[quote]Testy1 wrote:
Neither, I was only giving advice on the home buying aspect. If you ask around you can find home inspectors worth their weight in gold. My mom was in real estate and would only use one guy. You would be surprised what they can find behind closed walls (think attics and crawlspaces).
[/quote]
I’m involved in real estate and have friends involved in real estate, and whenever you ask about a good home inspector, it is shrugs all the way around.
[quote]Testy1 wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
Women should have an odometer and their N should be printed on their forehead.
In scarlet letters. [/quote]
What about yours?[/quote]
I dont care.
Do pros count?[/quote]
If they would count for the women, yes.[/quote]
I have no opinion when it comes to this, pay for play seems to be rare when it comes to women?
Its the norm when it comes to men. [/quote]
Really? I have never directly paid for it.
[/quote]
Paying directly does have its advantages
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Testy1 wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
Women should have an odometer and their N should be printed on their forehead.
In scarlet letters. [/quote]
What about yours?[/quote]
I dont care.
Do pros count?[/quote]
If they would count for the women, yes.[/quote]
I have no opinion when it comes to this, pay for play seems to be rare when it comes to women?
Its the norm when it comes to men. [/quote]
Really? I have never directly paid for it.
[/quote]
Paying directly does have its advantages[/quote]
I’d be way to worried to ever pay for sex. If my brain experienced I could get sex with a new hot chick with effort akin to ordering a pizza, I think I would have trouble quitting lol.
[quote]Broncoandy wrote:
[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
I think Broncoandy and I have a different view of outside work, as well. I find that intrinsically rewarding, too, though I recognize that there are jobs I’d be miserable doing. Still, a job well done brings much more reward than television and candy, imo.
…
I don’t see it as “sacrificing” a career when a parent stays home, I see it as a mutual decision. The downside of that decision only comes in the event of a divorce or marital dissatisfaction (e.g. she’s a shitty SAHM and won’t get a job). But then, many women find themselves with men who leave something to be desired, work-ethic-wise.
[/quote]
People who don’t fancy television and candy will find more productive ways to spend their time. Education, home business, internet sales, pickles, jams, roadside stands… Point is the freedom that comes with having that much free time is not something the working spouse will generally have. You can’t put a price on that. For a stay at home person, every day is Saterday - only better because banks and such aren’t closed.
Stay at home spouse is a mutual decision you’re right. And it’s usually based on each spouses strengths, and preferences. Which is to say that generally the one who stays home is not there against their will. They choose to give up their career and stay home, while the working spouse gives up home life for their career. Alimony for the sake of “she sacrificed her career” is therefor an attempt to balance an equation which was already balanced (hence unbalancing it, and rightly leading to additional resentment and bitterness).[/quote]
It’s not about sacrifice in my view. I think a better way to state it is that both have made the decision that only one of them will develop his or her career. But whatever, it really doesn’t matter. Men have a choice, they do not have to agree to a SAHM role for their wives. However, should they decide while young and in love that that’s what they want, they should be aware that if it lasts more than 10 years they are going to have to kick in in the event of a divorce, assuming they make more than a beginner burger-flipper. Simple.
What’s interesting (and distressing) to me is that the MRA guys screaming the loudest also seem to be the ones who moan the most about losing traditional gender roles. Is that you, Broncoandy? I feel like I recall that it is, but maybe I’m mixing you up with someone else.
[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
What’s interesting (and distressing) to me is that the MRA guys screaming the loudest also seem to be the ones who moan the most about losing traditional gender roles.[/quote]
I hadn’t noticed that, but that is interesting.
[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
Yup
[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
What’s interesting (and distressing) to me is that the MRA guys screaming the loudest also seem to be the ones who moan the most about losing traditional gender roles. Is that you, Broncoandy? I feel like I recall that it is, but maybe I’m mixing you up with someone else.[/quote]
I couldn’t care less about traditional gender roles. I’d be more than happy to be a stay at home dad. Now I do take issue with fields where women are shown favoritism via less demanding physical tests (firefighters, police officers, military, etc…), and quotas (positions with large companies), etc… But that has nothing to do with traditional gender roles, and everything to do with less qualified people being hired based on their gender (aka sexism).
