When to Include Tren: Powerlifting Cycle

Pharma / TRT
21

This is an open forum.

I certainly don’t get paid to give advice, and much of the advice on this board is on the level that you WOULD otherwise have to pay for.

If people want to play roid cop I have nothing against it, the standard “roid cop” response needs to be stated in ALL cases where the user does not seem mature enough for us to responsibly encourage usage. Just scroll past the posts you don’t want to read.

If you want free advice you also get free ridicule. You are entitled to nothing.

I am personally choosing, as you notice almost all the other vets have…to not to give advice to this poster despite being one of the more experienced tren users here that also has considerable experience with powerlifting because he has chosen to represent himself in an immature manner and has already within the span of his first 10 posts chosen to get into a ridiculous “I will not listen to you because I can post bigger numbers on the internet” style argument with someone else.

This is not a place for tongue in cheek interaction, this is not bodybuilding.com, this is not 4chan, this is a real forum.

Be concise, polite, ask legitimate questions, receive legitimate answers.
Anything else is not done here.

22

^^^ here, here"

23

this is just my personal opinion

never think of using anadrol in your life man , it is very dangerous

i have lot of friends who are bodybuilders , few use anadrol , they are damn strong and huge for 2-3 years but after that they get very serious side effect , one of my friend commited suicide because it messed up in his body

instead use dianabol , dianabol is safer compared to anadrol , side effects are mild

26

[quote]Westclock wrote:
This is an open forum.

I certainly don’t get paid to give advice, and much of the advice on this board is on the level that you WOULD otherwise have to pay for.

If people want to play roid cop I have nothing against it, the standard “roid cop” response needs to be stated in ALL cases where the user does not seem mature enough for us to responsibly encourage usage. Just scroll past the posts you don’t want to read.

If you want free advice you also get free ridicule. You are entitled to nothing.

I am personally choosing, as you notice almost all the other vets have…to not to give advice to this poster despite being one of the more experienced tren users here that also has considerable experience with powerlifting because he has chosen to represent himself in an immature manner and has already within the span of his first 10 posts chosen to get into a ridiculous “I will not listen to you because I can post bigger numbers on the internet” style argument with someone else.

This is not a place for tongue in cheek interaction, this is not bodybuilding.com, this is not 4chan, this is a real forum.

Be concise, polite, ask legitimate questions, receive legitimate answers.
Anything else is not done here.[/quote]

Ok, I’ll play your game. How should I have acted? Are you of the opinion that I should have listened to that guy? Really, I’m serious, I’m not fucking with you. I give respect when respect is due and respect is earned and that guy didn’t act in a way that deserved it. If I didn’t as well, I apologize, although you have to agree I’ve been polite and well-mannered to all other posters.

The cock measuring contest, the “I lift more than you” part, was solely due to the fact that DoM or whatever was calling me weak. I never said I wouldn’t listen to him because of it, I’m not listening to him for other reasons, the main one being that he behaves like a retard.

27

[quote]Crapo wrote:

[quote]Westclock wrote:
This is an open forum.

I certainly don’t get paid to give advice, and much of the advice on this board is on the level that you WOULD otherwise have to pay for.

If people want to play roid cop I have nothing against it, the standard “roid cop” response needs to be stated in ALL cases where the user does not seem mature enough for us to responsibly encourage usage. Just scroll past the posts you don’t want to read.

If you want free advice you also get free ridicule. You are entitled to nothing.

I am personally choosing, as you notice almost all the other vets have…to not to give advice to this poster despite being one of the more experienced tren users here that also has considerable experience with powerlifting because he has chosen to represent himself in an immature manner and has already within the span of his first 10 posts chosen to get into a ridiculous “I will not listen to you because I can post bigger numbers on the internet” style argument with someone else.

This is not a place for tongue in cheek interaction, this is not bodybuilding.com, this is not 4chan, this is a real forum.

Be concise, polite, ask legitimate questions, receive legitimate answers.
Anything else is not done here.[/quote]

Ok, I’ll play your game. How should I have acted? Are you of the opinion that I should have listened to that guy? Really, I’m serious, I’m not fucking with you. I give respect when respect is due and respect is earned and that guy didn’t act in a way that deserved it. If I didn’t as well, I apologize, although you have to agree I’ve been polite and well-mannered to all other posters.

