What Price for White Skin?

[quote] Prof X wrote:
We get stats thrown at us left and right comparing the black race directly to every negative act that could be performed by an individual, yet for some reason, none of you see that act itself as being racist. The proper method would be to equate criminal activity to socio-economic influences, not skin color. As a result of relating every negative act to a race, we get told that any of us who aren’t criminals and are successful are an exception to the rule. [/quote]

That would be myopic.

The problem could well be outside the sphere of the black communities influence, maybe institutional racism, maybe laws that are passed with an ideal white family in mind that automatically puts any other lifestyle at a disadvantage when dealing with the law, whatever.

To say that asking the question per se is racist is nonsense because by the same logic one would not have been able to inquire into the deaths of black political prisoners in South Africa.
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[quote]
rainjack wrote:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ap-voguecover&prov=ap&type=lgns

This is stupid.

“It conjures up this idea of a dangerous black man,” said Tamara Walker, 29, of Philadelphia.

malonetd wrote:

Here’s one writer’s take on it:
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/7955740[/quote]

I love Jason Whitlock’s stuff.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
orion wrote:
Professor X wrote:
orion wrote:

Insofar I do not think “they” owe “you” anything. If anyone owes anyone anything it is you (personally, and “you” collectively) who has to thank them for the chances you had and would not have had without them.

What chances have I had that I need to thank someone for?

You were allowed to pursue a higher education, I think in part with the aid of the US military that allowed you to pursue higher goals than dish washing or peeling potatoes.

A hundred and fifty years earlier you would have been in danger by learning how to read and write.

Now I do understand that this is the way it should be and I do not actually expect you do thank anyone to play on an at least semi level playing field with surmountable obstacles, but the fact that you would have not those opportunities without changes in the hearts and minds of the white majority today remains.

Are these the people who should feel responsible for slavery?

I was “allowed” to receive a higher education? The military didn’t allow me any higher goals other than being in the military. I already had my degree when I joined.

You don’t have a clue what you are talking about. 150 years earlier, blacks were treated like cattle. How do I owe “thanks” for that?

Any progress that has been made in this country was fought for. No one gave it up lightly so how would I owe thanks for not being a slave anymore?

[/quote]

I was under the impression that you financed your studies in part by serving in the military.

My bad.

However, you do have a clue what I am talking about. The “change” that was fought for, was also fought for by white people. You do have possibilities that go far beyond those of your ancestors in part because of white people that were, in part because white people that are now.

There can not be any doubt in your mind that your live would have been significantly harder in the 40s, 50s or 60s.

So tell me now, what sort of responsibility do you expect white Americans to accept because of slavery and Jim Crow laws if they were too instrumental in ending it.

edited to make sense

[quote]rainjack wrote:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ap-voguecover&prov=ap&type=lgns

This is stupid.

“It conjures up this idea of a dangerous black man,” said Tamara Walker, 29, of Philadelphia.

[/quote]

I refuse to even acknowledge that bullshit…that was nothing made into something…which also happens too damn much…from both sides.

[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:

rainjack wrote:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ap-voguecover&prov=ap&type=lgns

This is stupid.

“It conjures up this idea of a dangerous black man,” said Tamara Walker, 29, of Philadelphia.

malonetd wrote:

Here’s one writer’s take on it:

I love Jason Whitlock’s stuff.[/quote]

His stuff is “interesting” to say the least…but of course he only speaks for himself…definitely not for us. I love how he also manages to berate Lebron James at the same time with sterotypes himself…like he’s Uncle Ruckus. He proves that its possible to “bojangle” with a pen and paper.

[quote]Big_Boss wrote:
BostonBarrister wrote:

rainjack wrote:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ap-voguecover&prov=ap&type=lgns

This is stupid.

“It conjures up this idea of a dangerous black man,” said Tamara Walker, 29, of Philadelphia.

malonetd wrote:

Here’s one writer’s take on it:

I love Jason Whitlock’s stuff.

His stuff is “interesting” to say the least…but of course he only speaks for himself…definitely not for us. I love how he also manages to berate Lebron James at the same time with sterotypes himself…like he’s Uncle Ruckus. He proves that its possible to “bojangle” with a pen and paper.[/quote]

So the first thing that comes to mind is an “ape”…but yet, they can’t understand why we get so pissed off some times. And expecting James to be our representative is unwarranted…he’s a young man with the opportunity of a life time to do well for himself and family. How is he responsible for how people perceive him?

[quote]Qaash wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
BostonBarrister wrote:

rainjack wrote:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ap-voguecover&prov=ap&type=lgns

This is stupid.

“It conjures up this idea of a dangerous black man,” said Tamara Walker, 29, of Philadelphia.

malonetd wrote:

Here’s one writer’s take on it:

I love Jason Whitlock’s stuff.

His stuff is “interesting” to say the least…but of course he only speaks for himself…definitely not for us. I love how he also manages to berate Lebron James at the same time with sterotypes himself…like he’s Uncle Ruckus. He proves that its possible to “bojangle” with a pen and paper.

