Worst Parenting... Ever

Off Topic
441

[quote]MHRhabdo wrote:
If you dive deep into the video to truly understand what is happening, I believe the video tells it all.

The boy received a punishment at school for playing with Steve’s pencil. How obvious does this have to be? She was clearly trying to wash the ghey out of him with a dose of hot sauce and a cold shower.

You people are looking at the situation all wrong.

And on a serious note, you cannot judge others for things they have done due to not understanding the culture and social influences that have been placed upon them.[/quote]
He got a blue card and a yellow card. He is clearly just trying to collect all of the colors and make his very own rainbow card!

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[quote]SteelyD wrote:
I usually get annoyed though when the childless start handing out ‘tidbits of wisdom’ based on nothing they’ve actually had to deal with with children. Yes, we were all children with the experience of being raised by someone and getting punished. However, walking the walk is a different experience and the perception of reality is from a different prism altogether.

[/quote]

Fucking truth!
End of thread.

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I wonder if any of you here know the condition of many Russian orphanages. We have someone in our extended family that adopted from Russia and that child too had problems. I can’t imagine what it must be like to be in one of those hell holes as a young child, then get shipped here to the LDS cult and have some bully force feeding me hot sauce and cold showers while brow beating me into submission. Don’t you think a kid like this needed something different?

444

[quote]colt44 wrote:

[quote]DJHT wrote:

[quote]colt44 wrote:

[quote]DJHT wrote:

[quote]colt44 wrote:

[quote]DJHT wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]colt44 wrote:

[quote]Rockscar wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]Rockscar wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]Rockscar wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]Rockscar wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

It seems like you have been raised to think little children should be [part of decision making processes. They shouldn’t in my opinion.

If I tell a little kid don’t eat that cookie and they do, it doesn’t fucking matter WHY they ate. They disobeyed an order and that order was made for a reason that a little child may not be able to understand…which is why they have PARENTS.[/quote]

Bingo. I used to ask my kids if they wanted X, Y or Z for dinner…between the 2 of them, they could not ever agree and one if not both were always upset at the outcome and I could never seem to recover. I’ve made this mistake, but it is a particular style that does not work. Parents feel they are making a more well rounded, decisive child if they are consulted about a lot of decisions…they end up being narcissistic in the end moreso than a regular child.

Now, they get what I give them for lunch or dinner. No arguing, and they better appreciate it…like it or not!
[/quote]

Can you point me to the peer reviewed studies supporting your learned conclusions above? Or are we talking about a study of one household? [/quote]

Dude, if you want a peer review for my points, then you must bring them as well for yours. This is MY experience with my kids, as well as many others I have witnessed.

There is NO RIGHT and NO WRONG way to parent proven by science. This is my experience as a father.

What is your hard on about with regard to what I said above?
[/quote]

You made conclusions. I have done no such thing. I have given my opinion.

“I’ve made this mistake, but it is a particular style that does not work. Parents feel they are making a more well rounded, decisive child if they are consulted about a lot of decisions…they end up being narcissistic in the end moreso than a regular child.” [/quote]

Right…I guess my conclusion is a hypothesis to you, but in my house, the more rope you give, the more a kid will hang themselves by making bad choices. If you are not an authority figure (Hands off) then the kids will run rampant. It’s a parents job to make sure they guided, and not left to their own devices.

What’s the problem in that?
[/quote]

Can you please explain to me the connection between “authority figure” as you put it and the video we witnessed? Can you please refer me to the post where someone said they shouldn’t be the “authority figure”. And finally, can you please explain to me where someone advocated a “hands off” approach to parenting?[/quote]

I said it earlier
“hands Off” and you replied that I meant people need to hit their children.

Anyway, I’m done with you, you just want to argue no matter what.

You have no right to judge another method as shown in the video. You don’t know the full story, you don’t know any of the childs past etc. There are more effective ways, yes, but in this case you KNOW NOTHING about the household situation and the kids behavior pattern. Tobasco and a shower…For fucking lying straight up AFTER you get in trouble at school 3 times. She took action.

