[quote]remixpaul wrote:
just for my own health, im not really training for any sport … just to be strong as a bull and also not out of shape lol … so ur saying eat some fruit in the morning before i run or just run on a empty stomach? anyone else have there opinions on this?[/quote]
I sometimes do my karate training at the morning. I used to drink Milo with instant coffee about 30mins before training. However, after I discover T-Nation Milo is replaced by Surge. This is how I do it:
30mins before: 1/2srv Surge + 2 tea sp coffee
During training: 1/2srv Surge in 750ml water
(but I must admit sometimes I can’t take it as I may throw up due to being punched/kicked on the stomach; When it happens I would just take a few zip and finish it after the class.)
After training: 1/2srv Surge + creatine
If you cannot afford Surge then Milo is still a good and cheap option. I would add some whey to it too.
Also if you are not training for an endurance sport I would suggest not to make your conditioning too long. Make it hard and short.
[quote]geekboy wrote:
remixpaul wrote:
just for my own health, im not really training for any sport … just to be strong as a bull and also not out of shape lol … so ur saying eat some fruit in the morning before i run or just run on a empty stomach? anyone else have there opinions on this?
I sometimes do my karate training at the morning. I used to drink Milo with instant coffee about 30mins before training. However, after I discover T-Nation Milo is replaced by Surge. This is how I do it:
30mins before: 1/2srv Surge + 2 tea sp coffee
During training: 1/2srv Surge in 750ml water
(but I must admit sometimes I can’t take it as I may throw up due to being punched/kicked on the stomach; When it happens I would just take a few zip and finish it after the class.)
After training: 1/2srv Surge + creatine
If you cannot afford Surge then Milo is still a good and cheap option. I would add some whey to it too.
Also if you are not training for an endurance sport I would suggest not to make your conditioning too long. Make it hard and short.
My $0.02NZD worth,
Geekboy[/quote]
Berardi covers this in a few of his articles. I know there was an article written last year called “The Athlete Diary” or something that might be worth a read in regards to AM training.
Actually Geekboys suggested pre/during/post training servings Surge look similar to what Berardi suggests from memory.
u think 30min of stairs would be enough? i usually thought a good hour would be enough of stairs or up hill mountain running cause the mountain and stadium stairs are 15 min from my house … so i would have a nice warm up walk there do some stretching then up hill run or stairs for a good hour then nice cool down walk to my house and eat my can of tuna [=
[quote]remixpaul wrote:
u think 30min of stairs would be enough? i usually thought a good hour would be enough of stairs or up hill mountain running cause the mountain and stadium stairs are 15 min from my house … so i would have a nice warm up walk there do some stretching then up hill run or stairs for a good hour then nice cool down walk to my house and eat my can of tuna [=[/quote]
With warm ups and that you would probably be around the 60-90 minute mark. I was just talking about the working part of the session.
My anaerobic and aerobic conditioning sessions work phase would only be around 30-45 minutes. Warm ups and cool down would put it in the vicinity of 90 minutes but only 30-45 mins of that is hard work.
My workouts take less than an hour. If you are using the WS4SB template, all workouts should last an hour or less!
Maybe you’re taking longer rest periods or busy talking instead of training! ;)[/quote]
My sessions would be around the hour too. I usually train with 2 other guys of similar strength so there is bugger all time spent changing the weights for different people.
yeah i get you … so 30-45min of hardcore conditioning is all i really need, right? cause then u add in the warm up and cool down and u get 90min … and to natedogg my ws4sb workouts take me like say 1 hour and like 10 min the most … i was typing fast and put 90min … but when u see a nice female then u add 10 min to my total time hahah [;
[quote]remixpaul wrote:
yeah i get you … so 30-45min of hardcore conditioning is all i really need, right? cause then u add in the warm up and cool down and u get 90min … and to natedogg my ws4sb workouts take me like say 1 hour and like 10 min the most … i was typing fast and put 90min … but when u see a nice female then u add 10 min to my total time hahah [;[/quote]
The thing that adds time for me is the ME Exercise. Sometimes if I’m feeling a little stronger than usual I will lift more than I was expecting to thus adding 1-2 extra sets. So that puts on another 6 - 8 minutes to the session’s total.
yeah i agree with u drama, if i feel strong i do deff pump out a few extra sets and set a new mark for myself … got anoter quickie for u … in the strenght and speed template defranco cut short the ME lower body day with only ME, some hamstring work and abs wih some conditioning … now im asking woujld it be okay if i did the original ME lower body format instead of his way for the speed and strenght format?
[quote]remixpaul wrote:
yeah i agree with u drama, if i feel strong i do deff pump out a few extra sets and set a new mark for myself … got anoter quickie for u … in the strenght and speed template defranco cut short the ME lower body day with only ME, some hamstring work and abs wih some conditioning … now im asking woujld it be okay if i did the original ME lower body format instead of his way for the speed and strenght format?[/quote]
What are you trying to do right now? What are your goals? The reason the ME liting is cut short during the speed template is because during that phase of training Joe is working on improving the speed of the athletes while maintaining other abilities. It’s unrealistic to expect to make significant gains in both speed and strength during the same training cycle.
If you want to get stronger right now, do the full lifting routine, if your goal is to get faster, stick to the speed template.