The cock measuring contest, the “I lift more than you” part, was solely due to the fact that DoM or whatever was calling me weak. I never said I wouldn’t listen to him because of it, I’m not listening to him for other reasons, the main one being that he behaves like a retard.[/quote]

No need to explain, apologize or make excuses, I am in no position of authority.

I am simply, as a courtesy really, telling you why you received no useful answers, and a method by which to receive useful answers in the future.

Now.

First thing youre going to need to do is get on amazon and buy some bac water and run HCG during your cycle. Its cheap and the HCG diet craze has made it easy to come by.

I also recommend running the aromasin at a moderate dosage simply as insurance and to keep anxiety down and aggression up. You can lower it closer to meet time to bloat up a bit.

You seem to have test, drol, dbol, and tren to play with.

Tren strength does fade when you stop actually shooting the tren, but much of the strength built stays with you and its a very good anabolic, so use it if you can.
You will want to be on test at a high dose, tren at as high of a dose as you can, tren and orals come meet time.

Powerlifting cycles arent complicated. Stretch everything out as far as you can at moderate doses and make slow steady gains, then right before the meet, crank the orals, the test/tren dose, and let it ride like a mother and hope you dont blow out.

Test and anabolics to build actual tissue for most of the cycle. Then androgenics out the ass near the meet to get everything firing hard and together.

You didnt seem to have alot to play with so run at minimum effective dosages as close as you can to the meet, then go balls out the week of.

Save enough test to run a gram meet week, then run the rest in even doses, dont ramp besides meet week, get the test as high as you can for the majority of the cycle.

Save enough to run 100mg of drol AND 50mg of dbol per day for meet week. And then run your drol and dbol at the same time at no less than around 50mg of drol and 20mg of dbol a day and put it in at a minimum of those dosages as close to the meet as possible.
Dont drop below 50mg drol, and 20mg dbol.

Technically you should not be messing with tren as you do not know how you will react to it and are not familiar with it.

But if you insist place it in at your 200 as close as you can to the meet, with enough saved for 400-600 the week of the meet. Use the tren at a lower dose primarily as an anabolic addition to the test, then ramp it up to use it simply as an androgenic for strength gains close to the meet and during the meet.

Running high dose test, tren, dbol and drol at the same time is not necessarily advised. But this will net you the most strength.

During meet week youre going to be rolling a gram of test, 600mg of tren, 100mg of drol, and 50mg of dbol.

I have no way to know what you can handle, but this is what I would do with what you have.

28

Thanks for the taking your time to give me a hand, I really appreciate it.

I don’t live in the US, I live in South America, so amazon probably would not deliver bac water here and if it did, the shipping would probably cost more than twice the price of the bac water itself and it would take more than a month to arrive here. Not only that but I live with my parents, storing vials in the fridge would be complicated to say the least. I am fully aware that it would be the best option and I considered it myself, but it would be such a hassle that it wouldn’t be worth it, so unfortunately I’ll have to make do with a high dose at the end or not using it at all.

About the rest.

Well, you make my proposed cycle look like TRT. When my order arrives, I’ll have the following:

50 ml of test (250mg/ml)
50 drol tabs (50mg/tab)
100 dbol tabs (10mg/tab)
10 ml of tren (200mg/ml)

and ancillaries.

Some of this stuff I already have on hand, some of it is still coming on the mail.
I have enough test to run at 600 mg/week and I’ll still have a whole bottle to spend on the day of the meet, more than enough to have a gram of test running the day of the meet. I don’t have enough dbol to run the week of the meet at this dosage if I also choose to take it as a kickstart at weeks 1-4 (I could do both, but my kickstart would be around 20 mg/day for 3 weeks or something equally anemic). I do have enough drol to run at 100 mg for 25 days, so I’ll have enough drol for the meet. If I use 600mg of tren the week of the meet, I’ll have 7 ml to spend on the previous weeks.

So, let’s put it all together and see if it matches what you suggested. I miscalculated something, I’ll be a 17 week cycle, not 16.