I have an 8 year old that would lie ALL THE TIME when she was 5-7. Sitting down and explaining it to her does not work, she still lied. I took action, not in the form of the video or violence in any way, but I took shit away and she screamed bloody murder worse than the kid in the vid.

My point is you cannot be holier than thou, which you seem to be projecting here.

As you said kids don’t come with a manual, and each kid is different…but you seem to know what’s in the fictitious document as well as what the child responds to best.
[/quote]

you need to work on your parenting skills…i feel sorry for your children[/quote]

You feel sorry for his children? Why?

In fact, tell us about yourself. How did your parents raise an outstanding son? What wonderful things have you accomplished that most kids don’t? Any cures for cancer coming from your direction?[/quote]

Colt this is what I will say about this, in real life you would not dare say this to a grown man. Being a father myself if I heard a young person say this to another man I would be inclined to kick that young persons ass myself. You may have had a fucked up childhood and so you see everything from that viewpoint. So are you a father? NO I can answer that because a father would not have said that to another man. [/quote]

If i saw a father not being a good father I would feel absolutely obligated to say something for his child’s sake[/quote]

So you are now the ultimate judge of what constitutes good parenting? Are you a cop? Again if you came into a situation only knowing a part of the information and you tried to mouth off to a grown man about his parenting ability. Well the outcome would not be good for anybody. I am not debating about this mothers actions, that is a judgement call, however you want to call out a guy on the internet who has stated that he has never done this to his own kids.

Your opinion is shit and pointless unless you are a parent, sorry dont care how educated you are or whatever view point you think you can stand on. I am not going to give my opinion on being an inner city black man because no matter what I read I will never have experienced that in my life and could never relate. My .02.[/quote]

Of course I dont think I am the ultimate judge but If i see child abuse I am not going to sit around watch it. I am not talking about getty angry at your child, but legitamte child abuse as seen in the video.[/quote]

Well sorry but this whole thread has been arguing the fact that it is not child abuse vs it is. So that is my point, what makes you the ulitimate authority? Do you work for CPS? Do you know the laws of your state in regard to what constitutes child abuse? If you ever saw a parent spank a child would you say child abuse, since the kid would be screaming? [/quote]

Certainly what took place in that video is not the worst thing someone could do to their child. However, it is child abuse. Clearly he has had that punishment before and clearly it did not solve any problems. Treating a child like that can cause serious emotional, physical, psychological issues. I have no problems with punishment of children, so long as its done in a decent manner. I think most logical people can realize that this women did not act in a decent manner.[/quote]

Have you been reading this thread or just commenting to my responses? Again you state this as child abuse, however many in this thread state it is not.
So punishing children has to be set to your standard? “so long as its done in a decent manner” your quote, again “most logical people can realize that this women did not act in a decent manner”. Well this was shown on national TV and I am sure some white knight sent this to her local PD, was she charged with child abuse? Do you know the child abuse laws in your own state. A case can be made that any punishment can cause emotional, physical and psychological abuse. The world is not black and white. I am done with this discussion with you, because you fail to realize there are other people in the world besides you.

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[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
I wonder if any of you here know the condition of many Russian orphanages. We have someone in our extended family that adopted from Russia and that child too had problems. I can’t imagine what it must be like to be in one of those hell holes as a young child, then get shipped here to the LDS cult and have some bully force feeding me hot sauce and cold showers while brow beating me into submission. Don’t you think a kid like this needed something different?[/quote]

You mean like the same 3-4 antipsychotic drugs that I have personally seen most of these foster kids IN AMERICA to be on when they come into my office?

Just a heads up, the usual course of action is very heavy medication and there must be millions of kids on many of these drugs now…and some would say that is a form of abuse in itself.

