[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
If I saw a naked old man in the shower “horsing around” with a naked minor, I’m intervening immediately. [/quote]
define “horsing around”. [/quote]
C’mon, BG.
Horsing around usually means physical contact (thus the word “horsing”). The boy and the old fucker were NAKED. Horsing around naked is a major fucking red flag.
Put your own son in that kid’s place. Now tell me how you see it.
And YES, I’m blaming McQueary for not doing a fucking thing. What a goddamn pussy, and a disgrace of a man and human being. And Paterno isn’t far behind. There’s no way you can be at the top of an chummy organization and not know where the cracks are.
the problem above is that you use the word “rape”. I do not believe that Joe Pa was told his assistant was “raping” a child in the shower.
[/quote]
Just to be clear, I did not author the above article. I’m very comfortable in describing sexual activities between an adult and a minor as rape, however. Perhaps you’d be more comfortable with sexual assault, corruption of a minor, child molestation…
Statutory rape is a term commonly used to refer to sexual activity between an adult and a minor.
McQueary testified he told Paterno what he had seen. Paterno testified that he had received McQueary’s report. Only when Paterno went on to tell Curley the AD did it become “fondling or something of a sexual nature”
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
And if indeed THEY covered it up, isn’t it possible they did not inform Joe Pa or may have otherwise given him wrong information???
Isn’t it?
[/quote]
What? You’ve raised some good points so far and made this a fun debate, but am I misreading your post here? It sounds like you don’t know what happened.
Paterno is the one who informed those guys, not the other way around.
We know that Paterno was aware of sexual activity between Sandusky and a small boy in the showers because he testified that he knew. The GA told him. Paterno then, a whole day later, told the Athletic Director. The AD and the VP of Finance discussed it with the AD 10 days later. No other investigation took place. The AD and VP then lied about their knowledge and actions to the grand jury.
Paterno did not go to the cops. Paterno did not follow up. Paterno and the GA (who was promoted to an actual coaching position two months later) in years since saw Sandusky around campus with children but apparently did nothing.
[/quote]
we do not know what he knew in terms of the RESULT of any investigation. was the guy cleared?
the problem above is that you use the word “rape”. I do not believe that Joe Pa was told his assistant was “raping” a child in the shower.
[/quote]
Just to be clear, I did not author the above article. I’m very comfortable in describing sexual activities between an adult and a minor as rape, however. Perhaps you’d be more comfortable with sexual assault, corruption of a minor, child molestation…
[/quote]
“horsing around” as it has been quoted by Joe Pa also can mean many things that falls way short of “rape” or “abuse”.
[quote]QuadasarusFlex wrote:
In my humble opinion,there oughta be ALOT more grey boxes.[/quote]
That graph says both McQueary and the wrestling coach at Clinton County High School witnessed Victim #2 but it was my understanding that what happened at that school was in 2009 and eventually lead to the investigation in the first place.
[quote]QuadasarusFlex wrote:
If anything,Mike McQueary should be the one on the cross,not JoePa. He actually witness the rape and he didnt go to the police right afterwards.[/quote]
Mike McQueary isn’t God to a massive legion of football fans. Don’t pretend like that doesn’t mean something. He acted as a coward and will rightfully live the rest of his life with that label, and he should be fired as well.
But when you stake your reputation on “doing it the right way” and put yourself up on the soapbox, you damn well better be ready for the backlash of a scandal like this. If you weren’t doing enough to prevent the repeated rape of children, then fuck you and everything you’ve done, because it means nothing. You are a fraud.
the problem above is that you use the word “rape”. I do not believe that Joe Pa was told his assistant was “raping” a child in the shower.
[/quote]
Just to be clear, I did not author the above article. I’m very comfortable in describing sexual activities between an adult and a minor as rape, however. Perhaps you’d be more comfortable with sexual assault, corruption of a minor, child molestation…
[/quote]
“horsing around” as it has been quoted by Joe Pa also can mean many things that falls way short of “rape” or “abuse”. [/quote]
Good grief, read the grand jury document linked by greg already. Victim 2, you only need to read a few paragraphs.
