Wave Ladders, Need Advice

Bigger Stronger Leaner Christian Thibaudeau Coaching
1

Hello,

this is my first post:D (sorry for my English…) I am not sure if this is the correct forum and if it is allowed to post here for me.
I am 17 years old and train since 14 months. At the moment i train 55 Bill Star(weekly progress). I can bench 110 kg 2, squat 1105, dead-lift 1503 and press above my head 65 kg*4.

I have read this article by CT:Wave Ladders for Maximum Strength. And now i have one or two basic questions :smiley:

  1. is it an even replacement for a 5*5 system ?
  2. what workout plan should i use? A split or a full body routine? Something similar to 5*5 plan or what is important?: i mean for example:
    Monday: Squat,Bench, and chin ups
    Wednesday: Dead-lifts, Overhead-press and Pend-lay Rows
  3. Density Work: are other examples for density work in the article : build muscle
    with heavy singles. Is this the same thing ?

A question on an other topic ‘‘build for bad: strength circuits’’. Is it for beginners like me or is it for advanced lifters ?

Thank you for reading :smiley:

2

If you are going to do the Waves/Ladders you would use that with ONE lift for the day. For example, you would only do the slight decline bench press and nothing else. It would be way too much volume to do the Waves/Ladders with three different movements all in one training session. The density portion of Heavy Singles has many examples for doing density and I’m sure you could use any of them with the Waves/Ladders. So, when I was doing Waves/Ladders I was doing…SGHP, Slight Incline BP, Squat, off, SGHP, Slight Decline BP, off, and repeat.

3

Thanks for your response. I have tried it today with squats, especially the density work was very hard…I know now, why you use it for only 1 lift per day. If i want to make all the big lifts as often as possible, how should i train the other lifts after the Wave Ladders?
Example: Monday: Squats, Bench and Rows. If i make at the Squats the Wave Ladders, should i train the Bench 55, and on Wesnday i make Bench with Wave Ladders and Squats 55?

4

[quote]Akidara wrote:
Thanks for your response. I have tried it today with squats, especially the density work was very hard…I know now, why you use it for only 1 lift per day. If i want to make all the big lifts as often as possible, how should i train the other lifts after the Wave Ladders?
Example: Monday: Squats, Bench and Rows. If i make at the Squats the Wave Ladders, should i train the Bench 55, and on Wesnday i make Bench with Wave Ladders and Squats 55?[/quote]

One main lift per workout means one main lift per workout. You do not do another big lift in that session, especially not using a sets/reps scheme demanding like 5x5

5

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]Akidara wrote:
Thanks for your response. I have tried it today with squats, especially the density work was very hard…I know now, why you use it for only 1 lift per day. If i want to make all the big lifts as often as possible, how should i train the other lifts after the Wave Ladders?
Example: Monday: Squats, Bench and Rows. If i make at the Squats the Wave Ladders, should i train the Bench 55, and on Wesnday i make Bench with Wave Ladders and Squats 55?[/quote]

One main lift per workout means one main lift per workout. You do not do another big lift in that session, especially not using a sets/reps scheme demanding like 5x5[/quote]

Oh thank you CT, its very nice that you also reply here :D. I am not sure if changing my routine from 55 Bill Star, to Wave Ladders with 1 main lift per day is a good decision. What do you think? Do you have any suggestions what i should do right now , when my goal is to get stronger and get more muscular (as fast as possible, like always :P)? Any suggestions would make me happy. If i should keep 55, do you think its a good idea to fit in High Pulls? ( maybe behind squats?)
Thanks for reading, i like your articles much.

6

[quote]Akidara wrote:

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]Akidara wrote:
Thanks for your response. I have tried it today with squats, especially the density work was very hard…I know now, why you use it for only 1 lift per day. If i want to make all the big lifts as often as possible, how should i train the other lifts after the Wave Ladders?
Example: Monday: Squats, Bench and Rows. If i make at the Squats the Wave Ladders, should i train the Bench 55, and on Wesnday i make Bench with Wave Ladders and Squats 55?[/quote]

One main lift per workout means one main lift per workout. You do not do another big lift in that session, especially not using a sets/reps scheme demanding like 5x5[/quote]

Oh thank you CT, its very nice that you also reply here :D. I am not sure if changing my routine from 55 Bill Star, to Wave Ladders with 1 main lift per day is a good decision. What do you think? Do you have any suggestions what i should do right now , when my goal is to get stronger and get more muscular (as fast as possible, like always :P)? Any suggestions would make me happy. If i should keep 55, do you think its a good idea to fit in High Pulls? ( maybe behind squats?)
Thanks for reading, i like your articles much. [/quote]

I can’t make that decision for you.