446

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
I wonder if any of you here know the condition of many Russian orphanages. We have someone in our extended family that adopted from Russia and that child too had problems. I can’t imagine what it must be like to be in one of those hell holes as a young child, then get shipped here to the LDS cult and have some bully force feeding me hot sauce and cold showers while brow beating me into submission. Don’t you think a kid like this needed something different?[/quote]

You mean like the same 3-4 antipsychotic drugs that I have personally seen most of these foster kids IN AMERICA to be on when they come into my office?

Just a heads up, the usual course of action is very heavy medication and there must be millions of kids on many of these drugs now…and some would say that is a form of abuse in itself.[/quote]

My brother is a Phd of psychology and professor at an ivy league school and he agrees with you. I don’t agree with the medicating of our society let alone our children. An alarming percentage of adults are now on some form of anti-depressant. However, my point stands - the conditions of orphanages in Russia are not pretty. As for the medication, although we understand the metabolic pathways of such medicines, we still do not fully understand how or why they “work”…and I use “work” in a relative, conditional sense…because they are by no means a “cure”.

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[quote]MHRhabdo wrote:

And on a serious note, you cannot judge others for things they have done due to not understanding the culture and social influences that have been placed upon them.[/quote]

Yes you can. You might be able to excuse or explain certain behaviors due to cultural or social influence, but a strike and a foul are a strike and a foul no matter where the ball is pitched. For instance, just because it’s the cultural and social custom to treat women in Afghanistan not much higher than dogs, does not mean we cannot judge the conduct as backwards and objectionable.

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[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
I wonder if any of you here know the condition of many Russian orphanages. We have someone in our extended family that adopted from Russia and that child too had problems. I can’t imagine what it must be like to be in one of those hell holes as a young child, then get shipped here to the LDS cult and have some bully force feeding me hot sauce and cold showers while brow beating me into submission. Don’t you think a kid like this needed something different?[/quote]

You mean like the same 3-4 antipsychotic drugs that I have personally seen most of these foster kids IN AMERICA to be on when they come into my office?

Just a heads up, the usual course of action is very heavy medication and there must be millions of kids on many of these drugs now…and some would say that is a form of abuse in itself.[/quote]

My brother is a Phd of psychology and professor at an ivy league school and he agrees with you. I don’t agree with the medicating of our society let alone our children. An alarming percentage of adults are now on some form of anti-depressant. However, my point stands - the conditions of orphanages in Russia are not pretty. As for the medication, although we understand the metabolic pathways of such medicines, we still do not fully understand how or why they “work”…and I use “work” in a relative, conditional sense…because they are by no means a “cure”.
[/quote]

But guess what, no one is on Dr. Phil because they transformed their problem adopted kid into a walking zombie with Xanax and lithium. I mean, why does EVERY kid suddenly have ADHD?

Anyone protesting that?

Any 19 page threads with people logging in for the first time calling the parents evil and insisting they should be killed and THEN beaten…and then killed again?

No?

Why the fuck not?

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[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
I wonder if any of you here know the condition of many Russian orphanages. We have someone in our extended family that adopted from Russia and that child too had problems. I can’t imagine what it must be like to be in one of those hell holes as a young child, then get shipped here to the LDS cult and have some bully force feeding me hot sauce and cold showers while brow beating me into submission. Don’t you think a kid like this needed something different?[/quote]

You mean like the same 3-4 antipsychotic drugs that I have personally seen most of these foster kids IN AMERICA to be on when they come into my office?

Just a heads up, the usual course of action is very heavy medication and there must be millions of kids on many of these drugs now…and some would say that is a form of abuse in itself.[/quote]

My brother is a Phd of psychology and professor at an ivy league school and he agrees with you. I don’t agree with the medicating of our society let alone our children. An alarming percentage of adults are now on some form of anti-depressant. However, my point stands - the conditions of orphanages in Russia are not pretty. As for the medication, although we understand the metabolic pathways of such medicines, we still do not fully understand how or why they “work”…and I use “work” in a relative, conditional sense…because they are by no means a “cure”.
[/quote]

But guess what, no one is on Dr. Phil because they transformed their problem adopted kid into a walking zombie with Zanax and lithium. I mean, why does EVERY kid suddenly have ADHD?