[quote]Broncoandy wrote:
[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
What’s interesting (and distressing) to me is that the MRA guys screaming the loudest also seem to be the ones who moan the most about losing traditional gender roles. Is that you, Broncoandy? I feel like I recall that it is, but maybe I’m mixing you up with someone else.[/quote]
I couldn’t care less about traditional gender roles. I’d be more than happy to be a stay at home dad. Now I do take issue with fields where women are shown favoritism via less demanding physical tests (firefighters, police officers, military, etc…), and quotas (positions with large companies), etc… But that has nothing to do with traditional gender roles, and everything to do with less qualified people being hired based on their gender (aka sexism).[/quote]
Okay, my mistake.
So if you did stay home with kids and your wife climbed the ladder and then at some point wasn’t that into you, would you be content to go to Home Depot and earn $18K a year, gross, while she was making $75K? Let’s say you had a couple of kids together, a girl and a boy, both older teens, so no child support - her income would allow her to get a three bedroom place so each of the kids could have their own room when they’re around (let’s say one goes to community college and the other is finishing high school). You’d be lucky (very lucky) to get a two bedroom apartment, which would have someone sleeping on the couch. Maybe welfare would pick up some of the slack, I don’t know. But should orion and I be paying for you to feed your kids?
Seems to me that it would be fairer for your ex-wife pay $25K/yr to supplement your income for a few years. You want to just suck up her money and work part time, fine, but you could also go for an associates in nursing, or something, and by the time the support ends be making enough to live with similar dignity to your ex-wife. To me that only makes sense.
[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
[quote]Broncoandy wrote:
[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
What’s interesting (and distressing) to me is that the MRA guys screaming the loudest also seem to be the ones who moan the most about losing traditional gender roles. Is that you, Broncoandy? I feel like I recall that it is, but maybe I’m mixing you up with someone else.[/quote]
I couldn’t care less about traditional gender roles. I’d be more than happy to be a stay at home dad. Now I do take issue with fields where women are shown favoritism via less demanding physical tests (firefighters, police officers, military, etc…), and quotas (positions with large companies), etc… But that has nothing to do with traditional gender roles, and everything to do with less qualified people being hired based on their gender (aka sexism).[/quote]
Okay, my mistake.
So if you did stay home with kids and your wife climbed the ladder and then at some point wasn’t that into you, would you be content to go to Home Depot and earn $18K a year, gross, while she was making $75K? Let’s say you had a couple of kids together, a girl and a boy, both older teens, so no child support - her income would allow her to get a three bedroom place so each of the kids could have their own room when they’re around (let’s say one goes to community college and the other is finishing high school). You’d be lucky (very lucky) to get a two bedroom apartment, which would have someone sleeping on the couch. Maybe welfare would pick up some of the slack, I don’t know. But should orion and I be paying for you to feed your kids?
Seems to me that it would be fairer for your ex-wife pay $25K/yr to supplement your income for a few years. You want to just suck up her money and work part time, fine, but you could also go for an associates in nursing, or something, and by the time the support ends be making enough to live with similar dignity to your ex-wife. To me that only makes sense.[/quote]
First of all, if for some reason I was unable to feed them without her assistance, kids should hang with her until circumstances change. No need for any money to change hands there, and no welfare either (although I will point out that by current law there absolutely would be child support payable for both of the children in your example, which btw is the worst fucking kind of alimony).
And if you wanna talk welfare, we can talk welfare, but for now I’ll just say that making an individual welfare bum the responsibility of a single individual is an absolutely atrocious solution to that problem. When people get divorced they are no more each other’s problem than they are yours or mine or Orions. That’s what divorce is. I’m not her problem / she’s not mine anymore. Social problems need social solutions. I don’t care if you wanna put a bullet in every single one of them. That’s a job for the firing squad. Not their gun toting exes. And if a few dollars of your income tax going to support people like that makes you wanna get a gun, just imagine what it would be like if you had to fork over twenty five grand a year for that shit.