[quote]Donut62 wrote:
remixpaul wrote:
yeah i agree with u drama, if i feel strong i do deff pump out a few extra sets and set a new mark for myself … got anoter quickie for u … in the strenght and speed template defranco cut short the ME lower body day with only ME, some hamstring work and abs wih some conditioning … now im asking woujld it be okay if i did the original ME lower body format instead of his way for the speed and strenght format?
What are you trying to do right now? What are your goals? The reason the ME liting is cut short during the speed template is because during that phase of training Joe is working on improving the speed of the athletes while maintaining other abilities. It’s unrealistic to expect to make significant gains in both speed and strength during the same training cycle.
If you want to get stronger right now, do the full lifting routine, if your goal is to get faster, stick to the speed template.[/quote]
Exactly. Prioritize what you are trying to do right now. The speed training is taxing on the body and that complimented with heavy lifting will be counteractive. You’ll go backward in both speed and strength and injury becomes very likely. If you could make maximum improvements in speed and strength, I’m sure Joe would have prescribed the full quota of 2 leg days and 2 speed days.
the thing is thou im not really working on speed just conditioning … u know up hill/mountain running and doing stairs at my local towns high school stadium … i was thinkng about just doing
monday - me upper body
tuesday - stairs or up hill running
thursday - me lower body (the way its setup in the 4 day template, the original one)
friday - re upper body
cause i wuld understand what u guys are saying if i was doing speed, but im not just conditioning … would doing the original me lower body template still efect me?
Before WFSB3 came out I made my own 2 variations which worked for my schedule
Sunday - Complexes (lower body)
Monday - ME Upper body
Tuesday - Rest
Wednesay - ME Lower body
Thursday - Low cardio
Friday - Rep Upper body
Sat - Rest
I tried also various versions of “washed-up meathead” templates and this one was the best for me in terms of strength gained and muscular mass (caliper test)
Mon - ME Upper (pull focus)
Wed - ME Lower (Deadlift)
Fri - Rep Upper (mix push pull)
Sat - Full grip workout (1 every 2 weeks)
I threw some conditioning workouts in between days and it did not adversely affect my leg strenght.
[quote]remixpaul wrote:
the thing is thou im not really working on speed just conditioning … u know up hill/mountain running and doing stairs at my local towns high school stadium … i was thinkng about just doing
monday - me upper body
tuesday - stairs or up hill running
thursday - me lower body (the way its setup in the 4 day template, the original one)
friday - re upper body
cause i wuld understand what u guys are saying if i was doing speed, but im not just conditioning … would doing the original me lower body template still efect me?[/quote]
If you are just doing general conditioning, and not maximum velocity/acceleration training, what you have there should be perfectly fine. You can probably still do the full four day lifting plan and add in sufficient conditioning. My current plan is the full 4 day template, with lifting in the AM, and then a conditioning session in the PM consisting of either a Ross Enamait style GPP session, a barbell complex, or rounds on the heavy bag.
[quote]remixpaul wrote:
btw what kinda of conditioning do u do? btw u like the de lower body day … cause i kinda dont like that hahah one leg day for me is fine[/quote]
If that’s your attitude then you probably need to do the 2 days a week
[quote]Donut62 wrote:
remixpaul wrote:
the thing is thou im not really working on speed just conditioning … u know up hill/mountain running and doing stairs at my local towns high school stadium … i was thinkng about just doing
monday - me upper body
tuesday - stairs or up hill running
thursday - me lower body (the way its setup in the 4 day template, the original one)
friday - re upper body
cause i wuld understand what u guys are saying if i was doing speed, but im not just conditioning … would doing the original me lower body template still efect me?
If you are just doing general conditioning, and not maximum velocity/acceleration training, what you have there should be perfectly fine. You can probably still do the full four day lifting plan and add in sufficient conditioning. My current plan is the full 4 day template, with lifting in the AM, and then a conditioning session in the PM consisting of either a Ross Enamait style GPP session, a barbell complex, or rounds on the heavy bag.[/quote]
I often did the Bas Rutten tapes as a conditioning style in the AM whilst lifting in the PM. I think it worked pretty well because it would fatigue the CNS like speed work does.
[quote]sawadeekrob wrote:
Before WFSB3 came out I made my own 2 variations which worked for my schedule
Sunday - Complexes (lower body)
Monday - ME Upper body
Tuesday - Rest
Wednesay - ME Lower body
Thursday - Low cardio
Friday - Rep Upper body
Sat - Rest
I tried also various versions of “washed-up meathead” templates and this one was the best for me in terms of strength gained and muscular mass (caliper test)
Mon - ME Upper (pull focus)
Wed - ME Lower (Deadlift)
Fri - Rep Upper (mix push pull)
Sat - Full grip workout (1 every 2 weeks)
I threw some conditioning workouts in between days and it did not adversely affect my leg strenght.
[/quote]
Nice work there. I think that is the beauty part of the program that people have the initiative to tinker with it and Joe seems pretty cool with that. I have read a few authors of programs who almost take it as an insult when people change things around in the program.
[quote]remixpaul wrote:
would doing stairs at the stadium be considered as speed work or conditioning or be a mix of both?[/quote]
It is not classified as speed training. I would consider it anaerobic conditioning if your training is what I assume it to be. IE repeated efforts with a break in between each working rep/set.
It would really help us understand a bit better if you actually gave us a breakdown of your stairs training. Not just 15 minutes warm up, 30 minutes of stairs, 15 minutes cool down. Actually let us know what you do in the meat of the session.