Anyone protesting that?

Any 19 page threads with people logging in for the first time calling the parents evil and insisting they should be killed and THEN beaten…and then killed again?

No?

Why the fuck not?[/quote]

I don’t know why not. We agree. Probably because the “abuse” is coming from our medical community. You’re a doctor, what do you think?

450

[quote]Professor X wrote:
But guess what, no one is on Dr. Phil because they transformed their problem adopted kid into a walking zombie with Zanax and lithium. I mean, why does EVERY kid suddenly have ADHD?
[/quote]

Well… actually…

**Note: I don’t watch Dr. Phil and (proudly) have never seen more than a clip or two. I just Googled and got that link :wink:

I’m not in to ‘talking head doctors’ as much as I’m not into ‘talking head political commentary’.

No argument here that it’s epidemic… sadly epidemic that so many kids are walking zombies. Actually, it’s pretty fucked up.

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[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]worzel wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]SteelyD wrote:

[quote]165StateChamp wrote:

If a child is doing something wrong, they need to learn to no longer do that thing. Looking back to when I was a child, I didn’t need to know WHY I shouldn’t do something; what was important was just making sure I did not do it. Sometimes physical punishment is the best option for teaching this.

Why would I not go this route? I don’t think I have it in me to hit a child. That’s my personal weakness. I do like the idea of digging holes or running though. [/quote]

LOL @ theoretical parenting.

Children do need to know why something is wrong or they won’t learn or understand. I think the childless here don’t give single-digit aged children enough credit.

When does ‘why’ become important? Their 10th birthday? 11th? 8th? Sorry, but my kids are raised to ask questions and to understand EVERYTHING they do. Apply this to bodybuilding (“Why squat?”-- “Don’t worry about it, just shut up and squat”).

Naturally kids going to ask why they can’t do something. Does anyone really think otherwise? Do you want your kids to be mindless robots?

Is ‘just shut up and do what I say’ how kids should be educated in the classroom, too?

My neighbor, the single, childless PhD saw that we got movie screens for the van for a long trip. She said that she believes that those things ruin children and that they should be made to sit and admire the scenery (for a 10 hour trip). Apparently, some of you would agree. I’m going to guess that many with children would not.
[/quote]

I think you miss his point.

Scenario: “A burglar breaks in the house and your kid doesn’t know it yet. You wake them up and TELL THEM to go hide in the closet. Your kids, based on your practice of them NEEDING to know why at all times, don’t go hide until you explain in fully why they need to.”

Meanwhile, the way I was raised, I am going to hide in the closet because dad told me to, not because he sat down and explained WHY in detail at all times.

The key to that kid surviving in that circumstance now relies on them being quiet and listening when told to do something.

No, no kids always need to know WHY right now. They need to learn to listen when told as well because who knows when them simply shutting up and doing as told could even save their life.

In my house growing up, you did what you were told to do BECAUSE your parents told you to do it. Yes, there may be some explanations as well but your obedience did not rely on an explanation.

It should NEVER rely on the explanation…at least if your parents did their job well.[/quote]

’
Again, you have this style or arguing where you exaggerate and stretch other people’s opinions. No one here advocated explaining every minute detail to your kid…some of us here try to explain as much as possible. Does that mean because we try to explain and TEACH, that we don’t expect a child to do what the child is told when it is told? No one said that, but you sure are taking something and running with it to stretch it to absurdity for the sake of your point.

Do you have kids? I don’t believe you do. If this were a BB thread, you’d be here telling like yourself to STFU, that you don’t count, and go eat and get back to us. Amiwrong?
[/quote]

I think you (PX) should take really take note of what TBG said here because it’s so true.