Second what the fuck did I do for the last 12 years while kids were in school from 8:30am till 3:30pm that the best I can do is 18k a year? I’m a half retarded high school drop out, and I’ve been making considerably more money than that since the day I dropped out. And how is it that after 18 years of marriage my share of the assets at divorce left me with zero dollars in the bank to draw on?
Third what is this dignity nonsense? Let’s not confuse money with dignity. I could sell my dignity for more than 18 grand getting dollars stuffed into my G-string. There’s no shame in doing an honest day’s work for an honest day’s pay, I don’t care if you are flipping burgers.
But hey, let’s just say that I did have 2 kids in their late teens like that. Again, right off there absolutely would be child support entitled by the letter of the law. That doesn’t dry up at 18. It goes till they graduate. But let’s pretend that’s not the case just for the sake of simplicity… Let’s also assume that she’s not some outlier deadbeat, and has an average sense of obligation to care for her offspring. That means she’s gonna pay for the college (lucky kids btw - when I was their age I was working to pay the mortgage, and put food on the table). Odds are she’s not gonna let those kids walk around barefoot in rags, so she’s gonna keep them clothed. But for whatever mysterious reason these 2 almost adults can’t live with mom. You think they’re gonna cost an additional TWENTY FIVE GRAND PER YEAR?! The fuck do these 2 kids eat? Diamonds?
Broncoandy’s kinda killing it in this thread. 
I think it’s a bit more grey than he’s letting on, but damn if he doesn’t make some good points.
[quote]therajraj wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Testy1 wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
Women should have an odometer and their N should be printed on their forehead.
In scarlet letters. [/quote]
What about yours?[/quote]
I dont care.
Do pros count?[/quote]
If they would count for the women, yes.[/quote]
I have no opinion when it comes to this, pay for play seems to be rare when it comes to women?
Its the norm when it comes to men. [/quote]
Really? I have never directly paid for it.
[/quote]
Paying directly does have its advantages[/quote]
I’d be way to worried to ever pay for sex. If my brain experienced I could get sex with a new hot chick with effort akin to ordering a pizza, I think I would have trouble quitting lol.
[/quote]
Well, once you have internalized that, imagine how much more interesting and less needy you will be…
“I have a golden vagina, serve me!”
“You do?”
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]therajraj wrote:
I’d be way to worried to ever pay for sex. If my brain experienced I could get sex with a new hot chick with effort akin to ordering a pizza, I think I would have trouble quitting lol.
[/quote]
Well, once you have internalized that, imagine how much more interesting and less needy you will be…
“I have a golden vagina, serve me!”
“You do?”[/quote]
How about the risk of getting arrested? Not to mention the fact that if you really want to bang a “hot chick” it is going to cost you a lot of money. Attractive escorts aren’t cheap.
[quote]Broncoandy wrote:
[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
[quote]Broncoandy wrote:
[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
What’s interesting (and distressing) to me is that the MRA guys screaming the loudest also seem to be the ones who moan the most about losing traditional gender roles. Is that you, Broncoandy? I feel like I recall that it is, but maybe I’m mixing you up with someone else.[/quote]
I couldn’t care less about traditional gender roles. I’d be more than happy to be a stay at home dad. Now I do take issue with fields where women are shown favoritism via less demanding physical tests (firefighters, police officers, military, etc…), and quotas (positions with large companies), etc… But that has nothing to do with traditional gender roles, and everything to do with less qualified people being hired based on their gender (aka sexism).[/quote]
Okay, my mistake.