Interesting point related to something greg said earlier… Victim 4 in the document said he remembers a specific day when Sandusky was really upset after Paterno told him “you will not be the next coach at Penn State”
A) Maybe he really did retire for the reason he said
B) Did Paterno really say that because he just knew he wasn’t stepping down for a while, or did he say it because he knew more about Sandusky than he’s let on?
[quote]scj119 wrote:
I just can’t get over the fact that Spanier and Paterno, who knew something but weren’t charged, were fired… .and Curley (who’s been formally charged) and McQueary (who saw it firsthand) still have jobs.[/quote]
Definitely.
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
I blame the media for this; I find it very disturbing that a bunch of us have the noose and tree picked out for Paterno when we do not yet have all the facts. We have charging documents, which are ALLEGATIONS that have not been challenged yet. We have the benefit of HINDSIGHT and who wouldn’t do something different with the benefit of HINDSIGHT? [/quote]
Ummm doesn’t the grand jury report allow us all to move WAY PAST the stage of simple allegations of wrongdoing??
OK I’m reading through the entire grand jury document, not just the Paterno-related stuff. I have to ask… his wife had ZERO questions that he would constantly hang out with one boy, have him stay at their house and do everything with him… and change to a new boy every couple years?
the problem above is that you use the word “rape”. I do not believe that Joe Pa was told his assistant was “raping” a child in the shower.
[/quote]
Just to be clear, I did not author the above article. I’m very comfortable in describing sexual activities between an adult and a minor as rape, however. Perhaps you’d be more comfortable with sexual assault, corruption of a minor, child molestation…
[/quote]
“horsing around” as it has been quoted by Joe Pa also can mean many things that falls way short of “rape” or “abuse”. [/quote]
To my knowledge, the “horsing around” comment did not come from Paterno. It came from the AD when the AD was relaying to the grand jury what McQueary told him.
McQueary testified he “reported what he had seen” to Paterno at Paterno’s home. Paterno testified he had received this report.
[quote]therajraj wrote:
Does anyone actually believe this sex ring has any real chance of being true?
This is getting dumb. The actual facts are horrific enough without having to make up shit.[/quote]
People said the exact same thing when Madden (the guy who “broke” the sex ring news) wrote about this while Sandusky Sex scandal 7 months ago.
The guy was right about almost everything so far it just took a little time for it to come out to the main stream. I 100% believe that it could be true.
[quote]scj119 wrote:
OK I’m reading through the entire grand jury document, not just the Paterno-related stuff. I have to ask… his wife had ZERO questions that he would constantly hang out with one boy, have him stay at their house and do everything with him… and change to a new boy every couple years?[/quote]
I don’t know, that wouldn’t cross my mind either.
Someone who I love and trust spending time with a young boy, doesn’t really sound suspicious at all.
Hypothetically if your father was a coach and spent time with young boys, would the thought ever cross your mind?
[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
we do not know what he knew in terms of the RESULT of any investigation. was the guy cleared? [/quote]
Paterno has not been criminally charged. I know a couple of guys in this thread said he was “cleared,” but I don’t remember reading anything that specifically said that. Maybe I missed it.
Anyway, we aren’t talking about criminal convictions for Paterno at this point, I thought we were talking about what he knew and if he had the power to do anything about it.
He definitely knew about the 2002 incident. I and others specualte that he knew more, although the evidence has not exactly shown that yet. However, based on his stature at PSU this speculation seems reasonable to most of us.
Even if you doubt the amount of power he actually had, I don’t see how you can doubt that he could have done more to stop what happened. Whether or not he rules campus with an iron fist, no one had the ability moreso than Joe Paterno to get shit done around there if he really wanted to. He admitted in his little retirement statement that he should have done more. And by not doing more, JoePa and the rest of the upper administration brought this shitstorm upon PSU when someone outside of the university finally stepped forward.
