could turn a blind eye to abuse.

And we’re not talking one person turning a blind eye, we’re talking a conspiracy requiring the silence of 5 or so people in authority - that damn near qualifies as a criminal organization. Sorry…don’t buy it. There is MORE to this story and it’s not going to be anything fantastic to satiate your rabbit hole desires. It’s going to be the tedium of testimony…“he said, she said”. It’s going to be a series of failures that in hindsight appear obvious (many airlines crashes and other catastrophic accidents for instance are a series of errors that when looked upon AFTER THE FACT appear quite obvious and even simple problems…add stress, human error and other factors in real time, and the “simple” becomes quite complicated). You get 5 people communicating about an incident, and with any wavering by McQueery and this things changes shape.

It could be the above, or 5 or more humans turned away so children could be abused. I don’t know one such man (although I know they exist obviously)…but somehow, 5 or more ended up at PSU in positions of authority. I find it remarkable that you could so easily believe that without wanting to know more.

LOL at the rabbit hole. Some of you have very active imaginations.

955

And Tom wasn’t making a case for a massive conspiracy, he was illustrating how the criticism of Joe is illogical based on how the investigation progressed. The point is that if these people didn’t act until recently (presumably based upon the CONCLUSION of an INVESTIGATION), how the fuck can Paterno be held to such a high standard when Paterno was operating WITH LIMITED KNOWLEDGE. Paterno was not an eye witness. Exactly what Paterno was told is still unclear. And what Paterno was informed thereafter is entirely unknown.

956

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
And Tom wasn’t making a case for a massive conspiracy, he was illustrating how the criticism of Joe is illogical based on how the investigation progressed. The point is that if these people didn’t act until recently (presumably based upon the CONCLUSION of an INVESTIGATION), how the fuck can Paterno be held to such a high standard when Paterno was operating WITH LIMITED KNOWLEDGE. Paterno was not an eye witness. Exactly what Paterno was told is still unclear. And what Paterno was informed thereafter is entirely unknown. [/quote]

Exactly . Sometimes people do a crappy job. Sometimes the info at the time is incomplete.

I’m only angry at other people in Pa . who were quick to condemn Paterno but had more knowledge and ability to get Sandusky off the street. The governor . The head of the state police. These men pointed their fingers to shift blame away from them . Problem is now Paterno is gone people are asking questions

Instead of rushing to judgement on the most famous person here it would have been wise to wait until all the facts were known.

But that wouldn’t be fun.

957

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:
^^^Jesus dude, I’ve been saying ALL ALONG that this is a massive cover-up. This goes way past just Paterno, but that doesn’t change that he could’ve and should’ve done more. Don’t know how many times I can say that we’re gonna be surprised how far down the rabbit hole this goes.[/quote]

I’m more thinking along TBG’s lines. I think clusterfuck might be more appropriate. Laying blame on Paterno is silly when he came forward. But we’ll find out when the facts are known.

I’m not one for conspiracies . More for stupid. I think there was more dumb at work here than conspiracies.

958

[quote]tom63 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:
^^^Jesus dude, I’ve been saying ALL ALONG that this is a massive cover-up. This goes way past just Paterno, but that doesn’t change that he could’ve and should’ve done more. Don’t know how many times I can say that we’re gonna be surprised how far down the rabbit hole this goes.[/quote]

I’m more thinking along TBG’s lines. I think clusterfuck might be more appropriate. Laying blame on Paterno is silly when he came forward. But we’ll find out when the facts are known.

I’m not one for conspiracies . More for stupid. I think there was more dumb at work here than conspiracies.[/quote]

And you may be right. Honestly, I hope you’re right. But with the way things keep unfolding I’m willing to bet the farm that this has been a massive cover-up.

959

It’s gotta be very strange to be working at Penn State right now, especially in the Athletic Department. With what? Three concurrent investigations going on?
(1) NCAA investigation,
(2) Penn State’s former-head-of-FBI lead investigation and
(3) the State’s continuing investigation.
Not even mentioning any victim attorney investigators poking around.

EDIT: Add Investigation #4
(4) U.S. Dept. of Education investigating compliance of federal protocols for reporting criminal acts

960

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]tom63 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:
^^^Jesus dude, I’ve been saying ALL ALONG that this is a massive cover-up. This goes way past just Paterno, but that doesn’t change that he could’ve and should’ve done more. Don’t know how many times I can say that we’re gonna be surprised how far down the rabbit hole this goes.[/quote]

I’m more thinking along TBG’s lines. I think clusterfuck might be more appropriate. Laying blame on Paterno is silly when he came forward. But we’ll find out when the facts are known.

I’m not one for conspiracies . More for stupid. I think there was more dumb at work here than conspiracies.[/quote]

And you may be right. Honestly, I hope you’re right. But with the way things keep unfolding I’m willing to bet the farm that this has been a massive cover-up.[/quote]

ask yourself…what are the chances of a “massive cover-up”?

Do you even know ONE person that would turn their back on some children getting molested? For there to be a “massive cover-up” there would need to be about a half-dozen or more willing to do that. I say these people exist but not at one University. Of course, I can be wrong…nothing is certain. But the more likely scenario is clusterfuck as Tom said. And as I’ve said, PSU did would not have benefited from any cover-up and would have easily survived an ex-coach being outed as a molester. Easily. Barely a hiccup.

The problem with “cover-up” is the absolute weakness of the “motive” which was presumably to “protect” PSU. First, as I said, PSU easily survives an ex-coach exposed as a molester. Paterno easily survives it. PSU football doesn’t miss a beat. The ONLY thing that harms PSU IS a cover-up.