So if you did stay home with kids and your wife climbed the ladder and then at some point wasn’t that into you, would you be content to go to Home Depot and earn $18K a year, gross, while she was making $75K? Let’s say you had a couple of kids together, a girl and a boy, both older teens, so no child support - her income would allow her to get a three bedroom place so each of the kids could have their own room when they’re around (let’s say one goes to community college and the other is finishing high school). You’d be lucky (very lucky) to get a two bedroom apartment, which would have someone sleeping on the couch. Maybe welfare would pick up some of the slack, I don’t know. But should orion and I be paying for you to feed your kids?
Seems to me that it would be fairer for your ex-wife pay $25K/yr to supplement your income for a few years. You want to just suck up her money and work part time, fine, but you could also go for an associates in nursing, or something, and by the time the support ends be making enough to live with similar dignity to your ex-wife. To me that only makes sense.[/quote]
First of all, if for some reason I was unable to feed them without her assistance, kids should hang with her until circumstances change. No need for any money to change hands there, and no welfare either (although I will point out that by current law there absolutely would be child support payable for both of the children in your example, which btw is the worst fucking kind of alimony).
And if you wanna talk welfare, we can talk welfare, but for now I’ll just say that making an individual welfare bum the responsibility of a single individual is an absolutely atrocious solution to that problem. When people get divorced they are no more each other’s problem than they are yours or mine or Orions. That’s what divorce is. I’m not her problem / she’s not mine anymore. Social problems need social solutions. I don’t care if you wanna put a bullet in every single one of them. That’s a job for the firing squad. Not their gun toting exes. And if a few dollars of your income tax going to support people like that makes you wanna get a gun, just imagine what it would be like if you had to fork over twenty five grand a year for that shit.
Second what the fuck did I do for the last 12 years while kids were in school from 8:30am till 3:30pm that the best I can do is 18k a year? I’m a half retarded high school drop out, and I’ve been making considerably more money than that since the day I dropped out. And how is it that after 18 years of marriage my share of the assets at divorce left me with zero dollars in the bank to draw on?
Third what is this dignity nonsense? Let’s not confuse money with dignity. I could sell my dignity for more than 18 grand getting dollars stuffed into my G-string. There’s no shame in doing an honest day’s work for an honest day’s pay, I don’t care if you are flipping burgers.
But hey, let’s just say that I did have 2 kids in their late teens like that. Again, right off there absolutely would be child support entitled by the letter of the law. That doesn’t dry up at 18. It goes till they graduate. But let’s pretend that’s not the case just for the sake of simplicity… Let’s also assume that she’s not some outlier deadbeat, and has an average sense of obligation to care for her offspring. That means she’s gonna pay for the college (lucky kids btw - when I was their age I was working to pay the mortgage, and put food on the table). Odds are she’s not gonna let those kids walk around barefoot in rags, so she’s gonna keep them clothed. But for whatever mysterious reason these 2 almost adults can’t live with mom. You think they’re gonna cost an additional TWENTY FIVE GRAND PER YEAR?! The fuck do these 2 kids eat? Diamonds?[/quote]
Eat? I’m talking about housing. I assume both parents want to be able to have their kids feel at home at their houses or apartments? I would be very sad if my husband decided not to be married anymore and I had to accept that my kids were people I visited rather than lived with as a result. If he could afford to maintain the house we’d lived in together and I had to find lesser accommodations. . .how is that fair when we agreed I’d be home washing everyone’s socks and cooking dinners?
Child support may go until they graduate high school, but not until they finish college unless it’s negotiated into the divorce settlement.
I don’t want to shoot anyone, personally, whether on welfare or child support.
I actually agree that a SAHM should be preparing herself to contribute once kids go to school. I have friends who have just drifted along after caring for young kids and I do sort of judge it. But I’m not in their marriages, and if they and their spouses agree, then that’s their agreement and I also judge people who don’t hold to agreements.
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]therajraj wrote:
I’d be way to worried to ever pay for sex. If my brain experienced I could get sex with a new hot chick with effort akin to ordering a pizza, I think I would have trouble quitting lol.
[/quote]
Well, once you have internalized that, imagine how much more interesting and less needy you will be…
“I have a golden vagina, serve me!”