You are SO quick to tear someone a new arse (in the BB forum) if they fail to meet your criteria of ‘experience’ and or ‘development’ yet you are here, preaching the preach, even though you have no kids?

I am not discounting other people’s opinions here (ain’t got the time) only yours! This is simply on the basis of other arguments you put forth (esp. in the BB forum) that are ‘always’ built on the premise of, among other things ‘experience’, which in this case you have none!

Using your logic you are the equivalent of a 150lb, 15inch bicep fan boy giving out advice in the BB forum to the 250lb, 20inch bicep brigade. Can you see that?
[/quote]

Guy, I couldn’t care less if you don’t like me. I see your actions as far as bringing up a post just to expand on how much you don’t like my posts to be about as weak as you can get considering I hadn’t responded in this thread for almost two pages and your post basically acts like I have no validity to speak on anything regarding parenting. You are not responding to statements directly.

Comparing knowledge of child discipline to lifting weights is flawed. It would only be a correct analogy if you compared it to someone who didn’t train but grew up with and around other lifters…which WOULD give them insight into training to a LIMITED degree.

I don’t care what you think. I have little respect for you on this board.[/quote]

Well at least that is something we can agree on.

I am highlighting your blatant need to incessantly argue and twist logic to suit your point and to be honest it is mind-numbingly predictable and you SHOULD be called out on it (every time!). The funny thing is you have been called out on it SO many times but you lack the humility to see it OR you just love arguing, which is it?

You act as if people ‘pick on you’ but you fail to see the vociferous nature of your posts and it is that reason why people ‘presumably’ attack you and not the posts content.

You see your posts stick out like a shit in a punch bowl so how else can I or anybody miss them?

I am sure you have heard all this ^ before and I am sure you couldn’t give a flying fuck what I think or what the many other posters on here think even though though it has been highlighted numerous times over the years, so on it will go…

Of course comparing child discipline to lifting weights is flawed! I am simply mirroring your twisted logic as you persistently disrespect and shoot down other posters in other threads for having a different opinion to yours.

BTW you still don’t have kids’ so your opinion is weak at best…

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[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
I wonder if any of you here know the condition of many Russian orphanages. We have someone in our extended family that adopted from Russia and that child too had problems. I can’t imagine what it must be like to be in one of those hell holes as a young child, then get shipped here to the LDS cult and have some bully force feeding me hot sauce and cold showers while brow beating me into submission. Don’t you think a kid like this needed something different?[/quote]

You mean like the same 3-4 antipsychotic drugs that I have personally seen most of these foster kids IN AMERICA to be on when they come into my office?

Just a heads up, the usual course of action is very heavy medication and there must be millions of kids on many of these drugs now…and some would say that is a form of abuse in itself.[/quote]

My brother is a Phd of psychology and professor at an ivy league school and he agrees with you. I don’t agree with the medicating of our society let alone our children. An alarming percentage of adults are now on some form of anti-depressant. However, my point stands - the conditions of orphanages in Russia are not pretty. As for the medication, although we understand the metabolic pathways of such medicines, we still do not fully understand how or why they “work”…and I use “work” in a relative, conditional sense…because they are by no means a “cure”.
[/quote]

But guess what, no one is on Dr. Phil because they transformed their problem adopted kid into a walking zombie with Zanax and lithium. I mean, why does EVERY kid suddenly have ADHD?

Anyone protesting that?

Any 19 page threads with people logging in for the first time calling the parents evil and insisting they should be killed and THEN beaten…and then killed again?

No?

Why the fuck not?[/quote]

I don’t know why not. We agree. Probably because the “abuse” is coming from our medical community. You’re a doctor, what do you think?[/quote]

That in general, just like that other thread about the police dog, the average person only reacts this way in public settings to things that cause a deep emotional response…to which they respond illogically for several reasons (including to simply be a part of the crowd or to gain social standing by being the one to “stand against it”)…even if they might have acted the same themselves in private.