1-16 Test 600mg/week then week 17 1000mg/week
1-4 dbol 30mg/day
10-16 Tren E 200mg/week then week 17 600mg/week

13-17 drol 100 mg/day
OR
11-16 drol 50mg/day then week 17 100mg/day

Week 17 is the week of the meet, obviously.

How does this look?

One other thing: I assume this cycle will put a lot of mass and weight on me. Assuming a non-silly diet, say 4000 kcal/day, can you give me a ballpark estimate of how much weight will I put? Will the gains be dramatic as to make “oh, I’m just eating a lot and training very hard” sound like a joke to a non-lifter? I shouldn’t really push past 205 pounds as I have next to zero experience in making weight and I wouldn’t trust myself to lose more than 7 pounds without the potential to screw things up as I plan to compete in the 198 class.

29

[quote]Crapo wrote:
Thanks for the taking your time to give me a hand, I really appreciate it.

I don’t live in the US, I live in South America, so amazon probably would not deliver bac water here and if it did, the shipping would probably cost more than twice the price of the bac water itself and it would take more than a month to arrive here. Not only that but I live with my parents, storing vials in the fridge would be complicated to say the least. I am fully aware that it would be the best option and I considered it myself, but it would be such a hassle that it wouldn’t be worth it, so unfortunately I’ll have to make do with a high dose at the end or not using it at all.

About the rest.

Well, you make my proposed cycle look like TRT. When my order arrives, I’ll have the following:

50 ml of test (250mg/ml)
50 drol tabs (50mg/tab)
100 dbol tabs (10mg/tab)
10 ml of tren (200mg/ml)

and ancillaries.

Some of this stuff I already have on hand, some of it is still coming on the mail.
I have enough test to run at 600 mg/week and I’ll still have a whole bottle to spend on the day of the meet, more than enough to have a gram of test running the day of the meet. I don’t have enough dbol to run the week of the meet at this dosage if I also choose to take it as a kickstart at weeks 1-4 (I could do both, but my kickstart would be around 20 mg/day for 3 weeks or something equally anemic). I do have enough drol to run at 100 mg for 25 days, so I’ll have enough drol for the meet. If I use 600mg of tren the week of the meet, I’ll have 7 ml to spend on the previous weeks.

So, let’s put it all together and see if it matches what you suggested. I miscalculated something, I’ll be a 17 week cycle, not 16.

1-16 Test 600mg/week then week 17 1000mg/week
1-4 dbol 30mg/day
10-16 Tren E 200mg/week then week 17 600mg/week

13-17 drol 100 mg/day
OR
11-16 drol 50mg/day then week 17 100mg/day

Week 17 is the week of the meet, obviously.

How does this look?

One other thing: I assume this cycle will put a lot of mass and weight on me. Assuming a non-silly diet, say 4000 kcal/day, can you give me a ballpark estimate of how much weight will I put? Will the gains be dramatic as to make “oh, I’m just eating a lot and training very hard” sound like a joke to a non-lifter? I shouldn’t really push past 205 pounds as I have next to zero experience in making weight and I wouldn’t trust myself to lose more than 7 pounds without the potential to screw things up as I plan to compete in the 198 class.
[/quote]

This is powerlifitng, 4k cals isnt going to cut it for someone looking to compete at 200. Lift harder, eat more. Powerlifters dont eat like shit unless they are trying to compete in a HIGH weight class where they simply cant maintain their mass with less cals.

This isnt bodybuilding, we dont “feel the muscles” and do high reps with bullshit weight.

Keep your diet pretty clean, high carb, but limit sugar.

Dont train like a pussy youre trying to get strong, this isnt bodybuilding.

I cant say how much weight you will gain, certainly 10+ pounds is a good estimate. Tren is actually very helpful as it tends to kill fat at the same time as you gain weight, this lets you gain muscle and lose fat at the same time to make weight easier.

Like I said, AI will help more of that be muscle and less bloat and fat.

Do not run a kickstart, its a waste.

You want to run the orals as close to the meet as possible to help with maximum muscle recruitment.

This is a strength cycle, not a bulking cycle. And even if it were a bulking cycle, kick starts are silly ego based steroid usage.

Waiting till the injectables with type I activity are fully kicked in would allow you to make the most use of the dbol and drol. Waiting till atleast a week after you start the tren would make the most anabolic sense with the orals.