So the first thing that comes to mind is an “ape”…but yet, they can’t understand why we get so pissed off some times. And expecting James to be our representative is unwarranted…he’s a young man with the opportunity of a life time to do well for himself and family. How is he responsible for how people perceive him?[/quote]

Exactly…thats why I didn’t get Whitlock coming off as if he’s faulting Lebron for being perceived in a negative way…and beyond the Vogue cover.

I think he’s one of those people that think that as soon as a African American receives some type of celebrity, they automatically become spokes persons for our entire race. Which I believe is just stupid.

[quote]Qaash wrote:
I think he’s one of those people that think that as soon as a African American receives some type of celebrity, they automatically become spokes persons for our entire race. Which I believe is just stupid.[/quote]

Exactly…but this is his job. He’s doing a good job of cashing in and sitting on his bank. He only says shit for shock value…under the disguise of “what black people are afraid to say.”

I’m still shaking my head on his logic about Lebron. According to his “expertise” I should get my tattoos removed so I won’t be associated with prison gangs. He’s helping the idiots who have issue with the Vogue cover.

[quote]Qaash wrote:
I think he’s one of those people that think that as soon as a African American receives some type of celebrity, they automatically become spokes persons for our entire race. Which I believe is just stupid.[/quote]

Shit, most of society seems to think the same way.

I fail to see the issue with this cover, however. Maybe if this were 1980 I could see someone taking that stance, but what the fuck is the big deal?

Why is any black man still being expected to represent his entire race once he achieves any level of success?

Also, Lebron is far from being extremely muscular so I fail to see the King Kong relation. If that was brought up simply because he is black, that is worse than any damage the cover itself could have done. His arms aren’t even that much bigger than the girl he is posing with.

I think the larger issue is why no blacks have ever graced their cover before.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Qaash wrote:
I think he’s one of those people that think that as soon as a African American receives some type of celebrity, they automatically become spokes persons for our entire race. Which I believe is just stupid.

Shit, most of society seems to think the same way.

I fail to see the issue with this cover, however. Maybe if this were 1980 I could see someone taking that stance, but what the fuck is the big deal?

Why is any black man still being expected to represent his entire race once he achieves any level of success?

Also, Lebron is far from being extremely muscular so I fail to see the King Kong relation. If that was brought up simply because he is black, that is worse than any damage the cover itself could have done. His arms aren’t even that much bigger than the girl he is posing with.

I think the larger issue is why no blacks have ever graced their cover before.[/quote]

Well, I don’t give a flying frak!!! about Vogue in general but the fact that the first black man they see on the cover and they start thinking king kong…speaks well of those that read Vogue, don’t it?

[quote]Professor X wrote:

I think the larger issue is why no blacks have ever graced their cover before.[/quote]

It’s not that big of an issue - only two other men have ever been on the cover. LeBron becomes one of only three men to grace cover of Vogue

[quote]Qaash wrote:

Well, I don’t give a flying frak!!! about Vogue in general but the fact that the first black man they see on the cover and they start thinking king kong…speaks well of those that read Vogue, don’t it?[/quote]

It certainly says a lot about stupid liberal “magazine analysts.”

[quote]Professor X wrote:

Why is “professional society” judging someone by what they wear IN THEIR OWN FREE TIME? [/quote]

You represent the company you work for in, and outside of work. It’s one of the first things my company told me when I started. It may not be fair, but it’s something that is not fair for everyone.

[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:

orion wrote:
Making white people pay for the crimes of other white people in the past is no way to fight racism, that is racism.

Professor X:
Relating blacks through statistics to crimes not committed by the individual is also racism. It is funny which wars you all run after.

It’s statistical discrimination. To take it out of the race context, it’s the same thing insurance companies do when they make young males pay higher insurance rates, and why males pay higher life insurance rates than females of the same age and general health profile. It’s a rational response to the problem of a decision-maker not having individual information.

In the case of the auto insurance, it’s based on the behavior of some young males - and it’s the fault of those young males, not of the insurance company, that the other young males are paying higher insurance rates.[/quote]

Good post.

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:
Professor X wrote:

Why is “professional society” judging someone by what they wear IN THEIR OWN FREE TIME?

You represent the company you work for in, and outside of work. It’s one of the first things my company told me when I started. It may not be fair, but it’s something that is not fair for everyone. [/quote]

Bullshit. Nowhere is appearance more important than in the military. Even who you socialize with on the weekends in public can bite you if you are an officer hanging out with enlisted. Still no one judged us by how we dressed ON OUR OWN FUCKING FREE TIME and certainly not to the point that they would judge certain clothing as “thug wear” unless someone was simply unclean or literally acting like an ass in public. In fact, there were many enlisted who wore earrings on the weekend even though this is prohibited on base.

You still have not specifically described what “thug wear” even is. I get the feeling many of you are seeing black men in basketball jerseys and jumping to “strangely close to racist” conclusions about them.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

That effectively forces any black person who is successful to act as a representative for an entire race. Should that individual fail, everyone will notice the failure as being “part of the rule” and associate it with race. I am not sure how someone could deny this.

[/quote]

Prof. X:
You are a role model for any young person, black/white/green/male/female. From what I can gather from your posts, you are a (presumably) successful, surgeon, a military veteran, and one seriously physically impressive human, oh, and just happen to be black.