People came out of the woodwork in this thread to protest this woman’s hot sauce and cold showers. Meanwhile, they willingly accept the walking zombies because, hey, no one is crying or screaming so they don’t even have to deal with it emotionally. Out of sight, out of mind.

The truth is, most people don’t give a shit about either issue. No one here is about to adopt this kid to “save him”. No one here is even going to remember this outside a vague brain fart in a few weeks. No one cares about those walking zombies because they’re quiet.

Most of the responses here were simple posturing. A bunch of people fighting for social standing with a minor few actually speaking deeply about the topic.

That’s why.

People are sheep…and most really don’t give a shit.

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Of course the needless “medicating” of a child is abuse. As is neglect (which in most cases is the cause for these ADHD cases, IMHO). But the OP wasn’t even discussing meds in the first place, otherwise I’d have chimed in about it earlier.

I agree. Most people ARE sheep.

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[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
Of course the needless “medicating” of a child is abuse. As is neglect (which in most cases is the cause for these ADHD cases, IMHO). But the OP wasn’t even discussing meds in the first place, otherwise I’d have chimed in about it earlier.

I agree. Most people ARE sheep.

[/quote]

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[quote]Professor X wrote:

That in general, just like that other thread about the police dog, the average person only reacts this way in public settings to things that cause a deep emotional response…to which they respond illogically for several reasons (including to simply be a part of the crowd or to gain social standing by being the one to “stand against it”)…even if they might have acted the same themselves in private.

People came out of the woodwork in this thread to protest this woman’s hot sauce and cold showers. Meanwhile, they willingly accept the walking zombies because, hey, no one is crying or screaming so they don’t even have to deal with it emotionally. Out of sight, out of mind.

The truth is, most people don’t give a shit about either issue. No one here is about to adopt this kid to “save him”. No one here is even going to remember this outside a vague brain fart in a few weeks. No one cares about those walking zombies because they’re quiet.

Most of the responses here were simple posturing. A bunch of people fighting for social standing with a minor few actually speaking deeply about the topic.

That’s why.

People are sheep…and most really don’t give a shit.[/quote]

Well, again, I cannot disagree with anything you have said above. I do feel that people are sheep and those in our history and society that have figured out how to manipulate and control the sheep (religion, politics??) have profited the most from the herd.

I think you know that I deeply object to the video and I won’t repeat my reasons.

And I think you know I share your outrage toward the medication of not only our youth, but our society. Start a thread about it, and I’ll show you the same passion if someone comes along and defends the over and unnecessary medication of our society.

Now, given that people will come out of the woodwork, act irrational and follow the herd, don’t ya think there is some money to be made there? LOL

456

[quote]DJHT wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
Of course the needless “medicating” of a child is abuse. As is neglect (which in most cases is the cause for these ADHD cases, IMHO). But the OP wasn’t even discussing meds in the first place, otherwise I’d have chimed in about it earlier.

I agree. Most people ARE sheep.

[/quote]

[/quote]

LOL!
I think I know them!

457

I’m actually happy X brought up the medication example. Because it’s an example of what many of us have been saying here all along - “abuse” need not cross some magic threshold to be harmful or considered “abusive”. There is no line in the sand for abuse. Abuse can be unintentional, uninformed, even negligent with no intent to abuse per se.

Do I think this nutty broad intentionally adopted a kid from Russia for the purpose of terrifying and abusing him? Of course not. Do I think she is misinformed, misguided and overwhelmed? Absolutely. But the foregoing, as forgivable as they could be, do not render her methods any less troubling. If we will only color abuse on a scale consisting of the terrible and outrageous, we truly lose our perspective.

Perhaps many of us here WERE abused as children - maybe not continually, but perhaps conditionally and situationally. But thankfully, humans, children, we in general are quite durable - some more than others. Just because you were beaten and you’re okay, does not mean it is right and it does not mean that a lesser form of potential abuse is not abuse simply by comparison.