And putting them in as close to the meet as possible would make the most use of them for peaking STRENGTH.

Run the dbol and drol at the same time right before the meet. You will have the tren kicking, the test kicking, and the androgenic properties from the orals will help you get all that new tissue working correctly.

Drol and dbol at the same time is better than higher doses of either. Dbol gets more aggression, drol more strength.

Both are needed for performance, if you have both, use both.

Just beware the pumps can get rough when mixing them.

I know your thinking it would be better to spread the orals out more and try to get more growth out of them, but it just doesn’t work that way.

High doses close to the meet.

30

[quote]Westclock wrote:

This is powerlifitng, 4k cals isnt going to cut it for someone looking to compete at 200. Lift harder, eat more. Powerlifters dont eat like shit unless they are trying to compete in a HIGH weight class where they simply cant maintain their mass with less cals.

This isnt bodybuilding, we dont “feel the muscles” and do high reps with bullshit weight.

Keep your diet pretty clean, high carb, but limit sugar.

Dont train like a pussy youre trying to get strong, this isnt bodybuilding.

I cant say how much weight you will gain, certainly 10+ pounds is a good estimate. Tren is actually very helpful as it tends to kill fat at the same time as you gain weight, this lets you gain muscle and lose fat at the same time to make weight easier.

Like I said, AI will help more of that be muscle and less bloat and fat.

Do not run a kickstart, its a waste.

You want to run the orals as close to the meet as possible to help with maximum muscle recruitment.

This is a strength cycle, not a bulking cycle. And even if it were a bulking cycle, kick starts are silly ego based steroid usage.

Waiting till the injectables with type I activity are fully kicked in would allow you to make the most use of the dbol and drol. Waiting till atleast a week after you start the tren would make the most anabolic sense with the orals.

And putting them in as close to the meet as possible would make the most use of them for peaking STRENGTH.

Run the dbol and drol at the same time right before the meet. You will have the tren kicking, the test kicking, and the androgenic properties from the orals will help you get all that new tissue working correctly.

Drol and dbol at the same time is better than higher doses of either. Dbol gets more aggression, drol more strength.

Both are needed for performance, if you have both, use both.

Just beware the pumps can get rough when mixing them.

I know your thinking it would be better to spread the orals out more and try to get more growth out of them, but it just doesn’t work that way.

High doses close to the meet.
[/quote]

Ok, I’ll save enough dbol for the week of the meet. Hooray, I’ll have enough androgens in my blood to put a whole old people’s asylum on TRT. I’ll bump to 4500kcal-5000kcal, but it won’t be really clean. I can’t eat 5000 kcals worth of chicken breast and brown rice, I don’t have much of an appetite. I don’t usually eat a lot of sugar anyway, but I’ll go heavy on milk, quarter-pounders and beef, complement with potatoes, fruit and whey, something of the sort.

About the training, I’ll be running Smolov for this meet, I think the “training like a pussy” part is not possible on this program, unless it’s a very tough pussy.

31

[quote]Crapo wrote:

[quote]Westclock wrote:

This is powerlifitng, 4k cals isnt going to cut it for someone looking to compete at 200. Lift harder, eat more. Powerlifters dont eat like shit unless they are trying to compete in a HIGH weight class where they simply cant maintain their mass with less cals.

This isnt bodybuilding, we dont “feel the muscles” and do high reps with bullshit weight.

Keep your diet pretty clean, high carb, but limit sugar.

Dont train like a pussy youre trying to get strong, this isnt bodybuilding.

I cant say how much weight you will gain, certainly 10+ pounds is a good estimate. Tren is actually very helpful as it tends to kill fat at the same time as you gain weight, this lets you gain muscle and lose fat at the same time to make weight easier.

Like I said, AI will help more of that be muscle and less bloat and fat.

Do not run a kickstart, its a waste.

You want to run the orals as close to the meet as possible to help with maximum muscle recruitment.

This is a strength cycle, not a bulking cycle. And even if it were a bulking cycle, kick starts are silly ego based steroid usage.

Waiting till the injectables with type I activity are fully kicked in would allow you to make the most use of the dbol and drol. Waiting till atleast a week after you start the tren would make the most anabolic sense with the orals.