I would consider you “The Ideal” role-model for youth, especially young black youth. I believe you have potential to be the greatest influence for some folks.

Do you feel like you must act as a representative for your entire ‘race’ (I don’t like that term, but using it for consistency in the post).

Do you feel like you must act as a representative for your community? Is it bad thing?

Who is the better role model, you, or LeBron James, or Snoop Dogg? I’ve grown weary of ‘black leaders’ who claim that Condoleeza Rice and Colin Powell ‘sold out’ the black community.

By becoming educated and successful, have you sold yourself out the “black community”?

[quote]Professor X wrote:
LankyMofo wrote:
Professor X wrote:

Why is “professional society” judging someone by what they wear IN THEIR OWN FREE TIME?

You represent the company you work for in, and outside of work. It’s one of the first things my company told me when I started. It may not be fair, but it’s something that is not fair for everyone.

Bullshit. Nowhere is appearance more important than in the military. Even who you socialize with on the weekends in public can bite you if you are an officer hanging out with enlisted. Still no one judged us by how we dressed ON OUR OWN FUCKING FREE TIME and certainly not to the point that they would judge certain clothing as “thug wear” unless someone was simply unclean or literally acting like an ass in public. In fact, there were many enlisted who wore earrings on the weekend even though this is prohibited on base.

You still have not specifically described what “thug wear” even is. I get the feeling many of you are seeing black men in basketball jerseys and jumping to “strangely close to racist” conclusions about them.[/quote]

Last year in NYC…there was a report in which the reporter was referring to a white teen arrested in a bias attack as wearing the official hip-hop uniform…white t, jewelry and a base ball hat…

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
Professor X wrote:

That effectively forces any black person who is successful to act as a representative for an entire race. Should that individual fail, everyone will notice the failure as being “part of the rule” and associate it with race. I am not sure how someone could deny this.

Prof. X:
You are a role model for any young person, black/white/green/male/female. From what I can gather from your posts, you are a (presumably) successful, surgeon, a military veteran, and one seriously physically impressive human, oh, and just happen to be black.

I would consider you “The Ideal” role-model for youth, especially young black youth. I believe you have potential to be the greatest influence for some folks.

Do you feel like you must act as a representative for your entire ‘race’ (I don’t like that term, but using it for consistency in the post).

Do you feel like you must act as a representative for your community? Is it bad thing?

Who is the better role model, you, or LeBron James, or Snoop Dogg? I’ve grown weary of ‘black leaders’ who claim that Condoleeza Rice and Colin Powell ‘sold out’ the black community.

By becoming educated and successful, have you sold yourself out the “black community”?
[/quote]

I’m not answering for him but wanted to ask why should he be? Aside from living life as a decent human being and influencing those within his circle? I’m not being condescending…just honestly curious.

[quote]SteelyD wrote:
Professor X wrote:

That effectively forces any black person who is successful to act as a representative for an entire race. Should that individual fail, everyone will notice the failure as being “part of the rule” and associate it with race. I am not sure how someone could deny this.

Prof. X:
You are a role model for any young person, black/white/green/male/female. From what I can gather from your posts, you are a (presumably) successful, surgeon, a military veteran, and one seriously physically impressive human, oh, and just happen to be black…

Who is the better role model, you, or LeBron James, or Snoop Dogg? I’ve grown weary of ‘black leaders’ who claim that Condoleeza Rice and Colin Powell ‘sold out’ the black community.

By becoming educated and successful, have you sold yourself out the “black community”?
[/quote]

I don’t know of anyone claiming Rice or Powell sold out. In fact, I am more than sure that if Powell had run for the presidency, that we may have actually had a black president at this point in history.

Lebron shouldn’t be expected to be a role model. If he gravitates into that position, fine, but expecting him to act like one makes no sense. I looked up to Michael Jordan growing up simply because of who he was, not even because of the basketball talent. I did not fault Jordan for being human and not being perfect…even when they tried to label him negatively about gambling at one point.

I don’t think celebrities should be expected to be role models. I think children should have their parents as role models initially. If they do their job to any level of competence, their kid shouldn’t be that influenced if a celebrity falls down in the eye of society.

Yes. I had one black grandmother come into the clinic today with her 10 year old grandson. He needed some teeth extracted. I talked to the kid like I always do (something I am very good at and I am not ashamed to admit it). She acted like she had seen Jesus when I was done. The kid didn’t cry (even when injected) and he left laughing. She left singing praises loudly as if I could do no wrong. I understand why she acted this way. I also understand that people like her waited a long time to see people like me.

That comes down to the individual. I have always done community service. I was in high school when a group of us started going to the Texas Children’s Hospital every Wednesday to spend time with the kids on dialysis. That is just who I am. Because of that, yes, I personally feel a responsibility because I feel that kids need to be able to see what can be done even if they didn’t grow up with much…all kids.

I don’t claim to be a “role model”. I’m not perfect. In fact, I am pretty sure that I am at least a little fucking crazy. I just know I’m different than some people…and my grandmother told me that was for a reason.