Like I said earlier, it’s like telling a 10 year old sexual abuse victim that she was not abused because her dirty uncle merely finger fucked her, that you had been finger fucked as a child and that you’re okay, and somewhere there is a 10 year old that was gang raped, beaten and left for dead. Now, I’m using exaggeration to make a point about this comparative logic that some have used here to defend this lady’s practices.

I happily admit that my visceral, heat of the moment reaction to this video was to want to gut and beat this woman. Now, that may make me part of the herd, but it also is a strong signal that my humanity is intact, and that I DO CARE about my fellow man and child. Somewhere, my internal compass said this is fucking wrong and I want to defend this child and hurt that parent. Is that rational? Perhaps not.

However, and this is my closing point (I promise); even setting aside all our base emotions, her methods, when judged in their entirety, cannot be defended on their merits. We can wax poetic all day about ignorance, culture, misinformed, misguided, overwhelmed, etc., but we cannot call that which is wrong, “okay”. And we cannot excuse it or defend it simply because we can conjure up worse treatments or punishment or “abuse”.

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Wait.

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
This summer I ate the ‘‘Hellburger’’ in Denton, Texas (and won a TShirt).[/quote]

Where did you eat a ‘‘Hellburger’’ in Denton? I don’t remember that from when I lived there. I feel robbed…

/hijack

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[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
I’m actually happy X brought up the medication example. Because it’s an example of what many of us have been saying here all along - “abuse” need not cross some magic threshold to be harmful or considered “abusive”. There is no line in the sand for abuse. Abuse can be unintentional, uninformed, even negligent with no intent to abuse per se.

Do I think this nutty broad intentionally adopted a kid from Russia for the purpose of terrifying and abusing him? Of course not. Do I think she is misinformed, misguided and overwhelmed? Absolutely. But the foregoing, as forgivable as they could be, do not render her methods any less troubling. If we will only color abuse on a scale consisting of the terrible and outrageous, we truly lose our perspective.

Perhaps many of us here WERE abused as children - maybe not continually, but perhaps conditionally and situationally. But thankfully, humans, children, we in general are quite durable - some more than others. Just because you were beaten and you’re okay, does not mean it is right and it does not mean that a lesser form of potential abuse is not abuse simply by comparison.

Like I said earlier, it’s like telling a 10 year old sexual abuse victim that she was not abused because her dirty uncle merely finger fucked her, that you had been finger fucked as a child and that you’re okay, and somewhere there is a 10 year old that was gang raped, beaten and left for dead. Now, I’m using exaggeration to make a point about this comparative logic that some have used here to defend this lady’s practices.

I happily admit that my visceral, heat of the moment reaction to this video was to want to gut and beat this woman. Now, that may make me part of the herd, but it also is a strong signal that my humanity is intact, and that I DO CARE about my fellow man and child. Somewhere, my internal compass said this is fucking wrong and I want to defend this child and hurt that parent. Is that rational? Perhaps not.

However, and this is my closing point (I promise); even setting aside all our base emotions, her methods, when judged in their entirety, cannot be defended on their merits. We can wax poetic all day about ignorance, culture, misinformed, misguided, overwhelmed, etc., but we cannot call that which is wrong, “okay”. And we cannot excuse it or defend it simply because we can conjure up worse treatments or punishment or “abuse”.[/quote]

I like you better all fired up, BG. Quit being so mellow and introspective

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[quote]OsakaNate wrote:
Wait.

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
This summer I ate the ‘‘Hellburger’’ in Denton, Texas (and won a TShirt).[/quote]

Where did you eat a ‘‘Hellburger’’ in Denton? I don’t remember that from when I lived there. I feel robbed…

/hijack[/quote]

Rooster’s Roadhouse:
http://www.roosters-roadhouse.com/index.html

Check out the menu: “Hellburger, $3.00 … Add scoop of ice cream, $9.00”

I’m a big guy who loves and seeks out HOT food, but there’s no doubt, it was tortuously hot.