And putting them in as close to the meet as possible would make the most use of them for peaking STRENGTH.

Run the dbol and drol at the same time right before the meet. You will have the tren kicking, the test kicking, and the androgenic properties from the orals will help you get all that new tissue working correctly.

Drol and dbol at the same time is better than higher doses of either. Dbol gets more aggression, drol more strength.

Both are needed for performance, if you have both, use both.

Just beware the pumps can get rough when mixing them.

I know your thinking it would be better to spread the orals out more and try to get more growth out of them, but it just doesn’t work that way.

High doses close to the meet.
[/quote]

Ok, I’ll save enough dbol for the week of the meet. Hooray, I’ll have enough androgens in my blood to put a whole old people’s asylum on TRT. I’ll bump to 4500kcal-5000kcal, but it won’t be really clean. I can’t eat 5000 kcals worth of chicken breast and brown rice, I don’t have much of an appetite. I don’t usually eat a lot of sugar anyway, but I’ll go heavy on milk, quarter-pounders and beef, complement with potatoes, fruit and whey, something of the sort.

About the training, I’ll be running Smolov for this meet, I think the “training like a pussy” part is not possible on this program, unless it’s a very tough pussy.[/quote]

Clean just means decent, healthy, proper nutrients at the proper times, carbs before and after workouts not before bed, good fats, no fast food, high quality food.

Dont neglect those fats, just make sure they are decent fats.

I would never advocate chicken breast and brown rice, thats bodybuilding again.

32

In a way, it’s not that clear cut what clean means.

For bodybuilders, clean means lowish fat, low saturated fat and low sugar. For paleo people, clean means medium-high fat and as much saturated fat as one wants, lowish carbs, zero gluten, PUFA and sugar. For the leangains guys, as long as you meet macro needs for the days and do your fasting thing, it’s cool. However, there are things that most people don’t consider clean such as soda, cookies, chocolate and stuff like that.

But I’m getting philosophical. I get what you mean.

34

[quote]naturalbuilder wrote:
this is just my personal opinion

never think of using anadrol in your life man , it is very dangerous

i have lot of friends who are bodybuilders , few use anadrol , they are damn strong and huge for 2-3 years but after that they get very serious side effect , one of my friend commited suicide because it messed up in his body

instead use dianabol , dianabol is safer compared to anadrol , side effects are mild [/quote]

I disagree. Side effects are dependent on the dose and user. I’ve used both and still would if I had them available.

I can’t find a single study showing anadrol is more toxic on a milligram for milligram basis than dbol.

How did your friend know that it was anadrol that messed up his body? What exactly was messed up that made him decide to commit suicide? What serious side effects did your bodybuilder friends experience from anadrol? What doses and other drugs were they using?

35

Westclock, I forgot to mention I have some halo lying around. Not a whole lot, just 16 tabs (10mg). Would it be a good idea to replace the dbol on the week of the meet with the halo?

36

[quote]Crapo wrote:
Westclock, I forgot to mention I have some halo lying around. Not a whole lot, just 16 tabs (10mg). Would it be a good idea to replace the dbol on the week of the meet with the halo?[/quote]

Halo is better for strength and aggression than dbol, but is a terrible anabolic.

You could throw it on top the last few days before the meet, I certainly might consider using it during the meet.

Mixing drugs is always better than super high doses of one.

Personally I would probably just use the halo meet day. Im not a huge fan of it. Works well but isnt the god of strength orals like people think it is.

Drol and dbol is pretty solid. I wouldent think poorly of putting some halo on top of it on meet day.

37

[quote]Westclock wrote:

[quote]Crapo wrote:
Westclock, I forgot to mention I have some halo lying around. Not a whole lot, just 16 tabs (10mg). Would it be a good idea to replace the dbol on the week of the meet with the halo?[/quote]

Halo is better for strength and aggression than dbol, but is a terrible anabolic.

You could throw it on top the last few days before the meet, I certainly might consider using it during the meet.

Mixing drugs is always better than super high doses of one.

Personally I would probably just use the halo meet day. Im not a huge fan of it. Works well but isnt the god of strength orals like people think it is.

Drol and dbol is pretty solid. I wouldent think poorly of putting some halo on top of it on meet day.[/quote]

OK, thanks.