“You do?”[/quote]
How about the risk of getting arrested? Not to mention the fact that if you really want to bang a “hot chick” it is going to cost you a lot of money. Attractive escorts aren’t cheap.[/quote]
Ah, you forget where I am.
Its legal and close to the ex Eastern Block, hence, cheap.
There ye go:
://www.laufhaus-vienna.at
Insert http please…
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]therajraj wrote:
I’d be way to worried to ever pay for sex. If my brain experienced I could get sex with a new hot chick with effort akin to ordering a pizza, I think I would have trouble quitting lol.
[/quote]
Well, once you have internalized that, imagine how much more interesting and less needy you will be…
“I have a golden vagina, serve me!”
“You do?”[/quote]
How about the risk of getting arrested? Not to mention the fact that if you really want to bang a “hot chick” it is going to cost you a lot of money. Attractive escorts aren’t cheap.[/quote]
Ah, you forget where I am.
Its legal and close to the ex Eastern Block, hence, cheap.
There ye go:
://www.laufhaus-vienna.at
Insert http please…
[/quote]
I figured it was legal where you live, but I was referring to therajaj, who I thought was not in such an open-minded jurisdiction.
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]therajraj wrote:
I’d be way to worried to ever pay for sex. If my brain experienced I could get sex with a new hot chick with effort akin to ordering a pizza, I think I would have trouble quitting lol.
[/quote]
Well, once you have internalized that, imagine how much more interesting and less needy you will be…
“I have a golden vagina, serve me!”
“You do?”[/quote]
How about the risk of getting arrested? Not to mention the fact that if you really want to bang a “hot chick” it is going to cost you a lot of money. Attractive escorts aren’t cheap.[/quote]
Ah, you forget where I am.
Its legal and close to the ex Eastern Block, hence, cheap.
There ye go:
://www.laufhaus-vienna.at
Insert http please…
[/quote]
I figured it was legal where you live, but I was referring to therajaj, who I thought was not in such an open-minded jurisdiction. [/quote]
I am sure that you are not implying that virtue in this case is only a lack of opportunity ?
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]therajraj wrote:
I’d be way to worried to ever pay for sex. If my brain experienced I could get sex with a new hot chick with effort akin to ordering a pizza, I think I would have trouble quitting lol.
[/quote]
Well, once you have internalized that, imagine how much more interesting and less needy you will be…
“I have a golden vagina, serve me!”
“You do?”[/quote]
How about the risk of getting arrested? Not to mention the fact that if you really want to bang a “hot chick” it is going to cost you a lot of money. Attractive escorts aren’t cheap.[/quote]
Ah, you forget where I am.
Its legal and close to the ex Eastern Block, hence, cheap.
There ye go:
://www.laufhaus-vienna.at
Insert http please…
[/quote]
He said attractive. I would hate to think that is the best. No girl on there is even a 6.
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]nephorm wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]therajraj wrote:
I’d be way to worried to ever pay for sex. If my brain experienced I could get sex with a new hot chick with effort akin to ordering a pizza, I think I would have trouble quitting lol.
[/quote]
Well, once you have internalized that, imagine how much more interesting and less needy you will be…
“I have a golden vagina, serve me!”
“You do?”[/quote]
How about the risk of getting arrested? Not to mention the fact that if you really want to bang a “hot chick” it is going to cost you a lot of money. Attractive escorts aren’t cheap.[/quote]
Ah, you forget where I am.
Its legal and close to the ex Eastern Block, hence, cheap.
There ye go:
://www.laufhaus-vienna.at
Insert http please…
[/quote]
I figured it was legal where you live, but I was referring to therajaj, who I thought was not in such an open-minded jurisdiction. [/quote]
Not really worried about being caught. They rent hotel rooms and you go up to their room. Cant imagine how you’d get caught.
In terms of ones on the street corner I can see that being a much more dangerous game because it’s out in the open
Main fear would be addiction and blowing wads of cash.