From your posts you seem to be the kind of guy who is looking to do more stuff. While it is a quality to be a hard worker, sometimes doing more will lead to less results. BUT if in YOUR mind you prefer to do more, then you will probably feel better with 5x5.

As for adding high pulls. If you add them they should probably be 1st or 2nd exercise in a session. 1st if you are only doing strength lifts (e.g. bench, deadlift, squat, military press, row) and 2nd if you are also doing explosive lifts (variation of the olympic lifts).

You might want to look into my program “Built for Bad” which might fit your psychological profile more than the wave ladders.

7

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]Akidara wrote:

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]Akidara wrote:
Thanks for your response. I have tried it today with squats, especially the density work was very hard…I know now, why you use it for only 1 lift per day. If i want to make all the big lifts as often as possible, how should i train the other lifts after the Wave Ladders?
Example: Monday: Squats, Bench and Rows. If i make at the Squats the Wave Ladders, should i train the Bench 55, and on Wesnday i make Bench with Wave Ladders and Squats 55?[/quote]

One main lift per workout means one main lift per workout. You do not do another big lift in that session, especially not using a sets/reps scheme demanding like 5x5[/quote]

Oh thank you CT, its very nice that you also reply here :D. I am not sure if changing my routine from 55 Bill Star, to Wave Ladders with 1 main lift per day is a good decision. What do you think? Do you have any suggestions what i should do right now , when my goal is to get stronger and get more muscular (as fast as possible, like always :P)? Any suggestions would make me happy. If i should keep 55, do you think its a good idea to fit in High Pulls? ( maybe behind squats?)
Thanks for reading, i like your articles much. [/quote]

I can’t make that decision for you.

From your posts you seem to be the kind of guy who is looking to do more stuff. While it is a quality to be a hard worker, sometimes doing more will lead to less results. BUT if in YOUR mind you prefer to do more, then you will probably feel better with 5x5.

As for adding high pulls. If you add them they should probably be 1st or 2nd exercise in a session. 1st if you are only doing strength lifts (e.g. bench, deadlift, squat, military press, row) and 2nd if you are also doing explosive lifts (variation of the olympic lifts).

You might want to look into my program “Built for Bad” which might fit your psychological profile more than the wave ladders.[/quote]

Thank you CT, you have read my mind, i was exactly thinking that: only 2 heavy sets are to less, i should do more… :slight_smile: So i will try build for bad in my next holdiays and do the high pulls as my first exerise :smiley:

8

CT, regarding the wave ladders, if im not planning on doing any density work or accessory work and am just focusing on gaining strength, is it really that important to only do 1 lift per session? I have done the wave ladders before and do not find them to be very draining (in fact i feel stronger) and feel like i could easily do an upper and lower body lift using the wave ladder technique in one session. Let me know what you think, thanks!

9

[quote]WaterlooWarrior wrote:
CT, regarding the wave ladders, if im not planning on doing any density work or accessory work and am just focusing on gaining strength, is it really that important to only do 1 lift per session? I have done the wave ladders before and do not find them to be very draining (in fact i feel stronger) and feel like i could easily do an upper and lower body lift using the wave ladder technique in one session. Let me know what you think, thanks![/quote]

  1. If you feel stronger AFTER the wave ladder workout that is perfect. That’s what we are tryingto achieve

  2. Density work WILL increase your strength

  3. If you do not do density work you could probably do 2 lifts using wave ladder then a complex

10

Hello CT,

Question about approaching the program.

If I have 5 gym days in week, would it be better to choose 5 main lifts or just 3 to hit them more frequently?
3 main lifts → week1 ABC AB, week 2 CAB CA and so on.

Then with 3 mainlifts some rotation for different lift like between 6 weeks?

5 main lifts to choose from: PushPress, FrontSquat, Bench, Deadlift and SGHP.

Thanks advance.